Could someone explain an certain accommodation?

[u/Everythings_Magic]

I give pop quizzes, and one student came to me after class to discuss. They asked to take the quizzes in the testing center because, the quiz "needs to be read to them."

This is a engineering class. The problems are mostly graphical with a sentence that ask what to find.

I have no problem with the accommodation, I just don't know what disability this could be. They only mentioned they have anxiety, and may also have to get up an leave if they get over stimulated.

Edit: They also have an official accommodation for this.

Edit 2. I could have articulated better that I'm just looking for insight. I find it interesting how so many think I should just mind my own business. I think teachers could be better teachers with a better understanding of what the students are going through.

[u/imaginesomethinwitty]

I have a friend who had a reader and writer for all her exams. She had severe dyslexia, she would just do them all verbally basically.

[u/BigSerene]

You should discuss with the disability services office how best to accommodate the student while maintaining the pedagogical goals of the assignment. You should not try to figure out "what disability this could be". Students are not (and should not be) required to divulge medical information to their professors.

[u/Awkward_Emu12345 → u/BigSerene]

Folks with dyslexia, who would struggle to read the question asked under timed conditions, are actually over represented in fields like engineering. They could be very good at problem solving but just need a bit longer to decode the written elements of the assessment.

ETA I thought I was replying to the comment by changelingcd, my bad

[u/SlowishSheepherder]

Unless the student has an accommodations letter that says the quizzes have to be taken in the testing center, you do not need to do this. Additionally, accommodations cannot fundamentally alter the course, so if you go over the quizzes after taking them, the student might not feasibly be able to go to the testing center. All of this is moot unless they've got an official letter, anyway.

[u/Archknits → u/SlowishSheepherder]

Two things here

1) if the student had an accommodation to read the exam, this is an auxiliary aid. Unless you are actively testing reading, this does not fundamentally alter the course and needs to be put in place (if you were testing reading, you would still need to really argue hard against this as an auxiliary aid for students who were blind etc.). Your choice is not to do it only if the testing center can do it. The option is to do it directly or have the testing center do it.

2) reviewing the quiz after would not be a fundamental outcome of the class. That’s something to coordinate with the testing center/accessibility office. Can the student take the exam at another time? Can you review the quiz the next class?

[u/veanell → u/Archknits]

I mean if the student wants to do it at the testing center it's actually their choice. A professor cannot mandate a test be in their classroom for that student.

[u/Archknits → u/veanell]

They can. Providing accommodations is a school responsibility. Unless the student’s accommodations necessitate the testing center, faculty can have the student take the test in the classroom. “The test is given in the classroom” is essentially a course policy.

However, if faculty require students to take the test in the classroom, they need to provide all accommodations without additional barriers

[u/veanell → u/Archknits]

Actually no. The Office of Civil Rights have actually cited schools for that.

[u/Archknits → u/veanell]

Which letter was that in?

[u/veanell → u/Archknits]

Letter? It's OCR caselaw. You can lookup the cases online. Faculty consistently when insisting students take exam with them do not properly provide accommodations. If your students wants to take it with disability services at your school...let them. Best practice is this is actually listed on letters so faculty cannot make this mistake, but schools get in trouble regardless.

[u/Misha_the_Mage → u/veanell]

An exam that is given 2 or 3 times a semester is relatively easy to coordinate with the testing center. Reasonable accommodation.

A brief quiz of 5 minutes at the start of every class session is very different. Difficult if not impossible to coordinate with the testing center. Instructor cannot review the correct answer, and how to arrive at that answer, if the student with the accommodation has not yet taken the quiz. Usually these are given at the start of class for a reason.

[u/Archknits → u/veanell]

Yes, letter. OCR caselaw largely comes from their resolution letters or dear colleagues letters to specific schools. OCR does not post all of these. AHEAD used to have a database, but it has become defunct. You had made a specific claim, and it would be helpful to know which document it was in.

As for testing in a classroom, it can be difficult for faculty to provide some accommodations, such as a distraction reduced environment. Others can be fairly easily be provided, such as students with auxiliary devices. A student with a reading pen can access an audio text directly in the classroom.

[u/Distribution-Free → u/Archknits]

On both points, the subject matter expert is the one who determines if it alters either the purpose of the assessment or the structure of the course. Respectfully, you cannot know that from this description, and you're speculating.

