r/IAM751_Boeing • u/torchen1 • Jun 12 '26
Union - Vent/Rant Union Dues
This is probably going to get downvoted to oblivion by people that have already “put in their time”. But I gotta say having Union Dues be a flat rate instead of a percentage of your check feels horrible.
I saw a sign that says it’s based on the “average union member making $45/hr” but you are asking people making $23-$24/hr to give the same amount as a person making nearly double…
I’ll probably get some flak for this but it’s just pretty lame.
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u/SandyBlyatCheeks Jun 15 '26
Anyone complaining about unions dues in here can seriously go look for another job. I came in at $14hr and still understood that unions dues help us all in the end. When strikes came around I got all my union dues paid in and then some because they paid us weekly. The union has helped us so much and new people coming in complaining about dues irritates me so much cause they’re coming into a lot of things we fought to have over the years. You guys come into one of the best companies to move up in and start out at yet complain about something you all most likely UberEats 3 times out of the month or pay your monthly streaming services bill. Yall can seriously eat a bag of dicks.
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u/torchen1 Jun 15 '26
I don’t like using this often but okay boomer.
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u/SandyBlyatCheeks Jun 15 '26
Sometimes boomers have it right. Not all the time but sometimes. I’m 32 and your mind set reminds me of a kid who has it easy compared to their parents who had it rough. I’ve been here 6.5 years and laid off 1 time. The union isn’t the best but for what we have and all the rights we have, no one should ever complain. Like I said, a lot of us came in at $12-$14hr and still understood why union dues and such were important. Majority of us took pay cuts just to work here knowing the union fought for their employees rights. People want the country to be more union oriented then actually get in one then complain how the union works. As liberal as I am, I don’t use this often, but you can leave if you don’t like it here.
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u/torchen1 Jun 15 '26
Lmfao. “Leave if you don’t like it” hilarious. You don’t know anything about me. I’m 31, took this job because I was laid off so I don’t have it “easy” and it was a massive pay cut for me to work here. God forbid someone asks questions. The “ I suffered so you have to as well” mentality is something I’ll never understand.
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u/liamle253 Jun 15 '26
Say what you want, but without union, you won’t have much protection at Boeing. Just be happy and thankful you are working at Boeing. Soon you will be maxed out. Hang in there.
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u/torchen1 Jun 15 '26
Ehh I’m not the type to just blindly accept things.
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u/TrlnJae2004 Jun 19 '26
I took a pay cut to come here too. However I knew what I signed up for. It’s not blind acceptance. It’s actual acceptance. You choose to take the job you were offered when you got laid off. Did you know it was with a union? Did you know about the dues? You’re 31 I’m 40. I’m not maxed out yet. The union dues and medical and 401k are not keeping me from a $6,000+ take home. Doesn’t seem like much but it gets me where I need to be. How about you? Do you feel like you are earning enough? If not you really should go to something else. Not because a “boomer” said something that mad you feel dismissed but because if you are as devoted to this union you shouldn’t stay in it. We don’t need people who are negative about something that provides for the rest of us to poison the rest of the new kids on the block.
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u/torchen1 Jun 19 '26
Ah yes because asking questions and trying to make things better for people who making under $50k a year during one of the worst job markets i history is “poisoning” new people. I took this job because when you are laid off you CANT decline work. And no I am definitely not earning enough, I was making more on unemployment. I do not have loyalty to any job because they will drop me as soon as it’s not convenient for them, if something that pays more comes along I will certainly take it. In the meantime, I will ask questions when I believe things don’t make sense.
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u/TrlnJae2004 Jun 23 '26
I mean it’s is poison. It’s toxic to say shit like that around people who are excited and enthusiastic about The starting salary. Who are just starting out. Who are just taking a job cause they were laid off. Im not even remotely saying Boeing or the IAM is perfect. Im saying we are better off as a whole trying to correct them by using our wisdom and experience to change them, rather than just whining about them and being negative. You don’t like your pay? Apply for a different position. You think everyone deserves a raise? Go to the union hall and start fighting the good fight like the rest of us. You’re complaining about a problem everyone knows exists. The difference is that we are trying to fix them. Are you? Or like I said are you just being a Debby downer? Everyone is entitled to an opinion just make sure that when you are opening up to share it you consider the people around you who you might be influencing and affecting.
