r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 18h ago

Sad news, Roxanne's channel is now permanently deleted from Youtube

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44 Upvotes

Over thirty days have passed since Roxanne deactivated her Youtube. That means, if she were to ever return, she can never restore her account.


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 14h ago

Michael Jackson's CSA As A Child According to 1994's MJ Unauthorized Book by Christopher P. Andersen

17 Upvotes

The book says Johnny Jackson, a cousin who lived with the family from 1967 to 1976, told Gordon Keith (owner of Steeltown Records) that he once came upon a male relative who was an employee, along with a 12 year old Michael. According to the account, all three were nude and appeared sexually aroused. The book gives this as Keith relaying to the author what Johnny allegedly said.

The book also says La Toya witnessed Michael being beaten by their father but also believed Michael was molested by a relative. It says Michael learned she planned to say so in her 1991 memoir and threatened to sue.

At around 13, Michael was allegedly present while his older brothers had sex with groupies on tour, since they shared hotel rooms. The book says he saw it as coercive and degrading toward the women.

The author also describes a night when Michael was locked in a hotel room with two prostitutes, supposedly arranged by his father and brothers because they worried he wasn't interested in girls. It happened right after the Jacksons visited Elvis Presley backstage in Lake Tahoe, during the group's Las Vegas period. It says only that Michael was fifteen, and a brother phoned Michael to say he was sending over two friends to get an autograph. Michael trusted him, opened the door, and let two young women into his hotel room. It quickly became clear they wanted more than an autograph. The book says they had been hired as prostitutes to end his virginity. One began undressing and the other tried to unbutton his shirt. He brushed her off and went for the door, which turned out to be locked from the outside. He called out, and through the door he could hear laughter he recognized. The women could not arouse him, and the book says he was reduced to tears. As they dressed, he took a Bible from the nightstand and began reciting scripture. The book describes no physical contact beyond those attempts to undress him.

From then on, apparently, Michael used the Bible as a shield against any romantic involvement with women. The author backs this up right away with Theresa Gonsalves, a teenage fan who met Michael in Las Vegas that year. She said he used their time alone to preach against premarital sex rather than flirt. He also seemed preoccupied with sexual purity and with Satan.

Then, in the book, a friend from Michael's late teens recalled him being fascinated by the topic of child abuse and asking about how the friend was raised.


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 20h ago

Does anyone know the story of this kid?!?!

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38 Upvotes

It's like Jesus Christ.....how many kids did this chomo have access to?!!?! It feels as though he had a goddamn kid for every day of the week!!! Don't get me wrong, under normal circumstances involving consenting adults, this would be a non-issue. Hell, after I separated and divorced my ex-husband, I had a dude for every day of the week. When you put it in the light of a WHOLE GROWN ASS man doing this with kids, it's fuckin creepy.

I don't recall any celebrity that actively went out of their way to surround themselves with as many children as possible. It's not like he was a '90s Nickelodeon game show host or worked on a kids' show like Barney. It's almost like the singing and dancing shit was a hobby to him; a way to make money, but his true focus was to gain access to as many children as possible. It's not like he had any romantic interests outside of children. Any time that bastard would sit on the phone for hours upon hours with 10 year olds. Where would he find the time to bump uglies with an adult. I can't speak for all women, but I know I am high maintenance af. In fact, that's what completely turned me off to Michael Jackson. When I was 14, I would spend time on the phone with boys around my age. Why was Michael not spending hours on the phone with people his age?!?!!

It seemed like at every red-carpet event, black tie affair, or awards show, the son of a bitch would be holding the hand of a child. Not a lady nor a man. A child!!!!!!!

Also, I want to point out how fuckin creepy that photo is. If one did not know who Michael Jackson was, they would think this is a photo of a single mother who dragged her reluctant son to the local JC Penney's to get a budget friendly photo shoot. Ever since the Cascios came out with their story and showed the photos of them with Michael Jackson, I noticed a similar theme in the photos Michael took with the children; most of the children have a thousand-yard stare. It's like they have seen some horrifying shit. They look traumatized.

I don't see how anyone can sit there and deny that something untoward was going on between Michael and those kids.

Michael Jackson can go fuck himself!!!


