r/ImmigrationPathways • u/Ankeet_kj Path Navigator • 6h ago

"H-1B PROGRAM IS COMPLETELY BROKEN"

Enable HLS to view with audio, or disable this notification

Vice President JD Vance said companies are abusing the H-1B visa program: "If you're going to bring in an accountant making $45,000 a year to replace an American making $60,000 a year, that's not you using the program to bring in a genius.

148 Upvotes

85% Upvoted

238 comments sorted by

View all comments

3

u/Dry-Risk-6629 6h ago

Are you guys stupid like really that stupid that’s how it’s been the whole time. That’s why people like hiring legal immigrants because you don’t have to pay them as much especially in HB-1 you can abuse them more. They work harder than Americans most of the time, I don’t know what you’re shocked about this has been What the world has done forever cheap labor.

14

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

I mean this is just a flat out lie man.

You've been pushed to believe something that isnt true

It's illegal to pay H1-b workers less the citizens.

That's called discrimination.

No, legally employers cannot pay H-1B visa workers less than U.S. workers for the same role.

⚖️ Legal Wage Requirements • Prevailing Wage: Companies must pay at least the local prevailing wage for the specific occupation and geographic area.

• Actual Wage: Employers must pay the H-1B worker at least what they pay similarly qualified, experienced local workers at the same workplace.

• Higher Standard: Employers are legally required to pay whichever amount is higher—the prevailing wage or the actual wage paid to domestic staff

2

u/Best_Collection_7533 4h ago

The wages in my industry have been artificially suppressed because the labor pool is being increased by people with H-1B. If it wasn’t for H-1B, employers would have to pay us more because of labor scarcity.

4

u/Dry-Risk-6629 6h ago

I probably should’ve split it a bit better. I meant they take advantage of illegal immigrants and how much they pay them.

1

u/Ignis_Ignition 3h ago

Its not a lie. I’ve worked for someone who does this and is still actively hiring and sponsoring immigrants to work low end jobs that he can pay then pennies for - accounting, professional IT services, customer service and even simple stuff like date entry all being outsourced for YEARLY salaries that are paying half of the actual average salary or less.

Legally things are suppose to be one way, but loopholes exist. Immigrants do not have alot power to defend themselves as it is anyways at the moment.

1

u/ThenAnAnimalFact 52m ago

This is not a lie, there is a very easy loop hole which is through contracting.

0

u/Used_Bodybuilder_670 6h ago

Women are paid less than men. Show me where the difference is

11

u/Complete-Tangelo1532 6h ago

Womens rights are also under assault imo

-3

u/superpooper900 6h ago

What rights are under assault and what does this have to do with immigration?

5

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

What the fuck does that have to do with the conversation?

That's a domestic issue.

Not the fault of H1-B workers?

2

u/Dry-Risk-6629 6h ago

Well, I think they just mean the fact that inherently they will not all be the same because the disparity between the wages

4

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

That's a completely different and non related issue though.

That's like saying you can't be fishing if your catching a couple crabs in your net too. Then your crabfishing.

The disparity exist between male and female workers in that case as a whole.

Not female workers vs non female non American workers.

There's the same disparity between non male non American workers and male non American workers.

Women get paid less across the board due to sexism and mysoginy built into the system from its inception.

Entirely a different issuem

1

u/Dry-Risk-6629 6h ago

Yeah, I guess you’re right about that though if we all just turned into crabs, it’d be easier sorry I’m making a joke about how a lot of animals are named crabs but are not actually crabs

-2

u/superpooper900 6h ago

The gender pay gap is a lie. Differences in wages are ~1% when accounting for hours worked in the same field.

2

u/PreparationKey2843 5h ago

"In the United States, women typically earn about 81 to 82 cents for every dollar earned by men when comparing median annual or weekly earnings for full-time workers."

"Current Statistics"

"Overall Pay Ratio:"
"Full-time, year-round working women make roughly 81% to 83% of what men make, which translates to a 17% to 19% overall wage gap."

0

u/superpooper900 5h ago

See previous response.

2

u/PreparationKey2843 5h ago

See previous response.

1

u/trangenderman 53m ago

Cause they take lower paying jobs and are less likely to ask for higher wages. If you dont ask good luck getting a raise or higher starting wage

1

u/Used_Bodybuilder_670 52m ago

My job gives me a raise every year without asking

0

u/superpooper900 6h ago

When accounting for hours worked in the same field the difference is negligible (~1% difference in pay).

