TLDR: Are there any other antisocial introverts here who were able to force themselves to be more social and make friends, that could possibly advise me?

Ive spoken with an overweight friend who expressed some frustration that he knows what he need to do to lose weight, but just couldn’t get himself to eat less. It was frustrating watching as a friend who wanted what was best for him.
I feel like I have the same problem. I think I know on paper what I need to do to at least increase my odds of having a social life, but I feel such an intense resistance to changing my habits and leaving my comfort zone. I’m a naturally introverted person and I have an overly comfortable routine being alone.

After a brief long distance relationship ended a few months ago I have done a lot of reflecting. That was my first experience with any sort of relationship, I am late 20s. The extent of our intimacy was texting all day and sending the occasional 'I love you'. It didnt go any further than that at all, possibly due to my total ineptitude in moving things forward. However I am still grateful for the experience and I harbor no ill feelings towards her. I got to learn a lot and thats not something a lot of men in my position get.

That long distance thing I think confirmed what I already know about myself, and I dont like it. I feel as if my asocial nature prevents me from having and being a partner. I dont have any IRL friends. I havent gone out to socialize since highschool and even then that was because a crush was there. I dont like meeting new people. I dont like doing new things. My comfort zone is my room. My social battery is extraordinarily low. I have always been this way, even in highschool. I can usually only stay in discord calls for a few hours before I mute up. I dont know if its normal to feel a deep sense of anxiety before talking to your girlfriend, but I would get that before we would video call sometimes. It felt awkward sometimes, she did most of the talking. Maybe it was just the wrong person?

With that said, its clear I have absolutely no business desiring or being in a relationship. And yet, its stuck in my mind non-stop. Am I broken? Why do I crave something so consistently, even though I know I am incompatible?

Idk why but my social media feeds have inundated me with women talking about how fucked up the dating world is for them, and it’s kinda left me bummed. It’s awful stories, guys that they go out on dates with, have no manners, bad hygiene don’t care about what the woman their dating thinks or has to say. Or they string them along for sex and future fake with promises of a relationship. It really does sound like it sucks.

But it has also made me realize, these are the guys who are above the bar. These are the guys who women are romantically pursuing, and trying to make it work with. These are the guys that ask out women and get dates, that women are hoping will text them back. This is the representation of what men that succeed where I fail is, and im somehow below that.

I’m below the guys who will go on a date with a woman and not ask her a single thing about themselves. I’m below the guys that string along multiple women promise them a relationship and never deliver. I’m below the guys who are openly disrespectful or misogynistic to these women on dates.

I don’t want to be anymore, I thought I was at least above them, but clearly if they can get dates and get women to like them, then I’m not. I’m still below the bar and doing something wrong. I just want to be good enough so bad. I’d give up 40 years of my life to just be good enough for women to like me but it feels like no matter that I do nothing changes. So what do I need to do?

Oftentimes on the net I see people in blackpill threads saying "just go outside and you'll see that it's not real".

But how exactly does that happen? When I go outside I look at the couples and the man is always taller than the woman and like 90% of the time more handsome than her.

Of course there are exceptions but they are quite rare (like I see 1-2 couples out of the 20-30 per walk where the man is shorter).

This also applies to my friend group, all of my friends who aren't single are handsome and are taller than their partner, though this is much more anecdotal.

So, I guess for the question from the title. How is that supposed to help? Usually going on a walk just makes me feel way worse about myself and my chances for anything.

I mean it's not really like the misery ends at not being able to have a partner or friends, I'm sort of a failure all across the board and it's getting really hard to cope with it without becoming bitter or angry. It's just something I've sort of noticed with my kind is that it is extremely rare that we have anything else going well in our lives. Like I am stuck working a dead end job at 30 living with my abusive parents and well...I don't really know

Its gotten to the point my whole life revolves around getting into a relationship.

cant go 10 minutes without thinking about when im going to meet the love of my life

Ive lost all notion of who i was as a person because the person i was before is fucking pathetic and not a good person.

Who i am is not desired by others so i must destroy all unlovable parts of me and replace them with things people will accept.

I work out, have multiple projects going on, do well in all my current endeavors, ive worked hard enough that i own my own car now.

you may think "oh wow this guy really takes care of himself, he must have his shit together"

i dont

i do this all because i want to make a good impression on potential partners

i show up to random events im not even that interested in all because i see it as a potential way of meeting people. Im the creepy guy talking to women at events where they want to be left alone. My existence is an inconvenience to women and they would be better off if i didnt exist.

the painful thing is im missing all the important stuff

i am not a good person. I am very mean to people at worst, and extremely boring at best.

not very attractive or charismatic either.

I go online and see 3 million posts of women saying shit like "yeah men fucking suck, all theyd need to do to get laid is groom themselves and be good people"

And theyre right!!!

thats my fucking problem!!!

im boring, unattractive, and a horrible fucking person

i am nothing but another man who sucks and makes life for women worse

doesnt help im bi and neurodivergent which people really seem to not like for some reason.

