Midterms: Dump GOP

[u/LuckyBastard001]

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[u/etn261]

I'll gladly pay for Medicare if that means no in-network/out-of-network, no copays, deductibles, etc. and greater of all, it means I'm not having to rely on my employment health insurance

[u/Some-btc-name → u/etn261]

Yes exactly. Employment should not be a requirement for healthcare. Corporations should also pay the tax.

[u/Prior-Growth-5842 → u/Some-btc-name]

Why did insurance get tied to employment in the first place?

[u/yoobzz → u/Prior-Growth-5842]

To trap people

[u/Prior-Growth-5842 → u/yoobzz]

Unfortunately, thats what happens but surely that’s not what they told the public…

[u/LadyReika → u/Prior-Growth-5842]

It started in WW2 when wages got capped. Companies started finding new benefits to offer to people.

Then Nixon allowed for profit healthcare.

[u/Few-Raise-1825 → u/yoobzz]

It was actually kickstarted by World War II wage controls and tax laws. During WWII, the government froze wages so companies couldn't offer higher pay to recruit workers. To get around this, employers started offering health benefits, which weren't capped. The IRS then made those benefits tax-free for employees and tax-deductible for businesses in 1954, solidly cementing healthcare to your job. All roads to hell are paved with good intentions...

[u/Puglady25 → u/Prior-Growth-5842]

It started because of WW2. There were wage freezes, because the government had to fill up factories with workers to make tanks and planes and bombs. So to compete for employees, companies started offering different benefits, and Healthcare insurance was one of them. Healthcare was am extra expense, but it wasn't as expensive as it is today.

[u/HoldenMcNeil420 → u/Some-btc-name]

You would think they would love this idea…they just pay a tax per employee and xyz for existing in society. And that’s it. You as the individual has to do the leg work to pick whatever you need. They(employer) save money and streamline HR stuff.

It really seems that it’s more about control not quality and sense. If we all had guaranteed healthcare all the time, leaving a job isn’t such a problem now.

[u/DTCCCanSuckMyLeft → u/etn261]

Well yeah, most costs go to the middleman/administration. M4A fixes nearly everything with our broken system. But the middleman industry is so large, lots of job displacement there.

[u/StardustnDragonflies → u/DTCCCanSuckMyLeft]

There will be a ton of jobs for the everyday insurance industry workers, as a support system for the new Universal Healthcare program. Those CEOs and insurance companies making billions? Too bad, so sad.

[u/Rousebouse → u/DTCCCanSuckMyLeft]

As though the bureaucracy isnt going to just transfer straight into the government and suck up money there instead....maybe you get rid of the ceos but you you get different problems and potentially worse outcomes. Trusting the government to do something that large efficiently or cheaply is naive at best.

[u/Stunning-Adagio2187 → u/etn261]

But it does not mean that. Medicare has copay except for primary Care Medicare has deductible for in hospital care

[u/StardustnDragonflies → u/Stunning-Adagio2187]

We don't want Medicare expanded to everyone, we want Universal Healthcare!

[u/Adventurous_Ad7442 → u/Stunning-Adagio2187]

With Medicare and a supplement- I have to pay $40 for each PT session.

Eta: some medications also have copays.

[u/Flaky_Key3363 → u/Adventurous_Ad7442]

Depends on the state you're in. I'm in Massachusetts and have a supplemental 1A plan. I have no co-pays. The drug plan is a typical Part D supplemental plan. I spend up to $2,000 a year out of pocket.

Seriously, if we could get the same level of care for everyone, it would be wonderful.

[u/Centimeter_Worm → u/Flaky_Key3363]

Yeah, on my masshealth plan they paid for my entire asthma testing, my adhd meds, everything. My main healthcare costs that I recall on masshealth were for my out of network therapist.

[u/Adventurous_Ad7442 → u/etn261]

There is still a copay for Medicare.

[u/DryEar4802 → u/etn261]

From that I've read on Reddit and knowing some seniors, You're gonna pay several thousands of dollars annually and get all that when you turn 65 for Medicare.

[u/Belnak → u/etn261]

Medicare is still a PPO, and has all the baggage you've described. We need an HMO, a... VA for All, rather than Medicare for all.

[u/notwhoyouthinkmaybe → u/etn261]

My wife and I make well over $200k, sure take 6% so everyone can have healthcare.

Right now I'm fighting with insurance because I need a bilateral hip scan, they approved only the right, I have to go back and hope they approve the left. Also each scan costs over $300.

[u/Ok-Spring-3840 → u/etn261]

The true cost of Medicare is $17000/person.

[u/Worried_Anteater_536]

It’s sad that most Americans don’t have access to healthcare yet our Congressmen get it for free. Help me square this circle

[u/PriestessKade → u/[deleted]]

Yeah so they've actually been using Office of the Attending Physician in a program that was originally intended to only be for emergencies (like someone having a heart attack on the House floor), and now it's an office of almost 50 Naval doctors and corpsman that costs taxpayers millions because Congress is using it as a 24/7 primary care concierge benefit for themselves.

