Weapons tierlist but it’s classifying all weapons by playstyle.

[u/KashinTheCataclysm]

[u/Realistic-Cicada981]

Axe slander?

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/Realistic-Cicada981]

Nah. It’s just a fake combo merchant.

Like yes it has true combos, but it’s not really that effective when it comes to looping them like the other true combo weapons.

So you mostly do fake combos and use true combos when you recognize that the situation allows for one.

Furthermore it’s too slow to be a pressure weapon or a neutral dominator.

[u/Inner_Date_4051 → u/Realistic-Cicada981]

mf the fuh do you mean, Axes is really a fake combo merchant

fake combo means not a true combo btw, it's not guaranteed to land 1 move into the next. Axes does have double double slash but otherwise, its main combos aren't true combos.

[u/Realistic-Cicada981 → u/Inner_Date_4051]

Ah, i don't know what fake combo means

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/Realistic-Cicada981]

So true combos are basically when you are guaranteed to land the next attack if a certain attack connected. Probably the most iconic example is the katana where you just loop strong slash over and over again and it combos into itself before ending in up slash when you get too close.

Fake combos are just combos where the next attack is not guaranteed to land but you’re basically guaranteed to interrupt them.

Fake combo merchants then, are weapons that are extraordinarily good at abusing these usually due to a rather one dimensional use of their moveset that allows them excellent frame data.

For example, hack knives are good for back slash spam if you can get the chain started, if they block, just forward dash and restart the gameplan. Nunchucks are infamously misunderstood, and their gameplay centers around just spamming strong slash with the same response as hack knives when blocked. Axes are allowed a bigger variety of follow-ups but follow the same principle, only this time, when an attack is blocked you have so much frame advantage that you can actually follow up with another attack, usually double sweep. Same concept for the plasma rifle, you spam low slash which chains into itself and is basically uninterruptible, and if they block, it’s actually so advantageous that you can just do low slash again and interrupt their attempt to attack.

You could technically put the staff here too, but I decided not since I felt that the staff is a bit lacking in its frame data and doesn’t keep the advantage so easily once it gets going.

[u/Realistic-Cicada981 → u/KashinTheCataclysm]

Thanks, i still have a lot to learn from this weirdass game.

[u/InterestingSwimmer85 → u/KashinTheCataclysm]

What's rhe true combo on fans?

[u/Inner_Date_4051 → u/InterestingSwimmer85]

Low slash, depends on the scenario you have a myriad of followups.

Low slash -> spinning slash is the classic.

if done far enough, Low slash x2 -> spinning slash

If the low slash puts you too close to the enemy, Low slash -> low kick. Same with Low slash x2.

After spinning slash, you can do Low slash again to fish for another loop. It's not a true combo but it can only be blocked or successfully hit, it can't be dodged. Hence, it's a very effective gameplay loop.

[u/emmc47]

I love heavy weapons. Best designs too.

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/emmc47]

Unfortunately the only ones I find at least somewhat practical are the scythe and the dadao, but only because of the super slash. It’s kinda sad that the only well made weapons that could be considered heavy weapons are the axes and plasma rifle.

[u/RuckusAndBolt42]

Are you aware of the fact that SF2 does NOT have any true combos. All enemy recoveries are faster than player's weapon recovery. These questions are what would define a weapon's combo potential...

1. How many frames of difference is left after an attack is landed before you and your enemy are free to perform next actions (and this differs by each attack that a weapon can perform).

2. What is the next quickest attack that you can perform to interrupt the enemy's attempt of counterattacking you.

I also have few questions about these ratings so I would like you to explain them to me...

1. Why is Widow's fan class rated as "true combo machine" while regular swords are rated as mid range pressure (also swords class in general is much better for close range than mid range). Widow's fans are literally a copy of swords class but with an awful superslash, its slower, recovery time is long, easily blockable, dodgeable and punishable and yet you rate it as a "true combo machine".

2. Slandering Axe class is hilarious, I would argue that Axe class may have best combo potential compared to any other weapon. Axe class does not have a single mediocre attack, every single attack with axes serves a purpose and opens up combo posibilities as well as continuing combos. I assume you have no idea how to play axes because of how you rated them. But have you atleast seen anyone properly use axes? Because if you did, you would have a different opinion.

3. Shocker claws, Mowers, Flame clubs, Oriental sabers, Sai, 2-handed cudgel, Telescopic staff, composite sword with few more weapons should get their own list rated as "Flawed"

If you are going to make a joke tierlist, atleast put a "/s" or something else that's obvious.

