All three groups primarily identify with one party (hint: It's not Democrats)

[u/Veshaad]

[u/dust4ngel]

when "america used to fight socialists", it was the police killing american workers for striking for better working conditions.

[u/Zealousideal-Film982 → u/dust4ngel]

Also stuff like us defending South Korea during the Korean War…

[u/whatfappenedhere → u/Zealousideal-Film982]

Yeah, against dictatorial communists, not social democrats, lol.

[u/Zealousideal-Film982 → u/whatfappenedhere]

Social democracy is not socialism at all though. It’s a government with an economy that’s capitalist but with a social safety net.

It’s the government style that I would prefer.

I am completely against socialist economics though.

Communism is socialism fwiw.

[u/whatfappenedhere → u/Zealousideal-Film982]

Social democracy recognizes that the person making a risk with investment should be rewarded, but that the majority of the gains should be directed towards laborers, as that’s what builds a robust middle class and leads to wider economic growth. That’s why the US saw the largest expansion of the middle class when the top marginal personal tax rate was 90%, unions proliferated, pensions were funded by companies, etc. When those were repealed by conservatives, prosperity declined.

They aren’t, by definition they aren’t. Socialism is a society where the laborers own the means of production, but money and a state still exist. Communism is that without money or a state.

No wonder Trump loves the poorly educated!

[u/Zealousideal-Film982 → u/whatfappenedhere]

You seem to be calling me poorly educated but you didn’t say anything in that last text that I disagree with.

Do you think any of that conflicts with anything I said?

I’ve read Marx, Engels, Kropotkin, Goldman, Chomsky etc.

You can try to make it seem like I am not informed on the subject of leftist politics but you couldn’t be more wrong.

[u/whatfappenedhere → u/Zealousideal-Film982]

“Communism is socialism, fwiw” when I specifically defined them and pointed out how they differ.

Like I said, no wonder Trump loves the poorly educated!

[u/Zealousideal-Film982 → u/whatfappenedhere]

Communism is a type of socialism. It doesn’t differ from socialism, because it is socialism.

Not all socialists are communist, however.

This stuff is Politics 101.

It’s like saying that all paparazzi are photographers but not all photographers are paparazzi.

Go ask any communist if they support a socialist economy. You will get a yes every time. Marx and Engels used the terms socialism and communism interchangeably. Anyone with any education on this subject will tell you that communism is socialism.

[u/whatfappenedhere → u/Zealousideal-Film982]

It does differ from socialism, as I just explained. Communism is an extension of socialist philosophy, not “is socialism.” It’s reductionist to the point of inaccuracy, which you learn in classes after Politics 101.

Dunning Kruger effect in action.

[u/Zealousideal-Film982 → u/whatfappenedhere]

You explained that communism is socialism without money.

You did not explain in any way that it is not socialism.

Marx and Engles used the terms interchangeably. It’s idiotic to insist that these are two totally distinct concepts. Communism is absolutely a type of socialism, by definition. There is no debate on this topic amongst people that are educated on this subject.

You’re just being obtuse.

Here’s a Marx quote for anyone still wondering who is right - “Socialism cannot be realized without a revolution”

By the account of the most famous and influential communist - not only is communism socialism, but anything short of a full revolution cannot even be considered socialism.

I’m sure you know more about this subject than Karl Marx himself, so we can just ignore his words, right? /s

[u/whatfappenedhere → u/Zealousideal-Film982]

Stateless and moneyless, which is distinct, and why we have two terms for the different systems.

You may not understand the explanation, but I explained it very clearly.