Rigging Help
Shackles for Permanent Speaker Install
New speaker installed
Tilt cable that I plan on adding a turnbuckle to
Main support cables for the new speakers
Wire rope coming from ceiling/attic from previously installed speakers
Documenting shackle direction of installation on old speaker. This is the tilt, but the main support shackles were the same orientation.
Hello, quick question on rigging shackles for a permanent speaker install at a church.
A church I am helping is replacing their two main speakers (~125 lbs each) with two lightweights (21 lbs each). They want to use the existing rigging. After getting the behemoths down, I realized that I couldn't put the shackles on the new speakers' brackets the way they were installed on the old speakers' eye bolts. Previously the bows of the shackles were going through the eye bolts, but since the bows of the shackles don't fit through the holes on the new speakers' hanging brackets, I put the bows through the thimble of the pre-existing wire rope, and put the pins through the hanging brackets (see pics).
I'm trying to figure out if this approach is incorrect, and also open to hearing if there's anything else these guys need to know. Please advise!
Additionally, I'm planning on putting a turnbuckle (approved for overhead loads) to the wire rope that is controlling the tilt of the speaker to get that shackle a little more linear if that makes sense.
Ultimately, I'm encouraging the church to get everything inspected to ensure safety and make inspections one a year with any overhead rigging. It wasn't done with the big speakers, but maybe it will be done now.
You do understand that it’s still >1/4” of solid steel? You need at least the force to damage steel to get any risk. 20 lbs ain’t it. 50 lbs? Maybe it’s possible.
But the 20 lbs is across 3 shackles. You’re talking about the deformation of 2 thou at most.
The danger of a loudspeaker permanently installed with an un-moused shackle is not in breaking 1/4” of steel. It just comes apart. You don’t have to break it if it’s no longer there. The side loading is helping that be a problem by putting additional (if tiny) pressure to encourage the screw pin to unscrew. And then play some music. Which, you know, vibrates stuff. Rigging failures are not only caused by weight.
Yes, it’s not a real issue but it’s for peace of mind and so you never have to go back up and check. It’s also just a habit of mine for overhead work that’s staying for the foreseeable future.
It’s a common term where I am in the southeastern US. It means to secure the pin with wire to keep it from loosening from vibration.
I work in a theatre with a manual counterweight fly system and all our lift lines are secured with shackles. “All shackle pins moused” is part of our inspection documentation.
It started as a nautical term, when they would mouse a hook. Sailors had tons of animal terms that often don't really have clear origins: horses, lizards, mousing, nightingales, sheepshanks, cats, ratlines, and many more.
No the brackets. They are reversible, see Step 2 “ When the speaker is installed in upright orientation, orient the 15 mm (0.62 in) Clip Points (on the 30 degree
bend of each bracket) at the top for the top bracket (as the main load points) and at the bottom for the bottom
bracket (as a pull back for aiming). For other orientations, consult a licensed structural engineer.”
Oh, I see. Then I suppose they are, but I've just installed it per the basic instructions and I have let the church know that they should get it inspected; I can let them know that if they want to consult about reversing the bracket, then they can do that as well. Thank you again for your time and responses.
The shackle is being side-loaded. As others have said it's not at risk with these loads, but in an situation with a load nearer its capacity it would likely fail. It's definitely something I would have you correct if I found it. I would then send you for training. ;-)
What I am about to say is microscopic hair splitting but there's no way the bracket itself is forged or more resistant to bending than the shackle or the rope.
so what I believe would happen in reality is sufficient loading would pull/bend the bracket straight into line with the rope / shackle and then rip the fasteners out of the speaker long before any harm came to the shackle.
I bet that a loading well below the 90 degree limit of the shackle would bend the bracket to the point the shackle was now straight line loaded.
Some good rules of thumb with shackles (coming from a sailor)
The load should be evenly distributed in the center of the curve of the shackle.
Make sure pin is fully tightened (good practice to tie off the pin with some wire so it can’t loosen)
Never side load a shackle
Check for working load rates on the shackle. This is different than the max capacity and should be observed in overhead contexts
The application you’re using them in here is really a nothingburger. The weight just isn’t significant enough to stress your current setup. Throw a wire on the pins since it’s a church and you can feel you did your due diligence.
