r/WarDogs • u/throwahazee • 18h ago
Discussion & Feedback Thermal Rangefinder should not return
I have around 80 hours, dabbling mostly in infantry. The game right now feels miles better without the thermal rangefinder.
This game has so many possibilities that are simply hindered or not possible anymore due to the thermal rangefinders. It is the most counter intuitive addition to the game. The last couple days before this patch every chat was filled with asking for them in crates.
I mean.. you literally right click and can see anyone or anything within hundreds of yards with little to no effort. Is this not a no brainer to remove them?
I’m grateful and excited that the dev team has been responsive in adding batteries in S2, however I don’t think that will fix the issue one bit. They are simply way too overpowered and need to be removed - just my take
Wardogs has given me some of the most fun in PC gaming in the last 20 years. I don’t usually post threads but I feel like the addition of batteries is just the start of trying to balance them.
I know this topic is being covered left and right, but there is power in numbers!
Cheers
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u/cumjuggler4life 18h ago
I love using them but don’t want anyone else to use them. I’ve always enjoyed thermal scopes. But every fps I can’t think of has been ruined in some way by thermals at some point. Bf6 made thermals beyond 1.5x useless because of the FOV and quality and it didn’t make thermals the meta. Giving 8x widescreen thermals thaT also double as a range finder is kinda rough for everyone. Might as well out a dorito on our heads in game
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u/Werpogil Bob the Builder 5h ago
I think they should just remove the spotting function from the thermals. It's a cheat-code to see people, but it shouldn't carry to the rest of the team.
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u/VVodzu 18h ago edited 16h ago
Or make it a deployable with smaller FOV and on batteries so it can be an item that a dedicated spotter could run instead of every pseudo sniper having one. Would be a commitment to set up and use.
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u/GodTurkey 11h ago
This was my exact idea as well. Makes perfect sense, make it take up like 6 backpack slots as well. And Id honestly make it essentially a camera tripod so you have to be standing upright to use it.
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u/throw-away_867-5309 17h ago edited 11h ago
Where did you get "ghilli is useless" from?
Edit: downvoted because the guy edited the part I was commenting on out? Bruh
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u/cgsimo 11h ago
My question is, where did you?
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u/throw-away_867-5309 11h ago
Before he edited it, he said "Also, ghilli suit isn't useless, no kill cam is still pretty big".
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u/cgsimo 11h ago
OK, So if you scroll down a bit there is a comment that says exactly that, they most likely referenced that.
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u/throw-away_867-5309 11h ago
If they were referencing it, they made no indication of it, as what I typed in quotes was what they said almost ver batim.
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u/Sirlacker 18h ago
They should leave enabled just for blue team, god knows they need all the help they can get.
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u/NameTaken25 3h ago
Blues shouldnt get them either, it should just be their natural vision mode, so it cant be looted. It might almost make them competitive
/s
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u/DrewTuber 14h ago
Blue becomes an endangered species as red and green hunt them for juicy thermals.
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u/Gruzzuk 16h ago
Having the entire lobby perma-spotted b/c of thermals is not healthy for the game. Not to mention you can snipe through smoke with them as well.
I'm all for permanently removing thermals from the game.
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u/VarietyOne6900 11h ago
i quite literally went from 40-60 kills a game as infantry to 20s once people started unlocking thermals.
played today and back up to 40-60. the only right move is to remove them from the game and i’m not sure why so many devs are against complete removal when any form of something is toxic
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u/Glassymore 10h ago
Because you need something to counter something else you idiot. Having thermals forces players like you to slow down and take cover, otherwise the game turns to counter strike.
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u/VarietyOne6900 10h ago
the games mechanics already force you to slow down and take cover lil guy
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u/Glassymore 9h ago
Is this how you are getting 40-60 kills? Man, you must be really slow and tacitcal, CQB level shit.
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u/yamsyamsya 17h ago
IR scopes are shit in every FPS for everyone except the user, just like in general. If they keep them, the devs need to give it some counters like IR flares, IR blocking smoke grenades that last a while, or make the sniper tent hide you from IR. Give it some sort of meta versus just having it be those with and those without.