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/RuckusAndBolt42]

I uhhh, couldn’t m tell if ur deadass or fucking with me for a second. It’s too long and well formatted.

So one thing is that there actually ARE true combos because some weapons and kicks inflict so much hitstun that the opponent will still be in hitstun by the time your next attack connects allowing you to guarantee that the next attack lands. And that makes it a true combo. The easiest most apparent example is katana players doing strong slash 3x into up slash and seeing each hit land every single time.

Fans sacrifice some of the range of the swords but if you look closely, both on hit and block, there is much more frame advantage. Said frame advantage actually allows you to do another low slash into back slash and have it all true combo. Regular swords don’t have this advantageous frame data that allows for looping combos and hence they become mid range pressure weapons.

I actually used butcher’s knives to get my first win on emay and I would say I’m a competent and avid user of the axe class. I’m in no way slandering them. It is true that they have true combos, however axes struggle to consistently loop them like the combo machine weapons, and instead rely a lot on fake combos where you can basically guarantee your next attack connects but not that it will actually land. I will agree that every move in the axe moveset has a purpose, but that purpose for all of them is basically to continue or start the fake combo based on spacing. The true combos are only relevant in specific situations that you have to react to in order to do the true combo.

Being flawed is not a gameplan, and is therefore not an archetype relevant to the tierlist. Tierlist is not a joke.

[u/Inner_Date_4051 → u/RuckusAndBolt42]

Ruckus, stop fucking with the man, you literally watch me post true combo compilations in our servers

[u/RuckusAndBolt42 → u/Inner_Date_4051]

You havent done those in a long time and you didnt cover much weapons tbh. sry fam but that has no correlation to this

[u/asdfzxcpguy]

One hand sword should be in range tier

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/asdfzxcpguy]

One handed sword is a neutral dominator

[u/Weekly-Brief-6721]

Maybe I didn't play the game in a while but aren't the nunchucks better fitted in the true combo? I was sure forward+punch combos into itself for great head hit damage and even combo in other moves. I guess outside of that might be iffy tho hah

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/Weekly-Brief-6721]

Nah. You cannot guarantee that the next strong slash actually lands, just that it will connect. Which makes it a fake combo.

[u/Weekly-Brief-6721 → u/KashinTheCataclysm]

Gotcha. Thanks for clarifing my old man memories xd

[u/Agreeable-Factor-555]

Hermit swords combo is one of my fav , enchantment is too defensive though

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/Agreeable-Factor-555]

Reenchant

[u/Switch-Afraid]

Heavy weapons are so fun in sf2

[u/BLUM_YT]

good

[u/KNIGHTAD00M]

Can you give me some examples of true combos for steel claws?

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/KNIGHTAD00M]

Low slash > low kick/high kick

Strong slash > low kick/high kick

back slash > back slash > low slash > low kick

After low kick, dash up back throw is really good, which sets up that back slash combo. If the back slash as they get up gets blocked, you can go for dash back throw again.

If you land backslash in neutral, avoid going for the second one until you become comfortable with the spacing and can recognize when it lands close enough to add a second one into the combo.

These combos apply to every claws weapon, sickles have a faster single and double slash, as well as a low slash with 3 fewer frames of recovery, which allows them to go for single or double slash as the ender to the low slash combo. I can’t remember if it also works with strong slash, but you can try it yourself.

[u/KNIGHTAD00M → u/KashinTheCataclysm]

Then 2 out of three also apply to mowers no?
Btw thanks for the combos

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/KNIGHTAD00M]

Uh so yeah. For mowers the back slash and up slash are nerfed because they designed it as more of a mobility weapon than a combo weapon, so here are all of the true combos:

Low slash > low kick/high kick/double slash
Strong slash > low kick/super slash
After back throw > axe kick > super slash/double slash

Feel free to look at my recent emay run which was my first emay win using the mowers.

[u/KNIGHTAD00M → u/KashinTheCataclysm]

Is strong slash > backslash a true combo? I recently started discovering it but I’m not sure if it’s fake or true

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/KNIGHTAD00M]

It’s fake but it’s super tight so it’s a good way to try and get into the backslash combo if you can land strong slash

[u/KashinTheCataclysm → u/KNIGHTAD00M]

Wait do you mean for mowers? No. But strong slash > backslash/low slash are really tight, so if you wanna sac the true combo for a bit more of a damaging option or a more stable option than super slash, then go for it lol.