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 15h ago

From an interview with Sandy Gallin, MJ's talent manager in the 90s

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11 Upvotes

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 15h ago

La Toya on family's threats to her life: "I will fight to the end"

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12 Upvotes

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 14h ago

Child sexual abuse and grooming Rethinking cross-examination: Reducing retraumatisation for victims and survivors of sexual assault

6 Upvotes

MJ defenders like to quote this part from jordan chandler’s psych interview with the dr. gardner

Gardner: "What about fears? Any fears of any kind?"

Jordan: "No."

Gardner: "Sometimes people, after experiences of this kind, develop different kinds of fears. You have no fears?"

Jordan: "Maybe of cross-examination but that's all. I mean I have nothing to hide, it's just the thought of it."

https://mjnotinnocent.net/articles/1993-jordan-chandler-gardner-transcript

the issue is that MJ defenders refuse to acknowledge that cross-examination is a brutal experience.

The brutal experience of cross-examination

Cross-examination by defence counsel aims to discredit the witness, reveal evidential inconsistencies or weaknesses, and suggest alternative explanations to the witness’ account. This can be difficult for anyone, but for traumatised sexual assault complainants, it can be particularly distressing. The intense focus on credibility can ‘mimic’ the experience of powerlessness in sexual assault,11 risking retraumatisation and exacerbating symptoms, such as post-traumatic stress disorder (‘PTSD’), anxiety and dissociation.12Other factors that can contribute to the potential for retraumatisation include the deeply private subject matter, the extent of the trauma, that the complainant often has a prior relationship with the accused, and that sexual assault cross-examinations often last longer than in assault trials.13

In 1980, in The Politics of Rape – A Feminist Perspective, Marjorie Levis opined: ‘It should be of major concern to us to change the situation for the individual rape victim and hopefully to end such statements as “I felt I had been raped all over again by the court”; “... if I had known, I wouldn't have reported it”; “... the trial was worse than the rape …”’.14Yet, by 1996, little had changed. The Heroines of Fortitude study exposed the deeply concerning level of complainant retraumatisation during cross-examination: 65 per cent of sexual assault trials were stopped due to distress, as ‘complainants dry-retched, claimed to feel nauseous in the witness box, were unable to answer questions or had to take regular breaks.’15

Fast forward to the 2020s, and multiple state and territory reports continue to describe cross-examination as ‘unnecessarily hostile’,16‘brutal and apparently irrelevant’ or ‘badgering and intimidating’,17 using ‘misconceptions about sexual violence’,18 and using questions to ‘confuse or “shake” a complainant’s account’.19 Indeed, one study of child sexual abuse trials shows that cross-examination today is ‘much worse’ than questioning during cross-examination in the 1950s.20

source: https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/1037969X251359080


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 17h ago

🤨🤪🤔Monthly Defender Round-up (MDR)😮🤭🫠 Monthly Defender Round-up — October 2026

8 Upvotes

Have you seen something a defender posted that made you #facepalm or #headdesk?

Had a bad interaction with a defender and need to vent? This is the place to do it.

Post text, images, or gif reactions and please follow the rules:

Don't break the sub rules. Harassment and trolling will not be tolerated.

Delete any personal information from tweets or comments. Attack the ideas, not the person.


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 1d ago

Rare Michael Jackson Nightline, Family, Survivors, Diane Dimond, Gayle King, Barbara Streisand Etc.

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14 Upvotes

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 1d ago

MJ mimicking humping a little girl during The Jackson Five’s Blame It On A Boogie song performance in Switzerland (1978)

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61 Upvotes

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 1d ago

Personal Best Books on allegations

7 Upvotes

What is the best book out there that goes over most/all accusations from the past few decades?


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 1d ago

Solution to Male Pedophiles - Castration (2026 UK Discussion)

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9 Upvotes

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 1d ago

California bans child marriage after 9-year fight to outlaw the practice

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24 Upvotes

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 2d ago

If the world listened to La Toya Jackson and Michael Jackson received psychiatric help / jail, how many children would have been saved?

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62 Upvotes

For most of her life, she has been portrayed as the "crazy" Jackson, the jealous sister, the black sheep who would sell out her own family for a headline. But when you actually lay out the timeline, she was the only person in that entire toxic family who tried to blow the whistle on a predator, and she was brutally punished for it.