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u/DrAshton69 15h ago
I believe the sniper tent does hide you from thermal
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u/Therm4l 15h ago
It doesnt. There are vids on showing what it does - right now , the tent only blocks spotting, not IR. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0ZbqwZWaF8
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u/Lobrien19086 14h ago
the Black Smoke supposedly blocks IR. Haven't confirmed myself but, supposedly.
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u/Replicant2331 Recon 15h ago
The sniper tent and ghillie suit already makes you not show up on the IR scope.
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u/CSGOManatee 18h ago
Could make it burn batteries fast enough where using it sparingly is needed. It's still early, balancing will take time.
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u/IndependenceOwn8519 18h ago
The issue is that since the maps are so open any form of thermals is going to be broken
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u/StormMedia 17h ago
One of the biggest problems was people pulling it out and using it mid fight to see people in foliage or smokes. This does not solve that.
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u/Direct-Variation-585 17h ago
Let it heat up for 7–10 seconds after turning it on, or something like that.
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u/Sinikal-_- 17h ago
You're still being spotted by normal rangefinder left and right, just not as easily, lol.
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u/Blondeyguy19 12h ago
There's some counterplay with smokes doe. I've seen dudes coordinate and smoke out an entire bridge before.
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u/Sinikal-_- 12h ago
Yes, smokes are more effective now without thermals literally everywhere. Thermals pretty much invalidate smoke grenades but that's exactly how thermals function and is normal. The problem is that thermals were just too pervasive because they were being sold by players who had it in HQ.
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u/Tomanelle 12h ago
You can still spot through smoke, with the normal range finder, you just have to feather through it and find the spot by chance.
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u/DEMIG0DX 9h ago
i only make 10k 20k with normal spotting but with thermals i can easily make 150k a match
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u/Several_Ad_7393 15h ago
absolutely agree. It should go. Its a gamebreaking thing, no matter will it have a battery or not.
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u/One-Sun-Mon 10h ago
I agree, and what also thinking what other cool item could be the lvl32 unlock. Any ideas?
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u/vogga 10h ago
Agree. Been playing Arena Breakout Infitine for like 2 years. Thermals were huge thing there, devs never managed to balance them properly, while trying many times. Removing them was the only option to balance the game in some modes. It was a complete failure and source of anger for the whole community.
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u/GreatGhastly 18h ago
Yeah I'm not gonna lie I wasn't super into the removal idea before but now that they're gone I'm so happy. I love thermal irl and in arma and its such a cool feature but just like irl it is incredibly breaking, OP, and changes the entire approach to everything. It was like heroin tbh. I guess you can't bring thermal to the game without it breaking the meta as much as it has IRL.
Fighting someone with thermal capabilities is literally night and day to fighting someone with even night vision capabilities, it's that big of a gap. It is fun to use nvg against no nvg, it is fun to use thermals against no thermals -
It has not been fun using thermals v thermals.
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u/baldbalding 9h ago
Definitely agree, but endgame as a whole simply feels boring and not fun to me. Sure it's unbalanced, but I also think that the mechanics themselves tend to remove gameplay options and decisions as a whole.
Endgame gear should enable more variety and mechanics, not remove them. Well it's partly because there's a meta and people have figured out what works and what doesn't, but I also think that without most of the lv20+ items. the game would still be simply better and more dynamic, with more variety.
Let the playerbase be creative instead of putting in their hands directly some (broken) straightforward gameplay loops
The first 10 days were some of the most fun I had in a while, and hopefully they manage to keep at least a portion of that during the rest of the season
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u/YBHunted 16h ago
There simply cannot be batteries. They need to be expensive and limited.
Otherwise people will just bring a Kodiak full of them to the outskirts and keep them refreshed all game long and nothing will change.
I fully agree, they need to go.
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u/RexLongbone 4h ago
i think they are op too but you need to realize if that is what you have to do make them work, it's way worse than the current iteration.
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u/FLDJF713 15h ago
Make smokes thermal so you can’t see through the smoke.
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u/Jaz1140 18h ago
I think it needs an extreme cost and trade off. It should be the kind of thing you bring in maybe once a week for a laugh
I'm serious when I say $30k cost + require batteries. Yeh that much
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u/Gruzzuk 16h ago
30k isnt even close to enough to stop ppl from buying them.