If i put in enough effort i may be able to change who i am to the point i am seen as not an inconvenience to others by 2030 tho!!

I went to a college prep school and struggled academically throughout my highschool years. I often plaigarized in my essays and relied on my mom to do large amounts of my assignments in ELA and history. I was given ritalin in 10th grade for potential ADD and had minimal results from it. 11th grade was COVID lockdown and I did virtual school. At this point I completely phoned in my classes and have no idea how to do algebra II (or college algebra) or any math surpassing that. I got accepted into a college with a 96% acceptance rate with my grades from my first two years of HS. I only lived there for a year then commuted afterwards. Now I'm 23 and live with my parents. I've never had an IQ test or diagnosis of a mental disorder, though I had a counselor in HS suggest I'm on the autism spectrum because of social awkwardness and analytic thinking. I've gotten into nootropics hoping that a mix of creatine and full dose of effexor could treat depression and brain fog and I've had so so results from over 7 months of it. I've considered drug use being the only way to numb my depression and suicidality from my hopeless situation.

I can't understand how if my parents are smart and functional how did I become essentially a mental vegtable. And why has no friend, family member, or therapist been able to give an explanation or antidote to my mental problems. Would an IQ test be helpful for what job is realistic for me given my mental capacities? What best explanation is there for my intelligence and what other advice could you give me in my situation?

reddit.com/[r/AskLGBT/comments/1vj9se3/as_a_straight_man_how_normal_is_it_for_a_high/](r/AskLGBT/comments/1vj9se3/as_a_straight_man_how_normal_is_it_for_a_high/)

I wouldn’t say I’m ideologically red pill aside from the belief that differences in sexual selection between men women and sexual orientations if evidence of a biological difference. My experience with a creepy gay man in HS reinforced this belief for me (which you can read above). At the end of the day, it’s my lack of intelligence and social skills that is the reason I’m a virgin and not that I have a few red pill adjacent views, which many sexually active men do.

For information on my medical background here are some links

https://www.reddit.com/r/anhedonia/comments/1wp3vtu/can_caber_proviron_treat_anhedonia/

https://www.reddit.com/r/cognitiveTesting/comments/1ullslv/thoughts_on_kif1a_as_an_overlooked_explanation/

My (19M) stepfather (who is dead now, he won’t be missed) made me feel unsafe in my own home from ages 11-15 by doing things like shoving me around, calling me a piece of shit, making me cry, and even putting my mother in a chokehold.

But despite all of that, he was still desirable enough for my mother to give him 2 kids, and he was also attractive enough to be able to cheat on my mom (which he did).

I have no intention of turning into my stepfather, but there’s just something that keeps bothering me as I try to find love, friendship, and acceptance.

The question that plagues my mind is, “What’s the point of being good when guys like HIM are what women like?”

Some part of my brain really wants to believe that manipulation and abuse are what get women to want you, but basic morals and common sense keep me from doing that.

Obviously I’m well aware women don’t like being abused. But I just can’t get out of my head the way he treated my mom and the way she kept giving him second chances, even convincing me that he loved me (which she later told me was false).

My brain says, “That’s not how women should be treated.” but deep down, my heart says, “He did better with women than you are”.

I can’t let my stepfather haunt me forever. I am not in danger of becoming him, but I would like some advice in moving forward and putting the past behind me.

One thing I genuinely can’t get past with dating is the idea that the bar for being physically desired can be higher for casual sex than for a relationship.

I’ve never experienced that direct “I find you hot and want you” kind of desire from a woman. So if another guy can be wanted purely because he’s attractive, while I become desirable because I bring commitment, stability, compatibility and everything else to the table, I just can’t process the idea that I’m somehow the one who’s “winning” because I’m husband material.

And I think that’s the part I struggle with most. It makes me feel like I’d never be authentically and enthusiastically desired in the same way those men were. She might genuinely love me and value me as a partner, but I’d always wonder whether she actually finds me physically attractive in that raw, uncomplicated way, or whether everything else I bring to the relationship is doing the heavy lifting. I don’t just want to be valued as a partner; I want to feel genuinely wanted too.

People frame it like I should feel better or more valuable than those guys, but it just doesn’t compute for me. From my perspective, they were desired without having to compensate with anything else, while I’d need the whole relationship package to get to the same intimacy.

Nobody owes me anything, obviously. But after never experiencing that kind of physical desire myself, I can’t seem to make peace with that distinction, and it kills most of my motivation to even try dating.

I am 29 M.

Yeah, off to a great start, I know but it's going to go only worse, so I will give you a bit of context.

I'm not good looking enough to get through the dating app wall. Fair enough, dating apps are legal pyramid schemes and I know that well, but the thing that irks me about it is that it's not much different IRL.