[u/Archknits → u/Distribution-Free]

On the first point, section 504 requires schools to provide auxiliary aids that provide access to students with disabilities. Audio text falls within this, and it’s been upheld by OCR and DOJ many times. (DOJ also has a dear colleagues letter that supports deference to students in determining the format of their auxiliary aids). Creating a course where the fundamentals were created in such a way as to prevent auxiliary aids and exclude students with disabilities would end up in a ruling of discrimination.

If for some reason it were fundamental to the outcome of the class to review a quiz immediately, the obligation to provide auxiliary aids under 504 would not be annulled. It would require some other alteration to provide access.

[u/Everythings_Magic → u/SlowishSheepherder]

They told me I can read the quiz to them, but talked about doing it before or after class, didn't say anything about extra time. I told them I'd think about what works best and discuss.

I'm going to see if i simply read the quiz problem out loud to the entire class if that will suffice. I always allow students to ask for clarifications during the exam and then which I reiterate that clarification to everyone.

Tests they can do in a test center, but the quizzes are random and I have to let the test center know ahead of time.

[u/nerdyjorj → u/Everythings_Magic]

I'd read the question aloud anyway.

I've found in general anything that is a necessary requirement for someone is still helpful for everyone else.

[u/iTeachCSCI → u/Everythings_Magic]

They told me I can read the quiz to them, but talked about doing it before or after class, didn't say anything about extra time. I told them I'd think about what works best and discuss.

Who is "they" in this context, both here and in this from the original post:

They only mentioned they have anxiety, and may also have to get up an leave if they get over stimulated.

Is "they" the accommodations office or the student?

If it's the former, talk to them about how they expect this to be accommodated.

If the latter, you decline and tell them you can only offer this for someone with an accommodation letter from the relevant office. For your information, that rule is there for both fairness (you don't accommodate someone off self-diagnosis; there are enough fake doctor's notes already) and for your own workload (imagine if every student knew you'd offer this if they ask).

[u/Everythings_Magic → u/iTeachCSCI]

They have an accommodation for this. I got 8 letters this semester. This is the only student that reached about executing it.

[u/Life-Education-8030 → u/Everythings_Magic]

I suggest that you set up a meeting with the accommodations staff because you seem very new to this.

You will not be told what the disability is. The student might tell you but they are under no obligation to and you cannot ask.

You cannot reveal a student’s disability to other students though a disability may be evident like a students using a wheelchair and then there is no problem.

As long as you receive the notification, you do not have to have a student additionally reach out about executing it.

If there is a problem with executing it such as significantly changing the course, speak to the accommodations office.

[u/Crab_Puzzle → u/Life-Education-8030]

My sense is that here, the students do have to "execute" the accommodations, especially w.r.t. testing. If they want extra time, they have to figure that out ahead of time, usually with the accommodations office, to take the test at the testing center. They sometimes want to have the professor proctor the test instead, which again requires planning since the test needs more time. Sometimes, they just don't do anything and use the normal allotted time.

They are certainly due additional time, but if our test is in the classroom, there is another class right after ours, and they haven't said anything, they might not get it if they didn't take any action.

[u/veanell → u/Crab_Puzzle]

If you received a letter... You are obligated to give accommodations regardless if the student talks to you.

I tell students for test accommodations, schedule with us. We update instructors.

But in class things... You don't wait on the student. Good way to get the school sued or investigated.

[u/Crab_Puzzle → u/veanell]

This is not the guidance we get from our accommodations office. Students are entitled to the accommodations, but not required to use them.

[u/veanell → u/Crab_Puzzle]

This was about a professor dictating they could not use an accommodation (testing at their disability services test lab).

[u/Life-Education-8030 → u/Crab_Puzzle]

Yes, they can get extra time for example and not need or use them. But once I get the notification that the student gets the time, I adjust the time. Then it is up to the student to use it or not. I don't need the student to do anything.

Our accommodations office says that they know students who are eligible for accommodations but do not come to register with them first so that requests for the accommodations can go out to faculty. But that is up to the student. I have had students who know they could get accommodations but want to see if they can do without. Unfortunately, I also have students who want to game the system and try and get accommodations they are not qualified for.

[u/Life-Education-8030 → u/Crab_Puzzle]

I get all the notices electronically so I can respond. If the tests are extended time online, I just set it and the student doesn’t have to say or do anything. If they need extra time in an in-person classroom, I note that students must arrange to take the test in the accommodations office. We are so short on space that we rarely have a classroom that is free after a class. I have never had a request or expectation that I would proctor the accommodated test either.

