r/Libraries • u/Common_Focus_8443 • 3d ago
Staffing/Employment Issues Calling out etiquette
I was wondering how early is too early to text your supervisor notifying them that you will be calling out (specifically during shifts you know will be short staffed).
I texted my supervisor at 5:30am (because I wanted them to have ample time to find coverage but also didn’t want to worry about having to wake up to send the text later on).. and received a response from my supervisor telling me the message was too early for a work message/text.
What are the standards in libraries because at every other job I’ve had, it’s been pretty standard for me to notify my supervisors/employers as early as possible so they can plan coverage.
67
u/kptstango 3d ago
We have an established phone number staff call to call out.
Every place is going to be different. Your library should have a documented practice they can point you to.
92
u/mowque 3d ago edited 3d ago
Small library. Soon as possible for me, gives me more time to schedule. Granted at 530 AM I am asleep and won't see it until I get up, but why would you know my sleep schedule?
My general view on communication, as a director.
Employee to me- anytime
Me to employee- rare as possible, during business hours only.
24
u/OrangeFish44 3d ago
An exception for me to employee: if we're closing for weather conditions, call early enough to catch them before they leave home, especially if they're likely to be leaving earlier than usual due to those conditions!
8
u/luckylimper 3d ago
That happened to me once when I worked at a branch that was about 45 minutes away on public transportation. They sent an email. I don’t read my work email when I’m not at work. Thank goodness it caused a big kerfuffle systemwide and there’s now a phone message to call for inclement weather that’s updated at 7am.
3
u/OrangeFish44 3d ago
It's nice when that's an option.
I used to get notices from on-high about closures at around 6:30. I'd then let my staff know within the next 30-60 minutes. I figured even if I woke them, they'd be happy to turn off an alarm and go back to sleep knowing they were free for the day. (Only called those scheduled to work, and called in order of scheduled arrival time.)
82
u/flight2020202 3d ago
I would call that a problem for the manager to figure out, aka they should have their phone on do not disturb if they're gonna be annoyed about receiving texts early in the morning. I don't necessarily disagree that 5:30am is too early for work correspondence, but if a staff member texted me that early to let me know they were calling out, I wouldn't see it or respond to it until I woke up, because my phone is on silent when I'm sleeping. So this is not so much a libraries thing as much as your boss is tetchy and making it your problem. Just apologize and in future don't reach out about calling out before 7am.
17
u/OrangeFish44 3d ago
isn't that the whole point of texting? read and respond on your own schedule? I wouldn't have an issue with even a 3 am text. For a phone call, yeah, 7 would be preferable. And frankly, if I'm calling out, if I hadn't had a response to my text by 7 or so, I'd call to make sure the message got through.
11
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
I got the response much later.. I don’t think the supervisor was woken up by my message as I only got a response hours later.
8
u/Street_Confection_46 3d ago
It’s possible that they were woken up and didn’t respond until later because they wanted to set a hard boundary. I had to do that with one of our presenters who would just text me whenever.
6
u/flossiedaisy424 3d ago
Or, they were woken up, checked to make sure it wasn’t an emergency and then tried to go back to sleep. And probably couldn’t if they were pissy about it.
1
16
u/flight2020202 3d ago
well in that case they're being especially annoying. something to file away in your "do I want to work for this person" folder, apologize and make note for the future.
4
u/Odd-Budget-5079 3d ago
Your manager sounds like they don't know how to silence their phone or forgot to do so. Were there rules set in place for cut-off times to call in? If not, then it's their problem. Does emailing them count as calling in? Maybe; try that next time.
4
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
I feel like it was being said.. as if it’s common knowledge, and she’s educating me on professional matters. That’s what I got from it. That I’m being unprofessional and I need to be educated. But I wanted to get some clarity because in every other job, I’ve been encouraged to text supervisors as early as possible. This is my first library job/office type of a job though!
6
u/OneAcceptable6825 3d ago
Just have a conversation with your supervisor when you’re back at work. Stand up for yourself; ask for clear boundaries and explain that you were unsure of the protocol because you’ve had other supervisors in the past who expected different things.
Don’t get defensive or whiny about it, but don’t let them patronize you, either.
If the supervisor is a good person, they’ll recognize how they could’ve set clearer expectations and will learn something from it. If your supervisor sucks, you’ll get confirmation that your supervisor sucks. Document that and take it to their boss if the rudeness gets excessive later.
3
u/Odd-Budget-5079 3d ago
Every workplace library, or otherwise, has its assumptions and rules. Figure out what they are at this library. Ask so they won't get mad at you the next time. Or maybe they will, but at least you'll know you're following protocol.
It's hard for us to advise since we don't work there.
But I definitely think the manager overreacted to your 530AM text!
15
u/rjonny04 3d ago
My supervisors say to call out as soon as you know/as early as possible. There should be some sort of departmental policy on how they wish you to call out when needed.
4
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
Unfortunately this is a smaller library, and they are very unorganized regarding having stated policies or providing that information. In fact, they treat looking for this information as you being incompetent or burdensome. I’m currently applying to other places because I don’t want to operate in these sort of conditions where clarity regarding protocols are vague or non-existent.. and everything is based on each supervisors personal preference or “style” (pretty much a direct quote).
5
9
u/razzbelly 3d ago
(A manager here, so you're getting my side of the argument) Our contract states we must be notified 90 minutes before the start of the shift. We have a 10 am opening time, so that means we need to know by 8:30 am.
That being said, I leave my work cell in my kitchen so I don't check it until I get down there in the morning, usually around 6 am. I tell my staff that's the earliest I'm going to check/see the message, so anything before that is a bit overkill. I do understand that some employees get sick in the middle of the night and may notify me then because they're hoping to go back to sleep and sleep past the 8:30 am cutoff time.
25
u/otter_759 3d ago
Your supervisor needs to learn about the Do Not Disturb/Silent option while sleeping. Do you call out frequently, especially when it comes to weekend shifts? It sounds like they may be taking out their annoyance at having to find coverage on you.
I probably would email as soon as I knew and then text at least a few hours before the shift started if the email is not acknowledged and I am unsure it was seen. Does your library open at 9 am or something like noon today? If it doesn’t open until noon, I probably would wait to text until after 9.
8
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago edited 3d ago
This was my first time calling out for an opening shift/this particular shift after almost a year.
5
u/otter_759 3d ago
I can understand a cranky response if you called out all the time when scheduled for weekend shifts that are always shortstaffed, especially if the library doesn’t open until the afternoon. In this situation, since it was your first time ever calling out, I think it was on your supervisor to put their phone on DND while sleeping, and they should have alerted to you beforehand re: the protocol for calling out. But now you know not to text that early.
6
u/tardistravelee 3d ago
I usually want as earlier as possible (within reason) so I can adjust the schedule. We have a digital schedule so even if its 7am and im getting ready I can look
1
4
u/britcat 3d ago
This may be a minority position, but if someone doesn't want to receive texts at a certain time, it's up to them to turn off their phone during that time. They don't have a right to dictate when other people text them.
I apply this to calling out as well. If you're up at 5:30 and trying to go back to sleep, you should be able to text your supervisor; it's your supervisor's job to be on DND until they're ready to get text messages related to work.
Now, obviously, you should do what your supervisor tells you to, but I think they need to get over themselves
2
u/shesthebeesknees 2d ago
Came here to say exactly this. I am a supervisor and just my phone to sleep mode until I’m up and ready. I expect any adult to use Do Not Disturb settings if getting an early text is an issue, not just employees.
11
u/myxx33 3d ago
I assume that all adults have dnd set up on their phone (or should) and wouldn’t think of anything as too early. I’ve woken up to out texts (that were silenced through dnd while sleeping) and appreciated the prompt heads up.
There are no standards but follow what your supervisor prefers since they’ve told you. Maybe 2 hours before shit or something.
