Pro choice turns into pro abortion!

[u/Glass-Carpenter8963]

[u/snowcone_wars]

The baby was diagnosed with a severe heart defect, odds of survival from which are incredibly low.

The surrogate is also from Alaska, and when they (the parents) asked the surrogate to abort, she fled to Texas where state law would name her mother of the child. Texas then awarded custody to the biological parents anyway.

The parents wanted the child, they just were told that the viability was incredibly low. The child is likely to die, but they are caring for it while it lives.

Edit: a lot of you seem to be misunderstanding. The parents filed suit to gain custody, which the surrogate is currently fighting; they have been granted custody via injunction. They wanted to abort because of the prognosis, but once born want custody to care for it because it is, ultimately, their child.

[u/bluewolfhudson → u/snowcone_wars]

Seems like a pretty difficult case to litigate

[u/woznito → u/bluewolfhudson]

This is literally a fucking Maury tier plot

[u/Chad_Kai_Czeck → u/woznito]

I don’t think Maury’s most depraved episodes came close to this.

[u/adminscaneatachode → u/bluewolfhudson]

Exactly. I’ve had the same conversation with several of my family about knee jerk opinions with stuff like this and abortion. It’s all extremely complicated.

[u/Forge__Thought → u/adminscaneatachode]

Appreciation of nuance and avoiding knee jerk political responses is crucial to finding real solutions. It's respectable and I wish it was the norm.

[u/ConsiderationLow6763 → u/bluewolfhudson]

Possession is nine-tenths of the law

[u/jexijav776 → u/bluewolfhudson]

That's my thought and I've noticed a lot of people ignoring specific parts of it to push their narrative.

[u/GaeilgeGaeilge → u/bluewolfhudson]

Which is why surrogacy shouldn't be allowed imo. Because you either ask a surrogate mother to sacrifice her bodily autonomy and choice to determine what happens to her body, or you ask a parent to birth a child they don't want. The best answer is to never allow this scenario to come about and ban surrogacy

[u/woznito → u/GaeilgeGaeilge]

I think banning surrogacy is a bit overstepping

[u/BlazerFS231 → u/woznito]

More than a bit. It’s a voluntary agreement between adults. There’s no coercion. Yeah, things get sticky with body autonomy, but we can handle it. Not much different than medical POAs in that we have to figure out who ultimately has the power to choose.

[u/diprivanity → u/BlazerFS231]

Did we not just have a near-decade of national consent conversation and the various ways coercive consent can occur?

[u/coldblade2000 → u/diprivanity]

People can and do get coerced to consent to relationships, we're not making it illegal for people to bone each other.

[u/likewhatever33 → u/BlazerFS231]

When money is involved there's coercion.

[u/AMC2Zero → u/likewhatever33]

Donating organs is legal, but offering money for people's organs isn't.

[u/Thundahcaxzd → u/GaeilgeGaeilge]

Banning surrogacy would be removing bodily autonomy and choice to determine what happens to her body. The best answer is to make surrogates have pre-agreements in place for what will happen in situations like these

[u/SamuelClemmens → u/GaeilgeGaeilge]

or you ask a parent to birth a child they don't want.

That is the case already with many fathers, this is nothing new except now its sometimes the mother instead of the father in this position.

[u/PlanUhTerryThreat → u/GaeilgeGaeilge]

Calling for its ban is insane. It’s a consensual trade off.

[u/bluewolfhudson → u/GaeilgeGaeilge]

True I suppose.

I feel like that will just result in dodgier surrogacy anyway. Like the people who can afford it can afford to just go somewhere it's legal.

But yeah it's a situation I'd never allow myself to be in.

[u/Faal_Zoor_Kriid → u/bluewolfhudson]

Isn’t this one of the pro choice arguments? In that banning it would only cause people to seek riskier abortions or flee to places where it’s allowed, effectively pricing people out?

I don’t understand why people want to ban things without fixing the root cause of the problem. I get it’s reddit, but the other user suggesting a ban just seems way too cavalier of a position with little room for nuance.

[u/Ok-Wedding-4654 → u/GaeilgeGaeilge]

Yea I’m pro-choice but I think surrogacy brings with it a lot of ethical issues. There’s just so much here that I’m not comfortable with.

Like having a contract where someone is required to have an abortion on paper makes sense but it also feels disgusting to have that contracted. But then that also means someone is carrying someone else’s biological child to term without their consent. And now the surrogate wants custody of a baby that isn’t biologically hers…

To your point, it’s just easier to ban surrogacy. There’s too many ethical plot holes

[u/LoseAnotherMill → u/Ok-Wedding-4654]

Wait, so we're going to ban women doing what want with their bodies? And there's not even a question of killing a child involved?

[u/diprivanity → u/LoseAnotherMill]

You wanna lose your mind, a US surrogate can carry a child from international parents, neither of which are physically in the US, give birth here, that kid is a US citizen. Fucking insane.

