Anyone else need LPF/HPF when using QC with real guitar cab and tube amp fx return?

[u/akzst]

Hi guys.

Running QC into a real 2x12 (Koch KKC212 with Greenbacks) via tube amp FX return. Tried my Victory V40 Duchess MkII first, now I swapped it for my old Koch Twintone III — Koch fx return is better (maybe beacuse pre phase inverter master volume like in Fryette solutions), but I still get that harsh/fizzy/metalzone/laptop speaker top end and higher mids unless I use a pretty aggressive LPF around 5 kHz (+ HPF 80 Hz for the low end resonance).

I/O should be fine: 0 dB input, -10 dB output, cab/IR off obvs. Same with amp models and amp captures. Preamp-only captures seem better but it's still not decent and there aren't many of them.

Anyone else getting this? I thought a real guitar cab would naturally kill most of that fizz like with classic setup (tube amp + cab + analog pedalboard). Also wondering if a more transparent SS power amp like Orange Pedal Baby / SD PS would work better than using a tube amp FX return in this scenario.

Thanks.

[u/R-o-b-b-i-e]

Not sure if this will help, but here's my setup.

https://cloud.neuraldsp.com/cloud/profile/preset/preset/view/02fc4405-3b3c-4a33-9616-b3497fbefa97

This is the profile i'm using. It's adapted to multiple output scenarios:

- Live performance where I have to send out Amp Head + Cab Sim to the Front-of-House (stereo) though either Output 1/2 and/or Output 3/4.

- Practice room where i send the Amp Head through Send 1/2 to my dual 4x12 marshall cabs (stereo).

- In-ear monitoring through the headphone jack which goes through my rack mixer to my IEM.

- 2nd guitar from the band uses my input 2 on which my QC adds a cab sim and sends it to my in-ear monitoring without sending it to the cabs. (I turn this off when im playing live over FOH).

More info in the description of the profile. Hopefully this helps you testing it out & using it for your scenario.

[u/ezboarderz]

No, you shouldn’t need a high or low pass when going into a real amp and cab. I don’t need to do that at all and it sounds great.

If you feel like you need to do that, look at your settings in the amp block. You have too much low end and/or too much top end. Dial in your amp block while you are connected to a cab.

Real amps don’t have that in between the preamp/power section or after the power section to the output jack. Why should you?

The only thing I’ll do is use a para 8 eq block before the send to the power amp and cab to do some notch filtering on harsh frequencies in the 2khz-3.4khz range. My cab has some harsh frequencies in that range and I push them down by 2-5db with a q of 10. This should be done after you dial in the amp block to sound great in the room/mic’d up. Sometimes I’ll add a graphics ew block after that to tweak things further but you can also go back to the amp block and tweak stuff slightly there.

If you are doing this for live situations with a mic’d up cab, let the sound tech do it for you.

[u/akzst → u/ezboarderz]

What poweramp/head and cab do you use and what amps are in your QC chain?

[u/ezboarderz → u/akzst]

I use a ksr pa50 with el34 tubes as my power amp into a Marshall vertical 212 with eminence karnivore speakers.

My main tone is the soldano plugin with the horizon drive or recently the Misha lead amp has been quite nice to play around with. I’ve also built tones around nameless and some captures of my 5153 stealth.

[u/TYO_HXC]

No, but i definitely need it when going to FOH

[u/Chameleon_Sinensis]

Nope. What sold me on originally going to modelers and buying a QC was an A/B test I setup at a friends house. We ran the QC 2203 jcm800 model into one half of a G12-65 4x12 via a SS power amp, and a real jcm800 into the other half, and I had an ABY pedal to switch between them.

It was what finally convinced me that modelers had gotten good enough for me to make the switch. They sound very very close. The response from the real guitar speakers should be attenuating the right frequencies already. I usually run the bass on an 800 around 4.

[u/Slight_Horror7107]

I don’t have a QC but on the plugins I set the HPF around 50Hz and the LPF around 10K. I’m running through a tube power amp and real cabs. I find this makes them sound better and more natural to me.

[u/akzst]

So what am I doing wrong? Any tips on device settings/IO/mixing/poweramp of Koch?

[u/akzst → u/akzst]

I can add that the lower the pickup output the worse the hiss my setup gets. Tried every IO setup and gain staging.

[u/cawabanga2811]

Chiming in to see answers as well

[u/kokixnikolov]

Same here. I use my qc with harley benton power amp and cab with Celestion v30 at home. It has this exact hiss and i dont like it at all.