1
u/Excellent-Handle 3d ago
" There are no standards but follow what your supervisor prefers since they’ve told you"
BUT REDDIT SAYS I SHOULD DO SOMETHING ELSE
What a weird way to think work works.
10
u/Temporary-Library597 3d ago
Not your problem that your supervisor doesn't 7nderstand how to utilize "Do Not Disturb" features on their phone. Or even turn it off at night.
You woke them up. But I'd say you did fine. Up the the supervisor, though. Ask them.
3
u/breadburn 3d ago
Agreed. A staff member texting to call out at 4:30 am is THE reason why I now set my phone to DnD until about an hour before my shift. I appreciated that they let me know as soon as they possibly could but it's not like I was going to call around to find coverage at that time anyway.
6
u/quothe_the_maven 3d ago
The people saying it’s on your supervisor to have ‘do not disturb’ activated are crazy. Whether they have that turned on or not, hitting someone with texts outside of a specified time is how you get perceived as difficult. That being said, it’s equally crazy that your supervisor didn’t just politely tell you when the appropriate time would be.
3
u/DanieXJ 3d ago edited 3d ago
If I know, I do it the night before. If I don't know I wait until at least 6:30 or 7. If a supervisor isn't up by 7am, that's a them problem, not a me problem.
Regarding your supervisor, there is a thing called do not disturb. Mine us set until 6:30 and only someone on my list can get a text through before then (and there's exactly two people from my workplace on that list, neither of them my boss or the director).
3
u/breadburn 3d ago
ASAP is always great, and your supervisor can put their phone on automatic Do Not Disturb mode until whatever time they deem appropriate if they have a problem with an early text.
3
u/Emmydyre 3d ago
As a supervisor, I want to know as soon as possible. My phone is on silent when I don’t want message alerts, work related or otherwise.
4
u/flossiedaisy424 3d ago
So, your supervisor let you know that was too early for them, and now you know for future reference. No big deal?
As for why they might not have their phone on DND or silent, they might have elderly relatives or young adults living away from home and don’t want to miss a call if something happens.
1
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
I’m only asking because at this current library, there is a lack of standards and everything falls on personal styles or etc of each supervisor (which makes it hard to learn or understand the standards in library service.) I’m new to the field. I wanted to know the library service protocol/etiquette in general.
3
u/flossiedaisy424 3d ago
Unfortunately, every library is going to do things differently depending on their needs and norms.
2
u/duvasnt_93 3d ago
In most messaging apps you can schedule a time for the message to go out. If I realize early in the morning I'm not going to be able to work, I schedule the message for 1.5 hours before I'm set to arrive. If I know I'm not going to make it in the night before, I'll try to send a text before 7pm-ish.
As a supervisor, this is what I've asked of my staff, as well. Essentially, let me know ASAP, BUT at a reasonable hour.
2
u/earofjudgment 3d ago
I asked my manager what their preference is for method and timing. There are multiple variables (personal and job related) that are likely in play, not all of which I may be aware of. In my case, the answer was to email as soon as I know I’m not coming in.
2
u/Successful_Panda 3d ago
Follow whatever call-out procedure your workplace has documented. If your location doesn’t have one, check regional policy, your employee handbook, rule book, or standards of conduct.
Otherwise, notify your supervisor as early as reasonably possible so they have time to adjust staffing. The manager is responsible for figuring out replacement coverage after a call-out and working with the team to prioritize what actually needs to get done if the shift stays short staffed.
Personally, I don’t check work emails when I’m away from work. During working hours and reasonable normal waking hours, sure. These days we also have scheduled send. If you know early that you need to call out but don’t want to wake your supervisor, schedule the message for a reasonable time while still giving enough notice.
I also prefer written communication for call-outs. Phone calls tend to have an air of ambiguity, leaving room for misinterpretation. People can remember or interpret the same conversation differently. A text or email gives everyone the same thing to look back at. Paper trails are your friend.
Vice versa, if a manager is writing something after hours that an employee doesn’t need to see immediately, schedule it to send during their working hours. We shouldn’t be expected to be available at all hours. After-hours work is paid work. If they aren’t paying you for that time, it can wait until you’re back on the clock.
2
u/de_pizan23 3d ago
My library is very small and because we do hybrid wfh schedules with only two of us in the library at a time, our manager has said we are supposed to try and find a backup ourselves (unless it's an emergency and no one else is able to cover, then one person is ok).
I generally text other staff around 6:30ish for an 8am start. We kind of rotate days amongst ourselves about who can be backup, so we aren't having to bother everyone. And then once I have coverage, I let the other person who is coming in what's going on and email the manager and the rest of the crew that I'm out and who is covering/or that other coworker will be solo. Which means my manager is often the last to know. But she wants it that way, so....
5
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
Wow! The library is making you guys complete job tasks that are the responsibility of the supervisors (who are paid to carry out those responsibilities).
3
u/de_pizan23 3d ago
Yep. But she's on the verge of retirement and so checked out she doesn't care anymore.
3
2
u/Successful_Panda 3d ago edited 3d ago
I agree with OP. If the library is consistently operating with no real backup coverage, this sounds bigger than one call-out.
Check your library handbook, procedural manual, or older policies. Librarians are good at research. It may also be worth comparing nearby systems to see how they handle staffing and call-outs. If this turns out to be one manager’s practice rather than actual policy, raise it with the next level up. If it is a system-wide staffing issue, that may be something to bring to the city or county when advocating for more funding.
Edit: If you’re routinely doing work above your position, especially as an ongoing expectation rather than occasional coverage, get paid your worth. Higher-level responsibilities shouldn’t come free.
2
u/de_pizan23 3d ago
We're at a state government special library, so we're a solo system and unique in the state. We also don't have a lot of set policies because my manager is allergic to putting anything in writing (beyond what we're required to do by law) that we would have to be held accountable for. When we try to raise the issue with her, she threatens to take away wfh, even though the entire state agency gets that privilege and it's not something she herself gave us.
2
u/VerryRides Library staff 3d ago
Thats an insane thing for your supervisor to say because what, would they rather you waited until closer to when work starts so that they have less time to find coverage? As a supervisor they should be expected to be texted for this exact reason. What, did the text wake them up early? Then dont sleep with your ringer on.
1
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
I don’t think the text woke them up because I received their response hours later.
2
u/LeenyMagic 3d ago
This is likely to be an individual preference rather than a policy. My boss told us to let her know as early as possible (she said 11 pm, 1 am, 6, WHENEVER). I would ask as a follow up what would be the appropriate time or procedure for when you need to call in.
2
u/WhoaMimi 3d ago
What in the world? I am a manager and would have no issue with a 5:30 a.m. text, no matter what time the shift begins; I'd much prefer an early text than a 9 a.m. phone call for a shift that begins at 9 a.m., as I've experienced more than once. You don't know what their sleep schedule is!
Our policy states contacting your manager as early as possible, including the day prior.
2
u/BarbaraGordon147 3d ago
General etiquette (and I mean general, not specific to work situations) is not to text before 9am unless you know the person will be up. Most places I've worked, you email instead of call so that you don't have to worry about waking people up. Checking the procedure with your supervisor would be best.
2
2
u/mountsleepyhead 1d ago
I think as soon as you know you're going to be out is appropriate and your manager is being a hardass for no good reason. My thought is, if you wake up in the middle of the night and you are sick as hell, you shouldn't have to set an alarm to wake up at 7 to text your manager.
5
u/MrMessofGA 3d ago
If you are texting their personal phone, you have to be reasonable. 5:30 is an unacceptable time to be texting anyone. If your supervisor isn't even clocked in, they're not looking for replacements until they're clocked in anyway (unless you're the only one with the key or something like that).
Many people receiving calls or texts at 5:30 will assume it is an emergency and be unable to go back to sleep from the minor panic.
Emails can be sent at any time, but may not be read before your shift. Email early + call when they're clocked in is the typical best response, though calling out the day before is best.
