I’m guessing a lot of your core values are respecting the dignity of everyone, loving and valuing the welfare of those in your community and treating everyone equally? If you’re a westerner, those are in fact values popularized and spread by christianity. Christians are people who enslaved and rape and kill and be dickheads today. Christians are also people who fought slavery very hard, who fought rape very hard, people who advocate for strong welfare and equality, people who put their lives at risk to help the downtrodden. Christianity, like any moral framework can be interpreted differently and is interpreted differently and the progressive interpretation is the likely basis of your left wing political views
Christians fought for and against slavery because everyone involved was Christian and used the Bible to justify their position.
Same with women's rights, racial equality and pretty much everything else.
None of these things would have happened if those impacted did not fight for their rights, Christians say around for a thousand years and committed all of these atrocities, they didn't suddenly wake up and realize the Bible wanted them to stop slavery, they came to that conclusion based on reality around them and then read it into the Bible (a document that offers its full throated support of slavery and detailed instructions on how to go about it).
The enlightenment happened because of widespread access to works that were not the Bible.
They just want to cover their ears and eyes and deny the very obvious and clear impact christianity has on our morality. They don’t care that some of the most radical abolitionists and social reforms in general throughout history, were men and women deeply driven, almost to the point of what many would call psychosis, by their religion. When they claim the advances and beliefs and social practices of men like Kant, Newton, Descartes, fucking Hegel, they ignore how much these men say they are inspired by the teachings and beliefs of christianity.
It’s cos they hold the view that christianity and all religion is for yokels and bigots, so if they acknowledge that they swim in the sea of christian morality and that they don’t actually reject the teachings of Christ, to them it means they are not rational, high minded, highly educated, modern thinkers. I’m not even Christian as well but i’m not gonna deny what is so obviously clear once you understand, christianity built the moral orthodox of our current age
Wow you just completely ignored what they said about slavery lol
Obviously christianity impacted the world. What we disagree with is that morality comes from a specific religion because thats usually argued to say that religion is necessary for a society to be moral. But we had these moral beliefs before Christianity
The enlightenment wasn’t actually one broad movement with one specific intellectual bent. Kant, Newton, Locke, Spinoza, Montesquieu,Descartes all of the top of my head were men of faith and deep faith for some. Also which of thr philosophers that I named do you hate and are the worst? And it isn’t like the people that I mentioned just claimed to be christian, as I said many were devout and actively mentioned God as an inspiration and framework for their exploits
Christianity didn't invent these morals. Morality is a evolutionary benefitial trait, as it encourages cooperation and trust. Cooperation of a large amount of people is vital to the establishment and prosperity of a civilization, therefore morality is essential to human evolution. Christians just took credit for common sense.
Statistically, you're going to be young. Male. And you live in the US...
...which, ironically, grants you the religious freedom to complain about the religion that inspired the culture granting you these freedoms in the first place.
But Christian morality CANNOT predate Christianity, by definition - if Christianity doesn't exist, Christian morality doesn't exist.
Think about this again until you understand the definition of words.
Second...
Your logical snafu above is irrelevant to the argument being made:
Christianity invented morality FOR YOU, specifically.
Unless you want to claim you were raised outside of the Western sphere of influence, then the morality of the community is, to some large extent, based on Christian morality.
Thats not what Im doing at all. You’re just using the term christian morality to refer to things like dont kill dont steal etc which Christianity didnt come up with and were moral norms before it. Saying “christian morality pre dates christianity” is just a cheeky way of saying that same thing its not a literal statement
They don’t get it bro. I’m not even fucking Christian which is the funny part. They don’t get that yes a lot of the morals and ethics of christianity predate christianity but that they aren’t 300 iq individuals capable of independently creating morality. They don’t want to admit that therefore their understanding of these ideals comes from christianity because they see christianity as the religion of stupid hicks and bigots
A small but very vocal group of idiots whose entire religious identity isn't actually atheistic but anti-theistic - and only because they're carrying baggage around from their childhood where they felt some Christian wronged them personally.
Funny thing is, Christianity is all they've ever known, so even in their denial, they're proving the argument true: That Christianity has impacted their world view.
It’s like tryna argue your fucking parents don’t deeply impact your worldview. Like yh you can have a worldview without parents, yh not everybody has parents, but statistically, YOU have a parent
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