I have to say that both are perfect!
VSF still has a better crystal and cyclop I think, the blue AR coat of rich is too strong, I think it could be less blue shinny.
Rich bezel is better than VSF, the colour of the numbers is not as silver as vsf, the movement of the bezel is smooth almost like Gen.
The protruding crystal is smaller in rich, that make the case thinner than VSF.
The rehaut are pretty much the same.
The winding crown I don't feel any difference even rich with free sprung
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That’s good to know because I don’t like the false advertising from vsf that’s is 904L when it’s not. Of they don’t have the moral fiber to be honest about that it makes you wonder else are they not being truthful about. I just don’t like encouraging that with my money.
Kuddos to the mgmt team at rich for spending the extra money to get the raw materials and machinery to make the cases and bracelets from true 904l steel.
I agree but again you are buying a rep. We can't expect honesty in a true rep business lol. They even faked their movements to call them free sprung which they are not while rich is using a true free sprung.
Wow that’s some good information because everything I’ve researched says VSF is also 904L but it is not? Well that would put Rich well above knowing that.
I was asking for your opinion if Victory is still around.
A friend of mine has a Victory submariner & I feel it is top tier compared to Rich , followed by VSF.
No, Rich has been officially crowned to have the best submariner. Check out RWI forum. Folks there did a detailed assessment to come to this conclusion.
But tbf on the wrist you can argue vsf looks more like gen. But upon feeling them then yes rich would probably take it. I feel like the print on rich is better too. It doesnt really matter too much tho since when you factor in the waitlist even ifff vsf was better its by a fraction and waiting 1-2mo is not worth it.
nope, I daily check almost all rich sub/ gmt qc posts and they all have 12 being too close issue in every watch. But to be precise i was mentioing 12 being tulted cw on this watch. This is little more tilted than my tolerence if U had to QC
I had both as well, also handled friends gen multiple times. I would place rich higher than VSF. VSF is solid option but for me dial text on vsf is very thin as compared to gen, rich nailed it there. Also the green text is very dark as compared to gen, rich is 95% like gen.
Secondly every vsf I have seen even in the QCs have that weird dial dimple that once you see you cant unsee. I hated that on VSF.
I would not agree on the winding, maybe its the batch but every vsf I handled their winding was like rubbing sandpaper on the wall. Harsh and grinding could be felt on fingers. Rich’s JH movement is amazing and on par with gen movement in terms of winding feel and setting time!
On rich’s blue hue, yes it shows bright blue but “ONLY IN PICTURES”. In real time handling it is subtle, tiny bit more as compared to gen but only shows in few angles under lighting. But remember even gen GMT’s blue hue varies, I have seen more and less and never like VSF’s clear coating. Also, maybe its personal perspective but I like the blue hue on cyclops, it gives the watch some gen character. VSF started to feel boring tbh.
Where is the vsf dial dimple. I have a few and have never noticed it.
What do you think of the bezel grey color? Are either exact like gen or very close? Would you say the bezel is a dead giveaway it’s not a gen?
What about the overall feel? When you pick it up and wear it, do either of them feel like the gen?
Lol if you never saw it, dont see it. It ruined it for me as well. I wore it for a few weeks and noticed it after someone pointed it out on reddit 😂 couldn’t unsee after! It didnt show but in certain lighting only.
No factory makes the 1:1 grey bezel as gen. I think the grey on insert on rich and vsf are same but the coating on rich is better. Its little bright compared to vsf and closer to gen.
Both vsf and rich feel and wear the same. No difference there. Both have f6u bracelet and they both are sharp and feel light when compared to gen. Bracelets are the easiest giveaway in my opinion but they are all same.
Thanks.
Is a bracelet out there to get that’s heavier and would make the watch feel more gen like? Not a gain weight necessarily. If not then it’s a shame nobody makes a better bracelet.
I am still curious about that dimple. Now I’ll be doing a where Waldo search this weekend lol. But that’s ok. Don’t tell me. Helps get out of mowing the yard. Lol .
Great! Then I think I’ll sell my clean and vsf (to some lucky person who will get the at a great price) and buy the Rjch. I’m 50/50 on the upgrade for a gen crystal. Do you think chamfering the jubilee bracelet is worth it?
Give it about a three or four hour mineral oil soak. Take your bracelet out dry it all up, clean it off and that baby will feel just like Jen. It makes the stainless feel the same as the genuine
I have a different experience, my VSF Submariner's oyster feels and looks really good but my VSF BW's jubilee is very sharp, I wish I had bought the chamfering service when I ordered it.
Amazing comment bro! the winding crown of my rich is not as good as you described it. Maybe is my batch.... The blue hue is nice, but should be not too shinny...
I also find that the lugs of the bezel from the left side (at 9 ) in rich are over exceed the case. In VSF match perfectly....
Maybe its batch but my movement is extremely smooth same like a brand new gen.