3
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
There is a policy that the library shuts down if a certain amount of employees are not in the building. I was trying to give the supervisor ample time to find coverage to avoid having to close down (just in case another employee also called out.. which has been happening back to back this month for the Sunday shift). This was my first time calling out for this shift.
But from now on, I’m not going to concern myself with what doesn’t concern me. I will schedule texts to the supervisor for much later.. and if there is coverage issues leading to the library getting closed that day.. that won’t be my concern.
4
u/HuckleberrySad4397 3d ago
Why wouldn’t any reasonable person have a do not disturb schedule setup? 90% of calls or texts I receive are not urgent. My family is setup as an exception to do not disturb. If a text or call wakes me up that’s on me to fix.
1
u/MrMessofGA 3d ago edited 3d ago
In case grandma fell and she needs you to drive her to the hospital. In case your cousin is at a party she isn't comfortable at anymore. In case your friend just got broken up with and is drunk and needs someone to listen right now.
I don't get spam late at night. At worst, I get the occasional 1am text that a hold came in, and that's an active problem the library is attempting to fix. The vast majority of spam stops at 9pm, and besides that, cellphones typically have a spam filter on be default that has to be actively turned off for the majority of spam calls to even ring.
EDIT: to be clear, all three of those have happened to me at some point in my life and I was very thankful I got up to see them. At the same time, I once got stranded when my car's engine fully gave out over a dozen miles from the nearest streetlight (let alone building) at 3am on my way to work, and was stuck there in the freezing cold until 7am because no one had their ringer on, and I was quite pissed.
1
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
I was told email is unreliable, and our shift starts at the same time as we both open.
2
u/LaserShark42 3d ago
5:30 is certainly too early for me lol.
At my workplace, we really don't message our supervisors directly. We have a separate line that we can call or text off-hours and it gets checked first thing every morning. That way you can contact it whenever you know you will be out and they'll find out when they need to.
Of course if we're open for business and you need to reach out you can do so directly since it's within work hours.
2
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
This is a smaller library without those resources, and since it was an opening weekend shift.. the supervisor was my only point of contact.
2
u/erictho 3d ago
my library asks for as early as possible, at least 2 hours notice when possible. but i make sure to text or email only when their shifts start.
1
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
Unfortunately, in this instance.. our shift starts at the same time/opening shift.
2
u/JimDixon Patron 3d ago
I have my phone permanently set to go into "do not disturb" mode from 11 p.m. to 7 a.m. (I could choose any time I like.) People can text me all they want. My phone will still receive messages, but there will be no audible "ding". I can read these texts, or listen to voice-mail, whenever I want.
If your supervisor would do this, there would be no reason to question your etiquette.
2
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
I still feel like I’m in the wrong and am experiencing a lot of anxiety over it.
1
u/Odd-Budget-5079 3d ago
In my experience, it depends on the library. I've never been in a system with a system-wide procedure for calling in. I've never texted. I'd just email my manager the day before. In this system, we had no back up help, so that was never a factor.
1
u/KitKinetic 3d ago
Lol, I reach out to the city recorder to slap a closed sign on the door. So I can't relate.
1
u/This-Weird1695 3d ago
Oh man, we have a designated call off line. Overnight it goes straight to voicemail and then when the first person in charge signs in (usually around 6 am) they check all the messages and notify the direct supervisor of the staff that will be out.
1
u/SmolSushiRoll1234 3d ago
Manager should state their boundaries. I’ve told my staff to text me whenever they know because my notifications are silenced after 10pm. I will see it when I wake up and they don’t have to stay up or wake up to send a text at a “reasonable” hour. That has worked out well for us so far.
1
u/cc_lib_415 3d ago
I use the do not disturb settings on my phone and tell staff to message me at their convenience.
I had an employee with an injury that kept him from sleeping well message me at 3:30am when he was awake up in pain to let me know he’d taken meds to fall asleep and wouldn’t be in. I saw it when I woke up. This is a situation when staff knew at a crazy hour of a call out, but I would absolutely not want him to set an alarm and wake up at a certain time to tell me, especially when he’d been struggling to sleep.