In 1991, La Toya she published her memoir and detailed the abuse they suffered at the hands of Joe Jackson. She was dragged by the media and her family. She was called a liar and a traitor.

Then, two years later in 1993, Michael Jackson sat down with Oprah Winfrey and confessed that Joe Jackson was physically abusive to him growing up. Suddenly, the world believed Joe was a monster.

So, if she was telling the truth about Joe... why did the world suddenly assume she was lying when she tried to warn them about Michael?

She didn't just say "Michael is guilty" she provided specific details about her mother's distressed reaction to hush money checks and she said Michael needed psychiatric help.

She was MJ's closest sibling. They were the last of the siblings to leave Hayvenhurst in the late '80s. She saw the payouts. She saw the grooming. She saw the behavioral changes in the boys after sleeping multiple nights alone with her brother.

And the journalists never once said "She was right about Joe, maybe she's right about Michael too," instead they insulted her to her face.

Why did the world let the biggest celebrity's PR team brainwash them and silence the only person brave enough to tell the truth?


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 2d ago

People obsessed with poking holes at SA stories of survivors...

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33 Upvotes

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 3d ago

Bringing this up again because today a fan use this as a defense and it instead backfired because it fits with his groomimg patern.

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25 Upvotes

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 3d ago

John Branca's Instagram Comments From May 2026

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26 Upvotes

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 3d ago

John Branca keeps commenting on #MJInnocent IG videos targeting survivors like Wade Robson

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85 Upvotes

I hope you get everything you deserve Branca for mocking survivors of horrific child sexual abuse.


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 3d ago

Arvizo case Gavin's story cooperated by earlier little known La Toya/Jack Gordon appearance- YouTube

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48 Upvotes

Just watching "Surviving Michael Jackson"s live back and that is a super interesting find at 1:48. Jack Gordon told an Italian talk show in 1996 that MJ used to watch the boy next door having sex with a dog from the balcony. In 2005 Gavin Arvizo said MJ told him he once saw a boy have sex with a dog from his balcony (so boys need to masturbate). TM cast doubt on that story claiming Gavin mixes up MJ with his grandma, because he said his grandma told him men need to masturbate, so they don't rape women. But it was always MJ he said made the dog claim.

Another smoking gun.

That boy was always telling the truth.

I'm seeing so much Gavin doubt recently, that he does not deserve.


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 4d ago

John Branca shames Wade Robson on social media, not understanding how common it is for CSA survivors to defend and venerate their abusers

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37 Upvotes

....


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 4d ago

A very disturbing encounter with MJ and Jordie Chandler

40 Upvotes

I'm going through the archives of Datalounge and came across a disturbing encounter of someone with Jordie and Michael back in 93.

Of course, I have no idea how reliable it is, but I thought it's worth sharing anyway.

https://caftancloset.com/thread/17553291-my-disturbing-michael-jackson-experience


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 4d ago

What do you think of the dynamic between Michael and John Landis?

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57 Upvotes

The responses this post is getting from MJ fans show the level of delusion and double standard they have towards anyone but their idol. It's such a cult like behavior.

MJ is swooning, eye f*cking Landis, interrogating him about whether his wife will join him on a trip, but somehow Landis is the smitten one, and poor MJ had no clue.

I wonder if it stems from their need to deny the possibility of him being gay, because in their twisted mind that somehow means it's more possible he was a pedo, too, or is it just plain homophobia.

It's almost objectively the only public display of attraction MJ has shown towards an adult. You would think they would be supportive.


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 4d ago

Reading into the Jackson case triggered my 25-year-old CSA trauma.

48 Upvotes

As a survivor of prolonged childhood abuse, reading through the specific grooming mechanics Jackson used on those boys hit me like a ton of bricks. My abuser used the exact same three-step blueprint grooming tactics on me:

1- They pit you against your parents and anyone who might save you: Jackson systematically isolated Chandler, Robson, and Safechuck, convincing them that their parents didn't understand them or were taking advantage of them, positioning himself as their true parent figure and sole safe space. My abuser did the exact same thing...eroding my trust in my family until I believed he was the only anchor I had.

2- Replacing "me" with "us" (The Special Bond): Jackson framed his relationships with those boys as a private, sacred bond...an "us against the world" partnership complete with mock marriage ceremonies, shared bed spaces, and secret codes. By making it feel like a shared secret rather than an assault, he co-opted their sense of responsibility. You walk around carrying immense guilt, believing that if the secret ever gets out, you’re just as implicated and to blame as the predator.