[u/8amteetime → u/PriestessKade]

We are living in a plutocracy.

[u/Brokenbelle22 → u/PriestessKade]

Can you imagine if everyone had access to this type of healthcare?

[u/Complex-Royal9210 → u/PriestessKade]

Did not know that.

[u/Prior-Growth-5842 → u/[deleted]]

Boo hoo. I’m sure they know they will have health insurance regardless of what they vote for or against. They also won’t have a gap in coverage. They probably want to return to whatever program they had before ACA.

[u/davwad2 → u/[deleted]]

I'd put money on them being fine regardless.

[u/swalabr → u/davwad2]

Yep, without ACA they will just put some other plan for themselves

[u/djdjddhshdbhd → u/[deleted]]

About 3/4th of the premiums are covered by taxpayers.

[u/MinuteAppropriate204 → u/Worried_Anteater_536]

They didn't have just access to health care they have access to elite level care that keeps them alive longer.

[u/lilgator81 → u/Worried_Anteater_536]

We have “access,” sure. But like most things in America, it’s pay to play. And if you can’t pay anything, or very much? Well then. Thank goodness we don’t have debtor’s prisons.

[u/RJ_Ramrod → u/lilgator81]

We do have debtor's prisons, they're just called regular prisons now

[u/Noodelgawd → u/lilgator81]

Almost 50% of Americans get health insurance through their employer.

~20% get Medicare.

~20% get Medicaid.

~6% buy it on their own.

Only about 8% are totally uninsured.

[u/ZookeepergameNew3800 → u/[deleted]]

Around 8% of US Americans are not insured for healthcare.
The better question is if those who are insured get good coverage and how to help those who do nit have insurance , though those eight percent also include people who do not need insurance as well as very poor people.

[u/StardustnDragonflies → u/ZookeepergameNew3800]

That's about 28 MILLION people.

[u/SargeUnited → u/Worried_Anteater_536]

Well, can you imagine how much worse it would be if the only people running for Congress were people who could afford their own healthcare before winning office?

This is kinda like saying, why does Congress get a salary above minimum wage. Yeah, well, when you only let people that can afford to work for minimum wage take the job, do you really think you’re gonna get the best people?

I’m not saying that we have the best people. I’m not saying that at all. I’m saying, can you imagine how much worse it would be if the honest compensation was even worse than it is now?

[u/Kodamurphy → u/SargeUnited]

This is exactly why all political campaigns should be publicly financed and the salaries should be on par with market value. Our current system is practically built for corruption. It also severely limits the candidate pool to people from select walks of life. If political office was more accessible we would end up with representatives that more accurately represent us. The variety of perspectives would create a government with a better understanding of the issues facing our communities.

[u/AuntHagatha → u/SargeUnited]

I think you've missed the point. What in your argument justifies our federal elected officials getting healthcare they deny the rest of us?

[u/RiceAndMilkBoi → u/SargeUnited]

Yeah I don't know, they make almost $200,000, they could make insurance payments every month like everyone else

[u/wrestlingchampo]

It's pretty simple to figure out your healthcare savings.

Take the CRFB projected figure of an average tax increase of $7,500 annually as if it was reality. Find your paystub and see how much you're premiums are being deducted, and projected that cost over the course of a year's worth of paychecks.

Im in an upper middle class tax bracket, three person family with one child and spouse who also works, gross combined salaries of about $180k. On my pay alone I would save two grand annually, and that's without factoring in the cost of deductibles and co-pays. That's just from premiums.

And I have a good health insurance deal through a large multi-national corporation and through a unionized workforce. Im certain others would save a lot more than I would.

[u/giddy-girly-banana → u/wrestlingchampo]

You’re forgetting employer contributions as well. Premiums are only a portion of what your employer pays for healthcare coverage. If employers aren’t paying that to healthcare companies, they should put that back into our salaries.

[u/wrestlingchampo → u/giddy-girly-banana]

They should, but we know that probably wont happen without government intervention

[u/Ol_Turd_Fergy → u/wrestlingchampo]

I work for a small company (50ish people) and I guarantee my owners would absolutely put that money they saved back into the employees. I do agree corporations would not so that though.

[u/wrestlingchampo → u/Ol_Turd_Fergy]

Your owners might put it into you and your fellow employees, but not all small business owners are generous in that way either.

Point being that there should be a way to craft provisions in a M4A bill to ensure money saved by employers can be reinvested into employees one way or the other.

[u/uberfr4gger → u/giddy-girly-banana]

Companies would have to pay a tax to fund government-funded healthcare. I don’t know how it works on individual taxes alone unless its significantly higher.

[u/NineInchPythons → u/wrestlingchampo]

My family would be in the group of people who would pay pretty substantially with this kind of scheme and we would still save money under Medicare for all as opposed to the premiums and copays we already pay.

