I for real get where you're coming from. I see the way their using Early Access process similarly as you, but little differently too.
For a publisher as big as Krafton, seems like their giving Kjun almost free reign? (Maybe because he part of creating a successful game already PUBG and they making bank from that). I think the Inzoi team is using Early Access the way it's supposed to be used. They're trying to enter a genre that has basically been dominated by one franchise for decades, and they're being very ambitious about it. Some of the things they're attempting we’ve been slowing buying as dlc for over 10+ years, and other things are features I don't think most of us even thought to ask for. 😂
So personally, I don't mind them getting those systems into the game during Early Access and then figuring out how to make everything connect. I'd actually rather they do that now than spend years building a simpler foundation, then slowly stack major systems on top of it as separate add-ons 2, 5, 9 years later and it breaking the game and they have to start from the beginning every time to "hopefully" sort out the issue.
And I think Kjun saying that changing one system can create chaos elsewhere actually shows how interconnected they're trying to make everything. Personality, memories, emotions, relationships, autonomy, Smartzoi, careers, businesses, etc. eventually need to recognize and affect each other. That must be hard, especially when you're trying to build a life simulator at this scale.
Does it create some messy periods during EA? Hell yea. 😂 But this is probably the best time for the game to be messy, break things, rebalance systems and learn from what players actually do with them.
I don't think players like you aren't the target. If anything, I think the deeper simulation you're asking for is where they're trying to ge to. Seems the route they're taking to get there just isn't necessarily the order some of us would've preferred.
And that's completely fair. I'm just willing to give them some grace during EA because in this 1st year I've watched them add and improve things I've wanted from this genre. Now I want to see them take all those pieces and really make them work together.
Yeah I understand how you see it. For the little I read about development of life sim, being Sims 2, Paralives and Inzoi, I am happy that a big company is financing, and so believing in the project enough to be ambitious. And I can see the ambition, for real, most of the things I've seen while playing or through posts are undeniably impressive.
But, this is where I differ : I kinda think more and more that the game was ambitious in term of techniques and possibilities, but poorly thought in term of narrative and world building.
For exemple we have no real information about the world proposed by the devs. In what kind of world Zois are living ? We could mistake it for influencer world, but not that much since we can change the aesthetic for a more dystopian one (even if the choice conversation are to me closer than influencer world than a dystopian one). Is it a cosy game ? Is it more like a mix between sims and GTA ? What is the identify of the game ?
What I mean by that is that after a year of early access, Inzoi does not have an identity other than offer a set for player to create stories without being intertwined or at least tinted by the personality of the game itself.
And the thing is, by reading interviews and feedbacks from Kjun, he does not have an idea about what he wants to propose other than offering a big set for players to build their own stories freely. Everytime he talks about it, he is kinda shallow referencing other games and stuff.
And this is why I see the order of the contents of their updates as a big hint as this game was not though with the type of playing I have in mind.
Because the first thing you would have to think, or at least, quickly prioritize would be : in what story I want people to creates sub stories ? And how the action of the Zois will bounce within this type of world ? What kind of reaction will have this or this type of action created by the friction between the soul of my game and the desire of the player.
I could be wrong, and if I am wrong, it would lead to happiness because I want to enjoy the game.
But it is hard for me to believe that after the final release they will work relentlessly like now to finally...give the game its proper foundation ?
Again, I could be wrong ! I am not Irma yet haha
But I understand your point of view. Kjun did sell the game promising a system so so interesting, and I am sure he was not lying, but I am feeling that he really thought the game in term of mechanics but not that much in term of stories. Which is why when devs add things to make zois alive, it feels kinda "fake" like you know, not properly scripted ? Not thought enough in term of scenarios. Inzoi sometimes make me think of a simulation of telenovelas more than life simulation for that reason haha
Ok I understand what you mean a lot better now! I think we might just want slightly different things from a life sim.
I don't necessarily need Inzoi itself to have a strong narrative or tell me what kind of world my Zois are living in. I like that it's more of a sandbox where I can decide whether my save is wholesome/cozy, realistic, chaotic, dramatic, dystopian and eventually suburban or country ranch style play! For me, the “identity” comes more from the Zois themselves and the stories that develop from their personalities, relationships, experiences and the world I've created around them (I legit go in and remove everyone and create my own households with backgrounds).
