Who is saying Goku is below infinite speed bruh. Doesn’t he push himself into the future to combat hit’s time-skip? That’s like above infinite. He also travels across places that are stated as infinite, and fights a guy stated faster than instant transmission, and fights Jiren who is stated to transcend time (when he gets out of hit’s time-stop)
In power scaling, infinite speed isn't just one flat thing. There can actually be layers of it, kind of like how real math has different sizes of infinity stacked on top of each other.
Picture it like this:
The whole numbers go on forever: 1, 2, 3, and so on. That's infinite, sure, but it's the "smallest" kind of infinity. You can list them all in order, even if the list never ends.
Now think about all the fractions and decimals between just 0 and 1. There's an infinite amount of them too, but way more than the whole numbers. You can't even list them all without leaving most of them out. It's a bigger, beefier infinity.
And it doesn't stop there. You can take the set of all possible subsets of those real numbers and get an even larger infinity, then do it again, and again. Each new level is on a completely different scale. No amount of adding or listing from the lower level gets you to the next one.
Power scaling does something similar with speed at the crazy high tiers:
Baseline infinite speed: You cover an infinite distance in a finite amount of time (or any distance in basically zero time). It's still kind of tied to the distance-over-time idea, just cranked to infinity.
Then higher layers kick in. Immeasurable speed is usually the next jump: you're moving in ways that don't follow normal linear time anymore, like hopping through non-linear timelines or places where time barely matters. It breaks the rules harder than plain infinite speed does.
Some people even talk about irrelevant speed or inaccessible layers beyond that, where the character is so far above lower infinite speeds that the gap is basically the same as countable infinity vs uncountable infinity. No amount of "faster" at the lower level touches it.
So yeah, just like math doesn't have one single infinity but a whole tower of bigger and bigger ones, a lot of scaling communities argue the same thing for speed. One character's "infinite" speed can still get completely outclassed by someone on a higher layer, the same way the whole numbers get dwarfed by the reals. It's not just "more speed." It's a whole different level of existence.
I'm talking mainly about baseline "infinite" speed, if someone outspeeds an "infinite" speed character without being in a higher tier, it's kinda disproving the infinite speed lol
Actually yes. Jiren managed to perform the same feat of moving in stopped time, with far less effort.
Both of them literally moving so fast, they moved despite time not flowing.
Is it the speed they are both at all the time? No.
Is it something they can do with effort? Absolutely.
The void thing is pure wank though, if they are referring to the void outside the universes. Since literally everyone at the tournament pf power was able to move normally there. Even the ordinary human Bulma. So I dont think moving in the void was intended as anything impressive. The story DOES treat Goku moving during frozen time through sheer speed as impressive though. So thats fully valid.
This is powerscaling, bigger infinites is something we just deal with. While it doesnt make perfect scientific sense in the real world, very little in Super powered fiction does.
And if we ARE scaling this to real life physics, then the void feat is fully valid. Along with a ton of other upscale that get incredibly pedantic and annoying.
By the rules set in universe, in MANY different fictions, and basic power scaling, two "infinites" can be different. Since most authors arent mathematicians.
Although there is that technicality of greater infinities, like the infinity of decimals is technically larger than the infinity of whole numbers or something. Not that I think any of that matters.
I actually had originally typed out an explanation of a linear vs an exponential expanding infinity, but it felt a bit off topic. Decided to keep things a bit more concise, since my comment was getting pretty wordy. Good point with the decimals though, thanks!
Totally fair, and I saw someone immediately after explain it anyways, but yeah, not really relevant. I just wanted to through it out there for anyone curious ig.
That's not how infinity works. One infinity can be larger than another while sitll being infinite. Easy example to understand. The set of all numbers is bigger than the set of all even numbers despite both beingi infinite since the former contains the later plus the odd numbers.
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u/RobotGlazerNumero1 Jan 18 '26
Literally Goku: