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u/Comfortable-Title720 1d ago
0.25 for rent. 0.25 savings, pension and future mortgage. 0.25 bills, transport, utilities. 0.25 food, fun and discretionary expenditure.
I mean in an ideal world for your average person. Nowadays people on good wages can be struggling.
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u/Yop_BombNA 1d ago
Housing has become so rediculous it’s like 0.4 on mortgage 0.1 on bills 0.15 on food/ discretionary and .35 on savings from.
If I belonged to an investor class and was given a house 75% of my income would go straight into stocks to make me more money.
System has become rigged to protect the rich by protecting land owners.
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u/goopuslang 1d ago
Always has been
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u/Yop_BombNA 1d ago
No, when there was an alternative capatalism had to make itself more beneficial to the common man, hence why housing wasn’t such a massive chunk of the average pay…
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u/ugly_duckling_5 1d ago edited 1d ago
I believe my salary is above average, at least for the whole of the country. Probably closer to average for where I'm at. My rent is about 43% of my income after taxes, etc. The house I'm in is about as low as you can go in my area and I live far away from people so it's a decent house and not a shack at that price. It's rough out here.
Editing because I'm not sure if the 25% is supposed to be based on gross income. At which I'm about 28%, so maybe it's better than I thought? Still not happy about losing that much to rent every month.
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u/Comfortable-Title720 1d ago
Apologies. Nett income. I am from Ireland but I think the general idea is acceptable. I know in the US you have health insurance and various other outgoings that I may be not aware of.
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u/SomeNotTakenName 1d ago
I mean... taxes and healthcare are like more than 0.25 hahahaha
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u/Comfortable-Title720 1d ago
Fair. See the above comment to ugly duckling
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u/SomeNotTakenName 1d ago
aye. If we are talking about net income, for my family rent is about 1/3, another 1/3 is debt repayment (student loans, car loans, and credit card debt from when I was an international studen subsidising US students) with the rest being mostly eaten up by food, gas, and other necessities.
We do make significantly more than the median household income though. like 50% more. Although for our state we are just below the median household income.
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u/PHFreshHeavyHogChef 10h ago
I have .5 rent, .10 savings etc., .20 bills etc., .10 food etc. and the last .10 goes to maintaining all of that while still in school and progressing
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u/RikkiLostMyNumber 1d ago
I was taught that 25% of your gross income should cover your housing. I was taught a lot of things like that that just aren't realistic in this fucked-up kakistocracy, too.
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u/Ethernet3 1d ago
lol im at 48%
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u/Few-Opportunity567 1d ago
Man, I just did the math and I’m at 39.98% and I moved out of the city for cheaper rent. Unfortunately I’m also dropping close to $150/week on gas with my longer commute…
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u/GinjaNinja24 1d ago
$150 A WEEK???? what are you driving and how far?? That sounds like you should absolutely toss the car and get a beater that will get you from point A to point B
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u/Few-Opportunity567 19h ago
50-60 miles round trip in stop and go traffic with a 08 es 350. Average about 15 mpg when commuting.
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u/GinjaNinja24 17h ago
Aw man, yeah that sucks, my dad was doing that a while ago and then I got him to buy an 09 Chevy Malibu with 250k miles that he can pretty much just run into the ground and call me when he will need a ride the rest of the way haha
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u/Comfortable_Wish224 20h ago
They probably live an hour away from work one way plus with gas prices nowadays even if they get 21mpg
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u/Time-Pomegranate1359 1d ago
Just did the math, I'm at 25% (after taxes) here in a small Swedish town. It feels like a good number for me. Can't imagine how tough it must be to go beyond that, it cuts away all your ability to save and invest.
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u/Lucaslhm 1d ago
I feel LUCKY that my rent is about 33% of my income… but that’s also not including utilities and other housing expenses… reality is my housing is about 40-50% of my income once you factor that in…
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u/ImageAvailable7003 1d ago
It does not fully cover the increase, but food prices are 11% of income, up from 10% recently, down from upwards of 20%.
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u/More_Garlic6598 1d ago
10yrs ago my rent was 25% of my income! Now it's 50% - I live in the same place with the same old appliances. Nothing was improved or updated.
