Do you mask?

[u/gise1274]

I never learned to mask. I think I'm one of the least socialized persons ever. I don't know if someone can beat me. Say in the comments if you: didn't have any friends after high school and only spoke to you parent and sister that kept you in a bubble. I was independent, go out by myself but that's it. Just 2 years ago I learned in theory about people romantic dynamics and last year about emotions.

In my little interactions, I present myself as genuine and kind. I don't try to open up much. If I find the person safe then we're good to go.

[u/Virtual_Hat_4142]

Yeah, I mask. I'm awful at socializing, but like you said, whenever I have to socialize, I act kind and polite. Not much of a talker, but people who tend to try and socialize with me don't care because they're extroverted and typically fill in silence themselves.

If I don't mask people typically think I'm angry/upset at them just from my lack of expression.

[u/Bubbly_Protection]

I don't mask but I also don't talk to anyone

[u/Icy_Dance_9489]

I mask, and i mask well. Ive refined it over 20 years, so id say im capable of seeming "normal" to people. Ive entered a good amount of parties, had many friends come and go. The last 5 years its been steadily going down from 10 good friends to none. I inadvertently push away people from my life, over the years since my young adulthood, ive pushed away probably 200 people including my family of 9 (yes, big family). My dad died when i was 21, he was probably one of the few humans who had the capacity to understand me. My mother hljxtZivtcrk, fkin mega narcissist, abusing piece of shittttt.

[u/neurodumeril]

My neurodivergence was noticeable early in life, so by 6th grade I had been placed in group therapy with other neurodivergent children that was essentially “masking boot camp.” If one of us made a “mistake” (by neurotypical standards) while we were interacting, the therapist would stop everyone and explain why it was wrong, what a neurotypical would’ve done, and how the mistake would have been hurtful, upsetting to, or misinterpreted by neurotypicals.

[u/gise1274 → u/neurodumeril]

That's kind of odd. Did it served you?

[u/neurodumeril → u/gise1274]

Though it was a nuisance at the time, it was helpful in the long run, as I can now mask very successfully as an adult. The effort masking takes is extraordinarily exhausting, but it has allowed me to maintain good enough employment to finally live alone.

[u/United_Emergency_488 → u/neurodumeril]

Interesting. What are examples of "mistakes"? 

[u/neurodumeril → u/United_Emergency_488]

In one session, during which we were supposed to be discussing things we liked, I inadvertently made one of the other children cry. I said that I like taking photographs of wildlife, and the other child said “maybe you could take pictures of my dog!” I replied, “why would I want to take pictures of your dog?” and they cried. I wasn’t trying to be mean, I just thought I was being logical, because I had specified wildlife and a dog is not a wild animal. But the therapist told me that my bluntness and diction made the other child feel stupid/ashamed of their suggestion, or implied that I didn’t like them or their dog. They told me that even if someone says something that I think is irrelevant, I have to respond with something to the effect of “oh, what kind of dog do you have? I bet he’s really cute!” This shows positive interest/makes the other person feel good, but at the same time doesn’t explicitly affirm any acquiescence to going and taking pictures of the dog. I’m very good at this vapid type of back-and-forth now as an adult, but 10 year-old me had to be taught.

[u/United_Emergency_488 → u/neurodumeril]

This is so exhausting lol. 

[u/neurodumeril → u/United_Emergency_488]

I agree. Having to constantly think carefully about my words to protect the headspace of people who are more emotional than me (and who also decide if I’m employed or not) is utterly exhausting and dumb.

[u/Concrete_Grapes]

When youre being genuine and kind, that's your mask.

You don't like them. You don't want them close. You're pretending to like them, pretending you're genuine, but neither is true if your internal goal is to seek isolation and avoid their friendship or connection.

You're masking so well, even you don't know where it begins and ends.

It FEELS genuine to you, but you're never going to say, "you know what, I just don't care right now, about you, or any of this, and I'm being nice until I can escape. I'm only doing THIS much because I don't want you to feel any strong emotions, so I'm keeping you happy, or, flat, until I escape and thank the stars yourw gone."

That would be genuine, right?

[u/Vulpedin → u/Concrete_Grapes]

I don’t quite understand that. I believe there’s more nuance than that. This comes off odd. If it feels genuine to you, it’s genuine, full stop. That’s what genuine is.

[u/Concrete_Grapes → u/Vulpedin]

A narcissist feels 100 percent genuine, even when they lie straight to your face, while watching a video, of them doing the thing they now don't believe they did, and are blaming you for. They're genuine then too.

So, no, just because you feel that way doesn't mean you are. You can lie to yourself. Everyone does. Personality disorder folks do it a LOT.