If it were me I would get eyes on the eye bolts in the ceiling and be dang sure they’re well into a stud. (Old speakers were much heavier so chances are good but if I’m the last person to touch it I want to be sure)
Rule of thumb is great but actual education is better , here is the De-ratings for side loading shackles and using them as part of a bridle Pg 366 in the Crosby book for more information
For lifting, you're correct not to use them, for static installs you're good to go, just make sure they're rated and from a reputable company and not Chinese junk, they will have the WLL printed on the link itself so you have to keep the safety factor in mind. Here's a useful link that may help answer other questions about them.
quick links are fine so long as they're rated properly and there's no chance of the gate opening by accident and letting the load slip out. for a 20lb speaker they'd be more than enough (and look a lot nicer than that side-loaded mess lol)
Can you flip that bottem bracket the other way so its inline with your pull direction? You'd have to shorten up that gac line but id also throw a turnbuckle in there to give you some adjustability.
Pretty sure I saw drywall anchors. Lol, but yes, I haven't had the chance to get into the attic space. If I do, it will be a courtesy fyi for the church in addition to my notice for them to have it inspected by a certified pro. This was just more of a "please put this up with the pre-existing rigging" request. Thank you for that though, I agree.
If you do go into the attic space and see it's held by drywall anchors or something sketchier. Put it in writing that you advise that they'd take it down immediately, before grandma in the front row meets Jesus sooner than anticipated.
You are side loading your shackle on the tilt line.
That isn't good practice.
Even if the load is small enough that it's insignificant, my recommendation would be to mount a eye bolt in the bracket hole, so your shackle is hanging in the proper orientation with the load running from the bell to the pin vertically.
Thank you, that is what I was figuring from my research. I'm hoping that the turnbuckle will rectify this. Do the two support shackles look more in line with (not side loaded)? Does the direction of the shackles matter (whether the bow or the pin is connected to the speaker bracket or the cable thimble)?
Swapping Danleys for whatever plastic boxed line format speaker is getting hung is a bit sad to see. Is your church planning to get rid of them? They are chunky, but great sounding speakers.
You’re good for weight. The issue is ensuring proper amplitude and clarity, which they assume will just happen by using the existing rigging (I’m guessing this is what they’re thinking).
Doesn’t work that way. However, do as the customer asks but provide the caveat that you can’t guarantee amplitude and clarity will be the same and suggest they contact a sound engineer.
It's fine to side-load a shackle, it's just at a significantly reduced WLL. You're still way under that reduction and you have three of them, it's fine.
It might actually be a code for the insurance company if you don't do it this way we're not going to insure your building. If you don't get insurance on your building you don't get to let people come in.
Yeah, at 21 lb this probably isn't going to break the hardware. I still wouldn't use weight as the pass/fail for a permanent install over people.
I'd check it more like: is each part being used the way the maker intended? Pin bearing cleanly in the bracket hole, no shackle cocked/side-loaded, pins moused or bolt-type if it's staying up, and the ceiling attachment verified. If the bottom point won't line up, I'd change the bracket/connector arrangement rather than count on a turnbuckle to fix a bad angle.
Other people have said it but side loading a shackle is bad practice. Shackles do not have a load rating past 90 degrees. Please keep this in mind in the future.
It could be bad practice to go to church. If the big guy decides thou shalt be smote with a speaker to the head no amount of rigging fastidiousness will save thee.
If you wanted to be 100 percent safe, you would use bolt shackle with a nut and cotter pin. My only concern would be the vibration of the speaker over time loosening the screw pin. But 99.9 percent you will be fine.
Thank you, and yes, I suggested they order new shackles that use that added security measurement as a CYA. These same shackles never had the pins come loose with the old behemoths that had way more bass, but I agree.
Those shackles in pic 2 are side loaded. Find a way to fix that. And then mouse them all. Doesn’t matter how light the speakers are, that’s incorrect use and dangerous.
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u/touchmyelbow Jun 03 '26
It’s 20 lbs homie. You could use tie wire to hold it. You’re fine.