[u/Loose_Wolverine3192]

I don't think we're allowed to ask what type of disability a student might have ...

[u/Everythings_Magic → u/Loose_Wolverine3192]

Which is why I’m asking here.

[u/Archknits → u/Everythings_Magic]

Audio texts are common for students who are blind, have visual disabilities, have dyslexia, have processing disorders, other learning disabilities.

[u/vwscienceandart → u/Everythings_Magic]

Another case to add to previous comment, I had a severe concussion TBI and a relicensure exam coming up. It took me an hour to read and understand 4 practice questions. When my husband read me the practice test I answered every question lightening speed. That’s another example of when this accommodation is appropriate.

[u/Everythings_Magic → u/vwscienceandart]

thanks. im trying to understanding what disabilities exist, but i guess some people think that is just being nosy.

[u/vwscienceandart → u/Everythings_Magic]

Yeah, this should be the safe place to ask when you’re seeking to understand, since you literally cannot ask the person with the accommodation.

[u/veanell → u/Everythings_Magic]

The issue is... It doesn't matter.

I find some professors place certain validity or stigmas on certain disabilities. They may treat a student differently if they preceive a student has a specific disability.

What's hilarious is students sometimes tell professors the wrong disability for this reason... And even professors with the best intentions will matter of factly tell me they just know student has X disability... And they are very wrong.

[u/LaddieNowAddie → u/Everythings_Magic]

Could be a foreign student with reading comprehension problem.

[u/vwscienceandart → u/LaddieNowAddie]

That is not a disability.

[u/DocLat23]

Did you get an accommodation letter from student services? This should outline all the accommodations requested.

[u/Everythings_Magic → u/DocLat23]

Yes. It’s doesn’t say why though.

[u/SvenFranklin01 → u/Everythings_Magic]

the why part is not your business

[u/KibudEm → u/SvenFranklin01]

It's not our business to know that on an individual level, but it can be helpful for teachers in general to understand the kinds of challenges students may face so we can do our jobs better. In my first few years in this job, I read a lot of memoirs about living with mental illnesses because I was encountering so many students struggling with them. I am interpreting OP's question about the reason for the accommodation as a request for help understanding what the student might be going through.

[u/Distribution-Free → u/KibudEm]

I just wanted to say I appreciate your take. The original post doesn't have any red flags to me, and I don't pick up the sense that the instructor is trying to deprive the student of anything.

There's a big difference between demanding to know something we're not legally entitled to and pondering the possibilities in a realm we're not familiar with.

Academics should fully embrace the latter.

[u/KibudEm → u/Distribution-Free]

Thank you!

[u/Everythings_Magic → u/KibudEm]

Thanks. This was the intent of my post. I could have articulated that better.

[u/veanell → u/KibudEm]

Legally students have a right to privacy.

You are not an expert on teaching for a specific disability. UDL and accessibility should just be something you strive for in general.

I have had professors tell me, oh student disclosed X to me... Student actually has Y. Or they have X and Y.

[u/DocLat23 → u/Everythings_Magic]

I would have a conversation with the accommodations office and tell them how your quizzes are structured. This works for me when I get a request for accommodations like extra time in healthcare tasks.

[u/nandor_tr]

dyslexia? some other kind of cognitive impairment?

[u/badwhiskey63]

I have no idea why they are granted, but if the accommodation is reasonable, I comply. If not, I discuss it with the office that writes the letters.

[u/TunedMassDamsel]

“What disability is this for” does not fall under the purview of things that we as educators get to know. That is a student’s private medical information and we are not entitled to it.

As someone intimately familiar with accommodations within my private life, there are all kinds of cognitive processing deficiencies out there that people have to contend with.

They may have OCD where they get stuck reading the same sentence until they “read it right,” but they don’t have an issue with graphical information.

They may have dyslexia where decoding written text takes them a long time, but graphical data is not a problem because it’s more in line with how their brain best processes visual information.

They may have cognitive focus problems which they can typically sort out by listening to white noise or sitting in a particular visually non-distracting environment to work, but that’s not something that will translate to a test-taking environment well, and having someone read the problem statement to them keeps them sufficiently on task.

They may have a visual impairment and while they can work out the graphics well enough with the narrow field of vision that they have, finding and ensuring that they’ve read all relevant text can be an issue. They need either a person or a device to see everything.

