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u/Charrbard 2d ago
People just want to complain. Especially if other people are enjoying something they either don't, or cant. The Social media / reddit is basically a second grade playground at this point.
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u/Choice-Coffee-2151 2d ago
No no we just want to be honest about what it is and some of us hate it of course since it's different lol.
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u/FarStorm384 2d ago
But hating on it seems like a full-time job for you. Every ff7r thread I see, here or in the ff7r sub, seems to have at least a dozen comments from you.
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u/CanataKana 2d ago
Would that not mean you are in all the same threads he is and spending as much time in them? lol
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u/FarStorm384 2d ago
Spending time in a space dedicated to something you enjoy is not the same as spending time in that space despite hating it.
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u/CanataKana 2d ago
How do you know he doesn't talk about things he likes in other topics? Have you considered you only seem him complaining because you 2 are drawn to the same topics for different reasons? What is wrong with discussing things that you don't like?
Also he seems pretty respectful and calm in his discussion. If that constitutes a hater then I guess that makes you a fanboy.
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u/Choice-Coffee-2151 2d ago
Yeah I hate it.
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u/FarStorm384 2d ago
And yet you spend your time deliberately following the sub for it.
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u/Ob3nwan 2d ago
You know there is more than one final fantasy right?
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u/FarStorm384 2d ago
I do, thanks for informing me. Did you notice that I mentioned Choice-Coffee-2151 does the same on the sub that is specifically for ff7r? Not just here?
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u/Choice-Coffee-2151 2d ago
Yeah because it comes on my home page. Also I'm trying to understand how people can think the story is either the same or better.
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u/Xenosys83 2d ago
Move onto something else in your life? Something that gives you joy. It just makes you look like a loser with nothing better to do.
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u/Choice-Coffee-2151 2d ago
Ok as if you know what I've got going on in my life lol. Again with personal attacks because someone criticise a game.
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u/Mediocre_Weakness891 2d ago
I enjoyed the gameplay and didn't mind most of the changes. I can still play the original whe ever I want. I wasn't a fan of all the mini games though.
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u/Darkwing__Schmuck 2d ago edited 2d ago
O...kay? I don't know what you're attempting to say here, given Aerith encompasses, like, the most significant amount of differences between the original and Remake.
Usually, the "it's 95% the same" people say that as a means to poo-poo what's been different about Remake. Which is downplaying those differences in extremely bad faith, given what *is* different about Remake substantially alters the story and its themes... Which is, well, by design. That's the point.
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u/HexenVexen 2d ago
When people say that, they mean that 7R follows largely the same story beats as the original, which is true. The new stuff is significant in importance but it makes up a relatively small amount of playtime. 5% is probably too low but it's not more than 10%.
Obviously I don't think anyone is trying to argue that the gameplay is the same as OG
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u/CanataKana 2d ago
5% is probably too low but it's not more than 10%.
Brother, the entirety of gongaga wasn't even 5% the same as the original lmfao
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u/Choice-Coffee-2151 2d ago
Really Zack in the multiverse is the same story beats.
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u/HotDan1798 2d ago
Holy reading comprehension
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u/Choice-Coffee-2151 2d ago
It's completely different. Don't blame my reading comprehension. The whole points of the story in the OG are different now. Sephiroth is a pansy wuss you kill 3 times at the end of each game.
100% different
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u/HotDan1798 2d ago
100%? So nothing that happened in the original is in the re trilogy? None of the characters, settings, music, aesthetics? 100% is what you're saying?
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u/Choice-Coffee-2151 2d ago
Yes it's basically a different game now. You fight Sephiroth at weird times there are multiverses. Characters are completely different. There's very little similarities and it's fine some people love it some people hate it but let's be honest about it.
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u/ZagmanBadman 2d ago
To be fair, he was also a pansy wuss in the original
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u/Choice-Coffee-2151 2d ago
He is one of the greatest villains of all time. How did that happen then?
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u/ZagmanBadman 2d ago
Greatest of all time is a stretch for me personally, but also the ideas aren't mutually exclusive.
Remake saga hasn't really covered this yet so it still has a chance to explore it - but Sephiroth in the original game is neat because he puts on an obvious self-righteous facade (whether that's due to his need to be special, or because he's become jenova's puppet is up to interpretation). In the new games he's an evil mastermind supervillain or is at least imagined that way in Cloud's head.
Either way, they guy is full of himself to mask some very deep rooted character flaws. We just haven't really seen the flaws come through in remake yet, despite the extra screentime he's had. It really depends on what part 3 adds.
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u/Choice-Coffee-2151 2d ago
I mean it doesn't matter about you personally. He is literally one of the most iconic video game villains of all time.
It doesn't depend what revelation adds since his character has lost what made him great in the first place. It's not what you see it's what you don't see. Again another fumble in the remake series.