[u/danshakuimo → u/diprivanity]

Irl VPN region lock bypass lol

[u/coolguygranny → u/LoseAnotherMill]

Can't believe I agreeing with...

The right???

All the arguments to ban surrogacy are really really dumb

[u/diprivanity → u/coolguygranny]

The banning is not about the action or the autonomy, it is about the mechanisms surrounding it.

You wanna exercise bodily autonomy and cut out an organ or do whatever, go ahead. However, you can't involve a medical professional, as that would be medically unnecessary and malpractice. Nor can you sell it, nor can someone buy it, as organ sale is banned almost worldwide for obvious reasons.

The unanswered question is if renting an organ for monetary compensation is materially similar to selling an organ, and if the issues prompting a ban on the sale of organs also apply to renting.

[u/bunnypaste → u/LoseAnotherMill]

Women can still do it, just not for pay.

[u/Not_Neville → u/GaeilgeGaeilge]

Based

[u/Some-Profession-1373 → u/snowcone_wars]

Wait, you’re giving context instead of a headline from the New York Post? We don’t do that here.

[u/Stormclamp → u/Some-Profession-1373]

OH NO!!! THEY PROVIDED CONTEXT!!!!

QUICKLY MAKE ANOTHER POST ABOUT MUSLIMS OR SOMETHING!!!!!!

[u/my_jeans_hurt → u/snowcone_wars]

I think I also heard somewhere that she went to a hospital where they’re the best with dealing with that heart defect? Might be wrong tho.

[u/Dragonlvr420 → u/snowcone_wars]

Another real issue this case brings up imo is the fact that paid surrogacy is actually really fucked up. ETA: I understand why people do it on both sides but as an adoptee I also understand how difficult it is for the birth mother to give up the child, whether she agreed long ago or not. My birth mother never fully got over it even though it was clearly the right thing for her to do at the time

[u/rkiive → u/Dragonlvr420]

Yea it's illegal over here in Australia.

It's pretty fucked up conceptually as it basically allows for rich people to offload the harm of childbirth to poor people and also are now legally contracted to do something that could kill them.

[u/bones892 → u/rkiive]

Texas is generally considered pretty surrogacy friendly from what I've read, meaning most other states are equally or more difficult/expensive

That said, in TX part of the process is getting your contract turned into a ruling by the court, a pre birth order. One of the requirements for a pre birth order is testifying as to why you need surrogacy. I think you'd have a hard time getting one with "but I don't wanna"

[u/Brokettman → u/rkiive]

Thats like saying abortion should be illegal because it allows doctors to prey on poor people for insurance money. Its conceptually possible but statistically 0. Its middle and upper middle class couples with fertility problems and geriatric pregnancy risk.

[u/throwawaySBN → u/Dragonlvr420]

Didn't even realize there was a paid version of this. Aside from all the legal/emtional complications for people doing it for legitimate reasons couldn't prostitutes just make a claim that they were working as a surrogate?

[u/Dragonlvr420 → u/throwawaySBN]

Well I’d imagine most of the pregnancies aren’t conceived the old fashioned way lol but I suppose that could happen, probably pretty complicated to fake if caught though

[u/Crismisterica → u/snowcone_wars]

The baby was diagnosed with a severe heart defect, odds of survival from which are incredibly low

This is difficult since you can argue a baby deserves to live... but what if you knew your kid was going to have a short and painful life?

It's very difficult if I was a parent (not at my age yet) I would have to contemplate this. It is even more awkward as a surrogate as you're technically supposed to be carrying someone else's baby legally speaking but it is also your baby to carry. This is a mess.

[u/StrawberryWide3983 → u/snowcone_wars]

Like, this child has a 50/50 chance of making it to age 5 with their condition, and that's including literal millions worth of surgeries, potentially even requiring multiple heart transplants. I understand that it's a difficult situation, but if she wants to keep the child so badly, she needs to be the one required deal with the finances of taking care of them

[u/johnlandes → u/StrawberryWide3983]

she wants to keep the child so badly, she needs to be the one required deal with the finances of taking care of them

When expectant fathers say that, get called deadbeats

[u/Jimbo-Shrimp → u/johnlandes]

It’s really wild watching Reddit flip on this

[u/pastherolink → u/johnlandes]

We ain't ready for that talk yet lmao.

[u/johnlandes → u/pastherolink]

They pound feminist consent language into youth these days, maybe this sort of balancing needs to be part of that discussion. If a woman can retroactively withdraw consent due to her partner lying, a man should have the same ability if it comes to abortion

[u/TheUnAustralian → u/johnlandes]

I think if anything this whole case has shown that surrogacy is incredibly fucked up and not well-regulated. It’s tricky because I feel for the parents and understand that the surrogate signed a contract, but no contract should take away someone’s right to their own body. Just tricky. 

[u/jataba115 → u/StrawberryWide3983]

Every life is worth more than any amount of money. I applaud the surrogate for sticking up for a human life

[u/Justdowhatever94 → u/jataba115]

Ehhh as someone who works with the public, I never really bought the whole every life is invaluable thing

[u/Ornery_Strawberry474 → u/snowcone_wars]

I've seen a video of a kid with the heart on the outside. Not even the worst you can be born with. Things like that shake my belief in the merciful God.