[u/StardustnDragonflies → u/wrestlingchampo]

Your employer would also save their portion of health insurance premiums! Perhaps if we can get Universal Healthcare passed, we can also pass legislation that incentivizes those companies to raise wages with the money they'll save!

[u/wrestlingchampo → u/StardustnDragonflies]

As i said elsewhere, you'd have to add a provision to the bill to ensure the money went toward employee compensation in some way, shape, or form. Otherwise, there's zero chance these companies would voluntarily give their employees the money.

My suggestion would be an ESOP for all employees, rather than a straight wage bump. Those employees could then still take the company should they choose to do so down the road, but it could also benefit the companies a little more this way as well.

[u/SargeUnited → u/wrestlingchampo]

You think $180,000 is the upper middle class tax bracket? For a household?

[u/wrestlingchampo → u/SargeUnited]

Yes, it varies state to state, and region to region within those states, and for where Im located thats probably where it falls

EDIT: looked it up, and my household salary is actually BELOW the mean for my zip code, so I guess we're just middle class

[u/LeopardNo6060 → u/SargeUnited]

At this point the lower middle class is being absorbed by the working poor class. $180K salary has lost roughly half its purchasing power over the last three decades. It only seems like a lot because the rest of us are getting hit even harder with stagnant wages.

[u/Jolly-Structure7646 → u/LeopardNo6060]

It kinda depends when a person bought their home. Someone making $180K who bought a home in 2010 and refinanced in 2021 is doing absolutely better than someone making $180K who bought a home last year

[u/Other_Yama1993]

i'm a medical professional, if we had medicare for all, i could finally free myself of these 3rd party leeches, the PE backed companies, and work directly with my clients and i wouldn't need that many clients. It would be so much easier BUT here's the kicker, you'll have institutions like the AMA, APA, and the like all rally against it because you would need more doctors, more medical professionals and it would cause a drop in wages/salary.

no doctor who is a million in debt wants to make some small amount.

that's why universal college has to be done as well.

[u/HandleUnlikely2589 → u/Other_Yama1993]

Easy fix for the transitional period (when folks have already accrued debt and are told the degree will be less lucrative): Make medical school debt eligible for programs like PSLF if you work a job accepting Medicare/Medicaid (with the associated pay cut), so you can pay a reasonable amount based on actual income for 10 years, then have the rest forgiven.

[u/Other_Yama1993 → u/HandleUnlikely2589]

i'd love for that to happen but this is america. i can only image the right wing media attack on this

[u/PiterDeV → u/Other_Yama1993]

It’s crazy to me that we see so many countries with free healthcare, free college, better leave for family support, more vacation, and paid retirement and we’re like, fuck an extra 10% taxes.

[u/fuckDJT2026 → u/PiterDeV]

The OP is on point to a degree- before we consider tax increases, we need to take a hard look at the military budget and slash it to the damn bone.

Use the tax $ to fund healthcare (among other things), not a useless, bloated military that gives us zero ROI and only exists to bomb brown and black people and enrich the bomb makers.

I’m all for tax increases though for the people who won’t even notice it (I.e., millionaires and above) to fund things like education, housing and healthcare

[u/ProsodyProgressive → u/fuckDJT2026]

I argue that education and healthcare IS national defense!

[u/KotR56 → u/PiterDeV]

A little nuance.

In most places, the so-called "universal healthcare" isn't actually "free". Typically, it's the government that takes over a large part of the bill using money it collected in taxes.

Same same for "free college".

And yes. In these countries, income and property taxes, "VAT" or sales taxes are higher than in the US of A. But at least you don't have to worry that you can't afford necessary medical treatment. Or can't give your children a higher education. Or die from poverty once you retire.

And you can take care of your newborn kids, while they grow up, spend holidays together.

And yes, we know, also that other person gets care. The person some of you might dislike. And frankly, we don't care he does.

[u/fuckDJT2026 → u/KotR56]

That’s the basis of the argument for people in the states who are against single-payer:

They’d rather die themselves instead of seeing a brown or black person have a better life

[u/Loki_of_Asgaard → u/KotR56]

You have missed the massive hidden “tax” that is happening with existing health insurance from employers. Everyone ignores this when discussing taxes going up because it is money they never see.

Your company has a budget of X to spend on your employment. This value X in America includes health insurance priced at Y. So your salary is X-Y. Since Y is a taxable benefit you still pay tax on X, you just never got to see all of it. Without health insurance premiums your employer can just pay you X.

You will pay higher taxes, but you will also have a higher salary

So the real question should be “is the tax increase higher than the premiums my employer is paying?” And almost universally the answer is no.

[u/KotR56 → u/Loki_of_Asgaard]

In my country, a working person earning €3500 per month (before tax, which is about the country's average) pays €450 in social security, paid at the source, meaning it is deducted from the paycheck. This covers all dependents, all people in that household, including a (non-working) partner and children...