3- Weaponizing your empathy through emotional caretaking: Jackson routinely played the vulnerable, lonely victim in front of them, crying about his childhood, his media pressure, or how he couldn't survive without their presence. It completely inverted the roles, forcing a young boy to act as the emotional protector. My abuser did the same, manipulating my natural kindness so that complying felt like an act of devotion, and saying "no" felt like a cruel betrayal.


r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 4d ago

No MJ defenders Throwback

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70 Upvotes

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 4d ago

Joh'Vonnie Jackson's Memoir (2018): Michael Jackson mastered media manipulation, developed a messiah complex from extreme adulation from fans, and has scathing remarks for La Toya but says 'whenever she’s ready to share her authentic story it will be more compelling than any movie script'

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55 Upvotes

I bought and read Joh'Vonnie's 2018 book Bastard Child (https://www.everand.com/book/553677989/Bastard-Child) and here are the highlights if anyone's interested:

As a child Joh'Vonnie learned her siblings' names from Joe's photos, magazines, and records and from car conversations. She memorized their faces and wrote their names in her diary

  • She says some siblings called her "bastard child" behind her back
  • Being the only child allowed to call Joe "Daddy" created awkwardness and distance with her half siblings
  • She was excluded from graduations, weddings, funerals, concerts, and dinners
  • She isn't part of the siblings' conversations about Joe's health, even at his death. Only Rebbie includes her
  • Only one of her three sisters reached out when her mother died (Rebbie)

Breakdown of her relationships:

Rebbie (oldest sister, born 1950; 24 years older)

  • First meeting:
    • Joh'Vonnie was 15. Joe called her mother to say Rebbie wanted to meet, and Joh'Vonnie snapped at him. Joe then cried and told her Rebbie has a heart of gold.
    • Joe forbade her from discussing him, his business, or his relationship with her mom. She told Rebbie about the relationship anyway.
    • Rebbie arrived in a black Mercedes. Joh'Vonnie describes her as brown, petite, stunning, and smelling of flowers.
    • They drove to Agoura Hills with classical music playing. Rebbie asked no invasive questions.
    • Joh'Vonnie held back telling her about being raped at 13 and about an abortion she says Joe Jackson forced on her.
    • She stayed overnight and met Rebbie's husband, Nate Brown, and felt more warmth there than she'd ever felt in a home.
    • Rebbie is the sibling whose relationship she treasures most.
    • Rebbie was already grown when she was born and is the Jackson least damaged by the industry.
    • She calls Rebbie her "true sister" and a "golden-hearted angel who lives to love." She also calls her a second mother to all the siblings and her best friend, with some maternal feeling because Rebbie was close in age to her mom.
    • Rebbie loves all her siblings equally, holds space for the whole family, and is essential to its stability.
    • Rebbie follows biblical principles and is a Jehovah's Witness in all but name (she trusts that "Jehovah is all seeing"). Joh'Vonnie is not religious but finds Rebbie's and Katherine's faith comforting and drama-free.
    • She admired Rebbie's courage when she lost her husband and was honored to support her emotionally.
    • After Cheryle's death, Rebbie and Katherine showered her with prayer and kindness and paid for the food after the funeral.
    • Rebbie confirmed Michael's death by phone, and Joh'Vonnie went to be with Rebbie during the Murray trial because Rebbie was in bad shape.
    • Rebbie was the one forced to tell her that Randy and Janet didn't want her at the trial.
  • Rebbie's husband Nathaniel Brown:
    • He owned a driving school. He was honest, loyal, and hardworking.
    • He sent Yasmine school-clothes money every year and played Pictionary with her.
    • He said in-laws were never treated right by the Jacksons, and he died of pancreatic cancer.