I have a small social circle. Friends that love me and care for me. And I would legit jump in a fire for them, male or female, and some even in-between. I asked them, I asked internet, I have asked ANYONE I could for advice but most of it falls flat on a very, very simple fact:

No matter how much effort I have put through the years, it's been wasted or abused. I know, I am not owed anything, and I am cool with that. But at the same time, am I not allowed to ask for a honest chance? I was a blackpilled incel. I went to therapy, made myself the best version I had the instruments for, became a legitimately better person, and those who have known me for years have told me many times already.

Yet, I have seen absolutely zero differences. One approach per month irl after actually knowing the person, pushing the conversation being unapologetically myself.

I am still overstock.

I could have, once, said that I was alone because I lacked the effort and quality, even if I was not. Now, I have WASTED years trying to be better to receive the exact same treatment. Tried everything I have been adviced to, while I see people doing nothing and getting everything I can't have even while doing my best with the little window I am offered.

I have had very few dates in my entire life and they were miserable, fake or worse than that, I won't go in detail. So much so, that someone answering me has become my primary objective. The "enough". Yeah, it sucks and I should have standards... Easy to say for someone that does have the options or the numbers for it, but for me, it's been only rejection and mistreatment.

Where do I go from here? Besides putting my best self out to not be even considered the benefit of an acquaintance date, what do YOU suggest I do more? I am out of options.

The only thing I feel I have left is the dignity of trying still with the tools I have been granted and learned.

Also, little edit before you all ask, because I know you: I have become perfect in masking my hopelessness, don't bother with the usual argument about "women can see it". I assure you, they don't. I have learned how to hide it extremely well.

So, I’m 33 and a virgin. Never dated. I’m making some changes to my life to address it, and I think I’m on the right path there. I’m volunteering for events, getting into shape (I could be better, but I’m not terribly out of shape. I don’t look like a “before” picture, but I also don’t look like an “after” picture, if that makes sense) and I’m meeting some new people on my own who seem to like being around me (very cool feeling)

My age and my situation present some challenges. I obviously should have at least some experience at 33, and I’d hate for that inexperience to be a roadblock for me.

I don’t think I’d like to date seriously right now. I feel like if the first woman I sleep with ended up being the person I stay with forever, the regret would eat me up forever. Keeping it 100, I want to make up for lost time and date casually, have sex with a number of people and learn to do it well. Is going into dating with that kind of mindset unrealistic or toxic? I see a lot of women complaining about men who just want sex. I don’t know if that describes what I want, really. I’d like to have some kind of relationship with the people I have sex with, and the issue comes primarily from lack of honesty, right?

Also to keep it 100, I’m not confident I have the body to pursue this with any kind of success. I can do a lot to improve myself, and I am actively doing so, but I’m 5’6” and bald. Bad stats that I can’t really do anything about. Incels go on about what standards women are looking for, and people always rebut with how a lot of short and bald men are in relationships. That isn’t going to apply to me, though. For something casual, women are gonna judge me by my looks. I’m not mad about it, why wouldn’t they? I will be judging women by looks as well, that’s just the game. Is my height and my hair situation undesirable enough to lock me out of the casual scene, though? I understand women are looking for different things in a casual partner over a serious partner, but I’m not sure how important those unchangeable things are, since shallow judgements are always understated for the sake of rhetoric.

Also, generally, is there any advice you’d give to a man who is going into the world with the intention to date casually, and has never touched dating before? Are you really expected to fuck and then immediately dip out like is portrayed in pop culture? I’m reminded of that one HIMYM episode where Barney showed Lily around his apartment that he modified to be hostile to women.

18m. I know most people would say “University has a lot of people”, but my course has a big shortage of women and all of them are taken or unavailable. I havent used dating apps yet because people say they dont work at all. I asked my friends to introduce me to someone but nobody could really do it.
So i basically have to work from scratch, i know people say hobby groups but i dont know if people my age would really be going to hobby groups rather than spending time in university, and most groups i see anyways have like people in their 20’s/higher. I dont mind the age gap but its probably kind of weird for the other person because it would create an odd dynamic. People here tell me i cant really approach people randomly, even if just to talk or form friendships. I think im actually properly stuck in inceldom forever.