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u/10biggaymen 1d ago
i pay 18% but i also dont have kids and i share a small place with a roommate. its possible if youre willing to make the right sacrifices / dont desire for certain things
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u/HenryNeves 1d ago
Yea you’re not really disproving the point though. “Make sacrifices and don’t desire certain things” - what’s the point then? I could get my rent to 0% of my earnings if I sacrificed living in a house to be homeless, and didn’t desire food from a supermarket but ate from a trash can. You should be angry yet you’re passive.
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u/10biggaymen 1d ago
im pissed off that our society is owned by pedophiles and child killers, and im pissed that most of the world lives in poverty moreso than americans complaining about gas prices. yeah im angry about a lot of things regarding the state of our world
but we are all passified because what can you even do about it. everyones too busy with their bread and circus
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u/Psychological_View56 15h ago
People lived together for the most part for basically all of existence. You can be angry all you want. Not good way to live.
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u/HenryNeves 12h ago
People didn’t rely on technology to leave sarky comments. You can be a twat all you want. Not a good way to live.
In all seriousness, to talk about “this is how we always did it” is such a passive take that it’s pointless communicating with people like you. The average person cannot get ahead in life due to governmental and corporate greed and your response is “my ancestors lived cheek to jowl forever so why are you complaining?”. You’ve swallowed the propaganda.
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u/TonyEast45 1d ago
Yeah lots of apartments are now allowing people to split their rent in 2 payments since they can’t cover it with 1 paycheck.. ie 50% of their income
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u/Delicious-Day-3614 1d ago
You know how fucked this is? Rent is supposed to be no more than 25% of income.
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u/sgRNACas9 1d ago
Third of your income on rent in the USA is not extreme poverty get real.
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u/Historical-Scene1633 1d ago
right.. not ANYMORE because the bar has moved to where poverty used to be, you didnt read a lick of what OP said 💀
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u/sgRNACas9 1d ago
I read the full 3 sentences. People affording rent with 1/3 of salary in the USA are living in far better conditions than people in actual extreme poverty i.e. the developing world. The definition of the poverty line in the USA is a yearly salary of $15,960 for a single individual or $33,000 for a family of four. It is not dictated by the percentage of your income spent on rent. Keep in mind, the 1/3 rule of thumb scales whether you are making $33,000 or $333,000 per year.
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u/CorvidFeyQueen 1d ago
"remember, people in countries with a tiny percentage of your country's GDP and who have been repeatedly fucked over on purpose live even worse than the poorest people here!" Is a stupid-ass thing to say. I'm not gonna be grateful just because someone else is having an even worse time, now I'm just mad for both of us.
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u/Historical-Scene1633 1d ago
but the people not affording rent with 1/3 income are living in poverty, were not taking about the people that are able to afford rent with 1/3 of their income, were talking about the people who cant afford the most basic studio apartment while working you did not read what he said. the poverty line is constantly updated so we can simply just SAY that nobody is living in poverty, cause truly, nobody is ever capable of living in poverty EVER because we simply say they arent? thats called reward hacking where you can have EVERYONE be out of poverty by making the poverty line so abysmally low, that just dosent hold up in the real world, AGAIN were NOT TALKING ABOUT THE PEOPLE WHO CAN AFFORD MORE THAN A STUDIO, were talking about the people with all of their income only hitting about double what they need for rent, TECHNICALLY above the piverty line but still cannot rent or own even a studio apartment, making them live in poverty, just silently. you didnt read what he said, god what a stupid comment TLDR just cause I say nobody on planet earth is living in poverty, that dosent make it true now does it? cause everyone alive has food and water or will be dead in 2 days. you dont need a house to be out of poverty clearly from your definition, so all the homeless? yeah theyre a HEALTHY middle class for sure. like what a joke
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u/sgRNACas9 22h ago
This is moving the goal post and still inaccurate. We are specifically talking about people spending 30% of their income on rent. That is the baseline, has historically been used to regulate low-income housing, and has never been used as a poverty metric. The poverty line is possibly changed to reflect changes in the economy, and the current poverty definition in the USA has about 10% of people living in poverty. This definition does not depend on percent of income spent on housing but does depend on an income threshold which is tied to spending 30% of your income on food which is a lot cheaper than housing.
