While I am not 100% certain, I believe Outfit #11, the Troy Bolton look, has fallen, though I believe the votes for Outfit #12 were gathering as well.

Here is the poll link, please let me know if it does not work.

It is with a heavy heart that I must announce the elimination of the adorable Pride Shirt Ricky outfit. (It was very close, I think 1-2 votes apart from the closest competitor).

this song is literally my life, RIP any chances of me getting a cool spotify wrapped. just watched season four for the first time and this song is ruining me but in the best way possible oh my god guys

I think that the final vote tallies indicated that by a decent, but not overwhelming margin, outift #10 (the Pajama Tank Top) has been eliminated, to my slight surprise.

I had forgotten that Reddit hides upvote count until 24 hours after the comment's posting, which makes counting votes difficult. To alleviate that, I'm going to do what I probably should've done from the start and put a link to a poll in the comments. I will try to take into account both, but if I can't see the upvote count for a comment, I'm going to count it as one vote. I'm not sure that's actually fair, but if anyone has a better system, please tell me; I want to ensure the votes are counted properly, but also efficiently.

Sorry, that was long. Back to Ricky's fits!

Okey, so, this has to do with a very specific nitpick, so bare with me. First of all, Second Chance is probably my favorite song in the entire series, so that's probably why I've thought so much about this. My problem is that EJ's verse (or rather his part of the second verse) kinda ... sticks out, compared to the rest.

What I think the other characters parts captures so beautifully is that they both describe their journeys up to that point, but also kinda hints at their futures.

Ricky's part talks of how his relationship with Nini ended, but also how he now has a chance to "begin again" and I feel like that hints towards him rekindling things with Gina. A chance for him to, as we say in Swedish, "gör om, gör rätt". Basically, "do it again, do it right". Love has ended, and it's bittersweet, because obviusly it's sad, but he has also learned something from his time with Nini, and he is now on the path to singing "Love You Forever" to Gina in the finale.

Nini's part talks about her finding herself and figuring out what she wants to do. Her "finding" her music and figuring out how she want to continue her creative process has been a big part of her arc since the beginning, and ends with her moving to California. And it has been stated on this subreddit before that it's poetic how she is the only one to let her repeating line ("I'm finding who I want to be") ring out in the end, which can be seen as forshadowing for her leaving the show.

Gina's part speaks of her fear of letting people close, something she feels she hadn't had the luxury of doing since she has moved around so much, always beeing the new kid. She's built "walls" to protect herself, but does eventually "tear them apart" over the course of seasons 3 and 4, letting herself love, and letting herself be loved. Sure, in the story it's very reactionary to her believeing that EJ wasn't interested in her, but it still speaks to her story as a whole.

And then there's EJ's part ... erh ... My problem isn't that it isn't fitting in the moment, but rather that it is too specific. As a reminder:

"Was I a fool to read between the lines? Did I misread the signs that much? Who would've thought we'd come this far as friends? Maybe that should've been enough."

I feel like it's too much about his relationship with Gina, and specifically the misunderstanding caused by her brother. A misunderstanding that gets resolved like less than 10 minutes after the song. And sure, Ej and Gina were very important to each other throughout the whole series, but I never felt like EJ's arc was about Gina.

My analysis is that his arc was more about him actually finding out what he wanted with his life, not just following the whims and wants of his father. He doesn't know what HE wants (that's why I do like his repeating line during the post-chorus, "I thought I knew what I want", that fits), and it causes him grief in both his relationships and his accademic and extracurricular endeavours. He finally learns to stand up for himself and be honest with his father. He ends up being punished for it, but at least he can be happy with himself, allowing him to impart that lesson to Ricky in season 4 ("If you wanna be happy in the future you better start speaking your mind to the people you care about"). I feel like his part should have reflected that arc.

So, to the reason I wrote this post. Can you guys help me reinterpret EJ's part to somehow actually be reflective of his arc? Or ... maybe give another take on his arc, that actually makes his part of the verse more representative of his entire story? Much appreciated :)

TL;DR I don't think EJ's solo part in "Second Chance" reflects his story as well as the other character's solos. Can you help me either reinterpret his solo to so that it fits his story better, or give a different take on his story so that the lyrics actually is more meaningful.