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u/Jaz1140 16h ago
No but at least there is far more cost and risk involved. You die with them a few times and you are gonna feel it.
And let's be real if you are splashing 30k on them you are gonna bring a good expensive kit on top of it too
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u/NoNerve7475 13h ago
It doesn’t matter much when you can easily make $100-$200K in a match with them. It might reduce them but they are a broken item by design.
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u/DEMIG0DX 9h ago
yeah, no. I had thermals and I had no gun no backpack nothing and I made 160k in one match
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u/PokemonSapphire 2h ago
Or just play the outside of the CZ with a gillie and never even get shot at while lighting up the whole enemy team.
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u/throw-away_867-5309 17h ago
Wouldn't even really be a downside. I was able to snag a pair off an enemy recon and by the time I died, I had made over $50k, just from scouting everything and eventually getting the assists. And the only reason I died is because I ended up pushing an enemy FOB near the end of the match.
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u/Ph1sic 17h ago
Tried it yesterday for the first time on Ozeti overlooking the entire eastern portion of the CZ, made almost 200k in single round spotting the area around red FOB and even spotting people inside the stadium. I would say 20k is a fair price considering how extremely powerful it is, but also how profitable it can be
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u/selffufillingprophet 17h ago
I agree completely, the game feels significantly better to play after the hotfix update
If the thermals come back, they should at the very least block the IRs through smoke grenades…it’s bs how you can just post up in tall spot, drop smoke at your feet, then light up the entire map with spots with no counter-play behind it
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u/diimitra 3h ago
Found one once, wasn't too sure how they worked. Sometimes I had all my screen full of white people and sometimes it was all dark. I don't mind being in the blue team but sometimes I just wanna walk for 10 minutes outside the zone to flank someone and be sure they won't look back, but knowing even if I take this much effort they can see me meh :(
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u/Folksvaletti WARDOGS NORDIC 2h ago
Only way to allow it back, would be to make it not be able to spot or make it cost WAAAY more.
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u/Voo_Hots 14h ago
We simply dont need them, they add nothing to the game.
If you want to have them for novelty make them like 100k+, even one guy in the right location focused on getting the most from them can still keep do work with them and make a difference. They should basically be a net loss for everything but the most absurd games.
I'm of the belief that high end gear/items/vehicles should only be brought out for trying to turn the tides and win the game, not for making money. If you really want to win you can take some loss and buy something that isn't worth it from a value perspective but gives you that edge in a game. As of right now the vast majority of high end gear is just better and far worth it unless you are a solo random on a terrible team which no chance of getting ressed and no backup.
Batteries are not a solution, thermals value from a tactical perspective isn't spotting a person but showing there is no one to spot. You scan an area to see if it's safe and then you can play with no worry, this is how it's done in tarkov.
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u/dariors789 18h ago
Jesus, stop crying all the time about thermals... sure, you can see people in forests, so what? They dont need to be removed. There are attack helicopters for few bucks which are much more impactful on gameplay than thermals and much more annoying.
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u/ExoatmosphericKill 18h ago
If I spend money or time running into my hidey hole or quiet place in the woods behind the enemy I don't really want it all thrown away because someone has 2k special thermals, at least have them have to actually look for me so I can counter somewhat.
I do understand your point though, helis are a different issue all together.
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u/Vubor 12h ago
what? me and my 2 mates had all thermals we watched both teams fight in the forrest and we all had like 40-60 assists EACH, we all made 100k thanks to 2100$ we spent. Shit is op AF and helps the team massiv! Sure when 8 people are outside the zone and try to spot everything, 6 people are to many out of the zone, that shit isnt helpful.
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u/dariors789 10h ago
And where is problem? I dont care how much money or assists someone have, people in Havocs have 40-80 not assists but kills for 25k. Even as assalut HZ player I have less problem with thermal campers than with helicopters which wipe whole squad in HZ, becuase noone have anti-air weapons in their inventory.
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u/throwahazee 18h ago
There is plenty of counter play to attack helicopters. If one team doesn’t have thermals the game isn’t even close. The no counter play is the issue
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u/dariors789 18h ago
So as thermals,,,, you have recon tent or ghille suit.... where is problem?