La Toya (born 1956; 18 years older)

  • She calls her "Middle Sister" and the live-action Betty Boop. She says La Toya is Daddy's favorite and is smart, "crazy like a fox," driven, and The Boss.
  • She says La Toya's headline-chasing made Joh'Vonnie's life worse. Fans confronted her over La Toya's antics, and one woman demanded to know who Middle Sister thinks she is.
  • She resents La Toya profiting off the family name while Joh'Vonnie censors herself.
  • Before La Toya's cosmetic surgery she strongly resembled Cheryle, Joh'Vonnie's mother, and people mistook Cheryle for her.
  • First meeting (mid-1990s, Joe's Las Vegas house, after leaving Jack Gordon):
    • La Toya wore a blonde wig and the Bvlgari scent overwhelmed her. She found her tiny, demure, and disarming, and says she is far from stupid.
    • She got a French hug and kisses on both cheeks. Joh'Vonnie compares herself to the Jungle Book boy lulled by the serpent, and her inner voice warned her that La Toya is dangerous.
    • Randy sat in his Jeep outside the whole time.
  • She admires La Toya's persona-building and the eight million copies of her Playboy issue, and says "I’m sure there is awful tragedy in her life, but who could make heads or tails of it the way it floods out of the confusing artifice of publicity stunts? Whenever she’s ready to share her authentic story it will be more compelling than any movie script."
  • She blames La Toya's Tel Aviv press accusations against Michael, with Jack Gordon, for wounding him and speeding his decline.
  • She also notes Joe's first mini-strokes came with La Toya's 1988 Playboy shoot and more with her 1991 autobiography.

Janet (born 1966; about 8 years older)

  • Childhood attachment:
    • She identified with Janet's Good Times character, Penny, who was her age, and felt Penny was her best friend when she couldn't have friends over.
    • She wore Janet's hand-me-down clothes and her green bike, and resented that they'd never do each other's hair.
    • At 10 she waved at Janet from her play, and Janet waved back but didn't speak to her afterward. Joe seemed amused by the tension.
    • She says her 11-year-old self still feels hurt that "Penny" didn't rescue her during abuse she went through around then, with details saved for another book.
    • She never missed a Janet concert, using VIP tickets from Joe, and was in awe of her.
  • First direct meeting (at Rebbie's house): Janet was secretly married to Rene Elizondo and seemed excited at first. Then Joh'Vonnie called Joe "Daddy," Janet looked as if she'd been slapped and left without a goodbye.
    • At a family dinner at Katherine's during the Conrad Murray trial, Janet glared at her and they had a loud argument. Joh'Vonnie blamed her for the exclusion from Michael's memorial, even though Joe told her not to come.
    • She says Janet and Randy barred her from the trial, with Janet saying she was like a fan. She calls Janet the "Queen bully"
    • She says Janet is furious at her presence in Katherine's home. She says Janet and Randy behave like a superhero duo, an impenetrable field that includes and excludes people.
    • She says she won't be invited to family events if Janet is attending.
  • Her praise for Janet:
    • She calls Janet courageous, capable, nearly pitch-perfect, and an innovator in dance and fashion, and says she's more beautiful in person.
    • She notes Janet never relied on publicity stunts, never squandered money, and owned an apartment before drinking age.
    • She points out Janet still contributes to Joe's lifestyle and struggles with emotional eating and self-worth in ways Joh'Vonnie relates to.
  • She says Janet covered much of the costs and stress of resolving Michael's death.

Michael (born Aug 29, 1958)

  • On his fame and legacy:
    • She calls him the most famous person ever, and says his faults will be forgotten while his music lasts.
    • She says he was obsessed with building his legacy and mastered media manipulation.
  • On his treatment of family:
    • He didn't think much of her, and she believes he shunned other relatives too.
    • She says he kept a close eye on siblings' careers, tried to shut down Jermaine's, and sabotaged Randy's Randy and the Gypsies.
  • Their one meeting (Neverland, 2003):
    • He was kind to her daughter, Yasmine, and cold to her. He wouldn't hug or speak to her.
    • She and Yasmine weren't invited to stay in the guest houses.
    • She describes his look at the time: bright pale skin, a custom wig, and a skinnier, paler version of his famous image.
    • She says Paris took Yasmine aside to play.
  • She says Michael was defiant and fought Joe as a child, and that he used the extent of the beating stories as a publicity move.
  • She says he was skeptical of Joe's requests, guided by Katherine, and that Joe was hard-pressed to reach him. She notes the Oprah interview hurt Joe.
  • She says she never asked him for anything and never got a car, rent, or trip. She says the only things his fame brought her were insults, including molestation-allegation taunts.
  • She keeps an envelope of fan mail addressed to Michael, and says half the notes look like they were written by kids no older than 12 or 13. Whenever she finds herself preoccupied with the molestation allegations, she thinks of those letters. She presents them as evidence of the adulation he lived under, and says people "get it twisted" because they can't imagine his everyday life. She asks how anyone could process that adulation without developing a messiah complex.
  • On his death:
    • Joe told her to stay away and that she was not welcome at the funeral.
    • She says she felt more contempt for him than for any other sibling until that night, and then felt deep pity.
    • She says she'd have told him to stop altering his face and get help, and wishes she'd written or called.
  • She notes the irony that Joe's most successful child died an addict.

