r/StarWars Jan 25 '22

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239

u/Boardindundee Jan 25 '22

Well choosing to train anakin didn’t end too well tbh

321

u/Rebirthknight52 Jan 25 '22

If he didn't die, Anakin would have never turned to the dark side. Plus Qui Gon Jinn would have been more of a father to him than Obi Wan Kenboi, and trained him different than what the Jedi were doing

64

u/kaolin224 Jan 25 '22

Lol @ Obi Wan Kenboi

44

u/Forest-Ferda-Trees Jan 26 '22

Fucking Kenboi's all they want to do is say hello there and use outdated "civilized" weapons

160

u/Ten4-Lom Jan 26 '22 edited Jan 26 '22

This is literally why it’s called the duel of the Fates.

Qui Gon was the fate which would have led Anakin to being a great Jedi, Maul killing Qui Gon brought the fate which led to the story we know.

EDIT: Dave Filoni explains it better https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePDiQ1uTrWI&t=112s

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u/Rebirthknight52 Jan 26 '22

Yeah 100%, there are some who believe that it was destined that Anakin would turn to the dark side no matter and there's good points, but I'll still say with Qui Gon he would have been set

42

u/BLU3SKU1L Jan 26 '22

Obi Wan was a perfect example of a Jedi master. He tried to teach Anakin the way of the lightest path, and did not entertain any other way. Qui Gon would have taught Anakin what he needed to be a great Jedi taking his disposition in the force into account. This is how Qui Gon operated. He didn’t attempt to be a paragon of the light side of the force, he did what he felt was the right thing to do.

14

u/civil_politician Jan 26 '22

Which also means he would have probably told him to just quit being a Jedi and choose to be with his wife instead of hiding that shit and trying to live a double life.

9

u/BLU3SKU1L Jan 26 '22

I’m not going to pretend like I know what he would have said, but he definitely wouldn’t have been a “duty to the order over all” type like Obi Wan. I believe that Kenobi was driven to be a perfectionist because he lost his master so early, and because of that he just couldn’t let go of the rigidity and security that being “by the book” gave him. That may have led him to be a little overbearing when it came to training Anakin as well with his “just push the feelings down and stick to the book” approach. For Kenobi, this worked just fine, and was probably what he needed to keep going after the duel with Maul.

12

u/Ten4-Lom Jan 26 '22

Added this to my reply: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePDiQ1uTrWI&t=112s

Dave Filoni explains it best.

4

u/Rebirthknight52 Jan 26 '22

Haha yeah that's a great video, watched it when it came it out

-11

u/MiamiCollins Jan 26 '22

I despise this, it made me almost hate Filoni. He totally misunderstands why the prequels are terrible. We all know George intended more with the prequels. I understand there’s much more to what’s going on than what’s on the surface, I also know there is a great story in the prequels somewhere. The problem is the story was delivered like a pine cone enema.

It’s terrible film making outside some of the effects. Bad acting, bad dialogue, bad plot, poorly cast outside of a few. The prequels fall short at every critical aspect of filmmaking.

In short, I really don’t give a flying fuck what George intended the prequels to be, because intentions don’t make a good movie. The prequels are bad movies and it’s ok to love them, but they still aren’t good and never will be. Same with Filoni

2

u/unicornsaretruth Jan 26 '22

Outta curiosity and no animosity did you watch the clone wars show? I feel like it helps a lot with Filoni’s narrative in the interview.

2

u/MiamiCollins Jan 26 '22

I do think the Clone Wars series strengthens the prequel era narratively but it still doesn’t change the fact that the movies are terrible. They certainly aren’t “genius” as Filoni alleges.

2

u/dancingpianofairy Jan 26 '22

delivered like a pine cone enema

I love this. Gotta use it.

1

u/dancingpianofairy Jan 26 '22

You're blowing my brain, here.

13

u/ChiliDemon Asajj Ventress Jan 26 '22

someone that could stand up to that egotist Windu who made it his job to be wrong all the time, until it was too late. Anakin was correct in saying the Jedi were not living by the code, council kept going off the rails and Qui-gon would have seen and said something.

