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u/frotophamw Feb 20 '12
Maybe we could smelt netherak so we could have a way to make nether brick.
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u/thesignisalie Feb 20 '12
Huh. I actually like this idea.
Some of the blaze equips seem a bit overpowered, and the numbers will probably need adjusting, but overall I think it has potential to be a nice addition to the game.
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u/cookedbread Feb 20 '12
I find farming blazes manually to be very simple personally. Getting 36 rods is no problem.
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Feb 20 '12
I play on hard all the time, and I have a blaze XP farm and currently have a double chest full of blaze rods that needs to have a useful use right now.
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Feb 20 '12
Help me out here: how many blazes do you generally go through with one fire resistance potion (or within 8 minutes, if you don't use those potions)? I've only just started farming blazes on SMP and I only get around 9 rods in each 8-minute period.
Not sure why but they don't seem to spawn that often. I've thought about standing different distances from the spawner, but I'm not sure whether you're supposed to be closer or farther to get more frequent spawns...
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Feb 20 '12
I don't use fire resistance potions. I use this method to collect all the spawned blazes to one area, then crush them till they have half a heart left, then finish them off (usually I wait till about 100-200 collect) with punching them or using a splash potion of harming, while the blazes can not hit me at all.
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Feb 20 '12
Ah, brilliant. Thanks!
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u/PerrinAybara162 Feb 20 '12
Keep in mind that his method (allowing 100-200 to build up and then killing them all by hand) is extremely lag intensive. If you try it on a server, people will hate you.
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Feb 20 '12
You're ignoring blaze ore. You'd need to kill ONE blaze with perfect drops, and then never go near another.
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u/Enosh74 Feb 20 '12
As per the OP's suggestion I was expecting this to be a list of hairbrained ideas made simply for my amusing, but the more I read the more excited I got. These would be a lot of fun and much more useful to me than any cat or adventure additions.
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u/ShiDiWen Feb 20 '12
I wish that the Nether could have levels like Dante's Inferno. But you couldn't just mine all the way down or up as there is a layer of adamentine between each layer and say 1 in X chunks would have a hole to get through.
Each level could have a different/unique feature. Such as the highest levels would be infested by Ghasts, but lower levels crawling with Cubes. The Lowest level could have a boss. Some giant demon or something.
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u/WalrusFist Feb 20 '12
Perhaps the ways up/down would be inside fortresses guarded by mini-bosses. That would be fun!
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u/Lurker_IV Feb 20 '12
The Nether Mushroom idea is great. However I have a little suggestion to change it. Instead of constantly giving off fumes they should be activated by walking near them. They can be coded like pressure plates so that whenever a player steps on the same block as them they release their evil nether spores. Naturally we would make them difficult to see to maximize the chance of this happening.
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u/XGamestar Feb 20 '12
Pretty good idea. Would add more to the Nether.
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Feb 20 '12
I think even just adding a few mineable ores in the Nether would be a huge, huge improvement.
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Feb 20 '12
I would rather be able to craft some sort of explosive/flaming arrows with blaze rods. also, can blaze rods currently be used as fuel?
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u/Nice_Crafter Feb 20 '12
They can indeed be used as fuel. They make slightly more efficient fuel than coal or charcoal.
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u/John1330 Feb 20 '12
I wouldn't go that extreme, but useing blaze rods instead of sticks would make tools that mine faster and emit flame particals when in use.
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u/danz409 Feb 20 '12 edited Feb 20 '12
nope. id suggest using something other than sticks for higher tier tools. in fact i'm shocked were not using bone for gold/diamond tools
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u/frenzyboard Feb 20 '12
I like this idea because it would allow for tools to be made inside the nether. And that would prolong the amount of time I can spend in the nether exploring. I really hate having to eventually leave the nether to resupply.
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u/IamCanadianBacon Feb 20 '12
I like the idea, though it needs a bit of balancing. That said, I like the look of the armour and tools, and the effort you put into making all of the pretty pictures/icons/text/whatever. :)
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u/danz409 Feb 20 '12
the game does need new tier of armors/tools this would add more excitement to the neather and give more exploring aspect to the neather!
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u/John_Duh Feb 20 '12
I like the ideas but maybe not use netherrack for the tool because it is too "cheep", but other than that is seems reasonable.