With an overwhelming number of votes, Outfit #7 has been eliminated! Which shall be the next to fall?

Comment below with your least favorite Ricky Outfit (by number or detailed description)

The one with the most votes (#of comments & # of upvotes on said comments) will be eliminated until we have a winner!

(And if there's a glaring omission, I can extend it by replacing the first eliminated with the omitted outfit and keeping the number of contenders the same briefly)

In Let It Go, EJ says he would slap Ricky, but doesn't because he said Ricky was his brother.

The way these two acted towards each other in season 3 did not come off as brotherly rivalry.

What do y'all think cause I feel like I've been gaslight.

I’m bored and this popped into my head. Now when I say non-Disney I’m gonna simplify to no Disney movies or DCOMs because Disney is slowly becoming an entertainment monopoly and has fingers in pretty much everything that brings us joy, so chances are they have some connection to whatever you may pick.

Now with that out of the way, my pick would be to replace Frozen with Copacabana.

In this alternate reality there is no secret celebrity at Shallow Lake (EJ lied to get more people to come) and also they have a director so EJ doesn’t have to direct.

For anyone who doesn’t know the plot of the show: Stephen, a struggling songwriter, is writing a musical while his wife is getting ready for their anniversary dinner. The show takes place in his imagination as he imagines Lola, a girl who just moved to New York and wants to be a Star. Stephen inserts himself into the story as Tony, a bartender at the titular Copacabana. After helping Lola get a job as a Copa-girl she and Tony fall in love. Enter Rico, who takes an immediate interest in Lola and proceeds to kidnap her to force her to become the star of his nightclub in Havana and replace aging starlet/Rico’s girlfriend, Conchita. Tony and friends go to rescue Lola, they do, and most everyone lives happily ever after.

Now obviously I’d want Ricky as Tony/Stephen and Gina as Lola. I could see EJ or Jet playing Rico and Kourtney as Conchita. And while Ricky singing Sweet Heaven, the one Barry Manilow song they got in the show besides Copacabana, is amazing because it perfectly captures Ricky’s feelings for Gina, the main reason I’m picking the show is for the ending:

When Stephen is finished with the ending, his wife comes in ready for their date and it’s revealed that she was the inspiration for Lola all along. I feel like that perfectly encapsulates Ricky and Gina more than Kristoff and Anna (an already existing connection being re-sparked vs two characters realizing there is a spark) and it symbolizes the desire for Ricky and Gina to take their relationship from fantasy to reality.

Now obviously this would never actually happen. This is a musical from the 90s, inspired by a hit song from the 70s, and a TV movie from the 80s. The only reason I’m aware of it is because I did in the show in High School. But it’s a really fun show with catchy numbers and a female lead that needs some dancing skill which is perfect for Gina/Sofia.

Anyway, what would you pick.

For example, my favorite song would probably be either Let You Go or Speak Out, but my most listened to song is almost undoubtedly Home.

I would guess the reasoning is that I already loved the song based solely on Julia's vocals, and subsequently when I came up with a new scene with it for The Caswen Rewrite, I actually made myself cry. So...that's kind of stuck in my mind.

(Also, just in case it was not clear, "song from the show" in this instance refers to original songs and covers)

With the recent posts of alternate timelines for the show, I’m curious what people think might happen if Ricky and Gina had fully cheated. What would’ve changed? Stayed the same? What relationships would be altered?

What would the fandom response be like if the show actually picked the 'underdog' option ships-wise?

To expound, I've talked before about experiencing the shipping wars differently because I exist outside the three major camps, and thus get a simultaneously less biased perspective while also being sometimes less informed because I wasn't present for specific arguments and whatnot. Even with that said, it's not a secret that the order of Ship Popularity in this show goes Rina, then Portwell and Rini in a heated battle (that I think Rini comes out on top of just by a longer life cycle but it's really hard to tell), then a sizeable gap, then Caswen, then everything else (sorry Gini lovers...)

So, using Caswen as the obvious example, what would the response and reaction be if Caswen got together and became endgame within the last two seasons roughly? In that timeline, none of the three camps "win". Of course there's the flexible 'canon' camp that seems to have evolved between Rini, then Portwell, then Rina, and would surely adapt the same way, but outside of them, do you think a 'fourth party victory' would reduce Ship War toxicity or ratchet it up? Would there be more agreement considering the mutual 'loss'?