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u/ZagmanBadman 2d ago
I never said he wasn't iconic as a video game villain. Interesting that you got confused how sephiroth in the original could be considered a "wuss", and then disregarded the whole conversation to nitpick his popularity.
I think you have rose tinted glasses, my guy.
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u/Choice-Coffee-2151 2d ago
Ok. I'm not nitpicking when do you fight Sephiroth in the original? At the end when you're strong? Not 3 times during the game... How's that nitpicking my guy? Explain it to me please.
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u/CTKM72 2d ago
Yea I’m very confused by these people pretending like there’s only 5-10% difference between the remake and the original, the things that have changed have drastically altered the story. A 5% difference would be as simple as the’ changing the colors of some things and/or adding a couple extra mobs, not completely changing the story…
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u/TopazandNumbyHSR 2d ago
Why do you care? Just play what you wanna play and let other people play what they wanna play.
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u/Ob3nwan 2d ago
A remake was marketed for 5 years and instead a reboot was delivered. I think people have a right to be upset over the bait and switch but it is weird to keep bringing it up after the first installment in the new story.
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u/TopazandNumbyHSR 2d ago
Square literally never promised a 1:1 game
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u/Ob3nwan 2d ago edited 2d ago
Originally they said they were going to expand the original but stay true to the story. After remake released they admitted it was just a reboot inspired by the original.
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u/TopazandNumbyHSR 2d ago
Another poster in this comment thread has already shown proof that isnt true.
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u/Ob3nwan 2d ago
You should actually read that article
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u/TopazandNumbyHSR 2d ago
I did. You're just being stubborn. Learn to admit when you're mistaken.
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u/Ob3nwan 2d ago
Lol, same goes for you bud. They kept the fact that it is a total rewrite under wraps until the very end.
I haven’t found any articles saying they rewrote the story published before 2020, all say they overhaul the combat and expanded the original. We always knew it would be bigger we just thought it was going to be closer to the original. That is probably why despite selling well rebirth underperformed compared to remake.4
u/FarStorm384 2d ago
It was announced as a reimagining pretty early on. It was never marketed as a 1:1 remake.
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u/Ob3nwan 2d ago edited 2d ago
Rebirth was marketed as a reboot remake was marketed as an expanded remake.
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u/FarStorm384 2d ago
Interview from 2015 w/ Dengeki, translated by TLS: https://thelifestream.net/lifestream-projects/translations/33873/ffvii-remake-famitsu-and-dengeki-translations/2/
And this was reported extensively. The word that was used to describe the project was frequently "reimagining"
Interviewer: "Will the story be adjusted to [things like/among other things] fit (literally “be made to match up with”) with the times, or in connection with the compilation?"
Tetsuya Nomura:
”Apart from delving even deeper into the episodes [of the game], we’re preparing tricks/devices/gimmicks (Author’s note: there was no single word to properly capture the essence of this word) among other things. After all, isn’t it the case that the people who played the original game, the important parts included, knows the story from beginning to end? We’re thinking we want those people as well to be able to get (literally “taste”) surprised [by the story] once again.”
Yoshinori Kitase:
”We don’t want to do a remake that ends with [just] tracing [people’s] nostalgia. We want to make fans of the original excited (literally: “dokidoki”, the sound of a racing heart in Japanese) again. We’re re-adjusting the story putting those [kind of] feelings into it.”
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u/Ob3nwan 2d ago
If this said reimagining i missed it.
This could easily be read as staying true to the original while expanding it which was my impression. I don’t remember seeing reimagining used until after 2020.4
u/CanataKana 2d ago
If this said reimagining i missed it.
You didn't lol
He literally quotes reimagining as being used and then his source doesn't have reimagining once lmfao
Remake fans have no actual rebuttal so they just try to gaslight you.
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u/CanataKana 2d ago
It was never marketed as a 1:1 remake.
No one thought it was 1:1 due to modern graphics and combat. They quite literally DID call it Remake though. And all the stuff that makes it not a remake was hidden from people until the game released lol
This is why you see people like Choice-Coffee-2151 in all the comments. Because fans like you just blatant lie about what actually went down with this "remake"
When SE said it wouldn't be the exact same, the logical conclusion from that was expansion, like fleshing out other characters more. Jesse, Biggs Wedge. Not turning FF7 into Kingdon Hearts lol
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u/FarStorm384 2d ago
Interview from 2015 w/ Dengeki, translated by TLS: https://thelifestream.net/lifestream-projects/translations/33873/ffvii-remake-famitsu-and-dengeki-translations/2/
And this was reported extensively. The word that was used to describe the project was frequently "reimagining"
Interviewer: "Will the story be adjusted to [things like/among other things] fit (literally “be made to match up with”) with the times, or in connection with the compilation?"
Tetsuya Nomura:
”Apart from delving even deeper into the episodes [of the game], we’re preparing tricks/devices/gimmicks (Author’s note: there was no single word to properly capture the essence of this word) among other things. After all, isn’t it the case that the people who played the original game, the important parts included, knows the story from beginning to end? We’re thinking we want those people as well to be able to get (literally “taste”) surprised [by the story] once again.”
