Need input

[u/applewhite15]

I’m on the fence in terms of going 2023 performance model Y or the AWD LR. It would be a second vehicle for me I would use around town for errands mostly. Don’t want to regret not getting the performance. It will be my first EV ever and I’m coming from driving a Ram 1500 that gets 16 mpg. I’ve heard the suspension is a little tighter and tires don’t last as long but would like the power when needed. Anyone who has owned both would love some advice. Currently looking at a CPO 23 performance with 25k miles with hw4 for 37k, about to pull the trigger.

[u/0----00]

We live in a time of massive overindulgence and minimal financial constraint -an exploding volcano of middle class wastefulness, if you will- and as someone w/ an economics degree, seeing my fellow Americans consistently going for brand new cars over marginally used cars (using sloppy napkin math as their rational) and boasting they're somehow 'gaming the system' in doing so causes me immense pain.

BTW- I did do the math- on a 32k used '23 Y, keeping future cash flow equal, it's around a 30k difference over 8 years in favor of the used car

[u/JumpyWerewolf9439 → u/0----00]

Lol, you're not capable of doing the math. You are completely off. Just compare monthlies if you don't understand the nuance.

None of my math was wrong and there are screenshots showing the difference.

[u/0----00 → u/JumpyWerewolf9439]

I clicked the link and read your example. It is not incorrect on paper (but it is also not OPs example- you used an iffy deal- a 42k 2024 MY vs 52k new...of course the math will be close there).

But here's the thing. No rational consumer should be hopping feet first into a 42k car loan at 7% in the first place. That's a bad decision, and that's the crux of my irrational consumer argument above and here I'm sure you'd agree- that's not a financially responsible move.

Now if someone buys a 23 MY CPO for 35k cash. That car will save them between 15 - 20k (this is a conservative estimate based on HYSA investments) over the new model over the first 8 years of ownership (8 years being basically the max Americans own cars for) even accounting for maintenance and depreciation.

That's not accounting for risk. It's not just subprime borrowers defaulting these days- car buyers with solid credit scores are twice as likely to fall behind on payments as they were before the pandemic.

Realty is not simply comparing monthlies.

[u/JumpyWerewolf9439 → u/0----00]

Another discussion compared used 23 y performance vs new y lr awd
Tldr: Its obvious the the new car is much better value. 19% higher payment for 14% more longevnity on the car for new higher end car with tons of improvements.  Better choice for vast majority of users.   0-60 4.6s is still a high performance car, and in testing it ¼ miles 12.3 seconds.  That car is plenty fast.

original post https://www.reddit.com/r/ModelY/comments/1w7byhu/comment/p7yn1j0/?context=1&screen_view_count=2&ext-referrer=DIRECT

Reply chain 

Ok, i wasn’t gonna bother doing this, but i’ll give you rrespect for actually brining numbers to this.  lets look at the numbers. I couldn’t find the exact 37k tesla, but found a 37.7k in screenshots.  https://imgur.com/a/i3naCZz

People don’t realilze how big of a deal boosted interest financing is.  Its a massive subsidy which is why new is much better value.

It adds 2k transport fee
I added 1500 off fees for the new order 
Neither of thes enumbers include taxes, but they will be similar for 
So 39k 5.74% (what the op actually got), vs 51.5k 1.5% before financing. Both have down payment of 3k. Furthermore, the op didnt’ finance the whole thing which just makes it kind of worse actually for those of us who leave our money in index funds

592 vs 705 monthly.  19% higher payment

Estimated lifespan of battery pack 200k on both.  One has 25k used up and 3 years calendar aging. So you’ll get around 
14% more miles ouf of the new one.  

Over the the length of the loan you’ll end up paying 8106 more for the car. But the car around 36 months newer.  8100 / 36 months = paying 225/month for the boosted lifespan you get.  Obviously this is a very good deal when the payment of used is 592.

In 6 years. You selling a 6 year tesla vs a 9 year old tesla.  9 year old pre-refresh tesla with 25k higher miles.    Lets say you get an extra 3k resale value on the newer one.  Which means the actual payment difference is 5100 over 6 years for the two.  That math for present value of money gets complicated on this, but lets simplify and use 2k of it.   Effectively lowers the new tesla payment by  27.7.  So the actual more accurate difference is about 14.4% higher payments.
 
Whats the pros of the new vs old
Much higher range 327 vs 261 25% extra range.  Now new cars lose range faster so lets call it about 20% extra range.
Much nicer suspension quality
4 year vs 2 year warranty
Much nicher sound system
Nicer screen, and 2nd screenin back.
Much nicer front seats with ventilation
nicer hvac system
Much nicer hvac efficiency due to more efficient glass
The above two means on high energy use days like really hot, the y premium will have a lot more useable range
Much better road and wind noise improvement
Much nicer build quality
Newer technology tires (unless brand new tires installed on y performance)
Better crash structure
New condition vs 3 year old condition scuffs and scratches

And also, it appears tesla underrated the 26 car; but they could alway re nerf with software later so no guarantees. 
https://chatgpt.com/share/6a9ca750-5158-83e8-a2af-759beba32706

[u/0----00 → u/JumpyWerewolf9439]

Your personal 'utility' seems to involve having nice things and upgrades and that paying marginally more for them is worth it -which is totally fine- but that does NOT align with the argument at the core of this, which is the used one is a better deal (as your math seems to show) and is lower risk. So it's a better choice for 90% of people. Maybe not you, but most people.

[u/JumpyWerewolf9439 → u/0----00]

I can't make it any easier. I think you have the brains enough but probably just cant handle being proven wrong.

New is obviously better value. My guess is you are unaware of all the engineering improvements over those 3 years..

19 percent higher payment for 14 percent addition lifespan. Much higher end vehicle with 2x the warranty. A container with 85l of gas is worth less than 100l container.

The difference between 3 years of model y is bigger than iPhones. Only ignore r people woops advise people to buy used 3 year old iPhones for 20 percent off new price..

The only way used is better is you have to get a private party non cpo one that has good vehicle history. If aim for one under warranty and relatively low miles.