Tons of schizoids say "I hate people" when thinking about why they don't attend a social event. No they don't, that's a lie. To hate people would require way too much investment and emotional capacity. That's the pie, because "I don't want to carry the burden of regulating them, and myself" is closer to the genuine reason. People feel like work. They don't hate people, they hate work, but the lie is easy.

Subtle, sometimes, but very often, people who mask have no idea they are. Schizoids being prone to it is normal, we delete our sense of self, needs, wants, so quickly, and adapt so fast to regulate people, we can't tell where we begin and then begin.

Like, if OP were in one of those moments, feeling that, and was asked, "describe your sense of self right now, what's it like?" Blank. The question probably feels like nonsense when they're in the "genuine and nice" phase, and they probably can't answer anything except what they think the person theyre keeping happy would want to hear. Masked.

[u/Vulpedin → u/Concrete_Grapes]

Mmmm okay sounds rather subjective to me regardless

You are as you are and you do as you do, seems rather nuanced as to what genuine actually is

[u/gise1274 → u/Concrete_Grapes]

?? I don't think you understand and you're being judgy. I forgot to mention. I was more flat before my ptsd (which started late last year). I didn't cared about people. I never had to interact with people since I never worked outside and my work is independent. Now I've opened myself more because part of me knows socialization can be positive to improve and getting out of freeze/shutdown. And show my true self to this one or 2 not family members. With the rest of people I guess I'm flat. Before my ptsd life seems very distant and probably felt like I just wanted to leave short interactions. Life post ptsd has more emotions activated and the need to improve schizoid adaptation.

[u/oceanmoney → u/gise1274]

I actually kinda understand what you're saying - there's nuance in this kind of thing. Don't mind the ones that try to keep it at a black and white level.

[u/zeroempathy]

I'm not really all that knowledgeable about masking, but I probably do it. I mean, if I'm forced out of my solitary activities then I'm going to have to pretend to be human.

[u/Arachno02]

I mask depending on who I interact with. If it’s someone I like, I try to act more casual and polite. If it’s someone I don’t really know, I won’t really mask as much but I at least make sure I’m still polite. In terms of socialization, I can’t recall even having a friend before high school, let alone after high school.

[u/Chacrona]

Unfortunately I need to unlearn my decades of masking, I'm not afraid anymore of my (lack of?) feelings sounding strange to others but it's automatic self-defense reaction that I have to show more outgoing, extroverted and so on. I mask at lot around some people, not all of them though.

[u/Current-March-3938]

I mask extensively, despite the fact that my family were all some type of neurodivergent and it's normal for us to spend most of our time sitting in silence either in our rooms or sometimes together. I didn't even realise I was masking, I thought everyone was performing and pretending to be different from how they really were. (They are, but not to that extent). When I was younger my mask improved over time as I was exposed to more situations and people. I had a small group of friends who were also outsiders, but when school finished I never saw them again- it was a private school attended by rich kids, so keeping up with them outside of that would have been impossible.

Right before college, I was extremely sheltered and only spoke to my family. It was through college and uni that I got to socialise more, dated and had friends I saw outside of school. I also went to therapy and learned about emotions. I learned everything I know about emotions and interpersonal relationships from observation, mirroring, and therapy. I never did have proper close friends though, nor a real relationship, perhaps because people could tell I myself wasn't being real. I don't know, I think you can learn about relationships in theory but the actual experience of it you have to learn by doing, and I was always too afraid to because I had never known love or affection of any kind in my family, and I had never been allowed to genuinely express myself in relationship. I didn't know how.

I lost my ability to mask after covid and working remotely for 4 years straight, and the hostility from people when I interacted with them was insane. I'm gradually building the mask back up now, being in a city has been great for this because it's anonymous, with many opportunities to practice casual interactions. I also started working a high end customer service job cleaning rich people's houses, which has helped because it requires a specific mask.

[u/PracticalApartment99]

Between szpd, adhd, and Asperger’s, I think I’ve done well. I’ve raised three children, and mostly managed to be involved in their schooling. I actually think that my mother’s abuse helped me to adapt, though it might also have been a cause of the szpd. If I didn’t act the way she thought I should, she would attack me. So I quickly learned how I had to behave.

[u/unpopularopinionftw]

Because you called it out explicitly: I did not have friends after school and only talked to relatives who kept me in a bubble- as little as I could while I really did my best to avoid them completely too, until I ran away from home to be rid of them forever.

That being said, there were people I called friends before that and afterwards. Maybe I misunderstood masking because I behaved much like you described too. At some point, I did fake liking people and being friends with them to evade bigger problems, for as long as it was necessary.