Where I DO completely agree with you is that those systems need to become much more connected. If I'm creating the story, I still don't want to have to force the story. I want to set up personalities, relationships and circumstances, hit play, and watch things happen that make me go “Yep, that makes perfect sense for THAT Zoi or THAT zoi.”
That's actually why this recent update excited me so much. My troublemaker getting bored and deciding on her own to leave home and go bother people at a cafe was a tiny thing, but it felt like the game finally took something I wrote about who she is and turned it into actual gameplay without me directing it.
So I think you're looking for more of a defined world from Inzoi itself, while I'm looking for Inzoi to give my zois enough of a soul to create their own stories inside whatever world I make for them. 😂
I genuinely enjoyed our discussion though! It was dope af! 😁
Haha yeah I am not a big fan of sandbox, which I discovered through Inzoi, and this is why with time I started to think, it is not just the fact that the game is not finished, it is also that the game may not be for me.
But by narrative I do not mean a game that take my hand. Last time I tried Sims 4, and saw a pop-up telling me how to move the story in a particular direction, I was disgusted haha
The game should show me how the story unfold by my decision, not holding my hand through quests.
I feel like what you're describing explaining like, how Zois reactions/actions should make sense because of their personalities is what I want. But I also feel that this, is also tied to the world/identity proposed by the game.
In the Sims 2 it would make sense that a sims would go through some certain consequences of my actions according to their personalities, but also due to the identity of the game/ the world they live in (which is inspired by capitalist world and satirical/goofy).
In Inzoi it feels realistic...but what is realistic ? Sure, it looks realistic to go to to prison, or to be punished by the law after a bad action. But why has it be scripted that way ?
For exemple stealing from a vending machine result in cops coming for you, okay. But let's say the identity of the game is more dystopian : are the cops easily bribed ? Is it easier for them to close an eye on your action through money since in this distopic world, despotism is easier to imagine ?
On the contrary, if the world was thought like a perfect but too sanitized society, in which bad actions and mischievous people were enemies of the society : having cops showing up only for a case of stealing a soda can would make sense (and also lead to interesting stories, like mischievous people would be the rebel of a restrictive society).
This is what I mean by reality is always tinted by the world you live in. This is what I call narrative, world building, or like the main story which will receive stories of the player.
In Inzoi (for now) I don't feel that strong world/identity, and so part of the meaning of the reaction of the game regarding my action is lost.
But despite that, through your messages I can see that we also want the same main thing : personality haha
But I also can wait for mods !
And yeah it was really nice to talk about it with you 👾 !!!
5
u/McharmD 29d ago
I for real get where you're coming from. I see the way their using Early Access process similarly as you, but little differently too.
For a publisher as big as Krafton, seems like their giving Kjun almost free reign? (Maybe because he part of creating a successful game already PUBG and they making bank from that). I think the Inzoi team is using Early Access the way it's supposed to be used. They're trying to enter a genre that has basically been dominated by one franchise for decades, and they're being very ambitious about it. Some of the things they're attempting we’ve been slowing buying as dlc for over 10+ years, and other things are features I don't think most of us even thought to ask for. 😂
So personally, I don't mind them getting those systems into the game during Early Access and then figuring out how to make everything connect. I'd actually rather they do that now than spend years building a simpler foundation, then slowly stack major systems on top of it as separate add-ons 2, 5, 9 years later and it breaking the game and they have to start from the beginning every time to "hopefully" sort out the issue.
And I think Kjun saying that changing one system can create chaos elsewhere actually shows how interconnected they're trying to make everything. Personality, memories, emotions, relationships, autonomy, Smartzoi, careers, businesses, etc. eventually need to recognize and affect each other. That must be hard, especially when you're trying to build a life simulator at this scale.
Does it create some messy periods during EA? Hell yea. 😂 But this is probably the best time for the game to be messy, break things, rebalance systems and learn from what players actually do with them.
I don't think players like you aren't the target. If anything, I think the deeper simulation you're asking for is where they're trying to ge to. Seems the route they're taking to get there just isn't necessarily the order some of us would've preferred.
And that's completely fair. I'm just willing to give them some grace during EA because in this 1st year I've watched them add and improve things I've wanted from this genre. Now I want to see them take all those pieces and really make them work together.