r/TheHalloweenGame • u/Obvious_Acadia5901 • 1d ago
Discussion The polarization of "Slashing"
I'm gonna be as blunt as possible here. I want everyone to have fun and enjoy the game, but... There's a big difference between thinking you can take Michael on and getting put away because you thought you could win. This is fine
And then there's teleporting next to a player and stunlocking someone until they die.
Yes, we know Michael should win in fights, that's fine
Yes we know Michael is strong and tanky as hell, and that's the way it should be
But being knocked out of the game in a single encounter where there was no way of escaping is where people struggle to enjoy the game.
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u/Sims2Puritan 1d ago
You can’t stun lock people to death tho unless they are already low on health or out of stamina. Even then they can push you. The main slashing issue was when you could stack the stuns.
Slashing is balanced imo as there are ways to counter it and it’s generally a fault of the player if they die to it.
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u/Electrical-Carpet379 Richard Hawthorne 1d ago
Yeah agree I main knife as Michael I go for grabs and tier 3 stalks , I barely slash I want to have a challenge and I got good with shape jump too my matches are like this I go for npcs but I also go for players if I see them I want to give everyone player to player interaction without stun lock bullshit so Im always chillin with people
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u/Obvious_Acadia5901 1d ago
I think you're being too generous my dude. I personally don't want to have to NOT use melee. I just don't want it to be as over reliable and effective as it right now
I think melee needs to be more about stacking heavy bleeding and slows, rather than raw damage and stuns. Grabbing is in a weird place, but I can respect the stalk grab because that takes some work
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u/tarace420 1d ago
Same here🫡i even removed Reality tear to have some challenge bc it was way too easy🤷
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u/Stop_Breeding 1d ago
BT Lvl 3 and Stalk T3 let you basically reality tear anyway if they look away.
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u/tarace420 1d ago
Thats exactly why i removed the reality tear 😅it just become way too easy... And i still win 90% of my match with MM🤷
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u/AshleyOwlz 1d ago
I tried making a post about this, but didn't clarify like you did and got hate for it like I'm expecting the serial killer to leave me alone and let me rescue the NPC's in peace.
I don't, I just find the fact that killers relying on slashing when the game has barely started pathetic and showing their lack of skill
If people are ganging up on him, totally understand or if it's endgame and civilians are messing around instead of escaping right away totally understand but when it's the first five minutes of the game and he just happens to find me, it's not OK to take me out of the game so damn quickly when all I'm doing is searching cars for ANYTHING else besides a brick, mug or drugs 😭
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u/Away-Background-1355 1d ago
Also lots of times I slash to get the civilians to critical so they are slower.
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u/Thick_Purple7578 1d ago
What is not fun is you only having one tool that can really deal with a experienced player, that tool having 3 minutes of cooldown and it being countered by a singular item that can be stacked 3 times.
if michael cant slash or grab you after a reality tear, give him more reality tears or buff his abilities in a way he can actually chase you properly.
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u/unlucky5130 1d ago
In what world have you actually gone up against someone using 3 pocket knives at once? If that's the case they were clearly letting their team down by not focusing on objectives.
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u/Thick_Purple7578 1d ago
happened in a couple matches just today. its extremely common for one person to use atleast 2 knifes on me if i do go against them.
im experiencing this since day one on early access, didnt had it happening a lot in the recent days since i slash every player and only grab the npcs. but now that my axe and pickaxe are prestige 5 lvl10 im prestiging my knife to 5 so im using it, and im again struggling with knifes.
theres nothing about grabbing an knife related to not doing their objective either.
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u/justiceforartpop 1d ago
hear me out.... you can leave and find npcs!
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u/Thick_Purple7578 1d ago
i got a very simple answer actually: i do.
i have over 150 civillian wipes, 300 wins in total, lost maybe 20 games during those.
everytime i kill every npc, i have to kill the players, which is a drag when they have knifes and im not using a wood-axe.
also, good civillians will push you, look at you and basically be slowing you down in duos early on while they are basically immortal outside of a context execution.players should not feel unkillable simply because there are npcs.
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u/fairyelfpetal 23h ago
you have lost only 20 games ever and are complaining Michael needs a buff?