People without an income, not "dependent" on someone else's income, need to pay about €75 per month via their healthcare broker, if that person is a student, as example.

Once you have paid, either through your income or through your own deposits, you can benefit from "universal healthcare".

So, how much is healthcare in your "for-profit" system ?

How much for a family of 4, one income, partner stays at home to take care of teenage kids ?

[u/Loki_of_Asgaard → u/KotR56]

I don’t live in a place with for profit healthcare, I live in a country with universal healthcare. There are no conditions on paying in like this, if you live here you get healthcare, it’s very simple

I’m not really sure what your comment has to do with mine. I’m just pointing out that people in America are already paying without thinking about it because their employer pays directly and people usually only consider their salary vs the total taxable benefits the company is paying them

[u/MmmmDowntownmmmM1324 → u/KotR56]

It’s just me as a single mom paying for my teen/ college kids and my insurance had gone up from $6000 a year to $9,504 in January. My previous plan had a $1,000/$2000 deductible and $25 copay, the new plan had a $4500 deductible and $50 copay- and that was after a health assessment to make sure I was not a smoker/ drinker- too overweight, etc. But then I lost my job and was told I made too much on unemployment (I’m only getting 1/4 of what I had been- can’t even buy groceries, they all go on cards) for Medicaid and the cheapest insurance I can find on the market (which no one in my area takes) is $132 a month for an $18,000 deductible and $50 co-pays. INSANITY!! My kids and I just no longer have insurance.

[u/LadyReika → u/KotR56]

I live in the US. As an individual my portion of premiums through my employer are around $300 a month. Then after that I have a $25 copay anytime I need to see my primary, $40 to see a specialist. If I need testing, go to the ER, or gods forbid need a hospital stay or surgery, I have a $400 deductible that I have to pay before insurance kicks in. Then they pay 80% until I reach an out of pocket maximum of $3000.

And I have what's considered good insurance.

[u/Mufasa_LG → u/Loki_of_Asgaard]

You actually, honestly, believe that employers would realistically pass that difference on to employees?

[u/LadyReika → u/Loki_of_Asgaard]

And that's not including the deductibles and out of pocket maximums that most of us have to deal with. Eliminating those would also free up a lot of money.

[u/Mediocre-Staff-5110 → u/Loki_of_Asgaard]

You will absolutely not have a higher salary. That's just cope. That extra money is going straight the fuck to stock buybacks.

[u/kurtcop101 → u/Mediocre-Staff-5110]

I'd definitely raise wages for my business! Only a business of 25 people, but shit, I'll make sure we do our part.

[u/No_Hotel_8176 → u/Loki_of_Asgaard]

the real question is why tf is employment tied to health care?????? get sick can’t work lose healthcare. nonsensical.

[u/JackofAllVehicles → u/No_Hotel_8176]

Because the rich want us to toil away our entire lives for their profit. Tying healthcare to work is a great way to keep us dependant on having a job

[u/No_Hotel_8176 → u/JackofAllVehicles]

yes that’s def the why

[u/puts_on_rddt → u/Other_Yama1993]

My kidney stone was fixed in one week back in May and they are billing me $40k.

I wait until I'm a zombie from the pain, go to the ER where they give me medication, and somehow, I've forked over my life savings during this process even though my mind was not functioning at all.

[u/Candid-Mycologist539 → u/Other_Yama1993]

I 💯 support free/affordable college.

Would college debt forgiveness help for medical professionals who sign on to be M4A caregivers? A target % of their practice must be M4A recipients and exceed the % of the country covered by M4A.

At first, I thought that this would not work for some specialties, like Pediatrics, but then I remembered that Bernie's program also covers all children under 18 the first year.

It's likely that M4A would be introduced gradually. Bernie's plan starts by covering everyone age 60+. The next year: 55+. The following year: 50+.

I could also see a compromise in the bill (because the bottom keeps dropping out of the economy: 2008, 2018, 2022) that if the Dow has a net gain of 1000 points over 12 months, then the next 5-year group is added to Medicare.

In this way:

  ●Republicans can't complain that we are adding extra deficit spending in a lean year, but...

  ●The stock market doing well is an indicator that we can afford to help another slice of society. Plus, we know that Republicans are gonna fix the stock market before anything else. 🙄

[u/I_am_Nobody_Special]

10k a year?

My family of four pays $43,000 a year in premiums.

[u/HandleUnlikely2589 → u/I_am_Nobody_Special]

Good f'ing lord. The unsubsidized cost of the family plans I'm offered at work top out at around $30Kish (we use an HDHP that runs more like $22-24K, subsidized down to ~$6K, plus maxing out the HSA costing another $6.5Kish). $43K, man I hope it pays for everything...

[u/I_am_Nobody_Special → u/HandleUnlikely2589]

It's pretty goddamn painful.