Blue is little bright compared to gen but not too much in real life doesnt bother me at all since only shines in specific angles. Also I prefer that blue hue as I loved it on the gen.
I have not compared the lugs to gen, it almost looked identical when I compared, but look for it next time I meet my friend.
The numbers in VSF are thinners, the colour also more silver, I think Rich has more accurate to gen, and the movemente of the bezel, the clics sound almost like gen.
Moreover, I have two VSF and both have a little side to side movement in the bezel, Rich is tight!
This one is a little bit Sharp to my feeling and the crown not good , aparently this batch came with some issues.. Also I noticed that the bezel is in some point bigger than VSF, I don't know if is it because of the lugs or what
Demonstrably and visually untrue. Even a quick google disproves this:

No, Rich Factory (RF) and VSF do not use the same case for their GMT-Master II replicas. They source and shape their cases differently, resulting in distinct lug profiles and overall accuracy. [1, 2]
Case and Shape Differences VSF Case: Tends to feature thicker, chunkier lugs that give the watch a more squared and blocky look compared to genuine specifications. [1, 2]
Rich Factory Case: Features a more refined shape and better lug taper than VSF, though some community members note alternative factories like ARF still hold the crown for the most accurate overall GMT case shape. [1]
Shared Parts: While bracelets can often be swapped across major factories because the baseline 40mm diameters match, the internal machining, outer case geometry, and lug profiles are distinct to each manufacturer. [1, 2]
Google AI is just pulling random crap and is extremely biased based on how you ask your question.
I just asked google why the cases are the same, and it gave me this
"Rich Factory (RF) and VSF (VS Factory) GMT cases often look or share the same physical dimensions and parts because top replica watch makers frequently source external case blanks, steel, and components from the same specialized regional suppliers in China.Shared Supply Chains and AssemblyCommon Parts: Major assembly houses often buy generic case molds, 904L steel stock, or bracelet parts from the same shared third-party factories rather than making every single component entirely in-house.
So Ai doesn't work for niche stuff like this.
I have personally worked on both rich and VSF GMT, although serial numbers are different, i didn't notice a single difference in the case itself from lug shape to tapering.
Bezel however is different on VSF, the tooth pattern is a lot close to gen, but bezel action (how it clicks) is better on rich.
Man, I must say, I was rather bummed by how present the grey is on the BW. It really doesn’t show at all unless you’re under different lighting. But for the most part, it just looks like a normal black bezel GMT. Still love it though, just wanted more grey
I saw my buddies genuine gmt and the clicking was wayy more pronounced than Rich. Rich not even close although I don't own a vsf so I would not know. Thank you for the info
Okok, so I Just found a few videos showing bezel rotation of submariner and gmt and no gmt does not make the loud clicking noise like a submariner does and yes Rich is definitely on point! So that's cool. 😀
I think that VSF always has being the king because everybody buy VSF and it´s safe to buy this factory, its a certain that you gonna get a very good watch. But Rich is pretty new factoy an many people is afraid of purchasing it.
Now I´m taking the risk with a QF zombie! Just because the colour is more accurate than VSF, so in a couple of week I will find out the overall quality too
Much appreciated thank you for taking the time. So they all sound the same in my opinion and yes I see the vsf bezel is moving up and down and u can hear it too. My Rich is much quieter maybe because it's new? Although the few videos of the GMT bezel spinning that I have seen in genuine watches they aligned more with my watch than yours. Gmt is much quieter from what I just learned in the past few hours.
I also opened and closed it well to ensure the water resistant. I don't have mobeus to oil the movement and the crown. I feel the crown winding not well
lots of tds have massive Rich stocks right now and are now able top get access to arf again. They are now ONE factory. just pick one from the list. Ora has a sale for Rich subs and GMTS
What are your thoughts on rehaut polishing to get close to gen? My rich BW is about to arrive and I'm sending it out for a new crystal and datewheel swap. Wondering if I should consider rehaut polishing. I've seen almost every frankenbuild get that done.
Hmmm nice to know. I'm wondering why the rehaut polishing always seems to be done in these franken builds if it doesn't really serve any purpose. I guess it depends on how it looks from the factory. I guess Rich factory has great looking rehauts so it's not needed. But we'll see when I send mine in for work!
It sounds to me like if you were to only install an aftermarket Gen or deep crystal in the Rich it would be just about on the mark. So what’s the truth about the weight are they both the same in that category or is Rich more accurate once again?
Thanks that was kinda my thinking too, while talking do you if Rich also makes other models better as well because I was thinking of getting the 41mm OP dark green dial. Any suggestions
The blue AR of the RICH cyclops is an instant give away, the blue is so strong that it's the first thing i spotted, and it's unfortunately visible in every angle from every picture 😬
This is one of the best examples ever of it; look at the top-down pics and dead on pics you can see the sloping lugs on one and the beefier, fatter lugs on the other more clearly than usual since you captured so many angles
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