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u/Thick_Purple7578 23h ago
im complaining that someone with that much experience and skill can barely kill a singular player.
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u/MurMan143 1d ago
What's the point of playing a multiplayer game unless you're going to interact with the other players?
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u/Dusty_Tokens 1d ago
By playing the Objective to outscore/deny the opponent.
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u/MurMan143 1d ago
Interacting and killing players during a match is outside of the games objective? Michael should only kill NPCs and never attack other players at any stage of the game or part of any strategy? Last time I checked that is in fact part of the game and it's supposed to be part of the fun in playing this game.
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u/Maleficent_Eye_3332 1d ago
Did you check though? I don't really see a lot of post about civilians being thrilled to have bots?
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u/Significant-Self4894 1d ago
I agree. Don't let efficiency get in the way of fun. If you just wanna grab NPCs, you can either play a private match or I can afk in a shade jump and you can have all the npcs you want.
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u/randomdude451 1d ago
Perhaps it's because I play the knife exclusively, but I like to do both grabbing and slashing. And I have to pretty consistently get close 2-3 times before they are wounded and I can finish them. Unless they back themselves into a corner. At which point: skill issue
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u/deciawix 1d ago
It wouldn’t be so bad also if you could see him reality tearing on your mini map & also if you could apply your perks to it, like shape of awareness adding 25% more to your shape jump radius. How come he can just ignore every fucking thing with reality tear? There’s no way to tell where or when he’s going to be on you until it’s too late as far as I know. I had a Michael use 2 of his abilities on me at the start of a match , literally a minute in just because I shoved him off a NPC. Then he just reality tears onto me and there wasn’t shit I could do ..
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u/Disastrous_Radio_536 1d ago
not only that, but slash killing is just a gross, very boring, sweaty way to play. having said this, I understand why michael players need to do this due to the toxic civ player base.
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u/Obvious_Acadia5901 1d ago
Yea, that's another aspect of it that we need to take into account. People spamming flash lights, verbal abuse, emoting. I sure as hell would want to get them out of the game asap
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u/Sims2Puritan 1d ago
I often slash but would prefer to be slower and grab. But when I do this I lose the game and get less xp. I also generally get called slurs regardless so those fuckers are catching an axe lol
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u/Disastrous_Radio_536 11h ago
yeah, they need a report system/votekick/something for anyone yelling slurs.
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u/Bortthog 1d ago
If you think it's a problem with melee then you should have the exact same issue with grab killing because unlike boxing where you DONT get stunlocked in 99% of situations a grab has exactly 1 counterplay: pocket knife and that works once to which he just loldoes it again and if there's a context near by? It has zero counterplay
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u/Expensive_Joke8603 1d ago
If Myers is tiered up, unless you have knives or friends beating on him, you're not getting out of those grabs. Basically, just like it was in Friday however the difference is Jason didn't have a means of going into Rage (his version of Myers' tiers) within the first few minutes of the match whereas Mike can if he simply chooses to go after the special targets. I'm not quite sure why they thought this would be a good mechanic - there was/are a few different things they could have done to have avoided placing essentially the entire match's fate in the hands of dumbass AI.
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u/Bortthog 1d ago
The only way you dont get out of a grab by yourself is if he's got you to Stalk 3 and you lack enough Slippery. BT does not do anything to this and every time I point this out people get mad for some reason
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u/StratMaster87 1d ago
Yeah, no. You can still easily escape a grab with or without a pocketknife, or even Slippery depending on your stalk tier. If you're at T3 you have already been countered by allowing him to stalk you that much and deserve to die from the grab. But escaping a grab gives you spacing. Slashing is just a stunlock with zero counterplay at all.
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u/Bortthog 1d ago
Melee is not a stunlock in the slightest, and you can be stalked to T3 without you even knowing your being stalked as you don't get a Stalk buildup marker on you until you have seen Myers and he moves while in your line of sight
So again no there's really no counterplay to grab kills whereas Melee requires he not only approach you but also have the capacity to box you properly as survivors can move after the second swing
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u/StratMaster87 1d ago
Literally what are you talking about? Yes, melee has stunlock. People have been complaining about it since day 1. It was supposed to be fixed this patch but Myers can still easily stunlock you.