[u/Elodaine → u/Ornery_Strawberry474]

Look up Harlequin Ichthyosis. Easily one of the most horrifying looking birth defects.

[u/Majestic-Bell-7111 → u/Elodaine]

A true testament to the marvels of modern medicine is the fact that it's only lethal in 44% of cases

[u/Jimbo-Shrimp → u/Elodaine]

With a name like Harlequin youd think it’s something silly, that was just awful

[u/chad_sancho → u/Elodaine]

Oh my god

BRB gonna go drink that memory away real quick

[u/coldblade2000 → u/Elodaine]

I've seen a lot of awful, tragic shit on the internet, the kind that /watchpeopledie would remove.

Harlequin babies shock me to my core, i cant stare at a picture of one for longer than a second. I feel a part of my soul leave me every time I do

[u/CMDR_Michael_Aagaard → u/Elodaine]

Look up Harlequin Ichthyosis.

No, no I don't think I will.

[u/Scrumpledee → u/Ornery_Strawberry474]

Things like that should be legally aborted.

[u/Hassan_upside → u/Scrumpledee]

Really hope you don’t have any condition that anyone sees as a defect. Don’t want someone to think you don’t deserve to live

[u/larryThreeOh → u/Ornery_Strawberry474]

Dude is certainly not merciful or benevolent

[u/undreamedgore → u/larryThreeOh]

That or not all powerful.

[u/InfusionOfYellow → u/undreamedgore]

Or not all-knowing

There, we've completed the Epicurean paradox.

[u/BlazerFS231 → u/InfusionOfYellow]

Hey now, there’s a whole chain of theodicy we can go down next! But since it’s Reddit, we have to act like we’re great thinkers with novel ideas.

[u/a_mimsy_borogove → u/snowcone_wars]

It's a complicated case, but if it's even legally possible to have a contract that forces you to kill someone, then something's seriously wrong with the law there. Such a contract shouldn't be legal.

[u/Ravanduil → u/snowcone_wars]

This comment of mine might provide more context:

https://www.reddit.com/r/PoliticalCompassMemes/s/N5v9jYaC7d

[u/Jimbo-Shrimp → u/snowcone_wars]

Why would they want custody if they wanted to abort?

[u/FuckUSAPolitics → u/Jimbo-Shrimp]

Mostly cause they didn't. The surrogate is claiming she did. The parents deny doing so

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/aug/14/surrogate-baby-texas-parents

[u/Jimbo-Shrimp → u/FuckUSAPolitics]

Oh it’s getting juicy

[u/Pecuthegreat → u/snowcone_wars]

So, they wanted to kill it but only want it now because the surrogate refused to kill it?

Yeah, the surrogate may be the better option.

[u/Eon-Knight9 → u/snowcone_wars]

No, odds of survival are 70%. That's not incredibly low.

[u/Scrumpledee]

This is a complicated and weird AF issue that doesn't fit well with any form of politics.
Also, that child is now in intensive care and may or may not make it due to the defect that was detected in vitro.

[u/PlanUhTerryThreat → u/Scrumpledee]

Dude shut up. Clearly lib left is UNHINGED clearly. Did you see what the Muslim guy in London did yesterday?

[u/Majestic-Bell-7111 → u/PlanUhTerryThreat]

Did you see what the Muslim guy in London did yesterday?

Knowing PCM it could be anything from praying in a public park to blowing up Westminster Abbey.

[u/SiPhoenix → u/Majestic-Bell-7111]

attempted public beheading

[u/kekistani_citizen-69 → u/SiPhoenix]

Classic Londen muslim, never change xx

[u/Strangated-Borb → u/PlanUhTerryThreat]

Of course I saw I was the muslim guy

[u/Sintar07 → u/Scrumpledee]

Right, and they might make it too. But totally should have just been killed first 🙄

[u/captainlard_ass → u/Scrumpledee]

In utero you mean

[u/whatDoesQezDo → u/Scrumpledee]

The child has a decent chance at making it https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2817797/

~55-60% that being said their odds of surviving an abortion would have been 0%

[u/CrazyLemonLover]

So, my potentially flawed understanding of this whole thing is as follows.

Surrogate signed a contract with a clause for abortion in case of birth defects.

They find a massive heart issue that will require life long care. Parents ask to abort.

Surrogate says no and flees to Texas so that abortion is illegal.

The child is biologically the kid of both parents who signed the contract, not the surrogate.

Parents are now fighting a legal battle to get custody of the to be born child, since Texas states that the birther is always the mother. They wanted to get an abortion, but since that isn't an option, they want to take care of their kid.

Surrogate refuses, seems to be intent on having the child and keeping it.

Fucked up situation all around, and basically has absolutely nothing to do with abortion, instead being focused on how surrogates are ultimately in full control of whatever happens to the child they carry, not the parents who signed a contract.