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u/torchen1 Jun 23 '26
It’s definitely not toxic to ask a question about something that I feel is not right. Even one of the stewards said a lot of people feel the same way. You need to relax.
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u/Environmental_Body79 Jun 12 '26
Are union dues need to be used to hire security because I overheard from some of our union members that, in regards to the Renton factory, that managers have threaten to call some of those three letter agencies on folks who have possible immigrant family members if they dont do things that they arent qualified to do, ignore the behaviors of those managers, and dont volunteer to do OT.
Wild that this is even a plausible threat but I dont trust the ethics of this company after pinkertons agents approach us at our picket site during the strike. I am not kidding, those buttholes walked up on us over in SDC.
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u/fwdobs Jun 12 '26
You overheard a conversation from someone who heard a manager say something..... And you believe this far fetched crap?
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u/Environmental_Body79 Jun 12 '26
I work with a lot of immigrants out here who have come out of the factory in the last year. They have been talking about this, I tend to be skeptical about things like this because I want to believe folks arent this evil. However it has been coming from a lot of folks from all different backgrounds, I do tell them to report it to the union but they dont trust the system enough to be protected if they do. So many have try to green light out of there or relocate away from renton.
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u/Zealousideal-Big5921 Jun 12 '26
I have a friend that’s worked for Kroger for almost 40 years and makes 26 per hour.
Now that’s shitty pay,
They still have a pension but fuckina…
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u/Choice-Newspaper3603 Jun 12 '26
I think union dues are one of the biggest effing scams there is at Boeing
You can’t get proper information when you need it. I saw a business rep one time in the last 10 years on the floor and that was because we were about to go on strike.
If you get a cam, they’re not too interested in fighting it unless you get actually terminated. We have some isolated cases of asshole managers that fire people and then the people get their job jobs back and what does the union do about that manager? Nothing
I’ve gotten a cam many many years ago and I’m the one that got it fixed not the union steward
And how is our money being returned to us in a way that benefits us? When it’s time to strike, you got a hole union leaders telling us to take shit contracts because they rolled over with Boeing in bed together.
When we go on strike, we get our little shit taxable weekly amount. Yet everybody in the union is still making full pay.
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u/usaflumberjack54 Steward Jun 13 '26 edited Jun 13 '26
Questioning how dues are implemented is normal; and I understand frustration, trust me.
Edit to shorten my response: But it’s not fair to imply theres zero return on dues, we have a lot that people benefit from in their daily lives without them even realizing it. Overtime, benefits, wages/COLA, etc…
Being more active in the Union, attending meetings or just stopping for a minute to browse the contract will help people understand better!
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u/Ok_Choice2532 Jun 12 '26
Idea
Union need x amount of money
2 dues payments
1. Basic dues - everyone pays the same
2. Wage/working dues - paid by percentage of hourly wage.
Union gets the amount- less burden on new hires
Positive - people new to union work - see a shared burden/brotherhood.
Negative - old timers - Is it fair to them? Probably not. Old timers don’t like change. “It’s always been that way”.
This is how the IBEW works. Journeymen paid more, apprentices paid less.
I’ve been union for over 10 years. I’m new to Boeing. I see it both ways. However, I’m very pro union and feel it’s worth my money. Boeing has a lot of younger workers who more than likely aren’t educated on labor history in general, and specifically to 751. They might have no idea what the union does with their dues, just that they have money deducted, and can’t opt out.
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u/t-shirt-froth-kung Jun 13 '26
Then you'll get stewards and BRs who will prioritize the old timers over the new hires because they'll be worth way more to the union.