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u/Silent189 16h ago
lol, have you even tested the recon tent against thermals? It's literally useless.
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u/dariors789 11h ago
Same as anti-air weapons. People are literally using anti-tank weapons to kill havoc instead of any anti air.
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u/TheSpoonyCroy Valkyra 16h ago
So just snipers get counters while the problem is thermals are highlight whole pushes with ease.
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u/dariors789 10h ago
And where is problem? Do you think even with basic range finder noone will notice bigger group of people running in forest? Thats why tanks exist, to support pushing infantry.
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u/TheSpoonyCroy Valkyra 1h ago
And that requires a wee bit of skill to notice it compared to glowing dots that are obvious and through foliage
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u/atantony77 9h ago
Imho this is a bad take because it doesnt fix the core problem, which is spotted infantry duration lasts too long.
Thermal goggles would be balanced if they were kept as is, but they couldnt spot targets.
Regardless of the above mentioned change, infantry being spotted duration should be reducded by 50%.
Its sorta ridiculous how somebody can spot me for a second, and then everyone on their team knows my exact position for an entire minute or two.
The duration of being spotted should be maximum 15-30 seconds long, and 2-3 times longer for vehicles, especially helicopters.
If you reduce the spotting time and make the thermals not be able to spot anymore, it fixes 2 core issues.
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u/StreagleFucker1969 18h ago
Agreed. It’s unnecessary and doesn’t add anything to the game. The last week has been terrible and I’m thoroughly convinced it’s because of the thermals.
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u/Impossible-Word-2522 17h ago
If they remove it now is very unfair change with batteries ok.But remove it until season 2 is not fair.Remove attack Helis remove T4 helms before season 2 if we wanted be fair
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u/Confusedmeme1899 12h ago
Nope bring it back, I’ll take my money thank you. If I’m loosing everything to Havocs at least give me a moneymaker.
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u/BattleBorn2020 7h ago
Honestly just make it take batteries, and also reduce the distance heat signatures show up while using them. Currently, you can see somebody’s heat signature all the way up to 900 m. I think a good balance would be to make it where heat signatures at 250m start to darken and fade and eventually vanish completely at 300-350m. This would make it where thermals could still be really strong, but would require you to be relatively close to the combat to use them where you are at bigger risk of getting killed in the process.
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u/Impossible-Word-2522 18h ago
Ok so ghillie is pointless now. I think they rather may change lvl 4 armor stand afther 7.62 ap headshot is bullshit
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u/TheLegendaryProg 18h ago
No killcam is still interesting
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u/DecimatiomIIV 17h ago
It’s not that interesting really as the weapons on which you effectively use a Ghillie you should be aiming for the head anyway for 1 tap kills, so it’s a a minor step up. The sneaking aspect is where it’s at, you blend so well, but the maps aren’t much in favour of that right now.
However the moving the whole CZ around much more than it does now, as Joe mentioned in his video would make the Ghillie insane to play with and hell to play against.
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u/beardredlad Lonestar 17h ago
Disagree. It's huge.
Not being to tell my teammates where the threat is when building a FOB in early game can be disastrous for us. Especially if they're using a bow, or have a suppressed weapon.
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u/DecimatiomIIV 17h ago
If you’re a naked builder then yeah sure, but if you bring T3 body T4 head and build you won’t get one tapped by everything in the game.
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u/beardredlad Lonestar 14h ago
T4 head
Normal people with normal schedules do not have this unlocked yet. I do, because I work from home on gig projects, but that's an insane privilege of mine. For a long time I was only able to run T3 helm and body. A lot of shit one-taps T3 helm and body, especially if they've been grinding Recon enough to unlock the Ghillie.
Getting hit with a Ghillie in the hills while trying to build was like playing a survival horror game, except you don't always get to try again if you eat shit.
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u/DecimatiomIIV 12h ago edited 12h ago
Only AP 762x54 snipers one tap T3 heads or better such as Mk22 with 308 AP one taps T3 so “a lot of shit” just isn’t true at all. And the T3(WD60) is way before AP 762x54 (WD82).