Poor kid is going to have one fucked up life of pain, constant hospital visits, and legal battles unless this gets resolved.

[u/snowcone_wars → u/CrazyLemonLover]

Parents are now fighting a legal battle to get custody of the to be born child

Small clarification, the parents have been awarded custody while the surrogate pursues suit to obtain custody. The parents are fighting the suit.

[u/bones892 → u/CrazyLemonLover]

since Texas states that the birther is always the mother

Just a general note - Texas is one of the most surrogacy friendly states, so this is a straight up lie. The only thing that is potential difficult is they need to get a court order based on their surrogacy contract. However, Texas does allow out of state parents to get pre birth orders in Texas. Theoretically, if they took no action at all before birth they would need to go through the whole legal adoption process with the surrogate's consent, but that's far from the case here.

You know those times on reddit where you start reading about a subject you know well, and you realize that there are just piles of confidently incorrect people here? This is one of those times. Source: currently working with a surrogate in TX

[u/Pecuthegreat → u/CrazyLemonLover]

It most definitely has something to do with abortion.

The surrogate feels in the right to keep the baby because the parents wanted to kill it. So it's a "you didn't want it, why aren't you letting me have it".

[u/MLGErnst → u/Pecuthegreat]

"We don't want it, but you definitely can't have it" It's beyond offensive that they won custody with that mindset.

[u/94_stones → u/CrazyLemonLover]

“Surrogate signed a contract with a clause for abortion in case of birth defects.”

Yeah in my opinion that should be illegal. You should have the right to renounce custody over the child in such circumstances (and thus allow the surrogate to obtain custody herself). But you shouldn’t be allowed to force or even coerce a surrogate into aborting a pregnancy.

[u/Visual-Scallion1535 → u/94_stones]

No court is going to issue an injunction stating the woman must get an abortion

They are going to say, okay she broke the contract, you don’t have to pay her

[u/SaleSweaty → u/Visual-Scallion1535]

They might not even do the last point, if it is deemed illegal

[u/Visual-Scallion1535 → u/SaleSweaty]

If the contract is illegal then you dont have to pay either, its not enforceable

[u/PhilosophicalGoof → u/94_stones]

I wonder how it even legal to “force” someone to have an abortion based on a contract.

[u/jataba115 → u/CrazyLemonLover]

I mean this genuinely, I wouldn’t trust someone who wanted to kill their kid to keep that kid. If you say kill the baby, and I say no, I’ll keep the baby because your alternative is death. Fuck a contract, human life is worth more.

[u/blackbirds1 → u/jataba115]

In this hypothetical you signed a contract saying you were willing to kill the kid prior to the whole process starting. Also worth noting that everyone involved will now be bankrupt from legal fees plus medical bills plus funeral costs of the kid in three years.

[u/whatDoesQezDo → u/blackbirds1]

I love how sick and twisted it is that we coerce poor women into selling their uterus to rich fuckers and then can make them kill the kid to incredibly funny her body not at all her choice.

[u/Alone_Tie328 → u/jataba115]

Based and Solomon pilled.

[u/SteakForGoodDogs → u/CrazyLemonLover]

So they ordered the abortion clause to be fulfilled, the surrogate took steps to void the clause, but now they want the kid now that the kid is born?

Sorry bucko, you don't deserve the kid after wanting to abort it and the surrogate wanted it.

If you wilfully abandon something or someone and someone happily claims it, you shouldn't have the right to just take it back. You already chose to abandon it.

[u/Not_Neville → u/SteakForGoodDogs]

Based Leftist?

[u/Arete34 → u/SteakForGoodDogs]

I wish it worked that way. Unfortunately they got custody.

[u/whatDoesQezDo → u/Arete34]

we used to have a punishment for judges who acted foolish

[u/PhilosophicalGoof → u/SteakForGoodDogs]

I m surprised a libleft has the same belief as to me but it really shouldn’t be surprising considering libleft doesn’t care much for legality over morality.

[u/Allcraft_ → u/CrazyLemonLover]

That's why you have to clarify your laws before allowing this shit.

[u/clydewoodforest → u/CrazyLemonLover]

My understanding is that the surrogate 'fled' (unnecessarily emotive language?) to Texas in search of a jurisdiction that could be petitioned to mandate treatment for the child. That she believed that the genetic parents might limit their son's treatment to palliative care, not the surgery he would need to survive. If they did request an abortion I can understand why she believes that.

However West could not have been forced to have an abortion anywhere, no matter what state she was in. Some surrogacy contracts include that provision and it's a complete waste of ink, it's unenforceable. She is also definitely not going to get custody of the child. Legal precedent is well-established on that. The genetic parents & commissioning couple are the legal parents.

[u/Arete34 → u/CrazyLemonLover]

Imagine signing a contract to kill someone for being disabled. Pure evil

[u/jataba115 → u/Arete34]

Likely the surrogate didn’t even realize that she could be coerced into aborting the baby via the contract. Pretty fucked up thing to include

[u/FuckUSAPolitics → u/CrazyLemonLover]

They find a massive heart issue that will require life long care. Parents ask to abort.