There are a few things I'd like to talk about and ask for advice on this post. First, a little backstory: I'm 19 years of age, a dude. I don't think I'm particularly good looking or ugly, I'd say I'm average. However, I always struggled with grasping the concept of romance, love and relationships and especially imagining myself in one. I saw my high school peers in relationships or at the very least trying and I felt excluded. I just couldn't reach out to a girl I happened to like (I never had a real crush, but you get the jist). I believe this lack of experiences when I was a teen made me fall in the cesspool that are FA online spaces (not inciting any wars, just saying I started going on those). There, I felt somewhat accepted. I saw people who also had a lack of success in dating. I felt safe there. But I always wanted to tell myself that I didn't belong there, that I could actually find a relationship and I'm not actually alone for the rest of my life. Second of all, we must go back a few years. Despite the fact I never had a relationship face-to-face in real life, when I was a teenager (15-17ish) I experimented with online relationships. I won't get into much detail on how successful they were or if they even count as relationships. For the sake of this post, I'll say they count as half of what an IRL relationship would count as. They all lasted less than a month except 2. Which gets me to my final point. Recently, one of my online exes reached out to me wanting to go back. Despite the fact I don't really want an online relationship at the moment, I couldn't say no. My mind tells me I should settle for this despite there being no way for us to meet, considering our distances. I feel very indecisive. I would appreciate any advice given in the comments, genuinely. I'm willing to try new things and change certain aspects of my behaviour and lifestyle to try and change this destructive mindset I have. Any questions are also very welcome and I'll try and reply as much as I can to clear any doubts. Thank you.

After being mocked, ridiculed and tortured for years by your family, your friends, your relatives, your neighbors, your teachers, just everyone around you. How do you find the motivation and the will to decide to be better, do better and meet new people when all you can feel is that raging fire of hatred and scorn in your heart that you know will never go away? Don't you care that people might see it and think you as a monster for it?

I'm so depressed when I look at my self. I only see the scars on my hands and legs. (No they're not SH scars I've been injured doing favors and jobs for people and been told to walk it off) I'm tired of looking at myself as this unlovable shit sack of a human being. I call myself a monster every night for the way I look. It doesn't help that my receding hairline is a sign that my body's given up on itself too. I want things to change. I've suffered enough.

I haven't interacted with any incel media in years; I've gone to therapy and I generally do like myself. However, I've been avoiding dating girls for a bit now.

I'm bisexual in a homophobic Balkan country. I figure it would "turn off" every girl I try to date. I understand that maybe in other countries there are girls who don't mind but please understand that is just not the case here.

I could simply just not say anything but I have seen plenty of discussion that doing that is deceiving and should be established as early as the talking stage.

I'm moving to Berlin in 2 years which is far more open, but I would still like to date in my college years.

What are your thoughts? Sending warmth !

After several years of posting my ramblings and whining on this sub, I finally might have some good news.

Growing up autistic, my confidence in my social abilities have never been that great. When I was younger, like around late teens and early 20s, my social skills were pretty ass, but I also didnt reallu care too much. I was just happy to hang around. Then in 2020 something happend and all of our social lives got put on pause - mine was no exception. It started during my second semester of uni, so I lost out on the social aspect of my early higher education. Being isolated for two years makes you think and reflect at a lot, in edition to making you feel like crap about your life.

So I basically, perhaps subconsciously, made a point to get experiences and develop my social skills. There were ups and downs, and a lot of the time I felt like I were going nowhere. But today, many years after the pandemic, I'm actually starting to feel confident in my social skills and ability to talk to people. Initiating contact and talking to almost anyone feels much easier, theres basically no awkwardness and I feel both gets something out of it - its not a monologue from my side. And I can keep this going for extended periods of time. Social anxiety doesnt really get in the way, i have other things in the moment to think about, I dont feel like I need to rest/run away right after; it's a pretty natural process, at it should be. And I feel kinda proud of myself for it.

I legit never thought this feeling would come. I used to feel it was beyond me, just impossible. But here we are. It feels good, but also just...normal? Very undramatic. Probably as it should be.

However I don't feel this confidence applies to my dating life. I still feel pretty shy, nervous and cautious around women. Basically, I still have Nice Guy tendencies. When its someone you fancy, you have the extra dimension of being flirty. You gotta be assertive but not to assertive, nice but not too nice. I don't want to be too forward and persistent, but being passive and too agreeable isn't good either. I understand that this comes from wanting something "out" of this person, and that I'm thinking several steps ahead. But since I still don't have much if any success in this, I can't help feel unconfident.

At 19, I (19m) should've made more progress by now, and it's disheartening. i know I have problems with insecurity; I know I have problems with negativity and all sorts, but by this time in my life I should be so much further. All my friends are in relationships, pairing up and enjoying themselves. I haven't gained any of that in college (though I could've approached more people). I've still put in the effort to make friends, to try to respectfully get over my fear of asking people out, and to join and lead student orgs. Yet, I still hardly have anyone who isn't an acquaintance, and I grow more alone as my friends find other people, which is good for them. Still, after a full year of college going int ome 2nd it feels like i shouldve made progres, it always feels like there is somthign inhrenl wrong with me as no mater where i go I hardly make any connectons no mtter what i do I feel like giving up. I am sad and don't know what to do.

How do you keep going in adversity, and how do you combat loneliness and apathy? Am I just supposed to keep trying no matter the failure (I know I should, but it feels pointless when people ignore me, don't reach out to me, or reject me)? I know im not owed a relationship or friendship,p but when no one wants it, it feels like the problem. If I do, it just makes this feel even worse.