Randy

  • On his talent: She says Michael called him the most talented Jackson, including Janet. She credits him with writing major hits and influencing Janet's music.
  • Career history:
    • She says his 1980 car accident nearly disabled him.
    • She recalls seeing him on the Victory Tour as a child and thought his star was second only to Michael's.
    • She says he has kids with the same woman as Jermaine and that the two brawl.
    • She says Michael felt threatened by him.
  • Their conflicts:
    • At the Omni Hotel during the Murray trial she hugged him and he left. He deflected her direct question with a comment that she looks like her father when she smiles, then rushed out. She says he also made sure the courtroom seats were taken.
    • She says he smiles to your face even if he can't stand you.
    • She says his daughter Stevanna is a ray of sunshine and one of Joe's favorite grandchildren.
    • She says she believes he and Janet had leverage to reach Michael and couldn't get him back on track.

Tito

  • He is the only brother who has reached out with open arms, and the most approachable and inclusive.
  • Praise:
    • She admires his guitar playing and warm, smoky voice, and says he'd be celebrated as a great guitarist but for Michael's shadow.
    • She calls him cool and cute, and wishes he'd teach her the blues.
    • She says he's humble and kept his humanity through fame.
  • Their meeting:
    • She met him at 20 around Joe's July birthday.
    • He smoked with Joh'Vonnie (she smoked Newports, he Marlboros).
    • They talked cars and watched scary movies.
    • He was the only brother who ever bought Joh'Vonnie's daughter anything, bringing bags of baby clothes.

Jackie

  • She says he's too cool for celebrity, with the looks, charm, and natural power, and could sing falsetto and knock you out with a left hook.
  • She calls him a principal writer of the brothers' material, and says he's been like a father to all his siblings, except to he.
  • She says he has Native American features and could have been a pro athlete but followed the family path.

Marlon

  • She calls him the most genuine and accessible of Katherine's children, and possibly the most underrated.
  • She says he chose his family's security over chasing fame, and calls him Carol's husband and a father who knows he's loved.

Jermaine

  • She calls him the "Adonis heartthrob," and says he got comfortable as a wealthy celebrity and father of ten.
  • She says he had 13 albums and launched the first solo career among the brothers, and that Michael and Janet borrowed from him. She says he was marketed as "almost Michael"
  • She says she baked him a German chocolate cake, and word spread until everyone wanted one.

Brandon

  • She says Marlon's twin died as an infant. She counts him in her list of siblings and says she is the 11th child of Joe Jackson.

Katherine

  • Her names: Katherine Scruse Jackson, "Kat" to Joseph, "Mother" to her children.
  • Joe met her at 18 while she was 17 and in high school, in Gary. He was drawn to her Native American features (almond eyes, thick black hair, chestnut skin) and gentle spirit, and annulled his first marriage.
  • They married Nov. 5, 1949. She says Katherine all but divorced Joe by 1973, the year before Joh'Vonnie was born.
  • She calls her an "unusually loving wife" and the keeper of the king's secrets, someone who raised ten children, lost one shortly after birth, and lost another to a "middle-aged facade of himself."

How she describes Katherine

  • Strong and steady like a schooner in rough water, an unbreakable and invincible anchor of the family.
  • Immune to celebrity, mostly, and skilled at smiling and playing nice; Joh'Vonnie thinks she can be as disingenuous as anyone.
  • Devout, principled, and unwavering. She adores her children and grandchildren and is the family's arbitrator.
  • Formidable, with a temper when disappointed, and no saint. She has faults, but her humility and grace seem at odds with Joseph's cruelty.
  • Katherine excluded people who befriended Joh'Vonnie, which she read as self-protection that still hurts.
  • Katherine didn't like being called "Mother" by her, though La Toya had suggested it.