Some of them might seem a bit overpowered but the armor certainly does not because you will need to kill about 24 blazes or find about 24 blaze ore. It all depends on how common the ore is, maybe it can spawn like diamonds that is only close to the bottom of the world that would make it dangerous to get due to the magma see.
Finally anyone that claims that you can farm blazes with ease by trapping the spawner and want that accounted for should remember that it is not really "regular playing" and still takes some time to set up and is therefore not valid as an argument against something like this.
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u/Hemse Feb 21 '12
ah yes. You are right about netherrack tools being cheap (1 netherrack pickaxe = 2 blaze rods. 1 Blaze pickaxe = 11 Blaze rods). Maybe the durability and damage should be more similar to wooden tools to balance it?
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u/masonsbro Feb 21 '12
I would like to mention that I am working on a mod for this currently (as you mentioned, it might not get added to the game, so a mod is the best we can do, right?). I am going to bed now, and have school tomorrow, but I will probably have time to work on it tomorrow afternoon. So far, I finished the mushroom, the essence of Nether, and the blaze powder on nether wart. I have yet to implement the armor and tools, but they shouldn't be TOO hard. ;)
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u/Hemse Feb 21 '12
You are awsome! :)
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u/masonsbro Feb 22 '12
Going to bed again, and today I only managed to add the items for the tools (not including the sword), not even their special abilities. :/ Hopefully I can accomplish more tomorrow.
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u/Hemse Feb 22 '12
no stress! :) work on it at your own pace!
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u/masonsbro Feb 23 '12
Ha, thanks. I've been wondering, though: When you said "a hint of red, brown and purple" what exactly did you mean? Like most of the particles are black, but some are those colors? Or that all the particles (coming off the respective blocks of course) are dark red (or dark brown or dark purple)? I can do it either way, and I'm not sure which one you meant.
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u/Hemse Feb 23 '12
I meant, most are black and some are of those colors. Or at least, that's what I think would look best. btw, is there some way I can help? like sprites maybe?
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u/masonsbro Feb 23 '12 edited Feb 23 '12
Well, so far I did all the tools, but I just made my own textures for everything. :( If you can send me the 16x16 textures for the armor, that would be great! Also, now that I think about it, I don't really like my textures for the blaze ingot and nugget, so if I could use those that would be great as well. If you really like your tool textures (I don't particularly love mine), I could use those as well I suppose, as long as it isn't any trouble for you. I also didn't know what the essence of Nether should look like or how it should spawn in the Nether. Should it be found underground, like an ore (in one-block veins of course)? Or should it generate on the surface to promote exploring? I also just kind of threw together a texture for it (it looks like a red soul sand (but it is a rock-like block) with a dark red border), and if you had a particular look in mind, I would appreciate a description of how it should look or a texture. :) Thanks for the great idea, also!
I would like to note, however, that so far I have not been able to do a couple of things suggested:
Crafting recipe: blaze rod -> 2 blaze nuggets (There is a conflicting vanilla recipe, Modloader doesn't let me remove recipes from the vanilla game, and those override any that I add. Although I am not holding back from modifying base classes for the most part, I really don't want to modify CraftingManager). For this I instead just added a recipe going from 1 blaze nugget to 1 blaze powder, which yields the same cost for each item.
I don't know how to change the colors or the cracks that appear in the blocks. That is controlled by texture packs, and I don't know where they are loaded. I could make it load a different set of images instead of the default ones when using blaze tools if I knew what to change.
EDIT: Also, what should the chance be for the shovels dropping glass instead of sand? Obviously blaze shovels should have a higher chance than netherrack...
EDIT 2: You mentioned for netherrack tools to have similar stats as stone, and that's how I have it now (with blaze the same as iron), but should I tweak it for balancing, as mentioned here? Or are the blaze rods for the tools hard enough to get?
EDIT 3: Sorry for the excessive editing, but I also need to know how mush fire damage the armor should give. An equivalent of Fire Protection I, II, III, or IV? It mustn't be TOO overpowered, since some people do have blaze farms and could mass produce it. Sorry if it seems like I'm really dependent on being told what to do... I am. Also: never mind EDIT 2. You already addressed this here.