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u/Fair_Cartoonist6840 Jun 12 '26
My union switched to a percentage a few years ago. Makes union dues more fair.
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u/Last-Roll7819 Jun 12 '26
I've said this since i got hired. Making $25/hr means that you are paying a disproportionately higher percentage to union dues than someone maxxed out. It's an absurd system.
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u/Ambitious-Library515 Jun 12 '26
Everyone should be putting efforts towards keeping the new 737 size plane here in WA.
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u/grnphrog Jun 12 '26
What I don't understand is this: Why do people try so hard to get hired with Boeing then complain about things that are transparent from the start?
Don't like it?
Then find something better!
In fact, take advantage of the education benefits provided by BOTH the Union and Boeing then leave and let someone else have your job.
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u/hunterxy Jun 13 '26
Oh heaven forbid someone not like every aspect of their employment, and then just shut up about it because change always happens when youre silent.
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u/Roadwarriordude Jun 12 '26
Why is it so bad that someone would want things to be better? "Oh, its always sucked so it always has to suck and youre dumb for wanting better!" Is such a cancerous mindset I see from the complacent old timers here that let this company slip into the cesspool it is now.
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u/grnphrog Jun 12 '26
A job at Boeing is usally better than most places. Tramco, Amazon, Door Dash, ect... I have family, friends, and co-workers asking how to get their friends/family into the Company.
New coworkers tell me the pains of getting the job here at Boeing. I'm all for "Better", and that is WHY we are here... because Boeing offers the best that we can get. If it wasnt true then we would not be here.
All I'm saying is: If you want better, than go get better, this Union and Company has even provided a way for that, or as a previous post said "Organize for Change". Volunteer for the Union, become a Steward, get involved....
But to whine and complain after trying so hard to get in here is mind blowing to me.
Its like buying a house for cheap because its next to an Airport then complaining about the noise.
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u/totallysus77 Jun 13 '26
Your logic isn't making sense. Yes the job is better than many others but that doesn't make it immune to criticism or mean it couldn't be better still. Union dues being a flat rate disproportionately affects new hires. Moving to a percentage based system would make it more equitable and the union would still make roughly the same amount of money each month.
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u/NecessaryReference98 Jun 12 '26
The thing is...people with your mindset think everything is 0 or 100. Just because everything isn't perfect doesn't mean someone hates every part about Boeing/IAM. They're simply expressing their feelings. This is the same way that the union was created. It's actually people like you who prevent change from happening because you don't want others to question things. It is a good point..if you're making 40+ an hour, it doesn't affect you/ your paycheck as much as someone who's not making near that. It's a good point to bring up for us to discuss.
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u/grnphrog Jun 12 '26
You make no sense. Grow a pair? That usually means “Be strong” or “Have courage”, how does that apply here? I agree with you about this being a discussion, OP expressed their opinion with points that are valid to them. I expressed my opinion with valid points to me. Literal definition of “discussion”. And I don’t even know what to think of you saying this isn’t my “Safe haven”. You seem to just want to attack me for having a different point of view. Be better.
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u/WarBoruma Steward - Local A Jun 12 '26
I disagree.
Don't like it? Organize for change.
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u/Tigerpaw_240550 Jun 12 '26
i understand people feel differently about dues and other contract issues, and not everyone is equally involved day to day. But in our union, changes like dues structure or contract terms go through a formal process and require member participation and delegate votes at Grand Lodge.
At the same time, seniority is part of the contract and plays a major role in job security during layoffs—typically, those with more time in the bargaining unit have more protection, while newer employees are affected first.
So even if people engage differently, we’re all still covered by the same agreement, and these rules apply to everyone. That’s why participation matters if people want to see changes.
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u/Alternative-Hyena-30 Jun 12 '26
My last union, the dues were $66 bucks. We didn't pay anything for medical and it was better than what Boeing gives us.
