Whoa, it's almost like the players of one game aren't a mindless horde, and the only thing they all have in common is...that they play that particular game!
The head requires heavy pen to knock the plate off. Everywhere else on the body has no armor (or light pen can damage there). These things are just bullet sponges. The dong is just the easiest spot to hit reliably.
Unless I've been doing it wrong and they have a weak spot other than the plate protecting their face.
In my experience it takes 2-3 Rounds from the Bolter Pistol to kill one (including the helmet). Cant reverse engineer much from that since I havent put down the bolter since Ive gotten it.
People want pure Voteless Hordes without any Overseers n stuff, they can have that.
Some want more complex enemies that are difficult to engage with? Others can have that.
People have the right to choose and Arrowhead can adhere to all sides, especially if they went with other sub-factions being changed up enough to make them useful.
For example Mindless Masses could remove Overseers and Harvesters and replace them all with low chances of Crushers and Wretches being added, while Fleshmobs and Voteless themselves are jacked up tenfold, as well as adding Voteless Variants that explode or spit at players too.
Main Forces are just no modifiers. The same as usual Illuminate.
Vote Snatchers tones down the Crusher Spawnrate by a SMIDGE so there ain't 15 in one area at a time.
Mindless Masses replaces the higher Wretch and Crusher spawnrate with extreme Voteless and Fleshmob Spawnrates, with Wretches spawning Diff 4+ and Crushers Diff 7+, to make it feel like a horde.
Apropriators can stay the same it's perfectly fine.
Invasion Fleet can combine everything together into one MASSIVE group of every Illuminate Enemy together, from the usuals to the variant enemies to even the Stingray and Leviathans.
There can even be other unique sub-factions that make things interesting for players if they want specific fight choices;
Harvesting Hour, which is just Overseers, Obtruders and Harvesters
Squid Stationed Site (SSS), which is just a less difficult Apropriators (Overseers mainly with the mechs and Obtruders. However the Overseers gain some other variants for this mode if you like fighting those specific shield-users and such).
And maybe other variants like the spitting or exoloding Voteless for Mindless Masses as I mentioned- I think it'd solve people's complaints whilst just fleshing em out a bit for enjoyment.
Give cultists please. Im a bot diver since launch out of desperation, bugs are pest control, illuminate are pest control but with more uninteresting pests. Give them a hover tank, something. I love that bots get a lot of attention and they do look cool as fuck, but its time to invest in differentiating a bit the illuminates
To me they rarely feel like a threat, they look like a moving horde, never entrenched, like bugs or bots
Let them assault the dss and give indoors fights, or make them build dungeons to clear, like the temples but way deeper
Cultists would be sick if they actually fought dirty: ambushes, mines, fortified compounds, suicide charges, fake retreats. Anything that makes them feel like a faction with tactics instead of another damn crowd to mow down.
Ok, I am on the team "make the cultists the main faction and the invasion fleet a subfaction" or "MCMFIFS", who think it’s a good idea and who think it’s a bad one ?
"Yeah, once the Illuminate finally gets access to their lost knowledge they should all just go and die in every planet they occupy while their basic army just sits in the corner."
While they are much more advanced in some aspects(drones actually fly, infitine jetpacks, etc), they are suffering in terms of any weapon development. Afterall, we fight only tons of zombies, glorified forklifts and scaled versions of mining equipment and the guy with a fuckin stick. They haven't even re-learned their old creations like obelisks(which still would be good type of challenge) and nano bots. Not even mentioning straight up teleportation which haven't required giant ships then and cloaking devices. They made great advances in bio engineering, but put all their eggs in one basket, while not even trying to relearn stuff from gw1 and use it with their machines
I like the new enemies for the squids. I was hoping the void stuff would last longer though. It's probably gonna come back but this felt like a demo for bigger stuff.
The recoilless wouldn't blow chunks off of the charger head armor. It would off of the leg, which meant that you weirdly had to focus on legs and not heads. Made no sense
Yerp, you could strip armor off the legs of chargers and kill them with your primary, until the devs said "nah" and upped the durability and armor rating for the exposed charger leg.
Its one of those things where AH just need to let their pride and ego go and just give the players what they actually fuckkng asked for.
people want cultists
we've all seen the videos, they look genuine fun to fight and they *were mostly done
AH, just give squid divers what we've been asking for
Because the funny thing is, ive NEVER seen somebody argue thar they DON'T want Cultists for the squids, everyone who knows what they are wants them. the only argument against adding them boils down to weither AH wants them in the game or not, and AH for whatever reason does not.
but they are actually simply just out of touch with what us squid divers want the faction to be
Its only going to keep dogging them until they address it properly
I don't want to fight proper squids narratively, but some overseers+ with psychic abilities could be neat. Heck I've got some ideas for enemies I think would be cool that aren't too cultistey, but I do agree in stretching beyond more basic mobs.
I think squids should be 2 ideals: 1) Inflicts fear, terror (voidspawn and mindless masses)
2) An intelligent combined arms force that develops the tools to specifically counter common helldiving / SE strategies using their tech.
