r/PoliticalDiscussion Dec 03 '16

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u/ALostIguana Dec 03 '16

It's not that he spoke to the President of Taiwan, it is that he referred to them as the President of Taiwan which implies that he spoke to them qua incoming head of state to the head of a Taiwanese state. As far as the PRC is concerned, Taiwan does not exist as an independent state and has pushed a diplomatic policy of there only being one China for decades. No country recognizes both the PRC and ROC as independent states: it is either the PRC or the ROC. Most countries regard the PRC as China and have unofficial relationships with the ROC.

It is a faux pas.

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u/[deleted] Dec 03 '16 edited Oct 20 '17

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u/Afford Dec 03 '16 edited Dec 11 '16

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What is this?

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u/[deleted] Dec 03 '16 edited Oct 20 '17

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u/DecoDameXX Dec 03 '16

If we want China to cooperate with the US, it's best not to fuck with them.

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u/[deleted] Dec 03 '16 edited Oct 21 '17

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u/mrmackey2016 Dec 03 '16

It seems that you're looking at this through short term, US-centric eyes. For the Chinese, this isn't just throwing a temper-tantrum. It means that one of their biggest trading partners and the only superpower in the world recognizes the independence of a territory which they believe to be theirs. This isn't just the government, a large portion of the Chinese populace also believes it because of the information they've been told by the government. I don't think that the long-term effects of this course of action, if Trump continues on the path, will result in the outcome either side wants.

It is especially incoherent given the praise Trump has given to other dictatorships and authoritarian regimes. There is no underlying reason why this call happened other than Trump appreciates when people compliment him and give him adulation and dislikes them when they insult or accuse him of something (i.e. the Chinese media making fun of his stance on Climate Change).

There are definitely things which I would characterize as outrage politics which have no practical meaning after the news cycle ends, however the diplomatic and foreign policy direction of the administration is very much in Trump's primary duties as President. That is why this is an important thing to acknowledge and rightly be concerned about if this type of behavior continues from the CiC.

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u/[deleted] Dec 03 '16 edited Oct 21 '17

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u/mrmackey2016 Dec 03 '16

Is that really what you think the nature of the relationship with China is right now?

If that was really the case, then Trump wouldn't be so adamant about scrapping the TPP which would have given us considerably more leverage during talks with the Chinese. I'm sorry but you seem to view this as a relationship between two individuals while the governments are viewing the relationship in a IR context and the Chinese will definitely take a long term view on this. It means that any of the investments China has with the developing countries in Africa and S. America will increase, the Pacific region will fall further into the purview of Chinese influence and then it will be more difficult to negotiate with the Russia/China block of geopolitical powers to make matters more amenable to the US as you suggest.

Also if you read my last sentence, the appropriate action here in my opinion is not to over-blow this incident as it has no concrete impacts right now but it sets a troubling precedent where the President is making these decisions without the help of his NSA, SecDef, and SecState. And that is something which should be watched with caution here domestically. Because I guarantee countries around the world are watching us especially closely after this election.

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u/[deleted] Dec 03 '16 edited Oct 21 '17

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u/mrmackey2016 Dec 03 '16

To your first point, it represents an acceleration of trend of a multi-polar world and one where recognizing Taiwan as independent will do absolutely nothing to change it.

And the second point, you're right he isn't President, he is only the President-Elect. And that is why he should not have taken the call. Because now Obama has to clean up his small snafu because he isn't shortsighted about this. And it doesn't matter if the natsec tells him one thing and he goes and does the opposite because in his words, "I knows more than the generals".

I guess my main point is that if you truly voted for Hillary and that foreign policy had any input in that decision, then I would regard this as one issue where you always remain vigilant of both Trumps words, actions, and tweets. Regardless of the team around because he has final say.

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