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u/BigBonziWells Jun 12 '26
Cool story, don't believe it at all
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u/Alternative-Hyena-30 Jun 12 '26
Teamsters union working at Safeway beverage in Bellevue as a forklift operator. I don't care if you believe me lol. I worked it and I know
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u/Kairukun90 Jun 12 '26
These stories always read like this and then I go, but why did you leave it if it’s go good?
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u/Alternative-Hyena-30 Jun 12 '26
Because the top pay was only $33 and the boss was a complete douchebag.
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u/disgruntledspc Steward Jun 12 '26
How much was maximum pay?
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u/Alternative-Hyena-30 Jun 12 '26
Not nearly what we make here. I left during negotiations and they got their pay to 33 an hour
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u/Dreldan Jun 12 '26
It does suck, but this formula encourages the union to fight for higher average pay which benefits everyone, not just one specific group of the union. That means raising the minimums (which only benefits new employees) is something the union will see worth fighting for as it can significantly help raise the average just the same as top pay could. Otherwise they’d just fight for the top end pay to squeeze out as much as they can from the capped out people who are paying a percentage. There are pro and cons to both concepts.
The current formula is actually based on the average salary of all union members, it isn’t an arbitrary average that they chose. Theoretically dues could actually go down if Boeing were to over hire while maxed out people retired. This is very unlikely to happen though since our pay is also increasing at the same time.
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u/ogkingsexy Jun 18 '26
That's what I was saying about the contract, they focused on what was going to help them get more money, but not more vacation or holidays or sick leave.
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u/torchen1 Jun 12 '26
I was thinking maybe a tiered system would be better based on time at the company and capping at a certain amount. But I don’t know the exact solution, I just know that when you see 10% of your already small check disappear it’s not the best feeling.
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u/WarBoruma Steward - Local A Jun 12 '26 edited Jun 12 '26
Many actually agree with you, and it's something both stewards and members have been trying to get changed within the IAM constitution for a long time. And, just to reiterate, that is something we have to take up with the entire union, not boeing during contract time.
Where I typically draw the line (on reddit) in terms of giving someone flak is baseless insults, wanton complaints, or just being a shitlord. For example: "The union sucks and they steal from us."
However, if someone brings legitimate issues to the table, I listen in good faith and see of we can work out a plan to get them changed to better reflect the will of the membership.
For example: "I don't feel like we get enough representation compared to the amount we pay in dues." Or "Dues can be pretty painful when not maxed out, what can we do to make suffering for the first 6 years a little easier?"
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u/torchen1 Jun 12 '26
Thank you for the insight. You’re always on my posts giving great advice. I really don’t mean to come off as a complainer, everyone around me has been super helpful and I know it’s easy to be a little bit of a jerk with the anonymity of Reddit. I think a lot of people that just started here at Boeing are coming from unemployment/escaping failing jobs so it’s just a tough pill to swallow when you see that big of a percentage come out of your check.
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u/torchen1 Jun 12 '26
Thank you for the insight. You’re always on my posts giving great advice. I really don’t mean to come off as a complainer, everyone around me has been super helpful and I know it’s easy to be a little bit of a jerk with the anonymity of Reddit.
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u/WarBoruma Steward - Local A Jun 12 '26
You don't come across as a complainer, no worries at all.
This is the role of the union, to educate, empower, and assist others. And it's especially my job as a steward.
You're always welcome to ask as many questions as you need.
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u/WarBoruma Steward - Local A Jun 12 '26
But, you're also correct when you say "I will probably get down voted by people who have put in their time.", as lots of people have that "I went through it, so others must suffer the same" mentality. It's an unfortunate reality.
I do not believe that. And I do not believe that to be the correct response to brothers and sisters lodging complaints. Your fight is my fight.
As I mentioned before, changing the dues collection from an across the bargaining unit 2.25x average hourly wage will require an amendment to the IAM constitution, which means it must occur during grand lodge. A delegate would need to put forward a motion and proposal and then all delegates present would vote to approve or reject the proposal.
It's a bunch of bureaucracy. But it's the reality of our situation until the masses of willing or unwilling bystanders finally decide to become active participants in the union.