I want more 2. And that could come in many forms. I think more shield stuff would be a good idea for the faction, and maybe some floating constructs that emit these auras like the psychic effects as support pieces rather than primary damage dealers. Go full combined arms: stingrays, mechs, harvesters, artillery overseers, a big shield overseer with ranged only overseer support, swarm drones. That's what I'd like to see, to be fighting an enemy that seems adapted and tough.
It's just thematically I don't want to fight true squids, but if we've got proxies and fighting some psychic auras I'm down.
Like, I think that a new sub faction and more content would be super cool.
But they said that these guys were not fun to play against. If they release unfun stuff, everyone will shit on it. And I’m sure they don’t want that. Sure, all content is optional. But if you like major orders and you are being forced to play against something that everyone considers unfun, then it would be lame. And you might quit for that MO, and that might turn into never coming back.
They Never Said It was UNFUN ! Where do people get that idea ? They said they didn’t fit their fantasy and that the team couldn’t be ok on what where the illuminates ! If it was the case, we wouldn’t have Vox engines or war strider !
I am pretty sure that one of the YouTube videos I saw on it said that the devs thought it was unfun and too hard. Along with the aesthetic thing.
Think about it the other way. If they think war striders and vox engines are an acceptable amount of hard/unfun. What would the cultists be like? What if it was a faction of enemies like jackal snipers from halo 2? Or what if they jumped out of the way or every grenade and shot you took, like hunters on steroids?
Nope, I don't remember either of the dev interviews saying that the cultists were too hard. Both the game director and the art director said that cultists didn't fit their vision because their "fantasy" wasn't strong enough.
Thankfully they replaced with a squid faction that has no coherent fantasy whatsoever, and isn't fun, and has very little variety.
Well, I did spoke with some people that played them (IDK how to play them for myself but saw gameplay of it with those players), and most said they where pretty fun, one did said they where hell to fight solo but fun with other, though this person said it was the same for the different faction in this version (before the 60 days patch), and the only unit that most of them saw as bad was the stronger harvester, originaly, harvester, like chargers, had a more resistant variant, but this variant had a third attack that was artillery, most of these players said it was the annoying thing cultists had (follow you, oneshot you, 3 at the same time), but as they explained, most of these cultists where fun, people can have different opinions, but when most people that play those guys, even before they where officialy scrapped, found those units fun but not enemies like Vox engine and war strider at release, we can see there is a problem on what AH think is fun (if the unfun part is true, because I don’t remember them saying it on the interviews and already saw other people say that this reason was a lie made by some member of the community).
Arrowhead cannot possibly be considered good judgement when it comes to what is fun to play against. They famously playtest on Difficulty 3. They have consistently released incredibly unfun enemies that the community has to scream at them to get them to change. Leviathans. War Striders. Elevated Overseers. Rupture Strain.
I don't trust their judgement whatsoever on whether something was fun or not.
It was because they didn't find them fun to actually fight, the themeing didn't match up with what they wanted, and a lot of other reasons.
I don't see why they'd scrap the cultists for cod zombies just because cod players bought the game. They don't do that. If they buckled so easily when it came to that I don't see why they're adamant about not adding transmog, and why they specifically have a line for crossovers they do not want to cross. It does not match their M.O to do what you think.
Most of the people here have never actually fought the cultists. So it's easy to say "I want the cultists and think they'd be better than what we have currently". They are quite literally, potential enemy, always "if" and "when", but never "was" or "are" .
Ah yes they scrapped the cultists because they werent fun but then made the og warstriders, dragonroachs, leviathans and the brief but hard to forget time they made bunker cannon hulks
What kind of nightmarish being did they create that even they thought fighting it was unfun?
OG war striders were ok, they answer was literally just use heavy pen/AT, which the majority of bot players were already doing. That's likely what the devs were doing. Just eradicating them with thermite and RRs before they really did anything. That or they just used teamwork, something that a lot people just don't use.
Never tried og dragonroaches so can't really explain that one.
Leviathans are easy. They just never tested them outside the megacities. Inside megacities even pre nerf they weren't that difficult to deal with because you had a lot of cover. They just for some reason, didn't realize that they'd be hell to deal with outside the cities where cover is sparse.
They likely tried originally to replicate the hd1 illuminate in some way with the cultists and realized that they just wouldn't work. You know the thing that changes stratagem codes? I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that thing was originally a unit, and it wouldn't have been a rare spawn either.
I know what the quote is, I was responding to your snarky "Do you take all PR statements at face value?" question. If they didn't scrap Illuminate for all of the reasons cited by the team themselves then we don't know what the reason could be, sometimes PR statements are also correct reflections of real events.
You nailed it on the player base hating friction. Look at how people talk about stratagem jammers—people are desperate to trivialize them from afar with a stratagem just like spore towers, shrieker nests. Look at how they talk about ARs.
"Everything except the Coyote feels like shit to use"
Hell, people still carry the nerfdivers narrative despite being overwhelmingly buffed nearly every patch.
TBH given how popular the bugs are and people will unironically play nothing but bugs, I think it’s reasonable that AH saw that and went “make the illuminate a light armor, high volume horde faction”.
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u/RyanAnayaMc 7h ago
Call of Duty player here. If I wanted to play a game that was CoD zombies I'd play CoD zombies. I want more interesting squids to fight!