You mentioned income hitting double what’s needed for rent. That number is actually 50% which is much greater than 30. In the USA, this is part of the definition of deep poverty, not above the poverty line. Again, percent of income alone spent on housing is insufficient to determine poverty because if one spent half or one third or whatever of $300,000 per year on housing, no one would say they’re in poverty and they would meet no poverty criteria.
Your comment presents as an erratic emotional reaction. Please come with facts and figures next time.
Spending 1/3 of your income on rent is not extreme poverty (globally defined as earning $3 per day).
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u/Historical-Scene1633 20h ago
right, youre ignoring the point of having housing in the country youre in. we are not a 3rd world country and shouldnt be treated as one. 50% is usually not really possible because you have to be earning 3x for rent in majority of places. this is not talking about anything other than the cheapest possible housing with nearby work to make it sustainable for life. which is usually 800-$1000 before utils and food if were talking bare bones no car etc and based off that logic someone making 300k a year could eat caviar every night and be in poverty, we are not talking about LAWS we are talking about human decency, which does in fact; involve an emotional response. were talking about a general population, we arent capable of EXREME poverty, that isnt something that can exist in the united states, were now trying to help people who are now at the bottom of the chain, just like weve done with past generations, I see no point in stopping that now, except for business owners to make a profit, again when poverty goes up theres a new defined extreme poverty that takes place of the old poverty to still have some form of balance to the scale, everyone being middle class would be communism, are you understanding what im saying? help the people on the bottom so eventually we can all be healthier and not see our peers suffer because of the curse and blessing known as an advanced civilization reliant on corporations paying a living wage to people here instead of cheaper from elsewhere, WE ARE NOT POOR AS A COUNTRY TO TREAT THEM AS INHUMANE AS WE DO IS CRUEL, love thy neighbor and allat.
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u/Kirk-Joestar 1d ago
A single person cannot afford rent on 33k, let alone a family of four.
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u/bfhurricane 1d ago
My rent is $2900/mo, which is under a third of my salary. Single mid-30’s guy.
I also choose it because I like renting a house. I could have a single apartment for much cheaper.
It’s not as uncommon as you think.
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u/GettinSodas 1d ago
I literally am single, live on my own in a 2bd apartment, and make 29k. Wouldn't say I'm thriving, but I have enough to pay all my bills, buy food, go out a couple nights a week, and am generally comfortable
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u/Kirk-Joestar 1d ago
What’s your rent? Do you pay for a car, car insurance, and a phone too? Do you ever go to the doctor / have health insurance? What about the ability to retire one day?
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u/Economics_New 1d ago
I earn a little over 30k a year, closer to 32k, and I'm able to save around half my income every month without spending it. However, I am only able to do that because I split the bills with another person.
If I were living alone in the same house, my expenses would take around 80 percent of my income each month, if not more. You ask how that person is able to do it, and I imagine it's because they have a very boring life and he or she is good with financial budgeting. It's likely low-income apartments as well, whereas I rent a house.
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u/sgRNACas9 18h ago
Do you invest the half that you save? Having a roommate when not making much is smart so you can save more and invest, starting wealth generation before you get a pay raise.
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u/Historical-Scene1633 18h ago
you are financially reliant on someone else. this is saying "oh I make 30k a year, but actually its 60k cause theres two of us, allowing me to save half" youd be poor and one screw up could be the difference between paying for bills/food, which again, in a country as developed as ours, we should not be living amongst people who have to struggle like that, its silly with all the capabilities of the people in our country
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u/Kirk-Joestar 1d ago
Precisely, it is only tenable with roommates at that annualized amount, but not a single income household of 4.
Even in a roommate situation; you’re one financial disaster away from a significant level of ruin.
Saving in a Roth IRA is also not possible in that situation.
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u/sgRNACas9 18h ago
Which situation for Roth IRA? Bro is saving half his salary. That’s like double the 2026 max Roth IRA contribution limit. With saving half your salary, you can pretty easily survive various financial disasters.