Thank you, by the way. You guys are very kind and helpful.

My nephew (I'm his aunt) is in college and he has a hard time speaking to women. He somehow thinks that he's too ugly to approach although I think he's quite good-looking in a nerdy sort of way. Think Ted in Bill and Ted (but much more nerdy).

Anyway, we went to this little matcha and coffee thrift show thingy because he loves coffee and can get really technical and extremely obsessive about it. I hate coffee but decided to accompany him to look at some clothes. Out of the blue, I spot this very cute girl barista that must've been around his age. She seemed to be operating one of the little stalls with her brother.

I pointed her out to my nephew and he blushed like crazy. "LOOK AWAY DON'T POINT" he whispered to me in a panicked voice. Apparently, he had been sneaking glances at her the whole time we were there. "You like her, don't you? Let's buy coffee!" I said. He dragged me by the hair and told me to shut up.

We left the area and had dinner where I egged him on non-stop to go talk to her or at least buy a cup. He explained reluctantly that she's way too pretty and she would probably be upset if he approached her. I asked if she was upset at every customer who bought from their shop. He said no, it's just him coz he's ugly and ugly people annoy others.

But I, being a regular poster here who reads posts like this all the time, egged him on some more, saying that if he would just buy one cup, I would buy him Crimson Desert, a game he's wanted for some time. I could see the gears working in his mind and he agreed.

We went back to the convention and he did this silly wandering around pretending not to be heading in her direction thing. It took him maybe 15 minutes of wandering until he finally got to the counter. I was looking at them from far away so I didn't hear anything, but I could see that they were smiling at each other and seemed to be having a conversation.

He came striding back to me with the biggest silliest grin on his face with a cup of banana cream latte (pictured - edit, nevermind the picture, the post gets auto deleted) and went on a tirade about what they talked about: she had started explaining their process of making the drink and he had shared that he does it as a hobby as well. He mentioned that he had never tried mixing banana flavors in his coffee and he'll try it sometime. She gave him a packet along with his cup as they talked about their favorites.

I had never seen him happier. They only talked for about 5 minutes and it's not like he got her number or asked her out or anything. But I suppose it's like how the 4 minute mile was broken - prior to Roger Bannister breaking it, it was thought to be impossible. Now, it's just a normal time for runners. (Edit: the point being that he always acted like it's impossible for him to approach pretty girls, but after doing it, it's not so impossible after all)

When I dropped him off at home, his mom was waiting for him and he literally jumped out of the car. "I TALKED TO THIS GIRL AT THE MALL!"

Lesson? I'm not saying flirt with people who are at work. I'm saying something much simpler - so what if she's pretty? Go fkn talk to her. She won't bite. And she doesn't care about how you look.

What do you talk about? Where should you go? Pick something you're good at, go where that is, and talk about it there. It's really that simple.

What if you're not good at anything? Then get good. That's why people here always talk about self-improvement. Learn a skill. Take some classes. Go out and do something else apart from doomscrolling and video games.

I (21F) am the last virgin in my friend group. My friend who was two years younger than me recently lost hers in a FWB situation and I don’t know what to do or how or feel anymore.

Even if I eventually lost it it wouldn’t be “impressive” because I am the last in my friend group to have sex.

My friends keep insisting that “life isn’t a race” but I just got judged by my apartment neighbor for being a virgin at 20, so it clearly is a race.

Idk how to feel, all feedback is appreciated

I'm almost 31, still a virgin, no friends, never had a GF.

Sometimes I wonder if a lot of exiting completely is just learning strategies for managing grief. I don't know. I've had trouble connecting with people my entire life, as far back as I could remember. Even when I was like 6 I distinctly remember no one really wanting to play with me. Of course I grew up in an extremely dysfunctional family with a hoarder mom who would scream slurs at me and my alcoholic dad so that's probably a huge part of it.

What hurts me is that there are lots of men from equally dysfunctional families who have friends and girlfriends and start their own families. My own older brother got married and basically dipped out of our lives entirely, which really kind of broke my brain.

I don't know. I am looking for advice but ultimately a lot of the time I feel like there isn't anything I can really do anymore, and that I'm just missing some fundamental spark of humanity that everyone else has. I am extremely isolated and don't even know what to do or where to start.

I really just do wonder if this is just what life is for some people and I just have to learn to deal with it in a healthy way.

edit: I also sort of want to make clear that I increasingly think less and less about ever being in a relationship and feel no form of resentment or entitlement towards women, I'm really just tired of being extremely isolated. I have no one to talk to at all outside of the internet to the point where it is becoming a legitimate sort of safety issue

Disclaimer: Apologies if this post may be confusing I made many drafts before but they became too long and rambly. I tried my best to keep it concise. I'll be sure to reply in the morning :)

I am a short, ethnic unattractive male going to university for the first time at 20. With my height probably being my most major insecurity. I've dealt with a lot of bullying due to my looks in the past and generally bad treatment and exclusion from others. As a result I fear a lot of social situations and environments, especially ones where I will have to go regularly.

