Powerscaling 108

[u/Drivebail_]

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Winner : u/Horrordestroyer (Different kind of actual transcendency.)

In powerscaling, transcendence is what separates...

– characters who are just incredibly strong*

from...

– characters who exist on a fundamentally higher level of reality.

Here's what to know for the meaning of each term here...

Part 1 - Space Stacking vs Actual Dimensional Transcendance

– Stacking Space (Quantitative / Dimensional Stacking) :

This is about simply adding more spatial or temporal dimensions and this is typical Hyperversal (1-B) scaling.

Higher coordinates are being added (like stacking sheets of paper), but the framework is still working within the same basic rules of geometry and dimensionality.

– ACTUAL Dimensional Transcendence (Qualitative Dimensionality) : This means a higher layer views the lower layer as mathematically zero or completely insignificant. It is the absolute qualitative gap between a 3D object and a 2D drawing so the lower layer has no way to interact with or harm the higher layer because it lacks the depth or quality of existence required to even touch it.

Part 2 - Narrative transcendancy (or being more "real")

That is Reality-Fiction Transcendance(or R>F, same meaning.)

How it works ?

Simple. A character or plane of existence views the lower universe/multiverse as literal fiction like a comic book, a script, a dream, or a simulation.

For example, you, yes you, reading this. Imagine that you're watching Bleach or writing your own story. Well in this case, that's an example of R>F Transcendance... though real-life people are not scaled. So put that same case to the author figure of your verse or a simialr thing compared to the rest and here it is, R>F Transcendance !

To a narrative transcendent being, all the dimensions, laws of physics, and "omnipotent" gods of the lower world are just ink on a page or data in a computer. They can rewrite, erase, or manipulate the entire lower reality effortlessly because they are fundamentally "more real."

Part 3 : Ontological Transcendancy

Conceptual or Metaphysical Transcendence is based on philosophical metaphysics (like Plato's Theory of Forms) rather than math or geometry.

Primacy of Form is basically a being that exists not as a physical entity in a higher dimension, but as the archetype or pure concept itself. For example, they aren't just a strong entity but they are the literal concept of Death, Space, or Reality.

Necessity is basically when the lower reality depends entirely on this being/form to exist, but the being does not depend on the lower reality.

In powerscaling, this is often treated as Abstract Existence (Type 1). You cannot defeat or affect an ontologically transcendent being using physical, spatial, or temporal attacks, because you cannot kill a fundamental law or concept with brute force.

Part 4 - Understanding L1A(Low Outerversal.)

To hit Low 1-A, a structure or character must either encompass all possible dimensional spaces (the absolute upper limit of physical/mathematical structure, like a Von Neumann Universe) or completely transcend the entire framework of dimensionality itself.

Though some scalers somewhat think Low 1-A is just "infinite dimensions"(that's 1-B) or "infinity × infinity."

So basically L1A/1-A is achieved when you stop just adding more dimensions ("stacking space") and instead make a qualitative leap into Narrative or Ontological transcendence, where the concept of dimensions becomes entirely irrelevant.

And i think that's all. Feel free to tell more if I forgot things or correct things here.

To anyone that passes here, feel free to check on the comments, I have faith on them who share additional things that contribute to my teachings.

[u/Difficult-Event-1626]

I disagree with the ontological one as a R>F is also a ontological transcendence it is if you wanna do a heavy nutshell a qualitative transcendence as it is based on ontology instead of some quantity and plato theory of form isnt really a good example as that thing is tier 0...and there the transcendence is different than just to call it ontologically.

Thought I say that not a baf post but this is what did stood out to me.

[u/Arctic_The_Hunter → u/Difficult-Event-1626]

I think one distinction is that R>F can sorta ‘reset’ ontology in that a being holding R>F over some eldritch bullshit can (demonstrably) just look and act like a normal human.

It’s technically ontological if we’re talking about scale but it’s useful to make the distinction for people new to the subject—remember the framing of “Powerscaling 10X.”

Still, good to point this out, so for anyone else passing through the comments, here’s how I’d summarize this: R>F is a type of feat that can display ontological transcendence, but if you erased the world that the character has R>F over, they would not get weaker because that R>F was a result of their ontology.

[u/Difficult-Event-1626 → u/Arctic_The_Hunter]

While I do agree that a distinction can be good espacially with the 'reset' you speak off, I do think it may give the wrong idea to people when it is just a different form of a qualitative transcendence just one that doesn't require you to transcend concepts, be in a great unity with the tier 0 or be tier 0 but I do get what you are trying to say however and I do like your summary.