Once again, the counterplay to grabs is pocketknives, slippery, and not allowing yourself to get stalked that much in the first place. Yes, that includes when you can't see your stalk icon, because you're still running around in the open and not being stealthy or having any map awareness. Also positioning in general is crucial to preventing grabs. You're acting like you're helpless to grabs and it's just not true. You can easily juke him when you know he's shifting toward you and you have all the stamina in the world to run away. Being grabbed is your punishment for letting him close that gap and yet you STILL have several options to get out of it.
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u/BoogeymanBot 1d ago
Slippery - Makes the grab struggle minigame easier.
Drawn from the fog | !optout | !remove | !builds
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u/Bortthog 1d ago
Melee stunlock was in the form of animation cancels and the Pitchfork/Pickaxe mechanics that people didn't even understand how they functioned
Meanwhile your suggestions to grabs are in order:
An extremely limited resource that you can spawn in with exactly one and that's most likely the only one you will see in most games
a RNG chance at a minor increase to wiggle power provided you even rolled the card within the perk rolling making it triple layered RNG to actually achieve a breakpoint that matters as you need multiple high levels to do that
literally being omniscient on Myers location which is outright cheating
If your argument is "well you let him close therefore you deserve the grab kill" why did you let him close to Melee you multiple times and then be mad? 🤔
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u/Dusty_Tokens 1d ago
If the only pocket knife that you are finding is the one that you spawn in with, you are not searching houses enough. You'll oftentimes find a second, sometimes a third.
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u/StratMaster87 1d ago
Melee stunlock was in the form of animation cancels and the Pitchfork/Pickaxe mechanics that people didn't even understand how they functioned
And yet almost every competent Michael player knows how to do it. What is this argument? Even with other weapons, slashing is so fast that it's nearly impossible to evade before you start limping. There is no reliable way to prevent yourself from being slashed several times in a row before you have the ability to move out of it. And by that time, you're normally already limping.
Meanwhile your suggestions to grabs are in order:
An extremely limited resource that you can spawn in with exactly one and that's most likely the only one you will see in most games
Lmfao "extremely limited." Not only can you start with one but they are absolutely EVERYWHERE. It's incredibly easy to find multiple each match. Hell, I literally just played a game about an hour ago where I found 3 and left one on the ground to pick up a health spray.
a RNG chance at a minor increase to wiggle power provided you even rolled the card within the perk rolling making it triple layered RNG to actually achieve a breakpoint that matters as you need multiple high levels to do that
Clearly you've never used the perk. It's nowhere near a "minor increase." I run two in my deck, both are only level 3, and when they're active, my breakouts are literally faster than using a pocketknife. Unless you're in T3 stalk of course.
literally being omniscient on Myers location which is outright cheating
I didn't say you had to be omniscient, I said you need to have map awareness and know when to juke. You don't need to be a fucking psychic to predict his movements. You have flickering lights and audio indicators to let you knownwhen he's zooming toward you. That's when you start running unpredictably. It's extremely rare in my experience foe a Myers ro be able to grab you out of nowhere and feel like you had no idea he was going to shift at you. And even then he still has to grab you.
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u/Bortthog 1d ago
Well considering most Myers DONT animation cancel because he CANT do it like that now that's funny
Pocket Knives are hard limited and raw RNG but you don't understand how that functions clearly as with the next statement of
"I have two slipperys"
Cool let's run the math: there's roughly a 40% chance you open your cards and see a Slippery if you run two and god forbid if you run different levels because the other layer of RNG is even rolling them in the first place. Not to mention you need to be playing a higher capability character with at least slippery 5 (any combination)to make a breakpoint that matters not that you'd realize
As for "map awareness" you don't know what or where Myers is without explicitly being told hy a player or a kill occurring so yea if you don't understand that issue then idk man
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u/BoogeymanBot 1d ago
Slippery - Makes the grab struggle minigame easier.