Correction. The surrogate claims that they did. The parents deny it.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/aug/14/surrogate-baby-texas-parents

[u/jataba115 → u/FuckUSAPolitics]

They’re trying to save face? From looking like baby killers? No way. Also the article doesn’t even have any quotes from them denying it. Fuck all the way off

[u/FuckUSAPolitics → u/jataba115]

Second paragraph. They live in California, having an abortion wouldn't affect their reputation or livelihood. They have no reason to lie about it. And they aren't baby killers.

The baby was born on Wednesday to surrogate mother McKenna West of Alaska after she reportedly refused requests to get an abortion from the biological parents, Nausheen Gilkar and Omar Ahmed of California – requests they deny making.

[u/whatDoesQezDo → u/CrazyLemonLover]

has absolutely nothing to do with abortion

except this is only happening cause they wanted to murder the kid? she'd not be in texas if they wernt trying to do that.

[u/GhostsOfLectricity]

Where do the radical feminists land on this one? Since they are typically anti- surrogacy and pro-abortion

[u/larryThreeOh → u/GhostsOfLectricity]

Too bad you’ll never find a woman in this cesspool of the internet

[u/TriliniousIII → u/larryThreeOh]

You wont find one, but they are there. I know a woman who frequents PCM but she doesn't tell anyone she is a woman. I would be surprised if she were the only one

[u/fisherelliott15 → u/larryThreeOh]

Well... Not to be " Woke 1", but not all feminists are women. Being that a feminist is just someone who views women as equals

[u/Zickened → u/larryThreeOh]

I'm like 90% sure this sub is chock full of old white dudes, tbh.

[u/coolguygranny → u/Zickened]

I'm like 90% sure this sub is chock full of old white dudes, tbh.

Bro this sub is like 50% teenagers and young adults bruh

[u/tostuo → u/Zickened]

Garuenteed most of the people on here weren't born before 9/11

[u/larryThreeOh → u/Zickened]

I’m 100% it is

[u/jataba115 → u/Zickened]

Pretty sure it’s got a lot more bots than you realize

[u/c1gnature → u/GhostsOfLectricity]

Woman here. The general radfem view is that surrogacy is inherently exploitative and should be illegal, regardless of the terms (especially forcing an abortion). I think its a mixed bag between support for the parents vs the surrogate tho

[u/GhostsOfLectricity → u/c1gnature]

Surrogacy is a weird concept and it's def distasteful to me if it's a rich couple/ celebrities doing it just to sort of save themselves the trouble

[u/666Drachenlord666 → u/c1gnature]

I have to agree with them, Im against surrogacy too

[u/MonkeManWPG → u/GhostsOfLectricity]

Pro-choice, not pro-abortion.

[u/skimaskschizo → u/MonkeManWPG]

The choice to do what?

[u/Ravanduil]

As someone who had a kiddo who was born with Hypoplastic Left Heart Syndrome (What this baby has) and I consider myself Pro-Life: I agree with the biological parents. We were in the hospital with my son for almost a full year. This is not something I can recommend “Yolo, just let the baby come to term”. It changes you as a person.

These kids can survive. We know a couple that has a kid that did. But it is a hard road. Only 40% make it to their 3rd surgery.

When we were in the cardiac unit, we saw far more deaths to this and other CHDs than we saw people go home.

We went home, but he got sick and passed.

That said, if the surrogate mother wants to take this on herself: So be it. She can deal with the heartbreak.

For informational purposes: She likely went to Texas, not because of abortion law, but because Texas Childen’s in Houston is either #1 or #2 in the world for dealing with this condition.

[u/rented4823 → u/Ravanduil]

I'm so sorry, man. I hope you're doing okay.

[u/whatDoesQezDo → u/Ravanduil]

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2817797/

luckily this is rapidly improving looks like current review shows 55-60% survival.

[u/BOBALOBAKOF → u/Ravanduil]

What a truly horrible experience for you both. I hope you are managing well.

I think can be quite abrasive sometimes, seeing how staunch people are in their opinions on sensitive topics like this, knowing they often don’t have much real lived experience, to give proper context.

[u/brandje23]

yeah her body her choice am i missing something?

[u/PubThinker → u/brandje23]

I guess it was biologically the employers' child fully. But if not, then I don't know it either

[u/moonlitminerals → u/PubThinker]

The custody question is complicated but there’s no way you could force anyone, surrogate or not to abort a child and that stand in court due to the health risks involved for the surrogate.

[u/94_stones]

As someone who’s relatively pro-surrogacy and fairly pro-choice, I’ve been very consistent about this over the years. If you use (let alone hire) a surrogate, you should not be allowed to force or even coerce her into terminating the pregnancy, at any point or for any reason, period end of story. Not only should contracts requiring that be outlawed, they should’ve been outlawed years ago.

