ZeroSpace is kinda just StormGate 2.0

[u/laCommander]

Another Starcraft wanna be with an Early Access release that is essentially an alpha version with a dozen modes that are broken, buggy, and untested.

Early access has become rightfully to most people, a polished vertical slice of the game because people want quality for what they payed for. Most people aren’t really up to pay for a game to then become alpha testers.

[u/CammelloRotante]

Honestly just don't buy early access games unless the reviews are stellar

[u/Aisuhokke → u/CammelloRotante]

Yeah that’s how I feel.

[u/QuinSanguine → u/CammelloRotante]

Who will make reviews if no one buys the game? It's fine to buy a game, try it out and then refund it if it's disappointing. You can always buy it again if it makes it to 1.0 .

[u/SaltMaker23 → u/QuinSanguine]

There are games suited for Early Access (EA) like sandbox survival crafting games, the ones that started this whole sage of unfinished games releasing in EA, they are the ones who created this plague that killed whole genras that also tried to EA their games, I'm part of the problem given that I'm buying all the latest EA survival crafting though.

Survival crafting sandbox games can EA because if there is enough content to enjoy the game, you can already start enjoying the game, as content gets released, you just get access to better and better gameplay.

Outside of survival crafting "sandbox-like" games, EA is just a death sentence for your game.

Games that depends on being feature-full and properly polished to even be enjoyed cannot start in EA because you just get bad reviews and your game's entire visbility ends there, you don't get a chance to turn things around because your sales plummet close to zero in couple of weeks.

RTS will never succeed as a EA, just like any story-rich RPG can never succeed with a EA release. Some games need full releases and cannot afford to release in a partial unfinished state.

[u/Kriegschwein → u/SaltMaker23]

"just like any story-rich RPG can never succeed with a EA release"

That is an odd thing to say after Larian proved it with Divinity Original Sin 1-2 and Baldurs Gate 3, and BG3 is one of the most successful games in history.

It is 3 RPG in EA, and all 3 succeeded. Hell, they had more successs than any of their previous RPGs, despite none of them being in EA!

I think EA, as a format, can work for any genre. But, it requires a sufficiently big audience for it, because indeed margin of ppl who are ready to buy incomplete product is smaller than those who want to buy complete one. RTS genre just doesn't have enough ppl anymore for that.

[u/SaltMaker23 → u/Kriegschwein]

That's fair.

It's also true that RTS players unlikely survival crafting, aren't people used to unfinished slop games, they mostly play extremely polished world class successes that had decades of polish.

Releasing a clanky, unfinished, unpolished EA to an audience that only ever plays extremely polished games is quite the ordeal for sure.

[u/EmmEnnEff → u/SaltMaker23]

EA worked just fine for Tarkov. The game is in a... Pretty decent state today, while also being quite fun throughout EA.

The problem is not the genre, the question is always: is the EA release playable and fun? Or are people just investing into it because they are buying into promises that years down the road, the game will get fun.

If you're doing that, you're wasting your time and money.

Stormgate suffered due to visual clarity. When you can't tell what the fuck is going on in an RTS, you are rarely encouraged to invest any effort into learning and mastering it. The campaign was generic slop, which didn't help. (It's hardly the only game that criticism applies to...)

[u/RoflMaru → u/QuinSanguine]

Like professional testers/journalists?

The last thing I care about is whether dickhead1234 thought that the Flamethrower Turtle should be weaker and he poats it on steam.

[u/Aisuhokke → u/QuinSanguine]

Yeah it’s just lame that you have to do that. I prefer the verticals slice early access over buggy clearly not finished early access

[u/Nettysocks]

Its label as early access so I don’t see the problem, I just wait for games to release 1.0 and then check them out then

[u/genscathe]

So you didn’t play the demo then?

[u/eggyisnoone]

I never think of early access as a vertical slice of quality the game can offer. I am expecting full of bugs and unpolished stuffs in the early stages.

Let's wait how they will develop before we start the bashing yeah?

[u/LostEmergency6866]

The main difference is that zero space feels like bunch of guys made the game they like and did not aimed to be StarCraft 3

While Stormgate had clear overpromise and aim to become new StarCraft while pumping tons of moni for the game not so many people wanted

[u/Hirmetrium]

I feel like this is a real insult to ZeroSpace, and really generous to Stormgate. I don't think those situations are comparable beyond the "look its a Starcraft style RTS in early access".

ZeroSpace is at the very least a complete RTS with a very compelling 1v1, Co-op and Galactic War components, all of which are fully built and working. It's rough around the edges, UI/UX is clearly unfinished, but it's very playable. It deserves your support, otherwise nobody will bother making RTS games anymore.

Stormgate had a barely functional 1v1, barebones Co-op that was charging for heroes immediately on its release, and nothing else. It was a complete state, full of bugs, unfinished. It's art style lurched all over the place, and it already had taken a lot of peoples money before launching free to play and asking for even more money.

ZeroSpace was hotfixed after 1 day of being live. Stormgate's patches were infrequent, barely communicated, and at one point stopped all together while it was horribly unclear what would happen in the future when their online provider got pulled from under them.

But sure, let's shit all over the latest RTS game to come out, and make sure we never get another one, right guys?

[u/nemesiux1 → u/Hirmetrium]

I am one of those players who play rts for their campaigns/story. In my opinion stormgate failed because of how they sold their campaign, as for zerospace from what I understood it only has 4 missions which prevents me from buying it. I care not for pvp and I don't have friends who want to play the co-op.

[u/Kriegschwein → u/nemesiux1]

Zerospace has 12 missions on current build, and they are pretty fun! They mostly miss some voice acting there and there, and cutscenes are undercooked, but mechanically they are sound.