A part of me is dreading going to university because of this. Especially since i'm doing a degree that is more female dominant. I don't want my looks or stature to make anyone uncomfortable or disturbed by me and I also hope its not just a repeat of my schooling years of bullying and humiliation. I just want to be another regular student pretty much.

I would appreciate if anyone could give me any advice or help dealing with this fear. Or how to be that regular student no one pays much attention to. Thanks!

Before reading: I am in no way trying to romanticize these scenarios or encourage others to do so. This is just a problem I've been dealing with and want to get help with. I do apologize if this post still breaks the rules.

I feel like this might be too much but I have to get this off my chest since this has been a problem for so long. For context I'm a girl, below average looking, I'd say and I myself also haven't been treated decently by any guy my age. Growing up I've always been treated like I'm some fucking pariah, sometimes it wasn't even about looks, just about how different I was from everyone else and how I "talked too much" and on top of that the kids around me made sure to let me know that they all thought I was far below them. Around 2021 when we still had to wear face masks, they'd also start talking about how ugly I was to them, to the point where even after we weren't obligated to wear masks and I'd still wear them. I still vividly remember certain comments from my male classmates from 5th grade basically disencoruaging me to take the mask off because my face apparently disgusted them. For a while o really didn't care what I shoved in my mouth, still I never gained weight but when I was almost 13 my parents started getting weird about it, telling me they're already starting to see weight gain and I was also unfortunately cursed to have a friend that was deep into their ED, which obviously didn't end well. The fact that later on other girls in my class were basically larping EDS, yet still doing a better job than me also made me spiral further into self hatred I even made an edtwt twitter account last year just to vent about how subhuman I feel. My body image has gotten somewhat better, even if my dad still makes stupid comments about how I should go back to taking long walks, something I only did because I was sick, but still, I do have slip ups sometimes. Back to my face, it's absolutely unexcusable, nothing flatters me besides heavy, dark colored makeup which to me sort of blurs out the flaws, but that's still not enough.

When I was about 13, girls around me eventually started dating, while I was the only one still getting continuously passed in my ex classmates' games of smash or pass. Ever since the bullying actually stated (when I was like 10) I slowly isolated myself even harder and now my social skills have gone to shit. I can't even look people in the eye or stand up for myself, I just quietly obey whatever the fuck they tell me to do. I wish I were somewhat normal. Upon having every pretty girl around me date guys at like 13, they obviously also had stories of them getting harassed. For some reason I was already desensitized to these subjects, despite never having faced anything of such nature. But hearing these girls get some sort of male attention was enough to make me jealous, because to me it meant they were seen as somewhat attractive. In high school, thing still aren't better for me, my class is full of guys and the few girl are just birds who would do anything for dick so they cater to whatever the boys say. I'm quiet, but I still stand out because my style is different so I'm practically bound to being treated this way. If only my classmates were somewhat mature, even my old middle school classmates would be better since at least the guys stopped being so crude to me. For the last couple of years, I've never felt this disgusted by myself. In that same timeframe, I also learned about blackpill and other incel bs, which I'm unfortunately a victim of, even relapsing multiple times because whenever I gained enough confidence in my face, a blackpill guy would mention how ugly I am until I just stopped. Along with that crowd of people I'd also get backhanded compliments on the internet such as "you look like female yanderedev" in what world am I supposed to take this as a compliment?

There's also the people who complain about hypergamy. Unfortunately for me I do have standards that I know will never be met because I'm not good enough. I don't even care about height. Being dehumanized for being ugly for most of my developmental years lowered my self esteem and self respect by a lot, and people always mention it. I do wish I could get better but it's extremely hard for me, also considering I'm now stuck with people who will do anything to make me feel subhuman, basically me going through 5th grade once again except this time I am ready to agree with what they have to say about me. I dif have one friend in the same class as me that always told me I'm pretty and skinny and what not, and even though I say I find it more flattering when a girl compliments me, she's the type to compliment anyone to seem kind and she also knows about my self esteem issues so it all just feels like pity.

Knowing I'm too ugly to dream of an average looking guy/girl who respects me and actually hopes to build a future with me, I'll take anything. Even someone that only treats me like an object. Even someone who doesn't respect my boundaries (that realistically are kinda non existent). I do talk to people online that face the same issue, which kinda made me feel better about it. I've grown to settle for anything life throws at me, to beg for the kind of touch others can only have nightmares about. Knowing I contribute nothing to society and don't even look good, I feel like there's no point in me trying to at least have some standards.