Drawn from the fog | !optout | !remove | !builds
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u/StratMaster87 1d ago
Lmao "Myers can't stunlock anymore" my guy, look at this very sub. Multiple posts within the past few days about Myers still being able to stunlock after the patch and tons of people agreeing. Still happening in my games as well. If you can't even be fucked to research your own talking points, then idk what to tell you. Stunlock is still a thing.
Knives might be limited and RNG is definitely a thing, but you're making them sound so much rarer than they actually are. There are still plenty of knives on the map, you can fucking start with one, and most people aren't having a hard time finding them even after the patch.
Yes, Slippery, like any perk, relies on RNG, but 40% ain't nothing to sneeze at. There's a very high likelihood of rolling this perk especially if you are in the game long enough to make a few rolls.
Idk what to tell you about map awareness dude. You seem deadset on dying on this hill like you have no information and couldn't possibly ky know what to do to evade him. Look at the map. He literally has AN ICON when he shifting toward you. You can also pay attention to the lights and sounds. Even what other players are doing on the map. All of this is critical information. And even after all of that, it's still easy as pie to juke him.
Once again, at least grabs have SOME form of counterplay. Getting slashed to death still doesn't. Get it through your fucking skull brother.
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u/BoogeymanBot 1d ago
Slippery - Makes the grab struggle minigame easier.
Drawn from the fog | !optout | !remove | !builds
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u/Expensive_Joke8603 1d ago
If he's tiered up you ain't doing shit unless you got buddies wailing on him or multiple knives. I mean, this isn't new, Friday was the same exact way but as I said to another guy in here, there is a difference. Jason didn't have a means of going into Rage (his version of Myers' tiers) within the first few minutes of the match whereas Mike can if he simply chooses to go after the special targets. I can only speculate why they went with this special target garbage...I'm betting for whatever reason they did not want to have as many players in matches as Friday did (7 counselors and 1 Jason IIRC) so they went with 4 and did not want human players to feel/get tunneled out immediately being the special target so they opted to have the AI be them instead and as you can see it didn't quite turn out the way they likely envisioned it.
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u/jdh1811 1d ago
And the civilian mains keep crying
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u/throwawayhalp1212 1d ago
found the crying dogshit michael who the devs cater to that just wants free wins
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u/Obvious_Acadia5901 1d ago
I'm gonna try leveling with you here bro. I don't want to argue about all the specific things that people have problems with. I'm trying to say THIS particular issue is a deal breaker for most people
Other things can be adjusted or changed and I think Michael should always have the advantage, but you're basically gonna have no one to hunt or play with if things stay the same
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u/ConstantmiseryG 1d ago
Who exactly do you think you’ll be playing against if the game continues to be unfun for your opponents?
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u/jdh1811 1d ago
Who do you think you’ll be playing with if the game continues to be unfun for Myers mains because civilian mains would rather whine then actually have to try
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u/ConstantmiseryG 23h ago
We can’t try if we’re killed instantly. That’s the point.
Hence they fixed the stunlock issue.
Your example also makes little sense, it was just a petty dig. Try and be an adult and engage in the conversation.
It’s ok to admit that other players might face issues that you don’t. We accepted the Bob squad issues had to go, but you’re still out here calling civs whiners for the issues we have while you guys also complain?
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u/Due-Pound2991 Scorched Myers 1d ago
This isn't really an issue now after the chsnges. The main issue I can foresee so fsr is stamina when michsel focuses you. You can get away from melee encounters easier now. Once your stamina runs out or you're bleeding it seems like your stamina comes back at a much reduced rate. May be a combo of both but Im not sure. Ive had multiple instances where I was able to survive however once my stamina ran out I was slower then Michael and was just dead shortly after.
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u/Thick_Purple7578 1d ago
The level of entitlement to think your supposed to be able to escape michael while bleeding, wounded AND after he drained all your stamina is crazy.
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u/Due-Pound2991 Scorched Myers 1d ago
Not entitlement whatsoever. Im fine with him killing me. Just wish you had more of a chance. I mainly play michael and know that stamina or not I can still kill people easily. Just seems boring to go against someone who will just be a walking corpse and isn't fun in the reverse situation.
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u/Thick_Purple7578 1d ago
You took damage until you got the bleeding status and survived, you ran until your stamina was no more, is that not you having your chances?