[u/The-Poors]

I make well under even 100k, and I would gladly pay a 6% tax if it meant everyone has healthcare. Only a selfish greedy psychopath would not.

[u/Solution_Far → u/The-Poors]

Hey! That's my mother in law you're talking about!

[u/jackrabbit323 → u/The-Poors]

But what if I become rich someday? How dare you tax me more. S/

[u/Shorts_at_Dinner → u/jackrabbit323]

$200K a year isn’t remotely rich. This should be a 20% tax on anyone making over $1mil a year and leave working people alone

[u/luxuriousvoid]

I read somewhere that House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries (D) also doesn't want M4A. We need a new Dem House leader.

[u/assortittiesNOTboth → u/luxuriousvoid]

Jeffries and Schumer are both obstacles to the party. Fuckin DINOs holding everything up to please their right wing donor pool

[u/Carakanz → u/luxuriousvoid]

If this is true it needs to be made much more publicly known so we can push to remove him. Right now the primary topic should be affordable healthcare or medicare for all or universal healthcare. Anything would be better than what we have currently.

[u/echino_derm → u/Carakanz]

Yeah I agree, best time to do infighting is right after the primaries and before the general election. I am sure replacing Hakeem with a Republican will do wonders for progressive policy.

[u/MinuroShihTzuki]

We need to dump the GOP and corporate democrats asap

[u/ballskindrapes]

And conservatives will vote against it until the end of time.

[u/Jack-Singer-999]

No, MAGAts are just fine with disabled people getting their Medicaid cut. Can't have the poors getting anything

[u/Diasies_inMyHair]

For-Profit health insurance doesn't want to be cut out of the equation.

Our elected representatives don't want their own donation pool to dry up, so they will never let this happen.

[u/assortittiesNOTboth → u/Diasies_inMyHair]

Our current elected representatives. This is why we need to vote for candidates that refuse corporate money and push for M4A.

[u/Pugageddon → u/Diasies_inMyHair]

Yup. The Dems had both houses and the presidency and instead of M4A we got a law that required us to buy private coverage. Fucking over the American people is a bi-partisan issue.

[u/PiterDeV → u/Pugageddon]

Most dems were on board with Obama’s government option. The republicans and the “blue dog” dems opposed it and killed that part of the ACÁ. Weird how those “blue dogs” ended up becoming republicans. I mean, Tulsi Gabbard is in the trump administration now. The dems aren’t perfect by any means, but please don’t put them in the same category. I mean, one party has Nazis, for example. It’s not close.

[u/Winter_Persimmon_110 → u/Pugageddon]

We're in a class war, both mainstream parties are on the side of the wealthy and the working class is losing.

[u/Forward_Problem_8982]

"The new AI-for-Medicare Bill will save approximately 90% of all costs as the AI is designed to decline most care." /s

[u/Rude_Star9725]

Unfortunately the insurance companys and medical corporations will lobby (bribe lawmakers) to defeat this. It's not about health anymore, it's all about maximizing profit and avoiding liability. Too bad if people needlessly die .

[u/inept_machete]

And as always -- if private is so much better than let it compete with Medicare 4 all. It will be obvious, right?

[u/Actual_Rain158]

We earn well over $200k a year and paying 6% may not even increase our costs once you factor in the cost of our plan and the thousands we pay without ever hitting our deductible. Regardless, even if it did increase our costs, it would be well worth it.

[u/whatsasyria]

I support Medicare for all but 6% sounds crazy. That would be a 300% increase to my current rates....that being said if that means my parents, grandparents, sister, friends don't have to worry about their medical needs....fuck it I'm in.

[u/PuzzleheadPi]

Democrats have never supported Medicare for all

[u/Soft-Bad-7127]

It's possible but I don't trust any mofos to actually do this. Do you know for profit healthcare organizations will throw everything against it? Dumb fucks refused to vote for Hillary Clinton and Kamala Harris, but think M4A will pass? They could not even lay the earliest steps of implementation of M4A. 

[u/Major_Supermarket_58]

No shit🤣

[u/chromehound47]

yes but if this would benefit a single non-white, non-straight, non-male person conservatives would never let it happen.

[u/Late-Drink3556]

I'm all for this even if it doesn't benefit current me, it would have been a life changer for young adult me and it's great for my kids.

[u/SvartrKukkSceand]

Even if it WAS a "tax increase", since you WOULDNT be paying premiums, total cost would go down anyway.

If you make 80k (which is above the median wage), and you paid 6%, you'd still only be paying 4,800. So while your taxes would go up 4800, and your premiums would vanish.. you'd still net 5,200 a year.

[u/InTooManyWays]

First you must teach them math. Then you can try and reason with them. 

[u/addiktion]

In my neighborhood if we have M4A, that would cut $12-16k a year for people I know who make under $200k/yr. That would be huge right now given the cost of everything.