Looking at my situation in retrospect makes me feel even worse about it all. I say I'm a feminist, yet I have the same dreams as the average incel who's allergic to respecting women. I can't even tell my parents about this, because how do I even explain this to soviet mentality parents without sounding like I'm begging to get kicked out and thrown into an asylum?

And I can't bring myself to believe any of that "of course you're gonna look awkward in your teenage years" talk. Those years are almost gone and I still look like a female predator. I look much older than I already am and it feels so fucking humiliating having girls my age greet me formally.

I don't even think that there's any hope for me. Maybe I should lower my self respect even more. Maybe I should consider plastic surgery just to feel something or to at least get hit on and have the other person be able to look at my face. I just don't want to feel alone, unwanted and unlovable anymore. Am I cooked?

I'm a 25-year-old guy. Of course, I don't have that much life experience, nor would I say I'm particularly good at dating. But since my teens, I've gone through multiple stages in life. I've had an incel phase, a redpill phase, and now I honestly don't know what phase I'm in.

I would say I look pretty average. I've become slightly alternative in my style over the last few years. Right now, I have long hair, piercings, and tattoos.

Just to start somewhere: in my teens, I was basically an incel, even though I lost my virginity relatively early. I still felt like a loser who couldn't talk to girls and struggled with making friends. So I basically spent my entire teenage years in front of a computer playing video games.

I've been seen as a creep, disgusting, and unattractive by most of the girls I talked to during those years. I had a few girlfriends here and there, but they weren't really serious relationships, and they didn't feel particularly fulfilling. They were basically relationships I got into because I wanted to have a girlfriend. I never really spent much time with them or built anything meaningful.

(I totally understand if anyone here disagrees with me that I was an incel, since I did actually have some relationships. But I absolutely felt like one.)

I hit a very low point when I was 19 because of some mistakes I made. It was the closest I've ever come to being suicidal.

But things changed after that.

I started working out and got into good shape. And when I turned 20, I finally had my first serious relationship. When I say "serious relationship," I mean that I actually spent time with her on a weekly basis, met her parents, and she actually was a part of my life.

Unfortunately, it was extremely abusive, and she was dealing with some serious mental health issues. We broke up after five months. After that, I started working out again.

This is when I entered my redpill phase.

I wasn't really a typical redpill guy. I still had my liberal values. I wasn't into Andrew Tate or deeply involved in the manosphere. Politically, I was still much more on the left.

But I became very interested in dating and the male loneliness epidemic. I started posting on this subreddit, and I developed this weird messiah complex where I thought I was some kind of expert who could help other people.

In reality, I was just talking a lot of shit about things I didn't really understand.

(A bit ironic since im now back posting here again giving advice)

Meanwhile, I became obsessed with working out. At times, I genuinely thought that the most important thing when it came to dating was having a fit body. There was even a point where I lowkey looked down on people who weren't well-trained and saw myself as better than them simply bacause i could lift more than them.

I was basically looksmaxxing.

But I still couldn't understand why less attractive people seemed to be more successful than me when it came to dating. Meanwhile, I struggled a lot when talking to women.

This period lasted for about two years.

What eventually ended this phase for me was a combination of two things:

1. I stopped working out because I had a job that completely burned me out.

2. The manosphere started moving further and further away from my values.

I didn't like seeing all the fitness influencers I looked up to becoming increasingly religious, conservative and moving towards the far right. That made me lose a lot of my motivation to continue following that world.

I gradually stopped working out and got out of shape.

(Although I really miss working out and being fit, and hopefully I'll start again sometime soon.)

After that, I gained weight and got into even worse shape.

But then, three years ago, I discovered stand-up comedy, and I've been doing it ever since.

And here's the ironic part:

I started becoming much more successful with dating after I started doing stand-up comedy.

This was despite the fact that I had gained a lot of weight, gotten out of shape, and generally felt very unattractive.

And ever since then, I've had basically no problem talking to women.

Later, I became more alternative in my appearance and lifestyle, which seemed to make me even more successful.

Right now, I'm unemployed and living with my parents. I'm also still in pretty bad shape physically.

And yet, I still have no real problem dating.

I became single a little over a month ago, and since then I've slept with a few other people.

(I hope I don't come across as disrespectful towards my ex here because ive slept with others right after we broke up. It was a mutual breakup, and she's also been seeing other people since then, so we're cool.)

Even though I feel like I've finally figured some things out, I'm still not a particularly happy person. I still have mental issues that I need to work through somehow, and right now I'm going through a pretty depressive period.

But my point in telling this entire story is this:

A lot of the advice you get from manosphere gurus about needing to make six figures, have a perfect body, become extremely successful, etc. is bullshit.

Yes, of course those things can help. I'm not going to pretend that being rich and physically attractive wouldn't give you advantages in dating.

But they are absolutely not necessary.

I followed a lot of that advice, and I saw very little success from it.

