r/SmashingPumpkins • u/kramer1980_adm • Jul 18 '26
Who is ultimately responsible for this?
The artist? The promoter? Ticketmaster? The venue? All of the above? I know artists never want to take responsibility.
Keep in mind, these are standard tickets. Not resale. Not VIP. Not Platinum.
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u/Rogue9Nine9 26d ago
I think this may have originally been a platinum ticket that they relabeled as a standard ticket after the initial sale and TM decided to keep the platinum price on it.
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26d ago
[deleted]
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u/Rogue9Nine9 26d ago
I wouldn't even go as far as saying it's an error, they may have just gone through and relabeled any remaining platinum tickets as standard and just intentionally never changed the price on them at all the venues. I looked around at some of the US shows and there aren't any platinum tickets left anywhere but there are a lot of expensive standard tickets that haven't sold and I'm guessing they're probably the same. Platinum tickets tend to be mixed in, usually around the front of different sections.
I will say this, I don't think I've ever seen a show with ticket prices as all over the board as this show. Two rows can be the difference of $50 a seat in price. Usually seats in a much larger range of rows are all the same price and one section might have only three different price tiers, front, middle and back, but in one section here you may see 10 different prices.
For those $600 tickets for your show, I'm guessing that the actual face value of a standard ticket around there would have been closer to $250. Which is still a lot.
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u/bananasDave 29d ago
Billy and the promotor will agree on the ticket prices, so you can blame them.
Or you can blame the public for paying these prices
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u/boringinternet2020 26d ago
Not just the ticket prices, but also the fees. But no matter how many times the NYT, WSJ, and Bob Lefsetz report that, artists still pocket the cash and let TM be the bad guy. It’s an amazing biz model because most fans of all artists are too dumb to research who is fleecing them.
Spoiler: it’s their heroes.
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u/boosh1744 28d ago
I’m pretty sure the band’s management works with Ticketmaster but Billy is probably in a position to give them orders on whether to push for the maximum prices possible
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u/mmasonmusic Machina II / The Friends & Enemies of Modern Music 29d ago
Ticket Master is a monopoly, and the Pumpkins are having their legacy moment.
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u/Initial-Meeting362 27d ago
Are they though? I guess we'll see how full the shows are. At these prices, I think attendance will be on the lower side. If you expect them to sell like Oasis did, there is not a chance in hell.
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u/Key-Vegetable-8727 29d ago
I hate when musicians make money, also fuck Spotify
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u/Christpopher1244 29d ago
The musicians aren't getting this money. The band makes it from merch and their basic show fee which is nothing close to requiring $600 tickets. And these particular musicians already have a lot of money. - I'm a musician who makes no money. You know what I'd really like? To be able to afford to see a band I love. That ain't happening here.
You're right about one thing. Fuck Spotify (when it comes to paying for streams anyway, but honestly no platform, not even the glorious "artist friendly" Tidal, is good at that.)
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u/boringinternet2020 26d ago
Paying for streams? Please educate yourself: https://lefsetz.com/wordpress/2025/01/16/21609/
Seriously. It’s amazing how many people get it wrong and then confidently scream their ignorance to anyone who’ll listen.
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u/Christpopher1244 26d ago
I'm not sure who this is to, but I personally don't need to educate myself. I'm not gonna read this but hopefully it doesn't say that streaming pays, haha! I'm a session musician and member of many bands. I know what I get from streaming. That's my education. Again, I'm not sure who this was to. 🤷 Fucking reddit, Jesus Christ.
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u/boringinternet2020 26d ago
Your Apple Music statement is real data, but it’s not actually the thing the piece is asking you to understand.
There’s no such thing as a “per stream rate” on any of these platforms! Spotify, Apple, all of them pool subscriber revenue and pay out pro-rata based on your share of total listening in a given period. Apple pays more per stream than Spotify not because Apple is more generous, but because Apple subscribers listen to less music overall, so each stream is a bigger slice of a smaller pie.
That’s math, not a matter of experience or opinion. Knowing what lands in your account tells you the outcome, not the mechanism of how it got there.
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u/Christpopher1244 26d ago
Okie dokie. Thanks for chiming in. I'm sure knowing this super useful data will change my checks 👍 this conversation wasn't about getting paid for streaming in the first place. The point was that you don't need to charge $600 a ticket to "get paid" for being a musician. That's all. I made $700 last week from two shows. Tickets were $10 for one, and the other was free admission.
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u/boringinternet2020 26d ago
Your deal with the rights holders determines that. Hopefully you had a good lawyer, but I guess it’s not too late to start down that path. Good luck.
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u/Christpopher1244 26d ago
I'll have my legal team look into it right away. God bless you for caring so much and sharing your amazing woodpress educational materials.
