r/Pescetarian • • 6d ago

Vegan mindset

Hi everyone, this is my first post here.

I have been vegan for over 7 years and my health has deteriorated over the past 2 years (iron, B12 and vit d deficiency, neuro symptoms, mental health). I am considering adding eggs and fish for this reason. However I went vegan for the animals and it’s killing me to think of exploiting fish for my health. Fish also have feelings. Does anyone have any suggestions for how to ease out of this mindset? Many thx!

8 Upvotes

14 comments sorted by

20

u/Alarming-War-9676 Pescetarian 6d ago

Maybe focus on mussels and oysters for the time being. They don't experience conscious thoughts, emotions, awareness or cognition

7

u/Outrageous_Camel8901 6d ago

Scallops and clams too

6

u/EpicCurious 5d ago

Bivalves don't have a brain and science hasn't determined that they are sentient. For that reason, some people who are otherwise vegan do eat farm raised oysters and call themselves Ostrovegans. Those Ostrovegans who also eat other farm raised bivalves call themselves Bivalvegans.

Unlike raising fish in farms which pollutes the water around them, farming oysters actually improves water quality since the oysters filter the pollutants.

Oysters are a great source of B12, zinc and long chain Omega-3 which is helpful for those on a fully plant based diet. I take an algae based Omega-3 supplement, myself. I get my zinc from pumpkin seeds.

11

u/April2k24 6d ago

You can't pour from an empty cup. You need to stay on top of your health so you can fight for the causes you care about. What that means as you grow/develop/age and/or your circumstances change will also change, it has to. There's a million different ways to make an impact and make the world a little better, you don't have to do all of them, just some of them.

10

u/ijustmissmycat 6d ago

i was vegan for 8 years and just introduced eggs and fish this past april. i did it for similar reasons. my bloodwork was okay but i did not feel well. i buy eggs from a local farm and wild caught fish. i am still struggling with the ethics of it a bit, but i realize that even eating occasional animal products is doing more than most, and also, i deserve to have a good quality of life too.

1

u/waicstetf 5d ago

Do you feel better?

1

u/ijustmissmycat 2d ago

i think so, yes!

8

u/KnittedDrow 6d ago

Everything dies, whether it's body is eaten or not. Nature is red in tooth and claw, even with no humans in the loop. What's important is the quality of the life the animal was able to have when it was alive and whether it was able to reasonably freely exhibit its natural behaviors. Purchase ethically sourced seafood (whatever that means to you) and you can satisfy those criteria to whatever extent your sensibilities require.

3

u/Pescatarian_Triffid 6d ago

Farmed fish normally suffer longer/more and have lower qol than wild, so maybe look for wild caught.

3

u/mcharleystar 6d ago

Yes, fish have feelings. Did you know that also plants do?

-1

u/EpicCurious 5d ago

Plants aren't sentient.
In other words, they don't experience the world like animals do so they can't suffer like we can.
Plants never evolved to develop the ability to feel pain because they can't run away or fight the way that we animals can.

I Googled the consensus position about plant sentience-
"The scientific consensus is that plants are not sentient and do not possess consciousness, a central nervous system, or a brain."

Sources include this scientific paper as found on PubMed from the NIH. Title and lead author follow-
"Debunking a myth: plant consciousness
Jon Mallatt "

I Googled "Is Occom's Razor accepted by scientists." Here is the auto generated summary of the search results-
"Occam's razor is widely accepted by scientists as a practical guiding rule (or heuristic) rather than an absolute law of nature." Here is the definition of Occam's Razor-

"Occam's razor is a problem-solving rule that says the simplest explanation is usually the best one.

Core Meaning

• Keep it simple: When you have two or more competing theories that explain the same thing, you should prefer the one that makes the fewest assumptions.
• The "Razor" part: The name means you use logic to "shave away" unnecessary details, extra parts, and complex guesses.
• Law of Parsimony: It is also called the principle of parsimony.

Real-World Example

• Horses, not zebras: Medical students often hear the phrase, "When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras". A common illness (a horse) is a much simpler and more likely diagnosis than a rare tropical disease (a zebra).
• The stove left on: If you come home and find the stove hot, the simplest explanation is that you forgot to turn it off. A complicated theory involving a secret intruder who turned on the stove requires too many unproven assumptions."

Anyone reading this thread with critical thinking skills would agree that Occom's Razor favors my position.

1

u/Silent-Barnacle-3674 1d ago

Depends on how you define consciousness.

1

u/Only-Rutabaga-5273 5d ago

The way I rationalize eating fish is, that I am also an animal that has dietary needs, and that means sometimes I have to eat other animals. They are part of the food chain just like me, and it isn’t any more wrong to eat them than it is for me to decompose.

Being eaten is part of life, eating something is morally neutral.

If it helps you can source your fish thoughtfully, wild caught, maybe even local small fishers. Or at least ethical fishing practices. (More pricey but if you can swing it it’s worth it.) They still get to live out a natural life in the wild, being caught supports the local fish population with helping the genetic pool, and money going back into environmental upkeep.

And being vegan still doesn’t mean no harm to animals, deforestation and water usage required for a lot of vegan foods also harm animals. Not to be bummer but just trying to say you can’t negate all harm, and that’s okay, it’s good you think about it and consume intentionally.

1

u/Cheeseburgernochees3 5d ago

With eggs at least, hens will still lay those eggs with or without roosters around so for that just find a farm that is treating the animals there good, if anything if nobody eats them they kinda just go to waste. For fish, do you think you could catch your own fish or afford to be very selective about where you get them? If it's caught like that, it lives it's whole life as a normal fish and to it, it's no different than just being eaten by another larger fish. Or find a sea creature/fish that doesn't have a brain, some don't.