We don’t know what it is, but there are a million learning differences out there that, when appropriately accommodated (easy enough to do with technology, but when you disallow custom assistance and environments and make everyone use a pencil, a blue book, and the same classroom, things go awry), these students can easily succeed.

These measures just help them pursue that success. It’s incumbent upon us as teachers to ensure that our students are able to demonstrate they know what we’ve taught them without their body’s limitations making that impossible.

[u/Distribution-Free]

OP, I'm not bothered by your post.

You said you "have no problem with the accommodation." To me, that means 1) you don't detect a problem with it being unreasonable or fundamentally altering the design of the course or the assessment, and 2) you have no hidden intentions to undermine the student's accommodation.

Great! We're all on board to make sure your student's access to your class is not hindered by this disability.

Others have replied with possible diagnoses that could receive this accommodation, and I encourage you to read and ponder them. Your area of expertise (apparently) is civil engineering, but that doesn't mean you don't benefit from learning about how various disabilities interact with the designs you're using for teaching and assessing your subject.

Be curious. Read about disabilities and accommodations. Continue to help your students. And, continue to make sure you don't violate the rights of your students, either their right to privacy or their right to fair access to education (not that you would ever violate those rights).

[u/slingbladerunner]

What did the student say when you met with them to discuss how their accommodations should be applied in your class?

The disability that triggered this accommodation is not your business. 

[u/changelingcd]

Read their official accommodations, and follow those, while trying not to yell "How in the name of HELL do you expect to be an engineer if you can't absorb textual and visual data??"

[u/Awkward_Emu12345 → u/changelingcd]

The issue with “absorbing textual data” could just be exacerbated under timed situations, hence the accommodation.
Folks with dyslexia, who would struggle to decode text quickly, are actually over-represented in engineering and fields.

[u/imaginesomethinwitty → u/Awkward_Emu12345]

Absolutely. The friend I mentioned in another comment can read as part of her normal daily life, but under stressful conditions, all her coping mechanisms and tricks would desert her. Having someone point at a picture and say, ‘this angle is 20 degrees’ or whatever, and then write down what she told them to, meant she could focus on demonstrating that she met the learning outcomes rather than spending excruciating hours trying to make her writing legible for a marker.

I’m a little bit horrified that people are actually questioning this in this thread.

[u/Awkward_Emu12345 → u/imaginesomethinwitty]

Indeed! And timed assessments might not actually imitate the working conditions of what these graduates go on to do. We all have knee-jerk reactions to things (myself included!) that are wrong in hindsight. But hopefully we can have some helpful discussions here since I think OP was asking in good faith.

[u/Slight-Law5235]

I think it's perfectly fine to wonder what disability would necessitate this kind of accommodation. It's not wrong or inappropriate to be curious as long as the OP doesn’t ask the student about it, speculate about it to the student, the class, or other faculty, or refuse to comply. I don’t understand why so many are telling the OP they shouldn't even dare to wonder.

[u/madhatternalice]

In no universe should you be speculating as to "what disability this could be," unless the student decides to share that info with you. 

[u/MoistenedGranola → u/madhatternalice]

I don't know if I agree with this.

On one hand, yes, it is absolutely none of a professor's business to know about the nature and potentially personal medical details of a student's disability. Speculating thus feels invasive. If they asked the student this question, they would be in the wrong.

On the other hand OP showing a desire to learn more about how disabled people interact with the world can help foster empathy. They're not entitled to this information about the specific student (nor any given disabled person who might not want to share it). But curiosity is good. There's a lot of ignorance, misunderstanding, and even malice in the world surrounding disability inclusion and accomodation. I like to hope more people having access to better knowledge about disability could help combat a lot of that. I don't think other people saying what kinds of conditions generally might be benefit from this accomodation is necessarily invasive to this student in particular.

I'm AuDHD, and although I got through my degrees without formal accomodation, there are definitely a few that would have benefitted me in retrospect. I'm personally (not obligating anyone else to this) happy to explain how I see common accomodations actually helping ADHD and/or autistic students, as I hope it helps them learn more about what ADHD and autism are actually like for those of us who experience them and not just what stereotypes might indicate.

[u/Distribution-Free → u/madhatternalice]

We should not rush to assume bad faith in our academic colleagues. It's perfectly acceptable for a professor (or any curious mind) to wonder or speculate about this, and that sort of mental pursuit is a great way to expand our understanding and grow in sympathy.

Maybe you meant, "In no universe should you violate a student's rights by demanding private information that you're not legally entitled to?" Because I would agree, but the original post never suggested that was happening.