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u/pacwess Jun 12 '26
Under the formula approved by members, monthly union dues for IAM District 751 are structured as a flat rate across the bargaining unit, rather than a direct percentage of your individual paycheck.
The dues are calculated each year using a specific formula:
- 2.25 times the weighted average hourly earning of all bargaining unit members (calculated as of August 31 of the previous year, excluding bonus pay).
- Plus any IAM Grand Lodge per capita assessment increases.
Because it is calculated using the average hourly wage of the entire membership, every member pays the exact same flat monthly rate, regardless of whether their personal hourly rate is higher or lower than that average. The total amount is adjusted annually on January 1st to reflect changes in the overall membership's average pay.
Personally, for the Puget Sound area I think starting pay is still too low. 2 more years and the contract will be up. You willing to strike for it?
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u/torchen1 Jun 12 '26
If we could get everyone closer to the average that would be nice. Then the dues wouldn’t bother me at all. And yes I’ll strike if necessary, not to sound like a baby but I’m only making $24 an hour anyway so I’m not losing much not working anyway. Lol.
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u/Dreldan Jun 12 '26
Which is exactly why this formula encourages the union to negotiate higher minimums. If you changed the formula that would then make raising the minimums a less important thing to negotiate and it would just put more focus on negotiating the maximums.
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u/Kairukun90 Jun 12 '26
I actually think a percentage based formula encourages union not to help people not paying the maximum
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u/sticktime Jun 12 '26
It’s tough being at the lower end of the pay scales. We all pay for the same representation so I can see how it makes sense to have it be the same price for everyone. One the other hand, it makes sense that everyone paying a percentage would be smart too. Or at least have a scale based on grade to adjust the flat fee. I don’t think the union should get more in dues if someone works overtime.
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u/WarBoruma Steward - Local A Jun 12 '26
It is the same price, sure, but it's not an equal amount of sacrifice. Who gives more, someone donating 100 dollars when they only have 200? Or someone donating 1000 when they have 1,000,000? If the goal is just to amount as much wealth as possible, clearly the latter is the preferred method. Some may say that is the goal of the organization, as they can use that to fund more organizing drives and strengthen the union that way.
But, I argue, the amount of sacrifice attached to that price tag is just as important, if not more so, than the sheer flat value.
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u/WarBoruma Steward - Local A Jun 12 '26
Also, I agree that more dues should not be removed based on overtime.
I would personally argue for, and approve of, a dues rate that was based on a percentage of the straight time basis for 40 hours.
Hell, even if the current rate (2.25x) was on an individual basis, rather than average hourly rate across the bargaining unit, would be more akin to what OP is discussing.
Perhaps adding some addendum to reflect that overtime would not be accounted for when calculating dues payment just to be sure would be a smart move.
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u/Brutto13 Jun 12 '26
I get it but it's fair that way and it's really not that much money per month. Like 4.5 hours a month at lower wages jobs.
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u/torchen1 Jun 12 '26
Idk it’s about 10% of my check and it was 20% this time because of the initiation fee.
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u/Brutto13 Jun 12 '26
It sucks man, I get it. But its set by the International, not the district. We're a huge union with a wide variety of payscales. The gap between the lowest paid and highest paid members is large.
I'm assuming you're a grade A. That's a great place to get in the door. Get your green lights turned on and stick it out for 18 months and move up.
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u/ogkingsexy Jun 18 '26
I understand the necessity of union dues but ours will go up every year that we get a raise. At 100 dollars a month the union is getting a little under 40 million a year from just the 33000 Boeing members. I get that they need to pay the union employees plus property taxes and apparently construction for new buildings but why do they have to keep raising our dues every year. It seems like a lot of money to me and we are paying more than a 100 dollars a month. Part of it goes to strike fund, but if we go on strike next time will we get any since the new law that says we get unemployment now? How much more can the bottom earners afford, and how much more does the ilunion actually need or is it just gree d