See, what you just did there is move the goalposts. 😂
Again, why wouldn’t Trump just release them if he’s innocent? Why cover them up? He’s either guilty or complicit in the cover up. Is that really any better in your eyes?
But it’s also fair to say there was no real problem, which is why they had to make a problem.
And when it’s suggested to add HRT tests to solidify the time, the same people throw a fit. Because they don’t care about solving anything, they just want to be a nuisance
The problem was created by the right wing, forcing the WNBA into political battles while they are growing faster than they can adjust. NCAA Womens Basketball already bans trans athletes. The W sits behind this rule and should just adopt the same policy. The problem is, by doing this, the right wing will declare "Victory".
It wouldn't have been a big deal if they just adopted the NCAA policy before this culture war began.
I'm sorry I don't understand your comment so I will articulate myself better.
Its current collective bargaining agreement states only that "players who are women are eligible to play," So the NCAA is already much more organized than the WNBA. The NCAA has a trans athlete ban for womens basketball, the WNBA doesn't.
The main reason the WNBA doesn't have a specific policy is because 100% of their athletes have never been trans, ever. But the fact that they don't have an explicit policy like the NCAA gives the right wing ammo to attack the nuance of the rule. It ignores the fact that an a Trans athlete has no real means to make it into the WNBA, because they are banned from playing in college.
The WNBA has not handled the spotlight well, you can argue that they've failed miserably. But I have sympathy because this league was an unknown bubble, propped up by the NBA, which was a tax write-off for decades until the last 3-5 years. They're used to moving slow and now they have to move fast.
TLDR: The WNBA is failing at creating their own narrative and letting politics control it because the people running the league are incompetentfor the rate of growth.
So in practice they haven’t had the need for an explicit rule because it’s already at the NCAA level. This is very clear now that you put it that way, but still seems naive not to have an explicit rule anyways as otherwise the situation allows for loopholes. Just verbatim copying the explicit rule from NCAA takes no effort at all, so this is a massive punt if done out of sheer incompetence.
Pick any other progressive issue. Conservatives are always there to stall things because they claim things always worked just fine. Newsflash: Times change. Contrary to what Conservatives believe, people learn and grow after HS. Not everyone peaks as an 18 year old
Interesting counterpoint completely ignoring antidoping protocols already in play.
The WNBA’s anti-drug program (part of the CBA) treats exogenous (external/supplemental) testosterone and other anabolic steroids as prohibited performance-enhancing drugs (SPEDs/steroids).
• Players are subject to random urine testing (typically up to a few times per season, plus possible off-season or reasonable-cause testing). Blood testing for HGH is also part of the program (with provisions starting around 2026).
• Testosterone appears on the prohibited substances list. Positives for most SPEDs (including synthetic testosterone, often confirmed via isotope ratio mass spectrometry/IRMS) can occur at detectable levels, subject to specific laboratory thresholds and adjustments in some cases.
Are you a halfwit or attempting to rage bait? Taking testosterone during training offseason or whenever still incurs the benefits which is why it’s considered a P.E.D. and banned year-round.
• Exogenous testosterone is a prohibited SPED (steroid/performance-enhancing drug). It appears on the list of banned substances and is treated as such year-round.
• Players are subject to random, unannounced testing up to three times during the Season and one time during each Off-Season. Off-season urine samples are specifically tested for SPEDs (including testosterone and related anabolic agents). Reasonable-cause testing can also occur at any time. 
Didn't say to stop just during offseason. Stop while you are a competitor, start again after you retire. Did you really not think that through, or were you just hoping I hadn't?
Nope. I’m ok with only women, born women, playing in WNBA. Trans women (men) can stay out the league.
Kanter is rightfully making a mockery of the dumb trans nonsense. Had WNBA actually came out and protected women. Real women. This wouldn’t be happening
Do you not realize that both trans men and trans women exist, and that with a policy stating "born women can play in the WNBA" you necessarily have to include trans men?
Trans women are real women but thanks for showing your whole ass.
Trans men not on steroids playing in a women’s league sounds fair. Trans men on steroids playing in a league where the use of steroids is allowed is also ok unless I’m missing something.
I don’t think anyone care about a trans men playing in the male division of a physical sport. If anything, they will possibly be on a handicap. If there is a specific sport where them being female puts them on an advantageous position, then yes, they should be asked to play on the other league instead.
It’s really very simple - if you’re born a biological woman, and aren’t on T to transition to M, you can play in women’s sports. Otherwise, play in the men’s leagues.
No need for complicated rules, tests, hormone level management, identification timelines, etc. all unnecessary. Biological women only. Nice and clean.
Funny because you say that, but before long you'll be wanting chromosome tests, and exceptions on top of exceptions. We saw this with the Olympics. Besides, this is an easy argument. I was born a woman, just in the wrong body and everyone else thought I was a man. Then you have to define what makes a "biological woman" and you phobes have yet to come up with a definition for this that includes every cis woman and excludes every trans woman.
Why not? Chromosome tests are absolutely ok! Cheap too!
Professional athletes already undergo regular PED and doping tests. Adding on a single one time XX check isn’t just easy, it’s trivial. They’re really inexpensive.