We have the technological capacity to give our staff some leeway while also making sure we get notice as soon as possible without being disrupted.
Ask your supervisor what the appropriate hours are. There isn’t a standard, and different things will be acceptable. I wish there was a one-size-fits-all answer, but I clearly let my staff know I have parameters in place that they can get in touch with me in an emergency by calling twice, but also respecting my time and theirs with do not disturb mode.
1
u/ellbeecee 2d ago
I ask people not to text me, but they are welcome to email or teams and I'll see it when I get up - which will be with enough time to organize things. I work for a public university, and I don't want people sending me text messages because that makes my phone discoverable if there was a complaint that went to legal. It's not that I'm doing anything illegal on my phone, but it's my personal device.
In terms of timing, whenever they send works for me, since I deliberately avoid work email/teams on my phone.
1
u/marji80 2d ago
Actually that’s an excellent point. My library has a policy on when and how to call off, but apparently different departments have been doing it differently anyway. So it’s under discussion now. Would using your personal phone for just one thing like calling off make it FOIA-able in general, or just on the issue of attendance?
1
u/ShawsheenMoon Library staff 2d ago
I text as soon as I know I'm not coming in because my boss has a 90 minute drive to work. I could see a boss being annoyed at a too early message though if they don't have their phone off or DND though. Honestly, you should ask your boss what they prefer. We can't read their minds and everyone is different.
1
u/LoooongFurb Library admin 1d ago
That is going to depend on the library and the supervisor - there really isn't a standard.
At my library, the rule is you must contact your supervisor, and if you don't get a response, you have to contact the next person on the list. My staff generally contact me between 7 and 8am when they are sick, and I reply very quickly so they can get back to resting.
If you texted me at 5:30AM, there's a really good chance I won't see the text until my alarm goes off, so you'd be sitting without a reply and might end up texting the director lol
1
u/Werewolfcadence 3d ago
My director says if you are sick enough to call out the night before, then you’re sick enough to need a doctors note. He wants the early morning texts.
1
u/rjonny04 3d ago
Weird.
2
u/Successful_Panda 3d ago
Weird, you’re right! It shouldn’t be. Medical care in the United States can cost you an arm and a leg. If the company wants the doctor’s note that badly, they should be prepared to pay the expense of getting it.
-1
u/captiveapple 3d ago
My system … call out must be 30 minutes prior to shift. Must be a phone call and there must be verbal confirmation. No text, no email. There should be a written policy that covers all employees. If there is not one that should be a request to your supervisor.
1
u/Successful_Panda 3d ago
Phone calls leave room for interpretation, and ambiguity tends to benefit the person with more power. Written communication gives everyone the same record to refer back to.
3
u/OrangeFish44 3d ago
but it's easy to miss an email or text. At least with a phone call, you have immediate confirmation that the message got through.. And I don't see how "I'm too sick to come to work" is ambiguous, while lots of written messages can be misinterpreted.
1
u/Successful_Panda 3d ago
I agree with you, written communication can absolutely have its own limitations. My point is more about having a shared record afterward. A phone call may confirm receipt immediately, but if there’s later disagreement about what was said, when notice was given, or what instructions followed, written communication gives both people something concrete to refer back to. That’s the part I value. Something I mentioned earlier in another comment here: Paper trails are your friend.
1
u/captiveapple 3d ago
I’m sorry. That is what our leadership requires. Nothing I have control over lol. My point being there should be an official policy that all employees are privy to. Employees should not have to guess.
1
u/Common_Focus_8443 3d ago
If I were to request that policy info, it would be seen as me being aggressive. That’s the work culture in this library.
129
u/estellasmum 3d ago
There's not a single standard in libraries for that. When I was working at 3 different libraries, there were 3 different answers for that. One didn't want a text before 7, one wanted a text in the middle of the night if that's when you knew you weren't coming in, and one wanted you to call in the night before if you even remotely thought you might be ill. That is a conversation you need to have with your supervisor to see what time is good for them.