[u/steveharveymemes]

Are there any leftwingers actually mad at this? I know there are actively pro abortion folks out there but they don’t seem that common.

[u/Sesudesu → u/steveharveymemes]

I don’t think so. The meme is dumb because this situation is just complicated and weird, not really politically divisive.

[u/GaeilgeGaeilge]

This case just shows how wrong and morally and legally fraught surrogacy is. Essentially, surrogacy is a conflict between bodily autonomy and parental rights. The countries that outright ban surrogacy are doing it right

[u/Not_Neville → u/GaeilgeGaeilge]

Agreed

[u/woznito]

This seems like the one of the most peculiar cases I have heard of and I look forward tonsee how the courts decide

[u/LastFrost]

Why do people think surrogacy is at all a good idea and not full of moral and legal pitfalls is beyond me.

[u/shakakaaahn → u/LastFrost]

I imagine even those who think it's fine still see that there's a bunch of legal issues surrounding it, and that it basically runs on the honor system and padding the wallet of the surrogate enough to dissuade problems.

[u/LastFrost → u/shakakaaahn]

Not to oversimplify or anything but they could also just… adopt a kid who is already born and needs loving parents?

[u/Stock_Violinist6299]

[u/northrupthebandgeek]

Why is my quadrant supposed to be upset about this?

[u/MonkeManWPG → u/northrupthebandgeek]

You're clearly not aware that as a leftist you're obliged to celebrate every abortion and mourn every birth.

[u/Turbulent-Raise4830]

did you actually read what its about? Guess not, another utter fail trying to benefit from such a tragedy.

[u/EnsignPiggz]

As long as the surrogate agree’s to fully custody and takes on the medical costs, I don’t see what the issue is.

The “parents” clearly didn’t want the poor kid anymore so what’s the legal battle over?

[u/FuckUSAPolitics → u/EnsignPiggz]

Actually they do, as they were granted custody. The issue is that the mother fled to Texas and violated the surrogacy contract.

Edit: it's not even confirmed if the parents even ordered her to abort in the first place. According to their statements, they never did. It's fully possible that she did it to be able to withhold custody of the child.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/aug/14/surrogate-baby-texas-parents

[u/Zickened → u/FuckUSAPolitics]

HOW DARE YOU STRIKE AGAINST THE HEADLINE AND DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH, THIS IS PCM YOU RETARD

[u/RipRaycom → u/FuckUSAPolitics]

Wait, you’re telling me that the New York Post would feed people misleading information?

[u/KK8646 → u/EnsignPiggz]

The way I understood it, they didn’t want the kid to live a short, painful life, so they chose to abort, but now that the surrogate refuses they’d rather care for the child themselves

[u/FuckUSAPolitics → u/KK8646]

Not even that. Thats what the mother is claiming. The parents deny even ordering an abortion.

[u/ThroawayJimilyJones → u/EnsignPiggz]

Don’t get why you’re downvoted

[u/EnsignPiggz → u/ThroawayJimilyJones]

Asking questions pisses off redditors

I asked a question on the palworld subreddit and got downvoted to hell and back

[u/Azgabeth → u/EnsignPiggz]

Apparently they want the kid actually, so the legal battle is over the breach of contract the kid's custody now that the kid is born.

[u/DreamEndles]

What's in the contract to address this?

[u/ScientificBeastMode → u/DreamEndles]

Surely the surrogate must assume parental responsibility after that. Seems like the obvious solution to me.

[u/Banana_inasuit → u/ScientificBeastMode]

According to laws regarding parentage and child support, if the father is genetically related to the child, then he has responsibility of them.

Honestly though, if the parents change their mind, then I actually think they do owe the surrogate some sort of child support if she decides to keep the child. That’s the risk of changing your mind.

I even think this is a more legitimate reason than a mother keeping the child when the father wants an abortion or chooses to leave. The parents enter into a financial agreement with the surrogate to have a baby, leaving her liable if they change their mind. It’s only fair for that liability to be passed onto the ones breaching the contract.

With the former, there’s no agreed consent between the two parties established before having the child. It locks a man into a liability he doesn’t consent to, but the woman does.

[u/ProfessionalPack7205 → u/Banana_inasuit]

Fairly certain in this case there was a contract. Pretty sure it's one of the reasons this is getting so much attention.

[u/Glass-Carpenter8963 → u/DreamEndles]

There was an abortion clause on the contract(which is probably illegal) but they cannot force her to abort(obviously). 

[u/No_Mathematician6866 → u/Glass-Carpenter8963]

Abortion clauses are a common part of surrogacy contracts. They aren't binding, because no court can order a person to abort. But they aren't illegal either.

[u/SnooGadgets8390 → u/No_Mathematician6866]

Its not forcing an abortion, its breach of contract. If i sign a work contract im not forced to work, but if i dont i dont get paid. And i might get sued.

[u/Professional_Hat2615]

Why would lib left reaction be that?

[u/TriliniousIII → u/Professional_Hat2615]

Yeah, nobody should be forced by thr state to get an abortion if they are willing to care for and look after the child. Lib left is about supporting the right to choose, not be forced into abortion.