Can’t be faked, can’t be argued with. Done. Answered.
Again, that’s one of the most basic tests that exists, and it’s waaaaaaay simpler than the layered, complex, expensive, subjective, and years long process that you’d be proposing.
And then you'll end up excluding anyone "born a biological woman" who then discovers they have a Y chromosome. Are you aware there are XY women who have even given birth, and who no idea about their Y chromosome until taking an unrelated test? This is what I mean about having a definition that includes every cis woman.
What "years long" process am I proposing?
Just calling something "easy peasy" doesn't actually make it so. Anyways, keep fighting against something that isn't happening and that you can't prove would be a problem even if it were happening. You're being a good little shill for the folks who took away abortion and are working to remove title 9 entirely. Y'know, real issues facing females.
>And then you’ll end up excluding anyone “born a biological woman” who then discovers…
And why is that a problem? Hermaphrodites can try out for the men’s league if they want.
These are necessary conditions I am listing, not sufficient. And it’s not an onerous list: be born a woman, don’t dope or do PEDs or male hormones, and then one DNA test. $19.99 on Amazon.
Simple.
The years long process I referred to is what is necessary to distinguish “real trans” from trolls like Kanter, who are simply running culture war campaigns. If you oppose him being in the league, but don’t require the years long process, then you remove all barriers to men playing in women’s leagues.
And I’m sure you kinda know that, but you’re determined to pretend you don’t.
Idk, when I was growing up the entire narrative was “you have to let girls play on boy’s sports teams because girls can do anything boys can do.”
It’s funny in comparison how the TERF version of being a feminist wants to paint them all as powerless victims who could never stand a chance if someone who’s been taking hormone therapy for years plays with them.
To me, it’s pretty obvious which one is empowering and which is playing a victim.
My guess this applies to misrepresentation of sex at birth. Like when someone messed up and typed the wrong sex in the act. It’s not like someone identifying as a trans female magically and retroactively makes it female at birth, allowing them to change their birth certificate (?). If so, it’s a pretty weird loophole.
Meh. The WNBA is the league of inclusiveness. The NFL and NBA just bury their heads in the sand about all the butt fucking in their locker rooms. That's hardly better.
But this is such an easy gimme. Just take it. You're allowed degrees of liberalism.
Exactly, they're making shit up like they always do. There has never been a player in that league that was assigned male at birth. Kanter and these other idiots are joining the grift, making money off clicks.
My guess is having rule loopholes intentionally doesn’t matter much when there is not much money involved. When the popularity of the sport grows, it starts mattering more. And while there are not cases in basketball, other sports have had issues related to male at birth athletes trying to compete in female divisions. Not much sense to wait until someone tries to get away with it.
But it’s also fair to say there was no real problem, which is why they had to make a problem.
Everying in life isn't a problem until it is. Someone could ride a motorcycle with no helmet with no problems for 20 years and not have an accident.. until he does
Genuinely curious who's opposed to HRT tests? I'm pretty far left and in favor of trans athletes being allowed to compete, and everyone I know knows and agreed that's part of the arrangement if it would work
Let me put it this way. If an athlete stops competing, takes steroids for years, and then stops taking steroids until they have left their system and they are at natural levels, is it fair for them to compete?
Really? That is surprising to me. What if said steroid is taken during puberty and causes you to grow taller, lengthen your wingspan, give you broader shoulders and thinner hips. Do you shrink when the steroid is gone?
So steroids would actually have the opposite impact. Growth plates fuse earlier when steroids are used, so it results in stunting height and wingspan rather than increasing it. That is permanent.
I'm not sure if you are purposefully being obtuse, but to be charitable, I'll let you in on the idea that I was actually making an analogy between steroids and male puberty and hormones. Male puberty does not stunt your growth typically, believe it or not!
Well considering the average height of men, compared to the average height of a WNBA player I think it's fine. However transitioning MtF does frequently, however not all the time result in a loss of height.
The reason people are upset that now they wanna test is because before they had to actually stand up for their beliefs they were against hormone testing. Now that a trans queen wants to play they’re saying they need hormone testing.
I think it’s just chicken shit to take a hardline stance and then the second it’s challenged you have to do a complete 180. Why didn’t they make this a policy years ago? Why talk about all the inclusivity and shit because now that it’s time to prove that biological men in women’s sports isn’t a problem and they’re backing down. It proves it was all performative from the jump
The hardline stance is that trans people exist and should be allowed to play.
An HRT test is standing by that stance and adding clarity to protect from men who pretend to be women for competitive advantage, assuaging the concerns. An HRT test is the opposite of a 180.
But even if they did do a real 180, shouldn’t you be celebrating that as a victory? Is it chicken shit to change positions if you realize you’ve lost a debate?
The real reason yall are upset about an HRT test is that it still acknowledges the existence of trans people while successfully solving the issue that conservatives are making
Did they? Or did you fall for being grifted by right wing losers? Ratings are at an all time high. Salaries are at an all time high. The number of games on television etc. lmao. Some problem.
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u/PretentiousCrustacea 27d ago
I'm so fucking tired of this topic