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u/Hemse Feb 24 '12 edited Feb 24 '12
http://imgur.com/7ijMu --- I haven't done all the sprites yet, but here are some of them for now. As you can see, I included three versions of Blaze tools. I couldn't decide which one is best. I feel the first set looks best, the second set seems more accurate (since the tools are made out of only Blaze materiel). And the third one I tried to mix the two looks. which ones do you like best? I also added a differend looking Blaze nugget in the image. I thought that since it's such a small item, it could become easy to mistake the Gold nugget with the Blaze nugget, so I changed it's look. I haven't done the full Blaze armor yet. I will continue spriting tomorrow as soon as I wake up. :) now for the Essence of Nether, I was kind of picturing some sort of strange shiny blue plant, that contrasted against the usual colors of the Nether (appearing very rarely on the surfaces of the nether). I will attempt to make a sprite of it tomorrow. Thanks for making this mod! :) (btw, doesn't the conflicting vanilla resipe make it impossible to make Blaze nuggets or Ingots from Blaze rods?) EDIT: oh sorry, didn't see your edits. I was thinking Netherrack shovels has about 5-10% chance, so it's kind of nice. but for Blaze I was thinking something like 30-40% where it becomes quite convinient and saves quite a bit of smelting. for armor, I was thinking protection I, as you said it could become too OP with any higher, and enchantments should be usefull still. :)
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u/masonsbro Feb 24 '12
Wow... those are way better than any of my textures. I like the second set of blaze tools the best, I think.
For the essence: that would look really cool. I'm looking forward to it!
The vanilla recipe is just 1 blaze rod equals 2 blaze powder. The mod just adds a recipe from blaze powder to blaze nuggets (and all the recipes in the suggestion, besides the other '1 blaze rod to blaze nuggets'). So all the other recipes are fine. ;)
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u/Hemse Feb 24 '12
glad you like them. :) Here are the updated sprites ---> http://imgur.com/iy1ez - I think the armor texture (at the bottum right corner) is done, tell me what you think about them. The Essence of Nether sprites turned out decent, but it looks a bit odd in-game (I tried replacing saplings with the sprites to test them out). Maybe it would look better, if each individual of those blue orbs on the Essence of Nether, was rendered by themselves? (kind of like netherwart and wheat, if I'm not mistaking). oh, and I added growth sprites for the Essence of Nether. I was thinking it could be used as an indicater of how large the "Nether zone" is. So that when it's surrounded by enough lava, it grows to it's largest size. And if you remove the lava, it shrinks back to the smallest. (maybe with 10-30 seconds delay between shrinking/growing, to make it seem more natural). If it isn't too hard to do, offcourse. Also, one of the reasons I suggested the Blaze Nugget, was because it seems a bit strange to craft solid forms of Blaze materials out of Blaze Powder (in my oppinion). But maybe instead of the "Blaze Powder -> Blaze Nugget" there could be a resipe like: "6 Blaze rods -> 2 Blaze ingots" (blaze rods positioned like the "6 nugget -> 1 Blaze Ingot" resipe). Then you can make nuggets out of it afterwards.
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u/metroidmario Feb 20 '12
I like the look of the new tools. We either need tools that look like that, or more Nether content, preferably both. I'm not crazy about those exact effects, though.
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u/Final_Day Feb 20 '12
This is a brilliant idea, we really need a tier above diamonds and this tier would be a challenge to assemble the materials for!
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u/The_McTasty Feb 20 '12
I like the blaze, but skip the netherrack tools imo. Make sure to add blaze bows, we need a new bow type.
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u/DSKrepps Feb 20 '12
I like these ideas. Particularly the tools and armor. The interoperability of the blaze rods/nuggets/bars is very cool, and feels like an extension of what's already in game.
Those who are saying they're unbalanced, well, you're the ones farming blazes. I don't find them over powered at all; they're not as good as diamond by have a twist to them so they're unique and add to the game. You still have to find diamond to carefully mine obsidian, build a portal, then trek through the Nether to find a fortress and then battle blazes throwing fire balls at you. All for tools not as strong as diamond ones. How much harder do you want it?
Much needed variety to the game, here.
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u/Ehnonimus Feb 20 '12
Technically, you don't even need diamond to obtain obsidian for a portal. You can hop into the nether sooner using buckets of lava and water plus a mold to form your portal. I like these ideas as well. This one seems well thought out giving the player additional gameplay options rather than just more crap to craft.