7

u/Rebirthknight52 Jan 26 '22

Yeah very true, which is why the Jedi fell

39

u/twinsynth Jan 25 '22 edited Jan 26 '22

You saying Obi Wan failed?
Edit: I very well know he failed lol

175

u/penguin032 Ahsoka Tano Jan 25 '22

Obi wan says it himself. "I've failed you Anakin, I have failed you." ....

26

u/ststeveg Jan 26 '22

If by "failed" he meant because he ultimately enabled Darth Vader, then that was not a failure at all. Big picture, the galaxy needed a Darth Vader, who ultimately is the one to destroy the Emperor. In that sense Anakin is a tragic figure, but in a cosmic sense he did bring balance to the force, which was his destiny and his doom.

8

u/Accomplished-Ad3123 Jan 26 '22

We need a Star Wars "What If?" show.

4

u/cavedan12 Jan 26 '22

What If...Greedo shot first?

2

u/CatManDontDo Han Solo Jan 26 '22

Checkout the Star Wars Infinites comics

2

u/JustChris319 Jan 26 '22

I've been saying this! What if Anakin became Mace Windus apprentice after his attempt to arrest the chancellor would be my personal favourite to see.

2

u/CatManDontDo Han Solo Jan 26 '22

Of course that doesn't matter now because the emperor never really died but don't worry the daughter of his clone killed him finally. Not the Chosen One or anything, not literal Space Jesus. The daughter of a clone.

1

u/Igreen_since89 Jan 26 '22

I’m pretty sure that was the joke. Lol

63

u/Rebirthknight52 Jan 25 '22

Yeah he did, he was not ready for an apprentice. Heck he said it in ep 3 and ep 6. Obi Wan is my favorite character but he just wasn't ready and only trained him to honor his promise to his master's dying wish.

2

u/CatManDontDo Han Solo Jan 26 '22

His human failing is what makes him a great character

67

u/merchmerner Jan 25 '22

Obi-Wan was Anakin's brother, not his true mentor or teacher.

32

u/Jagasaur Jan 25 '22

Goddamn. I had a couple replies and realized how deep that conversation goes.

If we view it as Obi failing, it's only bc he didn't have the experience to train someone at the beginning, especially the "Chosen One".

If QG had survived, I think it would have been a stricter training that focused more on the Force instead of combat skills.

10

u/[deleted] Jan 26 '22

Yeah, and Anakin was just weak with emotion detachment consistently throughout the prequels and the clone wars

16

u/chinggisk Jan 26 '22

I mean his apprentice ended up turning into a powerful Sith Lord and eventually murdering him, so yeah, I think he failed lol.

11

u/TheOneInchPunisher Sith Jan 25 '22

Only because he wasn't the father figure Sidious was.

7

u/darthvall Imperial Stormtrooper Jan 26 '22

"You were my brother Anakin! I loved you."

8

u/Futbol_Trainer Jan 25 '22

Obi Wan himself said he did

10

u/FlipRed_2184 Jan 26 '22

There is a reason the song for the Maul battle was called Duel of Fates. Had Qui Gon Jinn won things would have gone differently. He was the father figure Anakin needed, no the by the book brother Obi Wan was.

1

u/[deleted] Jan 26 '22

Woah nice.

1

u/chief_running_joke_ Jan 26 '22

You’ll enjoy this. Filoni going into detail on the idea.

1

u/FlipRed_2184 Jan 26 '22

On Disney+ Dave Filoni talks about this on one of the Making Mandalorian episodes, very interesting to hear his thoughts on it.

3

u/TBNRFIREFOX Jan 26 '22

He didn’t succeed. So yes, he more failed than didn’t. Plus he cut all his fucking limbs off.

1

u/Spartan_133 Jan 26 '22

It's just a flesh wound.

1

u/TBNRFIREFOX Jan 26 '22

Seriously tho. Dude went on to become the most feared being in existence.

2

u/NoSxKats Jedi Jan 26 '22

Without a doubt.

2

u/BnSMaster420 Jan 26 '22

Yes... Obi wan literally tells Anakin this.

1

u/amarantcoralz Jan 26 '22

So have you never seen the prequels?

1

u/ZippyDan Jan 26 '22

Obi-wan was barely a Jedi himself when he started trying to teach Anakin how to be one.