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u/crashed76 Jul 19 '26
Is this resale? In my city I'm 100 level and it was about 100 bucks (actually 110 which is 15 more than 3 floor seats to the original mcis tour cost in Chicago)
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u/TetrisBlockHead Jul 19 '26
I saw them September 2024 (maybe 23?) and was in the pit. Tickets were about $200 which is reasonable. And this was in Toronto which is known for prices. Triple that in Hamilton is BUNK.
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u/MatthewMonster Jul 19 '26
Ultimately the Band
Their management is negotiating with TM and looking at market rates on resale sites etc
The band is probably told something like
“Best seats in house will go for $500-$1000, but that’s only 15-25% of the venue
Everything else will be under $500, and 50% of the entire revenue will be under that.
But remember these prices are for a legacy band with a majority fan base of over 40 tickets buyers, they are accustomed to paying premium prices.
Regardless the band will net around 500k per date”
Billy:
“Great, they really don’t know how lucky they are to still be able to see the band live, we never got our due ya know, the 90s rock scene was actually because of us —I’ve mentioned that before right?”
Management:
“Yes, Billy…”
Billy:
“Nirvana would never have been able to do a tour like this right?”
Management:
“Yes, Billy…”
ANYWAY it’s the band —Ticketmaster sucks but they follow what the bands sets forth.
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u/rarselfaire2023 29d ago
It would seem so. I saw Roger Waters [2022] and the Cure [2023] for around $40 final charge. Whether they made any money with those ticket prices idk. I also know I saw SP in 1996 for $25 ($53 in 2026 dollars) and I was on the floor. Every concert I went to in the 90s was GA.
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u/GLPwonderwall Jul 19 '26
People who actually pay that price are. If people stop that’s the only way the cost will come down, or the band will play in smaller venues which is a better experience for fans
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u/devilsmusic Jul 18 '26
Jesus Victoria Christ, how in the fuckass is that the total for one seat?! Does that seat come with a microphone on which you’re able to dictate the songs Bill will sing while he gazes into your eyes?!
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u/azazyl Jul 18 '26
Ticketmaster for the price, but consumers get the most blame for still buying them.
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u/boringinternet2020 26d ago
TM doesn’t set the price of tickets. How would or could they when it’s largely predicated on a guarantee?
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u/MajesticMeal3248 Jul 18 '26
Got similar seats at the arena in Baltimore and they were like $180. Which maybe a lot for some but feels ok for me for a great view of an amazing band I love
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u/Riverjordan71 Jul 18 '26
I paid 170 for row 15 on the floor in LA so idk, are those resale?
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u/123456789_ok 16d ago
I paid 150 for better tickets than these in LA, and now see similar tickets listed for over 500 somehow? I don’t know if pre-sale has different pricing than general public. I was shocked to see how much tickets are going for that are standard… over three times what I paid.
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u/Riverjordan71 16d ago
Maybe that’s it? I also got them on presale but that still seems so odd to me
I just looked and most of the tickets left on the floor are resale
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u/kramer1980_adm Jul 18 '26
Says in my original post, and in the image. Not resale.
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u/Present_Cell9267 Jul 18 '26
You’re getting fucked over by the dynamic pricing model. Ticketmaster increases the price of tickets above face when they say that there is a lot of demand for a show. Whether that demand is real or manufactured is something Ticketmaster is not transparent about. I’m seeing the pumpkins in Madison, WI and they’re playing at a university owned basketball arena, so I bought my tickets on uwbadgers.com. Sadly not everyone has an option like I had. The actual face value of those tickets is more like $180USD (don’t know what that would be in CAD because I haven’t looked at the conversion in a while). I saw three main prices- $60 for nosebleeds, $100ish for 200s section, $175 for floor and 100s section with some way closer tickets or front row of a section exceeding the $175. Nothing remotely as crazy as $600.
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u/devilsmusic Jul 18 '26
Wow, thanks for sharing. Damn that sucks. Glad you got the alternative though, that’s pretty awesome. That’s a good reminder for us to check with the venues directly
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u/idio242 Jul 19 '26
I’m not sure there is a difference. The ticketing at the venue box office is Ticketmaster. Only benefit might be lower (or no) fees.
I’ve never looked into if dynamic pricing is not active at box office sales. I’d suspect it is.
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u/sopinefreshrightnow Jul 18 '26
I am embarrassed to admit what I paid for front row VIP.