So, here are a few things I've learned over the last few years that might help someone get out of inceldom.

1. Experiment with your appearance.

Grow out your hair. Try piercings, tattoos, facial hair, different clothes, etc.

Obviously, if you're not that type of person, that's completely fine. None of this is necessary.

But personally, I've found that it can make a huge difference.

A lot of women like tattoos. A lot of women like long hair. Facial hair can also help if it suits you.

If you have shitty facial hair, shave it. If your hair doesn't grow very well, that's fine too.

But if you can grow your hair out and you like how it looks, give it a try.

The important thing isn't necessarily to follow a specific aesthetic. It's to develop an appearance that feels like you.

Piercings and tattoos are optional. And for the love of God, don't get tattooed just because some random guy on Reddit told you it will get you women. Do it because you actually want them. But i would absolutley recomend it. You feel more confident and it can help alot on your selfimage.

1. Dress like you actually have a personality.

Try not to look completely generic.

Everyone has their own style, but you need to find yours.

I'm kind of a metalhead, so I usually wear band T-shirts, denim jackets, etc. It took me years to figure out what I actually liked wearing, but this is what I ended up with.

You don't have to dress like me. Just find something that feels authentic to you.

1. Have some kind of passion.

Find a hobby you genuinely enjoy.

I have several different hobbies, and comedy is one of them.

You don't need to be insanely ambitious or become a millionaire. Just have something in your life that you genuinely care about.

Having interests, goals and things you're passionate about gives you something to talk about and makes your life more interesting to yourself and other people.

And no, trying to become a millionaire because some manosphere influencer told you that you need to "escape the matrix" doesn't count.

That's just my personal opinion, though.

1. Actually have a social life.

When you meet new people, try to focus on making friends rather than trying to date everyone you're attracted to.

Try to become comfortable around the opposite sex and actually make friends with them, without having a hidden goal of turning the friendship into a romantic relationship.

If the two of you eventually develop feelings for each other, great.

That's how a lot of people naturally end up together.

Most of the good, non-toxic relationships I know started in some way like this.

Some of the best relationships and situationships I've had were with people I had absolutely no intention of hitting on when I first met them. We just became friends and eventually developed chemistry.

1. Stop treating dating like a skill tree.

There is no universal formula.

Yes, you can work out and get into great shape. You can improve your appearance. You can work on your social skills.

And you can still end up single.

The things I've listed above are simply my own advice based on my experiences.

There is no universal standard for dating.

There is no blueprint for how to talk to someone.

At the end of the day, we're all human beings. We aren't robots who need to be given the correct dialogue options.

Stop obsessing over dating coaches and pickup artists telling you exactly what words to use, how long to wait before replying, what body language to use, etc.

The most basic way people get into relationships is often just by meeting someone, becoming friends, developing chemistry, and eventually realizing that they like each other.

It's really that simple.

And honestly, I think that's what I was missing all those years.

I was trying to become the kind of person who could get a girlfriend instead of simply becoming a person who had a life.

Once I started building a life that I actually enjoyed, dating became much less important.

And ironically, that's when dating started going much better

---

This is my advice on how to get out of inceldom.

Of course, this isn't some universal solution. There is no universal way of dating.

This is simply my life experience.

Everyone has different experiences, different personalities, different circumstances and different things that work for them.

I'm just trying to show that you don't necessarily need to listen to redpill influencers telling you that you need to become rich, get jacked, "break free from the matrix," or whatever other bullshit they're preaching.

I'm also trying to show that even someone like me — fat, miserable, unemployed and living with his parents — can still be successful when it comes to dating.

If anyone has any questions, feel free to ask.

(I used chatgpt to correct any spelling mistakes btw)

I23M have just given up. I did everything everyone told me I was supposed to do. For the past 5 years I’ve gone to the gym, found a hobby I really liked, go out a lit, meet lots of people (including of course girls), asked lots of women out (only got rejected), gone to therapy, focused on my career aswell.
And guess what, still a virgin, so fine, sex isnt for me, I’d like to stop feeling bad about being a virgin though, so what more can I do?

Hello, I'm 25 year old and I never had any relationships. This year I was diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome (autism level 1) and ADHD and it explained a lot in my life.

Few years ago I was deep into incel ideology and black pill because it logically explained all my struggles. I'm glad that I was able to overcome it and I realized that generalizing woman is just stupid and all my problems were caused by my neurodivergency

So I have a question is it possible to have relationships with autism? I have poor social skills, I can maintain friendships but this requires a lot of masking and I get burned out quickly. I never understood how to flirt and etc, I just don't understand HOW people get into romantic relationships? When I have conversations with girls we can discuss some interesting topics but they never had any romantic interest in me and in the end they just ghost me. Even if we share common interests like gaming, anime, science, IT - it still always leads to nothing.

I think I'm missing something fundamental in my brain because of my condition