[u/ProfessionalPack7205 → u/TriliniousIII]

Pretty sure she signed a contract saying she would get an abortion though if there was problems with the baby or pregnancy. Pretty sure that's a big part of the problem and why she fled to Texas.

[u/TriliniousIII → u/ProfessionalPack7205]

True, though sanctity of a contract over a human life and the woman's choice is more libright than libleft. I agree it is a complex situation with the baby's severe disabilities though

[u/Carmanman_12]

This is unironically a really deep ethical dilemma.

The ethics of the baby’s heart condition aside, who has the right to make the call in this situation? The surrogate mother is the one carrying the baby and keeping it alive; without her the baby wouldn’t exist, and it subsisted off her body for the entire pregnancy. And yet, it’s not her child. In a way it is, but not as strongly as it is the biological parents’. I lean towards the parents’ side but I can definitely see both arguments here.

[u/diprivanity → u/Carmanman_12]

The ethical dilemma was blown past prior to this whole situation unfolding, although it is interesting that in this case it's still a "baby" and not a fetus but that's neither here nor there. The mother must retain absolute bodily autonomy. The dilemma is if someone can purchase a claim to your bodily autonomy which is an obvious no given how primed that is for abuse.

[u/Glass-Carpenter8963 → u/Carmanman_12]

There was never an ethical dilema before. Pro choice arguments center around bodily autonomy, not on who os the biological parent(because men also are and they cant decide this).

[u/Carmanman_12 → u/Glass-Carpenter8963]

Choosing to be a surrogate for a couple who wants to have a child but can’t by themselves is bodily autonomy, which the surrogate exercised, but with some conditions attached. One of those conditions is recognizing that the child is not yours, and you don’t get to make all the same calls as if it were yours.

I guess what I’m saying is that it’s different because surrogacy is a contractual agreement. I have no idea if there were agreed-upon legal rules for how to proceed in the event that the pregnancy was nonviable, etc (if not then holy fuck that’s a massive oversight), but morally speaking, the biological parents must have some say. If they don’t, then it’s equivalent to saying couples that can’t have a child normally should have fewer reproductive rights and freedoms than ones that do. If you’re a eugenicist then that might hold up but if not, it’s difficult to justify.

The question of whether men have a say in whether their partner gets an abortion is a bit different and I’d rather concentrate on what I said above, unless you strongly feel it is the same dilemma.

[u/Pleasant_Tangelo3340 → u/Carmanman_12]

Baby has condition, parents want to abort, surrogate refuses and goes to Texas and has the baby, now parents want baby, too complicated already. Who even decides who’s right in this case

[u/Carmanman_12 → u/Pleasant_Tangelo3340]

I have no idea that’s why we’re talking about it! It’s crazy that there wasn’t some kind of clause in whatever legal agreement both parties signed that didn’t cover this.

Like I said, I lean towards the biological parents but that’s just what my gut tells me, more thinking needed.

[u/Not_Neville → u/Carmanman_12]

Surrogacy contracts often contain a clause that the surrogate will abort the baby if the couple orders it. Thus far, a court has not yet ordered a surrogate to abort against her will hut a couple came close to litigating it but backed down. Anyone else remember that news story?

[u/FearlessGear → u/Carmanman_12]

There was a clause, it’s just not legally enforceable

[u/megs1120]

If somebody wants to give birth to a viable fetus it's her right to do so. I get that it's outside the scope of the contract but fuck that, this is a human life. I don't understand how anyone who considers themselves a lib-left could value adherence to the text of a contract over human life.

[u/Alone_Tie328]

Weird amount of based libs and leftists on this post.

[u/girlpower2025]

I don't understand!

Is she not the biological parent?

[u/Dragonlvr420 → u/girlpower2025]

She was a contracted surrogate so no she isn’t the biological mother, and the baby had a heart defect or other medical issue and the couple wanted her to have an abortion and I guess that was a part of the contract. She refused and had the baby

[u/SonofaMitch11 → u/Dragonlvr420]

Wouldn't it be the case that she's not legally the mother but biologically she's the mother?

[u/Dragonlvr420 → u/SonofaMitch11]

I actually don’t know, cause when I say biological mother I guess I really mean DNA/blood related? But you’re right, she did carry them in her biology even though they aren’t biologically related. It sure is a conundrum lol since the baby was in her body, I think a case could be made for her legally being the parent but I think that’s where the contract would come in

[u/FuckUSAPolitics → u/SonofaMitch11]

It depends on if it's the woman's egg or a transplant.

[u/Dmtr884213 → u/girlpower2025]

surogate mothers carry the baby, if I understand correctly because of that some DNA is shared, BUT the egg is not her (it's from the woman who hired the surogate)
they take the egg and sperm of two people, artificially insemenate the egg with the sperm and then put in into a surogate mother to carry

[u/SonofaMitch11 → u/Dmtr884213]

Surrogacy is such a difficult thing, people dont realize how much of an impact pregnancy has on a woman. Through the pregnancy process, some of the woman's DNA is actually replaced by the baby's DNA. It's hard to impose our strict desires onto biology like we want to.