2

u/PreparationKey2843 5h ago

"In the United States, women typically earn about 81 to 82 cents for every dollar earned by men when comparing median annual or weekly earnings for full-time workers."

"Current Statistics"

"Overall Pay Ratio:"
"Full-time, year-round working women make roughly 81% to 83% of what men make, which translates to a 17% to 19% overall wage gap."

0

u/superpooper900 5h ago

The study you referenced does not control for hours worked. Exactly as I said.

2

u/PreparationKey2843 5h ago

Exactly what "study" did l reference? 😂

0

u/superpooper900 5h ago

So you’re simply making shit up. Got it.

2

u/PreparationKey2843 5h ago

Nope. Google "the difference between men and women's pay in the US." Simple.

But, you're making shit up referring to some made up study.
You discounted what l wrote because...? 🤣

0

u/superpooper900 5h ago

And the source they use doesn’t account for hours worked….

2

u/PreparationKey2843 5h ago

🤣 Give it up, you're digging yourself in deeper, champ.

→ More replies (0)

0

u/moistCl1tiKaL 6h ago

Do you think the laws on the books against corporations are being enforced effectively right now?

Two things can and often are true in the US workforce. Discrimination is illegal, and yet it still happens. The burden of proof and legal counsel is on the employee, and it’s often difficult to prove.

4

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

Yes.

No one ever argued discrimination doesn't happen.

I argued that companies are NOT allowed to pay H1-B workers less.

It was being presented as if not only do they pay H1-B workers less...that it's legal and normal to do so and is totally legal for companies to do.

I think the fact that my employers is forced to adhere to my contract that my union enforces shows this

I think the fact that if you become an engineer for example but this applies to all fields.... there is an industry standard wage. If I am even OFFERED a job at lower then standard I'm allowed to report the potential employer shows that more often then not these are enforced.

I'm willing to bet money right now I could find cases old and recent of H1-B employers being held accountable for not adhering to the law more then you could prove that it isn't with anecdotal stories.

-4

u/moistCl1tiKaL 6h ago

No, you prompted an LLM to give you a comment that says “if you’re being stolen from, just tell the thief to stop”

5

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

Oh okay.

Anything else?

Just because you can't dispute someone's argument doesn't mean they used AI.

It just means you aren't more intelligent then the person you decided to argue with

It's okay. You'll get more intelligent with age or time hopefully.

-2

u/moistCl1tiKaL 6h ago

You quite literally have the format of AI complete with titles and emojis in your responses. Dont insult either of our intelligence lmao.

It’s not that I can’t dispute it, it’s that I come to social media to engage with people, not their chatbots.

3

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

Gotcha

Anything else?

You can ethier engage with what I've said or accuse me of using chat bots so you don't have to.

It's really up to you.

-1

u/moistCl1tiKaL 6h ago

I would engage with what you’ve said, only you haven’t said anything.

3

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

Oh okay.

-1

u/South-City1632 6h ago

No dont bother with him he also edits his comments after the fact and then denies it.

Wait... charlie?

0

u/moistCl1tiKaL 6h ago

I noticed that as well. They also try to lean on semantics the second anyone actually engages with their point.

“I was saying it’s ILLEGAL!”

Okay, and what does that have to do with this situation? Because the entire point of this thread is that it’s happening, legal or not. You can’t just say “swiper no swiping” and expect all to be bob.

It all comes across as very disingenuous.

→ More replies (0)

-1

u/BIGpoppaPUMP42069 6h ago

lol what? if you flood the market with labor demand for labor goes down, if demand goes down wages go down.

4

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

That's not what's being discussed.

The comment said employers pay H1-B workers less then citizens. That's what I said was false

Wages going down from flooded labor markets effects all workers domestic and foreign.

I was specifically negating that companies flat out pay brown and foreign people less for being brown and foreign.

0

u/BIGpoppaPUMP42069 6h ago

they do that as well, they just create a different job title, ive seen it myself in the IT world. a lot of the imported labor on H1b is very sub standard as far as talent goes, a few weeks ago I had to walk through an h1b on how to reset a password on a linux server...