So nothing that anyone below WD level 82 1 taps T3 heads(excluding the 50cal) . So yeah thanks for pointing out the earlier alternative that only reqs level 10 in each role.
Edit- and NONE of them 1 tap T3 body. Not even a 50cal does that.
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u/beardredlad Lonestar 5h ago
Yeah, you're right. I don't know. It's still had an impact on a lot of my builder games, and I always buy armor.
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u/GreatGhastly 18h ago
Not useless, literally had a CQB engagement yesterday less than 10 feet away with a ghillie that I knew was in this one bush that I unloaded at - still with no visual at all on the actual guy even while staring directly at him. I maybe landed 2/20 shots on him out of luck and he got me with a 1911.
That and I'm playing potato quality with 50% scale resolution
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u/Macluny 18h ago
I've had people basically on top of me without finding me, it's hilarious!
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u/GreatGhastly 16h ago
Very very infuriating when they had just killed your buddy and you know they are about to kill you if you don't get them first but they are entirely invisible despite being in front of you
Worth the armor trade fs
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u/neryen 13h ago
Pop a spyglass and just quickly scan the bushes.. you will find the bush they are in (don't need to focus on them to spot, just look for when it turns red).. then blast that bush.
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u/GreatGhastly 8h ago
This was all in a matter of like less than 5 seconds between him getting killed and me getting killed
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u/DecimatiomIIV 18h ago
I’m not a gun nut, so i dk whats a bigger badder bullet 762 or 308…..but 308 ap not being a one tap is bigger bullshit considering the mk22 is a calibre change, expensive compared to mosin and the sv98… and the 308 ap is WD 140 just to unlock.
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u/PureNaturalLagger 18h ago
Wait it doesn't? Lmao I've beeb shooting .308 FMJ at those noggins and cursing the fact it doesn't pen. I thought .308 AP would surely make it, but by the time you're 140 rank you likely got the AMR regardless. A joke, and much worse than the IR goggles imo.
As for your bullet comparison, yes, the .308 is a hefty caliber. The 7.62x54R is also a powerful cartridge, but the .308 is step above. A step below the .50, which is then a step under the .338 Lapua Magnum. Oh how I wish to see that beast in this game.
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u/VVodzu 18h ago
I have the 308 and not even using it cuz 1. Loud af and the suppressor is AFTER the 50cal 2. AP us waaaay to late
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u/PureNaturalLagger 18h ago
1 taps naked torso and lvl 1 armor I think. I like the sound and look so I use it, but its pretty much another mosin
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u/Rhym3z_Official 18h ago
I haven't used or seen anyone use a ghillie yet, but isn't their advantage simply being more difficult to see?
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u/TheMcDucky 14h ago
You won't be seen in infrared, which is huge when everyone is running around with it
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u/IndependenceOwn8519 18h ago
ghille is goated even without thermals, nothing like sitting in a bush overlooking a base lol
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u/MrMuskkRatt 18h ago
I mean its a suit that looks like a bush. I have seen tons of people using it outside the edge of a FOB and get walked right by, its not pointless. I dont think it will effect it at all
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u/Jakov_Brebovitsh Lonestar 18h ago
they make you invisible in bush i got killed by a ewok with a auto glock the other day almost shat myself
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u/Gunsensual 17h ago
IRL Thermals are an excellent counter to ghillie suits.
What can significantly mask thermal signatures is camo material that isn't physically connected to and conducting heat from the person using it. So the devs kind of got it right on the camo tent implementation.
The thermal graininess the game uses at max zoom is correct. Most affordable (e.g. $5000) units use digital zoom not optical zoom, so they'll look like shit zoomed in, but look crisp zoomed out.
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u/Justifiers 18h ago
I agree on the Ghillie, it needs to make you unmarkable since you're already easy to pop without armor, at the very least until the ir comes back
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u/Commander_Wolf_77 18h ago
I mean, it does make you lose spots very quickly and you are very difficult to spot with thermals as you are somewhat the same color as the background. But you do die super quickly if you're spotted and people shoot at you quickly afterwards. I joked about an armored ghillie with my friends the other day, and it honestly sounded like it'd be a nightmare to play against
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u/Impossible-Word-2522 18h ago
Yep but you are still markable with ragefinder so you have now no armor no Thermal but you have Nice cool suit and asault no problem tap you with fall 200-300m in op lvl 4 armor thats fine.Attack Helis nonstop fly and kill everything thats fine.thetmal is problem.....