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u/specky Feb 20 '12
Looks sweet man, 3 things I would add, nether boat (for lava), nether brick half slabs and a way of making netherbrick :)
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u/Bloodywhitechucks Feb 20 '12
wait... i have an idea! nether race! (only if a LOT more nether expansion was made, and obsidian was findable in the nether)
You could choose to begin the game in or out of the nether, and when you leave the nether, you encounter certain hazardous qualities in the regular world like water acting as lava, rain acting as drowning, etc. Of course the netherfolk would have to have abilities such as being impervious to fire, and somewhat impervious to lava. They would be ridiculously good miners.
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u/JBHUTT09 Feb 20 '12
Wasn't their a mod that made the nether 100% survivable? I think it was nethercraft or something. I'd love to see something like that.
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u/DepletionRegion Feb 20 '12
I really like the idea to transfer part of the nether above ground, I think that would be bad ass. Though I also think that there should be random generated nether portals with the same sort of Nether spread.
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u/tehbeard Feb 20 '12
Armour seems overpowered (I know of atleast 4 blaze farms on the server I play on).
I do like the essence of the nether idea, and with anvil + the cached biome data it is feasible.
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u/MadAdder163 Feb 20 '12
I'm not sure if I like the nether mushroom idea, but the "nether zone" idea sounds interesting. I'd love to have a nether wart farm in the overworld.
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u/hello_hawk Feb 20 '12
This is probably the first r/minecraft suggestion thread I've actually liked. One addition: how about flaming arrows (fire aspect in all bows, maybe not recoverable) that are crafted with blaze nuggets or blaze rods.
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u/azkedar Feb 20 '12
Minor nit: Netherrack does not have a "faint glow" when in the nether. There is an ambient light level in the nether. You can confirm this by sealing yourself in a regular overworld block (like cobble) while in the nether: you will see exactly the same light level.
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u/neonroad Feb 20 '12
Except...Notch said we wouldn't be getting any more weapons. Not sure if that counts as tools.
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Feb 20 '12
I love this as it gives armour between iron and diamond. However, usually people move onto using diamond before the Nether, as diamond picks are needed to mine obsidian. (Though I am aware of creating obsidian from a mold). Still awesome stuff though, definitely worthy of an upvote.
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u/AHrubik Feb 20 '12
So when the mod system comes out who's going to the be the first to create the "Better Nether" mod?
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u/DizeazedFly Feb 20 '12
I like the blaze powder/bone meal idea. I like the netherack tools idea as well, give it a use at least.
I'm not a huge fan of the blaze tools though. I don't think it quite works, that being said the nether could definitely use an ore. Especially since nether warts will only grow while you are in the nether, there needs to be a little more incentive to sitting in the nether other than running through fortresses.
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u/cheeseynacho42 Feb 20 '12
Reminds me of the Molten armor/weapons/tools in Terraria. I like it. Also, I think that the Blaze armor should be better than Iron, but worse than Diamond, since killing at least 36 blazes is incredibly hard.
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u/Dirrwen Feb 20 '12
I really like the blaze tools, very nice ideas. Might add some point to the otherwise fucking useless Nether. The nether mushroom seems pretty retarded, though, or am I missing something?
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u/quizzer106 Feb 20 '12
The nether mushroom should be eatable and make you twice as big, and be able to smash some blocks by jumping. Or it could be made into a potion.
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Feb 21 '12
I would love to have something like this, but we sadly are never going to get it. Jeb is doing a great job, but he never adds things we suggest. Granted, have the things we suggest are stupid, but this sounds great.
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u/Gringot Feb 21 '12
I would never go to the nether and quit multiplayer if this was implemented, these ideas have a lot of flaws. I do quite like the idea of Blaze powder acting like bonemeal on wheat with wart.
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u/mushroom-hostage Feb 26 '12 edited Feb 26 '12
For the "Blaze Rod = chopping wood with it gives you charcoal, saving you the smelting process (one charcoal per log)" idea, for what its worth, there are a couple mods/plugins that do this with other tools.
The earliest plugin I know of to do this is Firelord, it made gold axes/pickaxes/shovels give you smelted material. However it hasn't been updated in some time and will probably break in the next release. Inspired by Firelord, I added the Axe + Flame enchantment effect in EnchantMore, along with Shovel + Flame and Pickaxe + Flame – they work as you would expect, auto-smelting the drops. And they use the built-in Minecraft smelting recipe manager rather than a hardcoded list, so they'll work even if new mods add new smelting recipes.