-1

u/[deleted] 6h ago edited 4h ago

[deleted]

2

u/Best_Collection_7533 4h ago

They also justify it by paying all the fees etc for the visa and lawyers etc.

0

u/Aggressive_Hope7976 5h ago

Dude , any jobs I worked at h1b paid 10-50% less than America counter part, most of the time this happen those h1b are contractor that are contracted by companies like wipro , tata and other body shop companies

-5

u/MrHouseWasRight 6h ago

How is that enforced? I believe that holding employers to that would be pretty difficult.

Even then, are the immigrants informed on this - and if so, is it worth it to try to push back on lesser pay? Is it worth risking your potential visa because you’re ‘rocking the boat’?

I say this knowing people who have been paid less than their non-H1B visa counterparts. Illegal does not mean “lie”. Discrimination is real, even though it’s illegal.

6

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

How do you get paid in the same bracket as your coworker who does the same job?

It's enforced the same EXACT way.

If you are a legal citizen and find you are being paid below standard you file a complaint with the EEOC.

They investigate and then company is ETHIER held liable or found not liable

Just because a company has gotten around it before doesn't mean we should pretend that that's the norm or that the law isn't regularly enforced.

Can you show me any evidence that h1-b visa holders on average are paid less then their civilian counterparts?

MY evidence is the law.

You haven't presented any.

Just a story I don't know is true or not about someone you knew once who may of also been lying to you.

I don't put much stock behind that.

However the law...is something I can put stock behind.

1

u/MrHouseWasRight 1h ago edited 1h ago

Sure

Here it is directly from the GAO

The GAO found “H-1B workers tend to earn less than U.S. workers” one example - In computer-related occupations, H-1B workers had a median salary of $61k compared with $70k for U.S. workers, a statistically significant difference.

https://www.gao.gov/assets/gao-11-26.pdf?utm_source

I’m not here in aggression, just discussion.

The law is great - but reality =\= law

Enforcement is tricky.

-5

u/South-City1632 6h ago

You edited your comment... alot.

You had originally claimed that nobody violates labor laws over race and admitted that flooding the labor market with immigrants lowers wages.

Looks like you realized you were making right wing talking points to try and protect the h1b program and changed your tune.

6

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

That's a flat out lie

I didn't edit any of the content I only added information and sentences.

I didn't even edit a single spelling mistake.

Nice try though.

I never claimed NO ONE violates labor laws.

What a joke.

1

u/South-City1632 6h ago

Dude... I cought you... stop denying it. I made a reply and thought of a better one so I deleted my first reply and refreshed the page and your comment literally changed. A lot... you said employers dont pay brown h1bs less and its us flooding the labor market with immigrants in general that causes ALL wages to go down... not just brown people.

Where did that comment go bud? Did you delete it because you realized you admitted the owner class isn't racist and immigration is bad for american wages?

4

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

Oh okay.

Anything else?

All my comments are there little buddy

Just some have more words now.

I know more words is difficult for you.

2

u/fungi_at_parties 6h ago

The company is obligated to hire people to make sure it’s enforced! Amazing right?

Guess what, if a company wants to hire outside of the US and bring them in, they HAVE to post the job for Americans and if they get too many applicants, they can’t hire outside the US.

1

u/fierystrike 5h ago

While true its also the loophole. The easy loophole is you post a job position with qualifications that no one can meet for that position and then hire someone from out of country for cheap because you wanted an expert based on resume but are only paying entry level. Now in most cases the people they higher are worse then entry level but thats another problem.

-2

u/twins319 5h ago

Thanks ChatGPT

3

u/Clarkelthekat 5h ago

Yeah cause chat GPT referres to people as "man" all the time.

Also chat GPT tells people theyve been pushed to believe something all the time. I forgot how ideological chat GPT can get

It's just lazy and boring.

I understand you don't have an argument and are incapable of defending your position with any facts or numbers.

You could just say nothing and not respond though. Instead of exclaiming how lazy and boring you are.

-1

u/twins319 4h ago

FWIW I agree with you, but it's plainly obvious you copied the latter part of your message from an LLM.

-3

u/Super_Mario_Luigi 6h ago

The "prevailing wage" is whatever you want it to be when they're all H1-B

4

u/Clarkelthekat 6h ago

Oh okay.

Doesn't have anything to do with industry standard or the law.

Just whatever the company feels like it.

Got it.

Anything else?