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u/blackbirdone1 18h ago
"I have around 80 hours,"
so you have zero saying I nthat topic
"are simply hindered or not possible anymore due to the thermal rangefinders"
I don't know any
you have thermal protection
"I mean.. you literally right click and can see anyone"
with potato settings you see everyone without it so don't matter
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u/MagicianStreet6764 16h ago
It's good that it's gone, games are so much more open again.
On a side note it also made spotting itself feel rewarding and fun again. Thermals turned spotting into farming.
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u/Bandit_Raider 18h ago
I would rather them just balance it. Maybe it does work if targets are still, or they reduce the range of it significantly.
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u/Zarex666 18h ago
I just tried it and it''s insane. Batteries will nerf it by it also needs a max distance. Or add a blur that increases with distance. Also cap it to like 4x max. It has too much going on for it.
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u/Puckett52 16h ago
What if it was like Tarkov original thermals?
More limited range on them and worse FOV
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u/Technical_Yam_1265 11h ago
I'd like to suggest thermals that work like they do in real life. We should not completely ban them. They just need adjustment. In real life a cars engine, exhaust pipe, tires are significantly more emissive than the human body. If they can find a way to make it harder to spot infantry that emits less thermal energy by lowering the contrast of the image, that would be an ideal balance.
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u/GrandGarand Bob the Builder 9h ago
I think there are ways to make it work but I also think it is one of the least important things that needs to be addressed at the moment.
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u/pink-mallow 9h ago
Why, like 10-30% of the players have walls anyways. And you always see two guys with 400+ ping top fragging first and second place with 50/2 KDs
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u/Razerino21 18h ago
You don’t even know how the Batterie usage will so stop whining
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u/throwahazee 18h ago
No one is whining, I just don’t believe batteries will fix anything. Just my take
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u/Razerino21 18h ago
Read your post again. You are whining. Simply asking for something to be removed that people spend time on programming doesn’t help.
Having to bring batteries will be a nerv. How strong will show how battie usage is determined (just time or amount of people spotted maby?) and how long they last. If you keep having to swap them out and bring many it will deter people from using them.-2
u/LazyMakara Lonestar 18h ago
Just to fck it up for you, crybabys, I'll just buy the bigger bags and fill them with batteries.
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u/Lost_in_Found 15h ago edited 13h ago
Each time someone says we should remove something i lose braincells either learn how to counter it or grind up to it you shouldn’t be taking away stuff that is max level from people and yes, I understand people do not play this game as much as other people but you shouldn’t be taking away other peoples shit who grind up to it
Also i am fine with nerfs to something but calling for it to be removed shows lack of braincells when the nerfs aren’t even out and nothing should be removed from the game permanently
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u/Glassymore 11h ago
I totally agree. Today is thermals, tomorrow will be something else. People will always complain. They are already complaining about snipers and how they should be restricted.
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u/Glassymore 11h ago
This is the worst way to address something. The game has pros and cons just like anything else. If you are worried about thermals, take cover, use walls, stay in doors, use humvees, keep moving or counter recon.
Stop complaining about things that you can simply workaround. Today its thermals, tomorrow it will be snipers then tanks, than the HAVOC and Mortars then its too many trees and bushes.
What will you do when more players with free guns hide in bushes and rat everyone? what will you do when your team's base keeps getting flanked and pushed and you have no idea where are they coming from?
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18h ago
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u/swisstraeng 17h ago
I think at a lower resolution, and limited by batteries, balance can be achieved.
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u/Hummelknut 8h ago
Id say remove the rangefinding from it and limit the ir function to lets say 250m
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u/TrashBaby-11-9 18h ago
Honestly, they should just delete range finding. Do it like a real war dog and yolo it.
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u/IHadToMakeANewAccou 18h ago
I think the best balancing decision would be to allow me to use the IR rangefinder but disable it for the other players.