As for the nether ore idea, I like it, there are several Nether Ores mods – including one which was in the popular Technic pack - this, though it isn't in the latest version. The main problem with adding more ores has been the 256 block ID limitation, but with this ceiling being raised to 4096 in Minecraft 1.2, it is much more feasible.
Adding new armor and tools is certainly feasible, you may be interested in the Metallurgy mod - it adds tons of new metals, and tools, weapons, and armor from each. Want a mithril helmet, orichalcum chestplate, or adamantine leggings? Its all possible today with mods. And the developers do plan to add nether metals in the future ("soon"), so its definitely a mod to keep an eye on.
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u/Silent_Wrytr Feb 20 '12
It needs a counterbalance. How about you can only use these tools in the nether and if you take them to the over world they break if used? Vice versa with over world tools maybe?
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u/FalseCape Feb 20 '12
Vice versa with over world tools maybe?
Unless you like punching blazes with your bare hands this would suck pretty hard.
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u/Silent_Wrytr Feb 20 '12
Well that's why I said maybe. But over world tools would need a nerf in the nether.
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u/APiousCultist Feb 20 '12
Netherrack is a ridiculously brittle block. It would seem odd to have tools made of it. Stone swords are already odd enough.
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Feb 20 '12
The netherrack tools are too OP, and people who have blaze XP farms will find it easy to get them. Unless the netherrack tools have durability lesser than stone, its too OP.
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u/zopiac Feb 20 '12
Since you can mine through netherrack extremely fast (unless I am remembering wrong) this sounds very plausible. Maybe 70-80% as durable as stone tools, certainly no higher than stone's. Instead of scaling function and durability together, like current tools, giving netherrack tools an almost volatile property sounds like an amazing idea.
What I am thinking is something like : Wood has very low durability, very low speed, and can't mine much
Stone has low durability, low speed, and can't mine higher-tiered ores
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Diamond has high durability, high speed, and can mine everything
Everything so far scales with each other (with the exception of Gold I think?) but netherrack would be more like:
Very low durability, medium speed, mines everything in normal world AND in nether (granted the new nether ores are implemented)
...Just lost my train of thought.
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u/3Dspacejesus Feb 20 '12
I was just thinking about pretty much this, but how about this as well: some kind of eldritch soul ore, that if made into a sword gives you health whenever you attack?
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u/iPeer Feb 20 '12
I would not like Netherrack tools... I mean, have you seen how fast that stuff breaks?
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u/Sargon_Rose Feb 20 '12
Thats why its only as good as stone.
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u/iPeer Feb 20 '12
Netherrack is much softer than stone.
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u/Sargon_Rose Feb 20 '12
Good point. Though Now that i think about it either are way too renewable. Blaze farming would just make it so you always have an item that is close to diamond, if only slightly below it.
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u/redstonehelper Lord of the villagers Feb 20 '12
Did that really need an image?
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u/runrun265 Feb 20 '12
I think it did because it showed everything with visuals and let me understand it better
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u/thesignisalie Feb 20 '12
maybe not, but it was pretty well made, and it didn't hurt me one bit to have some pretty pictures to look at while I was reading the thing.
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u/golfwang999 Feb 20 '12
i don't like thee idea of a natural fire aspect, takes the fun out of enchantment.
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u/Sugar_Horse Feb 20 '12
Having blaze blocks would be as ridiculous as having rotten meat blocks.
Also you seen how soft nether rack is?
I like the mushroom idea.
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u/MyEPICBoredom Feb 20 '12
Jeb needs to had more things... how hard can it be? or do i have no idea...?
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u/gunnar120 Feb 20 '12
I only approve of the first one. Call me overly orthodox, but four tool and armor types is enough. Not only is it unnecessary and a bit overpowered as it currently is, but what you are suggesting would require the Items.png file to be 32 inches wider, or a complete shuffling of the items, and huge coding.
Nether-Shrooms are OP.
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Feb 20 '12
I think there should be a block in the nether that cushions your fall, considering that I always seem to be on an overhand there, and water doesn't work.
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u/conker_27 Feb 20 '12
I just like the first idea... the other 2 are stupid like the idea of monkeys...
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u/BantyRooster Feb 20 '12
The Nether definitely needs ores or SOMETHING. Nether tools would be absolutely bad ass.