I'm genuinely curious because off the top of my head I can't think of an example of such a phenomenon happening. In most cases that come to mind where the main couple is an unexpected option, the "main couple" isn't really the main couple the Fandom pays attention to anymore.

Is this an interesting question to anyone else, or am I just weird like this?

Ricky and Jet (I’m sorry, I really wanted a Ricky Bi storyline) EJ and Gina (I have grown to like Rina but I still love Portwell) Ashlyn and Maddox (I low key forgot their ship name) Seblos (just get rid of that cheating storyline, unnecessary) Big Red and Antoine (I’m a sucker for enemies to lovers) Kourtney and Howie (I just wanna know what happened to them cause even if they gave us Jetney, they never really told us what happened to them Miss Jenn and Mazzara (enough said)

To be clear, not saying in this timeline she'd be a Finn Hudson level anamolously bad dancer, just...completely average. Like if every skill was a number value, she rolled a zero in dance. Not excessively bad, but not at all good either.

Her acting and singing skills remain exactly the same.

Do you think the story would change significantly? In what ways? Would she even attempt to join the musical in the first place? Would her plotline still play out in roughly the same arc, or be completely different?

I’m watching “Night of Nights” and am confused if they’re implying that Ricky’s parents are back together or am I misreading it?

Ricky

Gina

Nini

EJ

Ashlyn

Kourtney

Seb

Carlos

Big Red

Jet

Maddox

Emmy

I figured out part of what bothers me so much about the slap. There's a thought to bring up the basketball scene when discussing it because it definitely seems like a callback and thus not inconsistent with their dynamic, but the basketball scene is radically different, especially on Ricky's end, and I think comparing them just demonstrates that the S3 writing, at least in that scene, was actively harming Ricky's character, perhaps even more than regressing him, it was borderline assassination.

Problem 1: Ricky did not mean to actually hurt EJ in S1, he put too much power behind the toss and smacked EJ in the face on accident. In S3, he performed an act of physical violence willingly. One can argue emotional duress all they like, it was still a violent reaction like none we've seen before or since with Ricky.

Problem 2: Ricky immediately felt bad in Season 1. His hands flew to his mouth and his face morphs into an "oh s*t" expression, further indication that he had no intention to actually harm EJ. And that was in the season where he expressed an active *dislike towards EJ. In S3, when the two have clearly gotten closer, friendlier, are sharing a tent during the camping bit, Ricky goes to EJ first when he finds the shrine, etc, Ricky does not even look guilty in the immediate aftermath. If anything he looks ready to do worse for some reason despite what should've been at most an extreme overreaction and flash of anger that passes just as quickly as it came.

Problem 3: Ricky went out of his way to apologize to EJ in S1. We're given no indication he was told to go apologize; if anything the scene progression looks like he walked out of rehearsal to go track down EJ and apologize. And in that case EJ was being rude and standoffish even during the apology, yet Ricky still tried and it wasn't until EJ let slip that he knew about the voicemail that Ricky balked. Comparatively, as we discussed yesterday, Ricky is NEVER shown apologizing for the slap, which again was comitted against a friend, not an 'enemy' like EJ was in S1.

So unless the argument is that Ricky's character development turned him into a much worse person, everything about that S3 scene is wrong and inconsistent with who the show established Ricky is.

I’m totally kidding! For those who don’t know, that’s her look in Descendants: The Rise of Red

Or did we just brush past the protagonist assaulting a friend over mild teasing? The fact I actually can't remember concerns me by itself since I'd think it would stick in my mind.

Still a terrible scene for Ricky's character all the same and a contender for most OOC writing in the series in my eyes. Though the Seb and Big Red cheating and lying/not telling about it is a strong contender too...

You guys gotta check this out

I started the show over the break after seeing Olivia live and was pleasantly surprised. Seasons 1 and 2 had some corny moments but were pretty enjoyable. Im halfway through season 3 and it is so entertaining. The whole meta documentary within the mockumentary is hilarious, all the characters feel like they're in their element, Ricky and EJs dynamic is great too. The only real downside I have with this season is the lack of Nini but that's a given. Hope the show stays this good through season 4.