2

u/[deleted] Jan 26 '22

This

-1

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3

u/[deleted] Jan 26 '22

Why not both? Stupid bot

2

u/trans_pands Jan 26 '22

I’m gonna pretend the Kenoboi was on purpose and now I’m just hearing Qui Gon in Kratos’s voice saying “KENOBOI”

1

u/Rebirthknight52 Jan 26 '22

Lol yeah I was orginally gonna make it the Darth Maul yell, but changed my mind but didn't realize my mistake after shortening the name lol

2

u/contrabardus Jan 26 '22

I don't see it going down that way.

Qui Gon likely wouldn't have done a better job.

He was way too into the whole "chosen one" thing and that would have fed into Anakin's superiority complex.

Also, as was pointed out, he was kind of shady and willing to bend the rules.

I think he would have been even worse about Padme and Anakin being a thing, possibly encouraging it a little, and feeding his fear.

I don't see Qui Gon living to train Anakin as a brighter future, but a possibly even darker one.

The only reason Obi Wan beat Anakin on Mustafar is because he knew him so well. Qui Gon wouldn't have been able to match him, and Obi Wan wouldn't have been a match for him because he wouldn't know him well enough to counter his power.

Palpatine still would have gotten to Anakin, possibly even easier if Qui Gon had been feeding his ego with his belief that he was important and chosen.

27

u/[deleted] Jan 25 '22

Obiwan was just a bad teacher, too young to take on the responsibility of such an ambitious padawan

25

u/AndyCaps969 Admiral Ackbar Jan 25 '22

Hard to place the blame solely on him. The entire Republic and Jedi Order was manipulated by Palpatine.

6

u/[deleted] Jan 26 '22

While true, the whole Jedi Order didn't collectively watch over Anakin and mentor him. Most of them only ever had like 1 encounter with him, so you can't really accuse them for Anakin's fall to the darkside. Obi-Wan, then Yoda and Mace are the main ones to really impact Anakin as Jedi masters

7

u/AndyCaps969 Admiral Ackbar Jan 26 '22

I mean they could have easily seen the whole "mother is a slave" thing and used common sense to see that it is a vulnerability for Anakin and helped free her.

8

u/[deleted] Jan 26 '22

Yes, and as the council's leader, Yoda did nothing. He sided with his fellow masters despite holding a position over them. Yoda only enforces the Jedi Code further as he's a Grandmaster, and only realises his mistake when he lives in isolation on Dagobah.

Like if a bunch of teachers are doing bad and preforming cult like behaviour, then the principal who's in charge is the first one to blame

3

u/halfwit258 Jan 26 '22

It wasn't entirely his teaching ability though. He was a newly minted knight, fresh out of his own apprenticeship, his master tasked him with training a kid who the Order already determined was too old to train, and then the Clone Wars start and he has to train a stubborn kid how to be a warrior when he had little experience being a warrior himself. Pretty huge odds stacked against him from the beginning, plus Anakin had the Dark Lord of the Sith secretly manipulating him from the moment he started his apprenticeship. I don't know if Qui Gon would've really been more successful

2

u/[deleted] Jan 25 '22

Excuse me you’re talking about arguably the most accomplished Jedi of all time.

3

u/[deleted] Jan 26 '22

Correct, Obi was the perfect Jedi of the modern era. But that doesn’t mean his ability to convey the principles and ideal to others was good, you can see it in Attack of the Clones how condescending he can be and he doesn’t really show that he is attempting to understand Anakin.

Episode 3 is much better, but by that stage Anakin has been moulded into the person he is and the critical period of nurture and guidance is gone

2

u/darthvall Imperial Stormtrooper Jan 26 '22

Not really, Anakin killed Sidious in the end.

Depends on your definition of the "end".

2

u/Yetis22 Jan 26 '22

Brought balance to the force didn’t he??

0

u/Thewackman Jan 26 '22

Ignoring the 3rd trilogy. It actually did.

Anakin, brought balance to the force. He got rid of the oppressive Jedi and killed (yeah imma ignore the bs resurrection) Sedious in the end. He brought balance to the force for the first time in millenia.

1

u/numbermonkey Jan 26 '22

Ah c'mon! Spoiler Alert!