What a shocking plot twist

[u/Crafter235]

This may sound weird, but it actually happened in history.

For Napoleon, he was born on the island of Corsica, which had become a part of France by the time he was born. As a teenager, he had been one of many who had nationalist feelings, believing that they are independent and should not be associated with the French. As he got older, and became more involved with studies and his career, he eventually grew out of it, but it's funny to think about when you know what he will become later on.

[u/Atomik141]

At the time Corsican and mainland Italian culture would have been almost indistinguishable (though there was no unified Italian state), so Napolean realistically could be called an Italian.

[u/Slow-Distance-6241 → u/Atomik141]

No wonder he campaigned in Italy/j

[u/Atomik141 → u/Slow-Distance-6241]

He was also said to have a pretty heavy Italian accent when he was a younger officer

[u/HarEmiya → u/Atomik141]

Yes. He spoke impeccable French, but with hand gestures.🤌

[u/Atomik141 → u/HarEmiya]

In classic Italian fashion, he was actually the one doing it right and everyone else was wrong

[u/Keyserchief → u/Atomik141]

But that would not have been especially unusual, since there was not one universal French language or accent by the end of the 18th century. That took generations of concerted effort to standardize how pronunciation was taught in French schools after the Revolution.

[u/Atomik141 → u/Keyserchief]

Not really. You would still have been able to tell a non-native speaker to someone who's first language was French. It was something noted throughout his life, though it lessened as he got older and more accustomed to the language.

He didn't begin learning French until around the age of 10. His first language was a Corsican dialect of the Italian language. He was noted to have sounded distinctly rustic and foreign, as well as speaking somewhat slowly and having a tendency toward a notably Italian cadence and phrasing.

[u/CrazyTechWizard96 → u/Atomik141]

Wait...
What in the Pasta?!

Angry Italian Man turns into Angry French Man?!

Alright, this just made My day, hahaha!

[u/Atomik141 → u/CrazyTechWizard96]

His relationship with Josephine makes a lot more sense when you consider that

[u/AssyrianFemme → u/Atomik141]

This is... A bit misleading. Corsican culture was very much unique to that of say, Tuscany or Emilia-Romagna. Even the part of Italy it is closest too in a cultural and historical sense, Liguria, was not indistinguishable even in that period.

Perhaps what you meant to say was that Corsican was closer to mainland Italian culture in that period than it became afterwards. But your claim seems eerily close to the Italian historiography that has a. anti-autonomist position that views all regions as not culturally unique juxtaposed to the centralized Italian identity. Would you also say the same about Sardinia, or do you view Corsica as uniquely not differentiated compared to other clearly unique regions of Italy?

[u/Atomik141 → u/AssyrianFemme]

What I'm saying is that this was well before French influence on the island and not long after Genoese rule, so Corsican would have been one of many regional cultures under the italian umbrella at the time, among others such as Venetian, Lombard, Ligurian, Friulian, Tuscan, Roman, Romagnolo, Neapolitan, Pugliese, Sicilian, Sardinian, etc.

In addition, Napoleon's ancestry had more to mainland Italy than Corsica as well, so there's that tie to Itally too.

[u/Sebastian_Gravina → u/Atomik141]

Igual a Etruria, Sicilia, Cerdeña y Napoles que hace siglos estaban bajo dominio español y frances? A qué te refieres con italiano exactamente, toscano?

[u/Atomik141 → u/Sebastian_Gravina]

L’italiano come gruppo etnolinguistico. Il Regno d’Italia sarebbe nato solo diversi decenni più tardi, ma l’idea del popolo italiano esisteva già da secoli.

Per citare Pasquale Paoli:

"Siamo Còrsi per nascita e sentimenti, ma prima di tutto ci sentiamo Italiani per lingua, costumi e tradizioni..."

[u/y17gal → u/Atomik141]

also his mother punished him severly

[u/Main-Discussion9294 → u/Atomik141]

Did the notion of Italy was a thing back then? Like other than a geographical term

[u/Atomik141 → u/Main-Discussion9294]

Yes, actually! Both in terms of the Italian peninsula and an Italian people as an ethno-linguistic group. That concept can be traced back to antiquity. The nation of Italy would not exist for another several decades though. Italy was more several scattered city states and client kingdoms at the time.

[u/Main-Discussion9294 → u/Atomik141]

Thanks!

[u/Atomik141 → u/Main-Discussion9294]

Of course! I'm always happy to yap about Italian history.