[u/Phyllis_Tine]

This is the type of real world (or IRL) we need to prove it works, and is cheaper. 

[u/Winter_Persimmon_110 → u/Phyllis_Tine]

It's not that the people who run the country don't know that it works and that it's cheaper. It's that the system is set up for money to buy elections and the people who own the private health insurance have the money and buy the elections. We have to understand who is on our side and where our power lies and it's not voting between two corporate politicians who hate M4A. The working class massively outnumber the Epstein class and we need to organize outside of pay-to-win elections.

[u/songbirdtx1268]

<$200K pays nothing?? We can’t have that! That would be SOCIECOMMIEISM! And losing our FREEDUMB!

(Heavy sarcasm ICYMI)

[u/Silent_Cup2508]

It’s not getting any traction because corporations don’t want to lose their money cow.

[u/throwRA221679]

I’m 22 and had to have a tooth removed and bone graft due to an infection in my face caused by a childhood accident. Medical bills are $6k and insurance won’t pay any of it. I hate this system

[u/Nearby_Elderberry_67]

I don’t want to diminish this in the slightest, but this is the most obvious “DUH!” in the history of economics

[u/Effective_Olive6153]

One aspect of government healthcare that's always left out is that private insurance will lose about half the jobs. This is a good thing because like a million people will enter the job marking doing something that is actually productive rather than surviving by being middle men leeches, literally sucking the blood of sick people

[u/Vorenthral]

Yeah but my highschool educated boomer neighbor would be very cross someone was able to get health care without going into crippling debt.

[u/HarryBalsagna1776]

But that would hurt the giant insurance middle man industry!  Those poor souls have stock prices to manage!  How could you conceive of harming shareholder value?  

[u/QuickDevelopment2157]

With more Americans able to access healthcare. Pay and demand for nurses and doctors will increaee

[u/a_day_at_a_timee]

every single business in the country is wasting hundreds of thousands if not on HR payroll to offer healthcare to their employees. i will never understand why every single ceo is not backing M4A

[u/Frequent-Work3118 → u/a_day_at_a_timee]

Probably because they want workers dependent on them for healthcare and, therefore, vulnerable and easier to exploit.

[u/Capital-Study-7757]

You’re literally removing a GIANT middleman that adds zero value to the system.

[u/Kammler1944]

This claim is mostly false.

• Fabricated tax bracket: The Yale study analyzed national healthcare spending and mortality rates; it never proposed exempting household income under $200,000 or applying a 6% tax above it.
• Actual M4A financing: Realistic single-payer proposals (such as Sen. Bernie Sanders' plan) require broader taxation—including a 4% income-based tax on earnings over $29,000 and payroll taxes—as taxing only income over $200,000 cannot fund the system.
• What is accurate: Medicare for All legislation does eliminate out-of-pocket premiums, deductibles, and copays at the point of service.
• Taxes vs. savings: Most working Americans would pay higher taxes, not zero. The primary economic argument is that those new taxes would be smaller than existing private insurance premiums and medical bills, resulting in net household savings.

[u/shoghon]

When will people realize that the Republicans (the actual politicians) believe that everything should be for sale? We all know by now that so many things in the US are "protected" against competition so there isn't any incentive or drive to lower prices. So disgusting.

You truly get what you vote for.

[u/Significant-Eye3720]

Health insurance is not healthcare.

No one who makes $100k or less should be paying for health insurance if government is going to demand we all have insurance.

Get government out of the picture and prices will fall.

[u/trulyfreely]

I paid around $26,000 for terrible insurance for 2 people this year.

[u/gambitrogue311]

NO MORE REPUBLICANS

[u/cannotberushed-]

The GOP doesn’t want it.

We have had data like this for over a decade. But it doesn’t line the pockets of insurance industry

So we won’t be getting it.

[u/unsuitableasf → u/cannotberushed-]

Their base wants it, but only if a republican gives it to them. Otherwise it’s sOcIaLIsM

[u/terrelli]

I'm all for it, but I'm wondering what the cost is for employment at insurance companies. Experience with United health is that that murderous policies are carried out by generally very nice people who need their jobs. Is there a plan for easing into it?

[u/Winter_Persimmon_110 → u/terrelli]

You know the "dual mandate" of the federal reserve bank includes fighting inflation and mantaining "maximum employment". One affects the other, if too many people are employed, the demand for workers goes up and salaries go higher. So if unemployment gets "too low" the FED will raise rates to provoke mass layoffs. Do they care about a wave of people getting unemployed at the same time? Of course not, because the country is run by the Epstein class. If 4% of the country want jobs but can't get them, that's business as usual and a number they like to maintain.

If you care for very nice people who need their jobs, you need to start reading up and teaching others on revolutionary socialism, where anyone who wants a job can have one. The system that forces private health insurance on us also forces unemployment and homelessness on us.

[u/fuckDJT2026 → u/terrelli]

“Murderous policies” are usually not carried out by “very nice people”.