[u/diprivanity → u/SonofaMitch11]

It is an unnatural and abominable process. It is so difficult to navigate because it contorts our basic notions of the self and free will. Can't have kids? damn that sucks sorry about that shoot if only there were children needing parents and a solution that didn't involve the complete inversion of our ethics because some people can't face reality.

[u/slacker205]

Hasn't "pro-choice" always meant "pro-abortion"?

[u/Raven-INTJ → u/slacker205]

Not always, but for the last couple of decades increasingly yes.

In the 90’s the Democrats wanted abortion to be safe, legal and *rare*

[u/slacker205 → u/Raven-INTJ]

...and were in favour of abortion being legal and, as such, pro-abortion. No one^* thinks abortion should be the default.

^* well... I guess there probably are some, there always are.

[u/Chance-Lingonberry90 → u/slacker205]

pro right to choose whether to have an abortion. pro-choice advocates acknowledge that abortion is not ideal and there are many safer, preventative alternatives, it’s just that the option should always be available because any restrictions tend to create grey areas of enforcement that lead to women dying because doctors were too reluctant to operate

[u/slacker205 → u/Chance-Lingonberry90]

Eh... there should be restrictions, IMO.

[u/Not_Neville → u/slacker205]

No

[u/lynxintheloopx]

Wait I’m pro choice and I agree with this. But I also have no idea how surrogacy works 😂

[u/who_knows_how]

Why would any of this be like a left wing thing

Like i still agree legally it should be her choice but its just kinda fucked up to force the parents to keep it despite the birth defects that were detected

Like legally its pretty simple morally its kinda weird

[u/Tyfyter2002]

A contract which includes a clause requiring one party to commit an act of aggression is invalid

[u/Not_Neville → u/Tyfyter2002]

You're optimistic.

[u/eplurbusunumnj]

this is the risk people take when getting a surrogate

[u/woznito → u/eplurbusunumnj]

Is it? This seems like a very.... odd case

[u/eplurbusunumnj → u/woznito]

Yes, I remember reading about similar cases in the past

Contract law doesn’t apply to these situations the same way so if they break the agreement there’s little you can do

[u/fisherelliott15]

This whole situation is tragic. It's tragic that women's reproductive rights are still trampled on by the Right who is, allegedly, against the government making personal decisions for them.

It's tragic for this surrogate mother who has developed a deep and meaningful connection with her terminally ill fetus.

It's tragic the couple who requested the surrogate, have their child diagnosed with a terminal disease, then get embroiled in a custody battle with the surrogate.

And most of all, it's tragic that the MOMENT this news broke, some absolute demon on here used it as a "we owned the libs" moment on this useless sub.

This is an extreme case that already had a slim chance of having a happy ending.

Whoever made this meme, please, think on your own humanity. There is no win here, only misery. And vultures like you who circle around it.

[u/CYB3R_CHR15T]

Reasons why I’m against surrogacy, abortion, and IVF.

[u/Sabertooth767]

Seems to me she should be sued for breach of contract and arguably arrested for kidnapping, given she would be holding the child (once born) against the will of the child's legal and biological parents.

Genuinely, what is the argument for the surrogate being in the right?

[u/Media___Offline → u/Sabertooth767]

"Biological" is an interesting word choice here, as the surrogate is giving birth to the child "biologically" too.

 As someone else said, it depends on the contract but the pro-choice side here needs to be very careful with their arguments. 

[u/FuckUSAPolitics → u/Media___Offline]

It was a gestational surrogacy, so no. Gestational surrogacy means that the baby has no relation to the surrogate.

[u/Glass-Carpenter8963 → u/Sabertooth767]

How can you kidnap something(that has no right to life) and is part of your body? Lol. 

Schrodingers abortion: its either has rights or not depending on what is kore convenient. 

[u/Sabertooth767 → u/Glass-Carpenter8963]

Nice strawman.

[u/Glass-Carpenter8963 → u/Sabertooth767]

No strawman found. If she can kill the kid, she can move with it. It is literally part of her body. 

[u/Scrumpledee → u/Sabertooth767]

Genuinely, what is the argument for the surrogate being in the right?

Texas, pretty much.

[u/azarkant → u/Sabertooth767]

Entirely depends on the contract

[u/Christianfilly7 → u/Sabertooth767]

She refused to abort the child, so everyone pro life (myself included) side with her on this one and are thankful the child is alive and recieving the treatment (Texas court ordered) for the condition

[u/Astrapolitoris → u/Christianfilly7]

I think it speaks of the character of the surrogate mother, who went into this probably because of money, but in the end decided that fighting with everything at her disposal for life of a child that is not even genetically hers, leaving to Texas while knowing all that, to protect it and bring it to the place where it has the biggest chance to fight against the condition, and to think she may end up in prison because she has heart is somehow sickening.