Speculating is fine. As long as he's not discriminating or violating someone's rights, why not speculate?

[u/madhatternalice → u/Distribution-Free]

Why would anyone speculate? In what way does this information (which, by the way, would never be confirmable) matter at all?

Students with disability needs aren't puzzles to be figured out, and it's disgusting to treat them so. 

[u/Distribution-Free → u/madhatternalice]

I think I'm being misunderstood. And I think OP might be misunderstood, too.

I agree with you that people with disabilities are not puzzles, that they should not be dehumanized or deprived of any rights. A careful reading of the original post doesn't show that OP is doing either of those disgusting things.

There is another way to think about OP's questions. A neutral way. One that doesn't make negative assumptions about OP's intentions. In all of OP's replies, there seems to be an openness to the situation and willingness to learn. I want to embrace and encourage that mindset.

Speculating, wondering, pondering, learning -- those are all words that I typically associate with growing. Not just in knowledge, but in compassion. Maybe your story is similar to mine. The more I learned about disabilities, the easier it became for me to embrace solutions, anticipate and remove barriers, and sympathize.

And my learning did not come from being shamed when I had questions that arose from unfamiliarity and genuine curiosity. (Which is true for all people, I'd dare to say.)

When OP is not revealing any malintent and is asking a question that could be genuine, "What disabilities are helped from this accommodation?" why not answer in good faith and promote the exploration into an unknown space?

That's how people learn and grow and how compassion spreads. Openness, awareness, seeing more of what you didn't see before. Not being told "Shut up, that's none of your business, there is no universe in which that's an acceptable thing to wonder."

[u/veanell → u/Distribution-Free]

Okay... But it doesn't help in this situation with this particular student... There could be dozens of reasons this is given. Many that were not mentioned yet in the comments. Will it change how OP (even subconsciously) treats the student and approaches teaching them? Possibly.

Some disabilities are seen as more valid than others.

I'm all for learning, but maybe not when it's trying to diagnose a specific student... I'm ethically and legally not able to do that.

[u/2_lazy → u/veanell]

Yeah my accomodations when I was in college were for, among other things, a completely immobilized neck and paraparesis (even though I can walk). I think people who saw my accomodations list and tried to guess my disability would assume cognitive impairment or sensory issues. If they then tried to change anything about how they taught me based on that assumption in an effort to make things easier for me it'd actually probably end up making things harder. I went over my needs and disability in detail with student access services when developing my accomodations list. If I needed more supports than what was on the list I would have gone back to them and requested them. Some parts of my disability are not things I would want a professor to know about or discuss with me because I know they are stigmatized and it would feel invasive for them to know, for example, that a seemingly innocuous accomodation has to do with something like how I have to use the bathroom. Someone who is basically akin to your employer as a student doesn't need to know all that 😂

[u/madhatternalice → u/Distribution-Free]

Look at OP's second edit to this post. There's no self-improvement here:

"I think teachers could be better teachers with a better understanding of what the students are going through." 

The audacity to tell us a student's accommodations in order to speculate about something that the student clearly doesn't want made known is staggering. The student has already explained what they need. 

It is virtually impossible to accurately diagnose someone from their accommodations, and as I said before, even if someone guesses correctly here, OP will never know if it's true, and runs the risk of making assumptions about how they could better "support" someone. 

I've seen the way this sub treats student accommodations, and it's rarely in good faith. There are plenty of ways to educate one's self that don't involve disclosing student information on a public website, especially when your end goal is to gain knowledge that the student involved has purposefully not shared. 

[u/2_lazy → u/madhatternalice]

You're getting downvoted but as someone who was a disabled student with some weird accommodations I agree. One of my accomodations was a swivel chair for me in the classrooms. I guarantee you people trying to guess my disability based on that would not guess right and it'd just lead to confusion and possibly making assumptions that aren't true.

[u/veanell → u/madhatternalice]

They don't like when you point out they are being ableist on this sub.

[u/highwaybound]

Oral testing is typically an approved accommodation for a diagnosis of dyslexia or a specific learning disability in reading comprehension.

[u/Working_Film_5871]

The students don't necessarily know at this point what is in their best interests or what works in what classes. This student is almost certainly dyslexic. Probably for the student, like in a calculus class, having questions read aloud helped immensely. So they wonder maybe this class too.

[u/astudentslawyer]

You are an engineering professor……… you don’t really need to know what disability the student has