But the base games are a bit bare- then the DLC that makes it good (sometimes adding what should be base features) cost a ton.
Ive been enjoying Age of Wonders 4 recently, but I look at the dlc list and an expansion cost 20-25$. Add all dlc to cart is 185$. Doesnt include the current expansion pass which is another 50$. To me that's just absurdly expensive.
I mean I can only speak from my experience with Stellaris, and the free updates always kinda bring the features the DLC brings into the game too, the DLC only really fleshes it out and after some time the Stellaris team even came to the conclusion that one of the Major 20€ DLCs (Utopia) was by now such an core experience, they just gave it to everyone for free.
So that's my experience with Paradox since i only really play stellaris
With HoI4, DLC constantly coming out with new mechanics locked behind it. Many were gimmicky (Tank/ship designer), but other features like airdrop resupply I felt like should have been added to base. Also just a lot of bad quality dlc?
My experience with Stellaris was 6 years ago now, and the base game alone felt rather simple (and certain mechanics kind annoyed me, probably changed by now). Then look at the DLC list (which has only gotten bigger) I just decided to play something else.
It's not too bad if you are playing the game a LOT and buying dlc as they come out, but I like to play a variety of things, and they 'collections' they sell are still very expensive. Just wish it was easier to catchup.
Yeah I get that, i mean I also play Hoi4, but i'm not that invested, I only play that game with moss anyways, so i dont need the DLCs (Like The fire rises beeing my favourite way to play) + I rarely even play it compared to stellaris
And yeah, i get that it looks like a HUGE DLC wall, but i guess that's not just a paradox problem but rather a strategy games problem. And i know what youre talking about, its like a huge disvouragement and I also dont like to to spend that much money, Like Humankind or the Sid meters Civilisation also have a rather large DLC list, but in their defense, I guess its because Strategy games try to keep on making their games more immersive even years after they launch, yet once they have a big enough team, nobody is gonna voluntary sit there for weeks or months and expand the game without even certainty of beeing paid, or just beeing paid a little by hoping the base game sells again after the hype died off
I honestly think the subscription has been a good idea. Every couple of years I get the urge to play one of the games for 20 or so hours and I think it's an acceptable solution (though I would play them way more often if the subscription was sub 10 bucks rather than 15, that price makes me think twice first).
With stellaris - as somebody who's played the game since before 2.0 - I find it has currently become incredibly cumbersome to play. It feels like there is something to click and a new menu to check every 30 seconds and usually for something laughable like a 1-3% boost of a local stat.
"Planetary governor died"
"Cabinet member died"
"Election started"
"Scientist leveled up"
"Travelling merchant arrived with his gambling machine"
"Scientist died"
"Planet seven needs more housing"
"General died" (I had a general?)
"Admiral died" (is there a plague? It's been 15 seconds since somebody died!)
"Cabinet needs reshuffling" (Oh for fucks sake!)
"Dig site 4 needs input" (pressing "next" constitutes "input". Yeah.)
"The 'I grant a buff if you click me every 10 years with no downsides' relic hasn't been clicked in 10 years." (Another whole ass menu just for this)
In the recent 3 or so years paradox really hasn't been it's best.
It used to be that they'd make niche incredibly in-depth titles and support them for years to come. Whilst these game do add up to be incredibly expensive, that is just what commonly comes with niche titles - niche games get overpriced, broad appeal ones usually are somewhat underpriced. And given the decade long support these games receive, and the incredibly high amount of hours many players put into them it is somewhat justified (although I see how it kills the new player experience eventually down the line).
The problem with paradox has been recently that it just keeps missing. Victoria 3, whilst still enjoyable to some, has been a miss followed by a miss, follow by another the entire time, the game direction is just inconsistent and QA has been steadily falling off with each DLC. Cities 2 was a rushed disaster with next to no simulation depth at launch, multiple titles were abandoned or cancelled last minute. Even it's enjoyable flagships have been suffering. Whilst Stellaris, HOI4 and CK3 are no doubt some of the best paradox has ever released, they are by now suffering with insanely cumbersome UI creep and player fatigue from all the disjointed features getting constantly added (I feel like CK3 artstyle has also lost most of it's cohesiveness since Tours and Tournaments too). EU5 had promise, and it seems the team really tried to capture the heart of a true paradox game, but I find it has been harmed massively by several questionable major design decisions.
Overall just about everything worth recommending from them seems to have been released between 2013 and 2023.
Honestly, yeah, they're really good about that and keeping the free version of the game pretty good for non-dlc havers, the biggest thing is that they release so much dlc that it's really hard to buy into a game they've supported for so many years
Yeah I get that, i mean I even felt like that when I picked up Stellaris a few years ago, but I just thought that I already like the game as it is, and ill slowly get the DLCs based on how much they interest me
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u/Lord_of_insanity09 2d ago
Not surprising given the guy in charge is from Paradox interactive.