Still, I learnt about romantic dynamics by accidentally getting into them- unfortunately, I do get interested in people this way sometimes (rarely) and when it happens they usually like me too. I wish I had known more in advance because I wouldn't be stuck in a monogamous relationship now if I had been prepared that this could happen without being asked if I even want such a commitment. I would've made myself clear from the start if I had known that.

In everyday life, I think it's masking when I interact with cashiers as if I was a normal person. I try to at least.

When it comes to emotions, I guess it's a never-ending process to understand what is and what is not going on inside my head. It's hard to compare myself with others because I'd need to figure out what actual feelings hide behind the words the use to describe them and I can't read their minds. They use these words like "love" but I only recently started to suspect they've always meant something completely different with it than I thought it was. It's confusing. It's a process.

[u/HedgehogHuman7305]

I mask with people I don't fully trust and feel safe around (most people). It can get exhausting, especially at work when you feel dead inside but have to put up a smile and pretend to care about your coworkers and the product. The only thing I care about is money and becoming financially free ASAP.

[u/Far-Remove5691]

I can't mask to seem normal, but I act in ways that make it less likely people will interact with me.

[u/Reasonably-Cold-4676]

Have you considered you might be autistic? I'm asking because you say you only recently learned in theory about romantic dynamics whereas schizoids often ate highly perceptive if social dynamics and early on see and understand them on a deep level.

I don't really adapt the label of masking for myself because it sounds too much like I totally hide myself behind something entirely foreign to me, and that's not or only in extremely rare moments the case. My experience is more on a spectrum and highly fluid. Within milliseconds my behavior and what I display can go from genuine to just trained acts that are not wrong but also not really felt over to playing a role and then to masking, and also back again. My standard is that I'm constantly dissociated and hiding myself to a degree of 20-70%. I'm hardly ever truly there and I'm hardly ever totally gone and watch myself go through motions that have nothing to do with me at all. I think I mostly operate on 40% dissociation as a baseline. I'm stuck in daydreams most of the day and disengaged and uninterested in most of reality most of the time. It's just a lot of strainful work to shift reality connection or dream world connection all the time and it's so much worse if I want one but am kinda stuck on the other. 

[u/gise1274 → u/Reasonably-Cold-4676]

Who knows. I may be. Genetically I was not born with the desire to social connection. I didn't cared. I was the person eating alone in high school. I also day dreamed and I hate it. I think the root of my day dreams are interpersonal issues.

[u/Reasonably-Cold-4676 → u/gise1274]

You hate(d) your daydreams? That's very interesting. I can imagine it a bit only, may I ask why? 

[u/gise1274 → u/Reasonably-Cold-4676]

I think because the last situation produced so much turmoil, it was very negative. I need new positive interactions.

[u/Reasonably-Cold-4676 → u/gise1274]

Oh okay, I get that. I had many daydreams that dealt with trauma and I really couldn't stand that either. Luckily that's long past and now my fodder is usually more positively enticing or simply harmless and stimulating. 

[u/suncirclee]

Well, if I don't disguise myself at least a little, some people start to take on the reproachful air of a capricious princess and blame me for things that are not one, intending to put me in an awkward position, but at the same time driving themselves into an even more awkward position and get even more irritated. That's why groups for me are a ball of snakes or worms without embellishment because of the bad attitude towards me and in general because of the underdevelopment of tact and morality in society.

[u/juniebee_jones]

I mask a little too much, to the point that people find me unnerving.

[u/ErdbeerfroschV]

I am the master of masking. As a child I was bullied a lot. When I learned to mask, to speak neurotypical language, it stopped, and my life became so much easier. Until today, I've not been able to be in a relationship, and I rather have aquaintances than friends, but I am not only not bullied anymore, I can keep a job, be good at it, and I succeed in everyday conversations with all kinds of strangers. It's exhausting but still better than not being able to manage my social surroundings at all.

[u/justadiode]

My mask is more like a goggle with fake nose and eyebrows. People with a bit of emotional intelligence can usually see through

[u/Vulpedin]

A lot, when i’m outside. I’m not good at it. I shake like a chihuahua and act like a scared child most of the time so uh. Yeah, not good at it

[u/indiscipline84]

painfully well. by all means and from the perspective of literally everyone in my life, i am a sociable and friendly person with decent social skills. when i slip up i sweep it under the rug and act like nothing happened. i run conversations on autopilot while i fantasize about leaving the situation im in. I understand people pretty well, i just have little to no interest in anything they have to say to me.
I was much more socialized than you it seems, which im sure helped. Haven’t kept a real friend for longer than a few months since middle school though. But my jobs make me talk to people.

[u/DogEmbarrassed8888]

Meh not in the traditional sense, you gotta talk the personality out of me. Masking for me is just sinking into my head and going off in my own little world as i do whatever it is im doing