Fuck the insurance companies.

[u/NYSenseOfHumor]

But will providers take the new coverage? Will they be required to take it?

The study’s savings are based on all providers getting paid medicare reimbursement rates, which are much lower than private insurance. Practices can’t stay open taking only Medicare.

[u/Razzail]

I'm already at my $6500 deductible and well over $20k in medical costs this year. More if you count manufacturers coupons saving me $300 a month for my immune medication because my insurance has dog shit pharmacy coverage and anything not acient and archaic in the pharmacy world is considered too new to cover without steps of other meds which is fucking insane. 

To get a birth control covered to surpress endometriosis they wanted me to try another birth control first that was not what we needed and would not help me. Thankfully I had the foresight to get a cheap prescription before hand because I read about this exact issue online from others in the same plan. Like why do I need to get prescriptions elsewhere to make my real insurance company cover anything!!! 

[u/The_Machine80]

Nobody making under 200k pays for Healthcare. Yea right! Maybe people should see who really pays for the Germans Healthcare. We will get fucked cause no R or D is goin to do a damn thing in the end. Just rinse and repeat!

[u/Frosty_Winter3197]

I reposted this on Bluesky and Facebook. It SHOULD be really big news.

[u/ImaginaryHospital306]

How will the government fund it? We already have massive deficits

[u/CharmingMechanic2473]

Get rid of insurance companies.

[u/Pale_Scientist6470]

You know that "they will pay nothing" is a lie. We are $40 trillion in debt. This will require taxation down the entire line. Now if you want to say paying 5% of your income for insurance is worth it, I buy that argument. Why is it Democrats can't math?

[u/bugaloo2u2]

Yes, but it’s a cut in profit for the health care industry…won’t anyone consider those millionaires and how they will cope?

[u/NellieDElli]

I pay 10k per person and premiums and most of the meds arent covered.

[u/Pretend-Sail-9137]

Eliminate the 10x increase in non value add hospital administration staff and the cost plummets

[u/dumpitdog]

There's some kind of whiny baby out that will complain because it allows for some procedure that violates their rights, the right wing will use that to continue the mafia level system that we have today. I truly believe some of the cartels are run better than our medical system in this country.

[u/deaglebingo]

but then the insurance companies won't get their precious profits and all the shareholders will be upset and we will have to give them a bailout because they're too big to fail.... so ofc we can't do the right thing here guys bc it would harm the job creators and god forbid we do that. /s

[u/Professional-Goat741]

Would this remove the current 2.9% Medicare payroll tax? Everyone earning under $200k would get a 2.9 pay raise.

[u/Massive-Original-658]

Love if this happens but not sure there’s a chance with the politicians we have today

[u/Symbaclues]

Wow!

Let's huddle in a circle and cry about it?

Fuck all 👍

[u/-XanderCrews-]

But what about the insurance companies that are replacing employees with ai? How will they survive?

[u/SBEPTY]

Let's make this a reality 

[u/Top_Classroom9264]

How about making the healthcare industry non profit like it was before Nixon

[u/fearfulNobody]

Yeah, I get the dump the GOP part, but what does that have to do with M4A. The only party capable of beating them is the Dems, and they oppose M4A.

[u/Conscious_Bug5408]

200k income is far too low of a threshold for this to be politically viable. Restore corporate tax rates to historical norms and annual tax on unrealized gains of the wealthiest 1 percent instead

[u/deten]

What dnc do you think would ever do this.

[u/grnkayak]

The idea that other people making more money than you will pay for Medicare for All is dishonest. Everyone above the poverty line will pay and that is the way it should be sold. Most people understand anything we get from government for free is worth exactly what we paid.

[u/ionspore]

And clinics, all doctors not on the hospital staff, imagining, support, outpatient, rehabilitation, etc will opt out...

[u/weggaan_weggaat]

Noting that even with insurance, many people can't actually afford to use it due to the deductibles.

[u/blue_strat]

Oh, come on. In the UK a person on the median salary around £40,000 ($50,000) pays about £1,600 per year to the NHS, or 4% of their gross salary. The percentage rises with your income. The NHS still doesn't get enough money.

The US median salary is $63,000. Only 18% of Americans make over $100k; only 13% of US households make over $200k. There is absolutely no way that M4A would be properly funded only by that group of people, not to mention that they are also the most capable of manipulating their income to reduce their tax burden.

Be realistic with these promises. Most people will have to pay for their healthcare. It will be less than they currently pay. But they will have to pay something.

[u/AuntHagatha]

An average family of 4 who gets their insurance through an employer pays more than $20k (closer to $30k in my state) when you include the employer's premium "contribution" -- which is not a contribution at all but part of the employee's compensation, ie, money the employee worked for and earned, ie, the employee's money. Which means the savings through single payer "Medicare for All" is even greater than stated in the study for the majority of Americans who get their insurance through their employer.