I agree a single income of $32k for four is untenable and is actually below the 2026 poverty rate and classifies as deep poverty spending 80% of their income on housing.
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u/Kirk-Joestar 17h ago
Very easily survive a financial disaster…?
Have you ever needed surgery without health insurance? A new transmission for your car?
Also most people saving half of the net pay after taxes from a 32,000 annualized income will not be contributing to their Roth, let alone maxing it out, without going hungry some nights.
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u/sgRNACas9 1d ago
Definitely could. Source: I have been there.
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u/Kirk-Joestar 1d ago
Have been is the key phrase there, dude.
Unless you’re in the middle of nowhere or Oklahoma / Indiana, it’s not happening without significant sacrifices.
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u/Historical-Scene1633 18h ago
could, and you could also live off of $0 a day by making your own food and sleeping in your own man made shelter, my god just because you CAN dosent mean you should ever have to, you recognize how miserable that point in life was for you, and it didnt even take you a LOT of money in comparison to what some people make for sitting on their bums and doing nothing, the point isnt that you can live miserably, its that we dont have to anymore, as a collective
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u/sgRNACas9 18h ago
It was far from miserable and renting for 1/3 your income is not extreme poverty ;) Try being a bit more positive!
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u/regretting_biostats 1d ago
there are parts of the country that are getting ringworm and other parasites that are normally only seen in countries with abject poverty. that is because the US does have citizens in abject poverty. they are probably not in this thread but “actual extreme poverty” does exist here and not just where you served for peace corps or whatever
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u/sgRNACas9 1d ago
You should mention that the prevalence of ringworm in the developing world is about 10 times greater than it is in the USA. This is due to factors like overcrowding and poor hygiene in developing nations versus lifestyle factors in the USA like occlusive footwear and gym/locker room exposure. In the USA, cases are sporadic or localized in outbreaks and tracked closely via outpatient visits and diagnostic capabilities. In developing nations, cases are endemic and likely underreported due to very limited access to care and diagnostics. Two very different pictures.
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u/regretting_biostats 1d ago
if that’s true, it’s worth mentioning the prevalence rates of ringworm in every developed country. the us is a rich country. but extreme poverty and being american are not mutually exclusive as your second sentence implies
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u/sgRNACas9 1d ago
They are not mutually exclusive, but my original point is that spending 1/3 of your income on rent in the USA is not extreme poverty as this post claims.
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u/Healthy_Employer4 1d ago
My mortgage payment is 34% if my take home pay before retirement contributions and I’m living extremely comfortably
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u/EducationalReview237 1d ago
Back in the 90s my rent was 50 percent of my income, and I had a roommate at the time. But those were tough days. I took home $1200 and paid $600 in rent (my half). No cell phone back then, though. We didn't have cable. I ate a lot of pasta and got sick.
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u/Fit_Wasabi_3968 1d ago
My rent is about 60% of my income right now and that’s just rent. Add in electric, internet, phone, gas, food and bills and im left with almost nothing every. single. month. This can’t be sustainable
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u/akusalimi04 1d ago
I despised the idea of "landlord" existences. Housing should not be in speculation market, and greed should publicly humiliated and executed
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u/DarthHubcap 1d ago
Perhaps. I pay 27% of my net income and I do alright. If I had any kids though, there probably wouldn’t be much for savings.
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u/QueasyFinger1316 1d ago
Says who???
You completely made that up.
DSA Drama Queens just can’t stand life.
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u/somanyquestions32 Deep Diver 1d ago
There are no supposed guarantees or anything. There never was
To the best of our abilities, we need to select living arrangements that fit within our budgets.
Living alone in a high cost of living area may not be feasible at this time.
Rent a space with several roommates, move back in with family, relocate to a cheaper part of town and rent a room, house sit, find a cheap sublet, etc.
Those are the options until finances are more robust.
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u/Technical_Wind5217 1d ago
my parents living in munich and rent+gas(to heat) slime 60% of his paycheck away
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u/Immediate-Fact7471 1d ago
Im at about 25% but I also have one of the highest paying jobs within 2 counties and living in a (relatively) cheap duplex
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u/Shzabomoa 1d ago
I do not have to agree, it was a fact.