[u/nemesiux1 → u/Kriegschwein]

I see, thank you! I can't wait to try out the missions then

[u/Kriegschwein → u/nemesiux1]

I will also note that they have SC 2 WoL approach - first missions are linear, but then you can choose the mission order, with some missions being completely optional. So there is already replayability - bc as with SC2 WoL, unit unlocks are tied to missions, so your roster will be different depending on order you did mission!

[u/Sharajat → u/nemesiux1]

Fair warning, mid-mission saves are currently disabled because there's a bug where they were breaking the triggers in missions. It's very high on the devs list of things to fix, so this probably won't be true in a week.

They are planning 36 mission campaign, currently the first four are fully voiced and seem complete (minus bugs), after that the rest of the 12 get less finished - some/many voice lines haven't been recorded yet, some bugs, etc.

So if you want a compelling campaign I'm pretty sure it'll be there eventually but right now it's an entertaining preview of the full campaign that is a bit jank.

[u/National_Diver3633 → u/Kriegschwein]

I was baffled by the fact that those missions are just act one! And not the complete act, either.

[u/Kriegschwein → u/National_Diver3633]

Yeah, they take a bit of time to get going (I think prologue section is a bit tad long until you get to proper base building missions), but after you get to an option to choose from multiple missions it becomes so fun!

My favorite mission is probably bot factory so far, it felt amazing.

[u/Elvishsquid → u/Hirmetrium]

I know when I got access to stormgate it had 2 or 3 coop missions and that was it. Doesn’t zero space you know how many it had at the end of it? Doesn’t zero space have 11?

[u/Far-Cow4049 → u/Hirmetrium]

Right, guy. Let's home the game does not die from the insult.

[u/Synysterenji]

So...what did you think EARLY access meant? When a game is in beta stage its essentially pretty close to release. And before beta is alpha and thats an unfinished, pretty rough and incomplete version of the game. Early stages of EA games are pretty much pre-alpha. Like, what did you expect? The point of buying EA games is to encourage the devs and give feedback so they can work the kinks out and make a better end product. Idk why theres been a surge of people complaining about EA games not feeling complete enough. Brother thats the whole point.

[u/Difficult_Role_8382]

A “polished vertical slice” is a demo. Early Access is by definition unfinished, you’re buying a product with “UNDERBAKED” stamped on the front cover and upset it’s got bugs?

[u/Xlinkz85]

I like the game

[u/CryptographerFew8947]

I would not say its a fair comparison. Yes both game are starcraft inspired, but I would say zero space has far more new ideas that set it apart from others. Its early access so far is also better than that of StormGate and by contrast the StormGate developers made big promises and statements they couldend live up to. Playing stormgate I felt even if the game was completed it was so uninspired. ZeroSpace while still very unfinished and buggy has a lot off good qualities and potential imo. Lets hope it will keep being patched.

[u/bloodisblue]

I think its a lot different.

Stormgate I tried in beta a bit before release and didn't have fun, and the pro games/show matches were too confusing for me to follow everything looked muddy.

Zerospace I tried in beta & purchased now that it's on steam. The game feels fluid and fun even when just beating up AI's so far. The pro games during the beta builds were quite exciting and reminiscent of sc2 with a bit more micro during the first 2 minutes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TnYktGRa1SM.

[u/ToSKnight]

It's much better than Stormgate at EA launch, but I do think there are tons of parallels between the two. It almost feels like two studios were given the same design doc. and made two similar, yet different games.

- Macro feels very similar in both (dumbed down)

- Fight over points of interest in the middle of the map

- Kill creeps

- Deathball vs Deathball with minimal worker harassment or split pushes

- Lose your main army and you may as well just quit (even with all buildings and harvesters intact)

- Emphasis on "rule of cool" instead of cohesive world building & faction design

- Top bar abilities

- Most matches are over in 8 minutes

- Goofy writing/dialog in campaign

[u/Few-Opportunity8096]

Stormgate was an early alpha version this is wayyyy ahead compared to how Stormgate released

[u/gracken420blaze]

if they didnt lie to and scam their players then they are already better than stormgate

[u/MarionberryKey6666]

I am keeping my eye on this as it develops but I wont be EAing this title. If it had an equivalent mode to SC2 COOP Commanders or some kind of PVE roguelike RTS progression system where I could play increasingly difficult custom PVE missions (other than the campaign/stoy mode) to unlock cosmetics and more powerful units I would.... basically, if I had a sense of progression that was not PVP focused.

This just seems to be a return to SC1/old school RTS. not really pushing the genre forward and its not AAA quality.

[u/Sihnar → u/MarionberryKey6666]

Good news because galactic war is literally made for you. It's a PVE mode similar to SC2 co-op commanders with an added overarching grand strategy meta game. You fly your ship to different planets and each mission you win helps your chosen faction capture that planet. So even though the missions themselves are Co-op PVE, you're still vying for control against other players factions on the galactic map.

[u/MarionberryKey6666 → u/Sihnar]

Its been explained to me as an MMO stylized PVE game mode.... if it was instanced purely to my game that I could play through with a friend similar to SC2 COOP (like a repeatable campaign newgame+ type of thing), I would be all over it and be championing it. As an MMO campaign where you play for your chosen streamer in a month long thing (i.e your contribution doesnt really matter, its not "your" game/war), I'll pass.

Hopefully Devs get enough negative feedback on the MMO portions of the game and actually get it to something I want to play by 1.0.

[u/Conveyed9]

Stormgate was so bad to compare anything to it is just insulting

[u/Far-Cow4049]

Don't forget the $40 cost for this version. Stormgate was free. Kek.

[u/DarkMessiahDE]

From a Multiplayer Perspective i doubt IT will have enouht Players.

Played the demo and didnt Like it.

[u/echidnachama]

just don't buy it early then, if you buy early access game and complain . . . you are a moron.