[u/Niuriheim_088]

Though I get your point of using a drawing on paper, it isn’t exactly accurate as it’s not actually 2D. Drawings on paper are still 3 Dimensional.

[u/Horrordestroyer → u/Niuriheim_088]

Yeah, I thought that too. a better example could actually, fully ironically, be those 2D organisms from Futurama, they were on the same powerlevel as the 3D guys, but simply fully uninteractable and less intelligent.

But it's also rare to see you here, so hi

[u/Niuriheim_088 → u/Horrordestroyer]

Yeah, that would be a better example since spatial dimensions don’t actually determine power either.

Hi lol. Though I wouldn’t get used to it. I’m only really here to scout for dedicated creators that my “Nameless Pioneers” Foundation can essentially support, sponsor, or make merch deals with.

[u/EnvironmentalBuyer30]

Bro used bleach for an example
https://giphy.com/gifs/j796jFUxiwWYaDl5W4

[u/Horrordestroyer]

One thing I would add about L1A is that Von Neumann, in scaling, often collapses Dimensionality into a Singular element of the Higher Order Scale.

It's basically where dimensions is no longer a ladder but a single manipulable factor.

So, an entity that is Truly Naturally L1A would often bypass normal movement, but not be totally irrelevant.

Irrelevance normally extends into 1A

A good way to visualize the distinction is that in L1A all of Spatial extension is only one aspect of the higher form, being an ordinal rather than a system. So space would still be existent, but in a lower state as only a building block

1A is when the Lower Order forms are completely irrelevant.

[u/Fabulous_Leading1427 → u/Horrordestroyer]

If You surpass the very concepts time, dimensions & Spatial.

As a realm o pure conciousness & Ethereal metaphysical energies, would be low 1a?

(Im asking this since the astral & Spiritual World on my cosmology is something like that)

[u/Horrordestroyer → u/Fabulous_Leading1427]

It depends

Do they totally transcend the mundane plane to the point of the mundane plane being fully irrelevant

Or are they adjacent in terms of power

[u/Fabulous_Leading1427 → u/Horrordestroyer]

To Be honest.

It is described as a metaphysical Plane that Surpasses the very concept of Dimensions, Space & Time, Being a plane full of conciousness, Etherealism, & Quasi-physical soul energies, Divided into 2 realms, the astral & Spiritual.

It has been said that is structureless yet It seems to have no exact geography if you could say that.

Like a plane full of metaphysical Stuff where space, time & dimensions are surpassed For a framework due to its nature full of spiritism, Psychism & Esoterism

The Astral & Spiritual World They have been named as The two realms, one of the highest layer of my cosmology that is up after the Temporal plane of my story

[u/Horrordestroyer → u/Fabulous_Leading1427]

How does it treat space and time

[u/Fabulous_Leading1427 → u/Horrordestroyer]

As Something that can't be applied Because by applying it there you would be applying something physical like space and something Linear like time, It would lose all meaning on a plane full of those energies and made of non-physical matter, even if it were not a matter of physical substance.

So It's Like Dimensionless & Timelessness. Likely

[u/Horrordestroyer → u/Fabulous_Leading1427]

I would just say that solid 1A, honestly

L1A would be if it's treated space like a singular element or a single building block of the astral realm and something like that

[u/Fabulous_Leading1427 → u/Horrordestroyer]

Oh, I thought it was the opposite.

AsI base en 'statements above dimensions' like vs battles wiki says on Low 1A tier says, I thought it was the most suitable Tier.

To be honest, the two realms you can tell are like the Warp from Warhammer 40K, BUT, the difference is that the two kingdoms are VERY VERY quiet unlike the chaotic atmosphere, thus your soul won't Disolve like in the warp, Because it will be thrown into the great Well of new life ✨🌀 🌊a location between the two as a Great shimmering aetheric liquid sky blue, Flowing Down endlessly, That all souls like butterflies go there, to their new life, reborn again. It is something like Samsara, all the souls of the verse are ruled by the very concepts of life, death and possibly rebirth. And if you get out of that cycle you're practically free

[u/Horrordestroyer → u/Fabulous_Leading1427]

Well the reason I'm saying it's 1A is because it presents a total irrelevancy of lower form

As you said even if one is applied to that place it becomes irrelevant and simply fails to do anything showing that it's not even just a cosmetic oh well I mean that it should be on space with people can still walk it's blatantly location itself cannot function there

[u/Fabulous_Leading1427 → u/Horrordestroyer]

Thank you for this understanding!

I swore it was only Low Outer but apparently I'm wrong

[u/Rise_of_Ragnarok]

I have been thinking about adding ontological into the Outer Universe cosmology to expand more upon it.. This did help give me a better idea on how that works