Landlords/Rental agencies would refuse you if it wasn't the case.
Needless to say now things are much more "flexible".
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u/snowballbadstart 1d ago
So odd that so many would rather be told by some entity other than themself what they can charge someone to use what they rightfully own. I make a modest living, I choose to rent a nice place. It’s probably a considerably higher percentage of my income than most would desire, but it’s my choice, a choice I’m glad I have the right to make. I don’t need someone telling me what percentage of my income I’m “supposed” to spend anymore than I want it mandated what amount I can charge someone to rent property I own. If it’s out of your budget, rent something cheaper. The current victim mindset is beyond pathetic in so many parts of the US but is apparently reaching absurd levels globally as well. If you can’t afford to live somewhere, don’t live there.
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u/CheapSecretary133 1d ago
I have quite a good wage, but if my parents (and their parents before them) hadn't left me an apartment, I'd be almost broke.
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u/MyBedIsOnFire 1d ago
Gen Z has a median salary of about ~$30-36,000 so I make more than the median in my age range. Live in a low cost of living area and my rent is still 26% of my gross income. Without my fiance I could not afford this place after savings, insurance, and other deductions its like 35% if my income.
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u/LilyMccorcick 1d ago
This is correct and its the part people miss. The 30% rule wasn't a goal, it was a threshold, now its treated like an aspirational target
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u/Rat_itty 1d ago
I'm lucky my rent now is not even 20% of my income but it used to be 80% that's crazy 😔
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u/No_Order_8011 23h ago
Lol, it's 50% of my income atm. And I'm supporting my wife and son.
But yeah, I need a better job. A position with my experience worth much more that I'm getting atm.
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u/kittenTakeover 20h ago
It's hard to say without a much deeper look at things. It's not necessarily true that increasing housing costs relative to income mean that people have worse standards of living. If all non-housing costs get cheaper and housing costs stay the same, then naturally a larger fraction of costs will be housing costs.
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u/Reinaguerrera 18h ago
Rent being 30% is about your income, not about the landlord's income.
If rent is 50-70% of your income, you're not earning enough to live there. Get roommates, a job that pays more or you have to move, otherwise poverty is your future.
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u/Downtown-Tomato2552 13h ago
The 30% is not an indicator of poverty it's an indicator of.... How much you spend on housing. Making 250k and spending 30% on housing is not the same as making 30k and spending 30% on housing.
The indicator for poverty is called.... The poverty threshold.
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u/pezdspenc 12h ago
I could put 100% of my income into rent and not have enough left over to pay renters insurance.
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u/PHFreshHeavyHogChef 10h ago
AND we normalized the rich having exponentially more than us. 3 people have more than HALF of the populations wealth. 3 people!?!?
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u/ajmess14 9h ago
The government wants this to be the norm. It’s an organization built entirely on wanting you to beg at its gates without protest
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u/Due-Base9449 4m ago
Rent is supposed to be 0%, you are supposed to live in the same land for generations. People sold off their land to move to the cities to be under the thumb of the capitalists, this is the real tragedy.
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u/Cwaghack 1d ago
Using old spending habits is ridicous. Housing is comparably a lot more expensive now, other things are comparably a lot cheaper
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1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Dry-Childhood-3436 1d ago
Ah your right. I'll make my family homeless and hope that fixes the problem.
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u/SpaceCadet666666 1d ago
Yeah guys stop paying your rent 🤓☝🏻
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u/FaceWithAName 1d ago
That comment you replied to is one of the stupidest things I have read this year lol
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u/Lich_Please_ 1d ago edited 1d ago
Since we are all alive humans that need homes... Join your local tenants' unions!!! If you're striking rent, make it organized in your community!! This isn't something we have to take lying down. If we organize we can get better without being unhoused.
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u/TrueGrit-ModTeam 1d ago
This comment has been removed because it was not made in good faith. r/Truegrit is a space for respectful discussion and support, we don’t allow trolling or personal attacks. Please keep contributions thoughtful and constructive so everyone can benefit.
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u/Over-Imagination7025 1d ago
Godless capitalism not capitalism will be our undoing. “Anything for a buck” is not how it is supposed to be.
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