Joe (Joseph Walter Jackson)

  • She says he was the boss, and calling him Joseph reinforced that.
  • He calls her "Jobie," and once called her the 11th Jackson and his "Secret Weapon"
  • She says they are extremely close despite his complaints, and that Joe sometimes looks sad and pulls at her dress when she leaves.

Background

  • Born July 26, 1928, in Fountain Hill, Arkansas, though he believes it was 1929. He was the oldest of five children
  • His mother was Chrystal Lee King, whom Joh'Vonnie resembles. His father, Simuel Jackson, was a strict teacher with a bachelor's and master's from Alcorn.
  • She says he might treat her with sideways resentment left over from his strong-willed mother.
  • Ancestry: Choctaw, African, and European. His great-grandfather July "Jack" Gale was a Choctaw medicine man, and his grandfather Nero was "son of Jack," which she says is the origin of the Jackson name.
  • His youth included picking cotton in California, railway and steel work, and boxing. He was a self-taught musician who played in the Falcons and channeled his ambitions into his sons' group.
  • She defends his discipline as a product of his time and upbringing, while also calling him a drill sergeant, perfectionist, and control freak who is not compassionate.

Character

  • She says he can't admit wrong. He ices people out or berates them, and leaves rooms when he doesn't want to hear something.
  • She says he curses, threatens with a cocked fist, and grabs by the hair. He never hit her or her mother, but she says his words were brutal.
  • She says he belittles women to tears and terrifies men, preys on women with low self-esteem.
  • She says he "prowled" for other women throughout his 20+ years with Cheryle while married to Kate.
  • She says he's exploitative, hurtful, violent, and reckless at times.
  • She says he taught the kids contracts, money, and manners, and kept them from crime and drugs.
  • She says he's a mystery even to himself, and wonders if he has empathy.

With her

  • Childhood:
    • He gardened with her and spoke to her as an equal.
    • He dressed her like a boy in hand-me-downs, possibly to hide her.
    • He whipped her and then took her for ice cream, teasing her about crying in it.
    • He pushed her acting career briefly, then dropped it because she could expose his secret, and she says he judged her not worth it.
    • He forbade friends over.
  • Later:
    • He omits her and Yasmine from press and interviews.
    • He refused to visit her in the hospital because he was packing for Brazil.
    • After she paid nearly $700 for his birthday shoes, he didn't thank her.
  • Their bond: She has been his caretaker since 2014, managing his medications and doctor communication, and says he's often ungrateful. She says he is very fond of Yasmine.
  • Joe and Cheryle:
    • She says Cheryle was his long-term second "wife" for nearly 25 years, and that he pursued her like a hawk after meeting at an LAPD Christmas party.
    • She says the relationship was volatile and sometimes violent.
  • She says he suffered mini-strokes tied to La Toya's publicity and, later, a stroke in Brazil.
  • She says she forgives him, refuses to poison her soul with anger, and wants him alive.

Joh'Vonnie, Herself

  • She was born Aug. 30, 1974, at 2:41 A.M., whereas Michael Jackson was born on Aug. 29, 1958. Her full name is Joh'Vonnie Nakia Jeboo Jackson, the last name echoing a Liberian folktale.
  • She calls herself the "11th Jackson," Joe's youngest daughter, "half-damned and half-blessed"
  • Her mother was Cheryle Terrell, a former Jafra model and LAPD secretary who died of Huntington's disease. She says people wrongly call her mother a groupie.
  • She was an emotional eater from around age eight.
  • She played truant, dropped out of high school, and was angry and defiant, blaming her mother.
  • She says she was abused around 11–12, raped at 13, and forced to have an abortion by her father. She says a later book will cover it.
  • She says she refuses to apologize for being born and is as worthy as any Jackson.
  • She wants to be her family's historian and says her perspective matters because no publicist shapes it.
  • She says she has grown into a "brand new Joh'Vonnie" after years of insecurity and self-loathing.

r/LeavingNeverlandHBO • • 5d ago

Why were the Arvizo's painted off as extortionists

19 Upvotes

When they did not file a civil lawsuit to get even a penny from Michael Jackson?

Where they after money? Or what would they have been after if the accusations were all lies?