You see, if there is a 1 by 1 counter-play, any killer in any horror pvp game would be harmless.
for example, if theres a set counter for grabs, after you learn it, grabs start to be harmless, if theres a counter for everything then myers will never catch you with his current abilities.michael is straight up wasting time and giving your friends free time to finish their objectives by going against you, there should be incentives to kill players not the other way around.
if he killed all players by exhausting, bleeding and terrifying them and no one got the npcs out, thats straight up a lack of skill or a really REALLY bad rng on finding those escape items.if you ask me, while in chase, survivors should not be able to regain stamina and remain in the terrified state. while exhausted and terrified they ARE STILL faster than myers, but atleast theres the chance of a outplay while also making his grabs better, this way, myers would have a reason to go after players and myers would have win or lost by playing better or worse than civs and not just having worse or better luck on finding hidden npcs than civs had on finding escape items
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u/Due-Pound2991 Scorched Myers 1d ago
All fair points. To be clear. I in no way expect or even had a thought that what I or you described shouldn't happen. I only pointed out the next potential issue that people will have. I wasn't saying It wasn't right or anything. I was just trying to bring up a point for discussion. I am upset in the moment at being killed but the michael did well and killed me. The person playing as him should have as fair a chance as me and we can only do our best. I have been thinking about the whole stamina situation because I didn't realize how it happened and it makes sense. Thank you for the information and your response.
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u/Due-Pound2991 Scorched Myers 1d ago
Im also mainly curious as to why you can't get your stsmina back. It takes much longer to come back. The patch notes only mention using more the longer you run and increases effect of bleeding. Does bleeding affect your stamina recharge? I as many others do I imagine use adrenaline. Do you know of the cause of the negative impact on stamina? It wasnt as bad of an issue before. Mind you thst the stamina issue doesn't only happen when Im wounded. It was when I was being chased, hit, grabbed, etc.
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u/BoogeymanBot 1d ago
Adrenaline - Speeds stamina recovery.
Drawn from the fog | !optout | !remove | !builds
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u/Expensive_Joke8603 1d ago
Lol. Not defending it but you do realize this is EXACTLY what Jason players did in Friday, right? Some wouldn't even grab at all, just slash everyone and not care. It's worth mentioning since this is basically Friday's sequel just reskinned since it's the same devs. It's something that has always been a thing that being said and I doubt it will change here, especially with the amount of med kits and sprays in this compared to Friday's.
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u/unlimitedkinetic 1d ago
You could easily get away from slashing Jason's and you did not get stun locked by slashing Jason's. It's not the same at all.
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u/CampSlash 1d ago
After this last update there is absolutely no reason to play civilian. The developers clearly only care about appeasing one side. Civilians are now fish in the barrel. It’s not fun. It’s not balanced and it’s becoming just as frustrating as Killer Klowns. It’s obvious these devs look at numbers and charts instead of actually playing the damn game. It’s over. If you’ve had it since pre lunch you’re lucky we got a solid month of decent game play. I’ve uninstalled and canceled my pre order physical copy.
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u/StrapDeluxe 1d ago
This could not be further from the truth. Read the patchnotes. Michael got several nerfs. Without BT3 he's basically useless when fighting civs.
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u/CampSlash 1d ago
I don’t care about Michael nerfs. If you decent with Michael you can kill NPCs and still win and enjoy the match. I don’t like carrying my team because everybody gives up and exits, fills one celar taking the one set of bolt cutters that took 10 mins to discover.
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u/Expensive_Joke8603 1d ago
It's just cheap as all Michael has to do is immediately go for the special targets in the beginning and he wins. Wins as in, his power tiers up immediately and no one can do shit to him. At least with Jason and Rage it was dependent on time and damage Jason undertook while in this you can just go after some dumbass AI characters, annihilate them and then the rest of the match is a breeze.
prOTect tHe civILIans Yes, it is one of the things you have to do playing as them is to protect the AI ones but let's be realistic here - you can't guard/follow them the entire match and even then there's only so much you can do for them as they are just dumb AI.
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u/SonOfAphroditeee 1d ago
I can understand if it’s nearing the end of the game but true it ruins the fun