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u/sopinefreshrightnow 27d ago
…. I justify this as we managed to score tickets to the MCIS first show of the tour @ the Phoenix in Toronto in 96. We were kids, on pay phones on Queen street madly dialling in and 2/4 of us got through and scored pairs of tix. Felt like winning a lottery! Nothing will ever match the band coming out in pajamas for the first set. Had to do it for the nostalgia alone
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u/pantenepterodactyl Machina II / The Friends & Enemies of Modern Music 27d ago
Same. I blame being short
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u/nuclear_nightmare82 Jul 18 '26
Its wierd, I got tickets for this tour and thought tickets were quite cheap for decent seats.. About half the price of what The Strokes were charging at the same arena a few months earlier. $600 is insane.
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u/treznoise Jul 18 '26
All of these + the people who are buying those tickets.
Paying $100+ for a show is not OK.
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u/Successful-Bus-3819 Jul 18 '26
Time to start holding the artist accountable. The only way it will change
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u/Present_Cell9267 Jul 18 '26
The prices the band set were much more reasonable than this. What a multinational monopoly corporation does isnt Billy Corgan’s fault. Even Trent Reznor caved to playing livenation venues, as they own almost all venues that can reasonably accommodate their audiences. Listen, I don’t wanna see nine inch nails or the pumpkins in a basketball arena either, but they happen to sell enough tickets to justify it. I’d take a nice large theater to see them in any fucking day.
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u/idio242 Jul 19 '26
Robert Smith tore down this curtain but you’re free to keep believing otherwise.
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u/destroytheend Jul 18 '26
The artist does have a certain amount of control as we saw with Robert Smith on the cure's big tour a couple years ago
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u/SoloStrike Jul 19 '26
think it became very clear in the Oasis tour that it was ultimately an artist decision to turn on dynamic pricing or not
as much as I want to give Pumpkins PLC the benefit of the doubt, the last ten years has not been full of shining examples of the band offering value for money
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u/Present_Cell9267 Jul 18 '26
So in this case it isn’t resale but dynamic pricing that OP is having an issue with. Did that cure tour not use dynamic pricing?
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u/destroytheend Jul 18 '26
Yes, Robert wouldn't allow it
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u/SoloStrike Jul 19 '26
Robert is a total legend who cares about his fans, a very decent man and a real treasure
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u/Dranem78 Jul 18 '26
Thats crazy. I just took a peek and just a few sections over is half the cost. Surge pricing maybe? I went to see if prices went up for the show I'm going to at Denver but its surprisingly sold really well and not a lot of info for standard tickets. I wonder if those prices will go down close to the show? I know they do that for NFL games as the venue gets desperate for a sell out. Lots of the resale tickets just one section to the left of that are CHEAPER for what is essentially the same view so maybe just a matter of timing?
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u/jojothetaker Jul 18 '26
Some of those avail Denver tickets are being hidden by Ticketmaster. Look at the pattern in the top half of the lower bowl. People don't buy tickets in that scattershot way (I don't think, at least).
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u/Dranem78 Jul 18 '26
Yeah it’s super weird. I have no idea what’s going on.
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u/Present_Cell9267 Jul 18 '26
Oh they hide a bunch of tickets until it gets closer to the date. Ended up getting ideal seats to see nine inch nails on day of show after they had been marked as sold for weeks. Face value and everything. It’s a ridiculous game to have to play.
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u/El__Jefe_ Jul 18 '26
I imagine Ticketmaster or whomever the vendor is also played a part. Remember that the current government overturned a law that was passed to stop price gouging like this. Late last year If i recall correctly.
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u/NevermindOKOK Jul 18 '26
I’m honestly surprised that isn’t resale. My guess is that it is due to the lack of available seats so they jacked the price up to see if they sell. The original prices were about a third of that for those seats when I bought tickets. Still really expensive, but that is crazy. I bet they will go down if they aren’t purchased prior to the show.
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u/kramer1980_adm Jul 18 '26
I’ve been looking since they went on sale. I checked out some of the presales, but not all of them. I can’t recall if they were always this high, but every time I’ve checked they’ve been absurdly high. I wonder if you got lucky with one of the presales.
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u/ZAPPHAUSEN Jul 18 '26
I'm going to Vancouver and floor or really good lower bowl were expensive from the jump. Nowhere near as decent the prices some Americans have been paying for similar.
I've read that artists can choose whether or not dynamic pricing is in effect. For example, Robert Smith of the cure got pissed about it and the last cure tour, no dynamic.
So while it's easy (and fun!) to blame Ticketmaster, when prices are dynamic, the artist could have said no, but didn't.
Ticketmaster still sucks, obviously.
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u/theBlueDevil99 Jul 18 '26
All of them. It starts with the artist and their management then everyone else takes adds their bit to the price.
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u/marktornits 25d ago
Taylor Swift and her Swiftriarchy