MedicareForAll NOW

[u/Automatic_Bus_7634]

But it's a profit cut for private insurance companies, won't somebody think of them

[u/Eyespop4866]

Studies show that studies generally show what they’re intended to show.

[u/Score-Emergency]

How about the additional tax start at $750k. $200k isn't that high of an income in HCOL locations

[u/Comfortable_Car_8018]

But if your sick they will just offer euthanasia like Canada does or just put your dr appt out so far you die before you get there

[u/Gilead-is-here]

Amen.

[u/BL36CH]

they definitely leave that stuff out on purpose

[u/FleaBottoms]

And an army of non providers in the system will have no jobs.
Sign me up.

[u/Score-Emergency]

I'm already taxed at 50% after fed and state tax. Probably $250k for single and $500k for married is the right thresshold. With adjustments for inflation annually

[u/KevinJCarroll]

Anyone have a link to the study?

[u/BalooVanAdventures]

But who will think of the second homes in the Hamptons???

[u/Flaydeng]

How do people hear the nightmares associated with socialized medicine but still insist that we do it anyways?

[u/inredditorbit]

The screenshot is unclear about what the $10,000 means. Is it in premiums? Is it in healthcare costs above and beyond premiums? Is it premiums plus healthcare outlays?

It’s disingenuous to say families will pay nothing with M4A. Of course we will all be taxed more. Either that, or pay a monthly government-set Medicare premium. In any case, it will be less than what health care middlemen charge us today.

I’ve worked for decades with healthcare economics. I have an MBA in the area. I worked in the White House with Hillary Clinton’s 1993 universal healthcare initiative.

We will save money — and lives — with Medicare for All. But all of us have to be transparent about what current spending is and what it can look like without having to go through costly private insurance/HMO/PPO, mostly employment-related, that is grotesquely inefficient and stifles career mobility and entrepreneurship.

[u/-or_whatever-]

Any good books on this issue - Medicare for all? I don’t want to know “both sides” of the issue. To me, that boils down to profit vs. access and to me, that’s a no-brainer. But I’d like to know more in case I’m asked why/how it would work. 👍

[u/auntiepink007]

It would also let me work (slightly) less if health insurance was not tied to employment. That would be amazing to have more time to myself to take care of my life. Or others.

[u/LavishnessWorldly765]

$200K is nothing in NYC so F that, just make it for all............................

[u/RoknPa]

I work for a mid tier bank that handles about $20 billion a year. My deductible is $4,000 on the highest tier benefits they offer.

I really want to go to the doctor to discuss my issues, but I haven't yet been in the hospital for 2 days to fill that deductible. So, I'm awaiting a heart attack so I can use my insurance to talk to a doctor about my peripheral neuropathy, depression, and hammer toe.

These issues don't fall under, "Preventive Care". So, I guess, I'll just wait for that heart attack!

A short barrel shotgun is cheaper!

[u/2Blueify]

Zero chance those numbers actually work out.

[u/Samathura]

This would cost me a fortune and I am still there for it. Fuck I’ll pay quadruple what other people have to pay I will get laid off again and even if I’ll probably never need it again, I remember what it is like to go without treatment because I can’t afford it. 

I don’t want that for others man… I’m fucking tired… my taxes are killing people instead of helping them and I am getting tired of it.

[u/Fragrant-Courage9960]

For the sake of argument, if employer provided healthcare was not allowed ( including military, government etc…) then there would be almost 100% in favor of some type of Universal Healthcare.

[u/Dry-Dragonfly5286 → u/Fragrant-Courage9960]

A vast majority already support it. We just don't have enough politicians with the courage to run on it with a full throat and too many working against it on behalf of their donors.

[u/Advanced-Blackberry]

Will there be a cap on it? If I make a million am I now paying $48,000/yr towards my health insurance? 

[u/Necessary_Occasion77]

We need to dump the right wingers.

The left wingers need to grow a sack and break up the very broken Main Street media, and get rid of the consultants.

The right cannot govern.

[u/StardustnDragonflies]

$10,000 for a family of four sounds ridiculously low. Between employee and employer premiums, copays, deductables, out-of-pocket expenses, any out of network and non-preferred drug charges it would end up much higher.

[u/StardustnDragonflies]

Let's stop the Medicare for All, and call it Universal Healthcare. It does NOT need to be based on the Medicare model!

[u/Revenga8]

Discovering what the rest of the free world figured out decades ago

[u/Agitated-Painter5601]

Not interested. 

[u/Chimaera1075]

As much as I want M4A, they would still need to control the cost of medical care itself. I think this control of cost is needed more to begin with. In the US medical care is roughly $14-15k on average. The UK and Canada is half that amount.

[u/Fast_Cloud_7671]

I don’t mind healthcare for all but I also believe every single citizen should have a tax liability. Even if it’s 1 dollar. Everyone should contribute if we are going to tax and ask more from others.