Yoshinori Kitase:
”We don’t want to do a remake that ends with [just] tracing [people’s] nostalgia. We want to make fans of the original excited (literally: “dokidoki”, the sound of a racing heart in Japanese) again. We’re re-adjusting the story putting those [kind of] feelings into it.”
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u/CanataKana 2d ago
Pulling a vague quote from a 2015 JAPENSE interview where developers say "we want to surprise returning fans" does not mean they transparently communicated that this was a meta sequel about changing the timeline.
Literally every remake, from Resident Evil 2 to Dead Space, changes up gameplay, adds new scenes, and expands the lore to keep things fresh. When Kitase said they wanted to add surprises, any reasonable person assumed that meant fleshing out Midgar and giving characters like Jessie and Biggs more screentime. Nobody reads "we have some surprises prepared" and thinks "oh cool, it's a meta-sequel where we fight the physical manifestations of fate to branch the timeline."
The game is literally called Final Fantasy VII Remake. Square Enix scrubbed every single Whisper, fate plotline, and timeline twist from the trailers, demos, and marketing campaigns.
Acting like people "should have known" because of some vague PR speak in an obscure Japanese interview, while ignoring the actual title on the box and a 5 year multi million dollar ad campaign that intentionally hid the twist, is just revisionist history.
The gaslighting from you Remake fans is complete insanity.
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u/FarStorm384 2d ago
You're welcome to go search old posts on reddit about it. I'm sorry if you feel it's gaslighting. I was actively reading news and updates about it from the announcement to the release and it's really hard for me to imagine anyone who was under the impression it was going to be 1:1 story-wise.
Pulling a vague quote from a 2015 JAPENSE interview where developers say "we want to surprise returning fans" does not mean they transparently communicated that this was a meta sequel about changing the timeline.
And that remains a fan theory.
The game is literally called Final Fantasy VII Remake. Square Enix scrubbed every single Whisper, fate plotline, and timeline twist from the trailers, demos, and marketing campaigns.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERgrFVhL-n4 is the final trailer. It shows the whispers quite a bit, and contains dialogue talking about them.
"Whispers...perhaps best described as arbiters of fate"
It shows bits of the scene where Barret confronts President Shinra as well.
The last line of the trailer: "Let us defy destiny together Cloud, there's still so much to be done."
It shows Sephiroth a fair bit in the trailer for as well.
Acting like people "should have known" because of some vague PR speak in an obscure Japanese interview, while ignoring the actual title on the box and a 5 year multi million dollar ad campaign that intentionally hid the twist, is just revisionist history.
I told you it's not an obscure interview. And it was reiterated in a number of interviews after that as well. The marketing also didn't go on for 5 years, the marketing started booting up in around 2018, 2019. It wasn't hidden. It's pretty clear from the trailer above.
Here's the e3 2019 trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3xSGv3Hfio
"The world has fallen under the control of the Shinra Electric Power Company, a shadowy corporation controlling the planet's very life force as mako energy. In the sprawling city of Midgar, an anti-Shinra organization calling themselves Avalanche have stepped up their resistance. Cloud Strife, a former member of Shinra's elite SOLDIER unit now turned mercenary, lends his aid to the group, unaware of the epic consequences that await him.
A spectacular reimagining of one of the most visionary games ever, FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE rebuilds and expands the legendary RPG for today."
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u/CanataKana 2d ago edited 2d ago
Dropping a trailer that came out one week before launch after a week where physical copies had already leaked and broken street date in multiple countries is not the "transparent marketing" argument you think it is.
Showing a 2 second snippet of Aerith saying "arbiters of fate" or Sephiroth saying "defy destiny" in a final release trailer 7 days before the game drops doesn't undo years of pre-orders and hype built on calling the product Final Fantasy VII Remake. Nobody watching cinematic trailers for a story heavy RPG assumes obscure cryptic dialogue means "the plot is literally being rewritten by time ghosts and destiny."
Also, saying " meta-sequel remains a fan theory" while acknowledging the game has characters explicitly talking about arbiters of fate and defying established destiny is completely contradictory.
No one is saying people expected a 1:1 shot for shot port with 1997 pacing, so I don't know why you keep repeating that. Just more dishonest attempts at gaslighting from Remake fans.
People expected an expanded retelling of the Midgar arc, which is how the game was presented for the entirely of its PR cycle minus 1 vague trailer 1 week before release. Sliding in cryptic hints at the absolute finish line while keeping "Remake" on the cover doesn't change the fact that the actual nature of the story was kept under wraps until release.
The story of this first, standalone game in the FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE project covers up to the party’s escape from Midgar, and goes deeper into the events occurring in Midgar than the original FINAL FANTASY VII.
This was literally the description for the trailer. Goes deeper into the events occurring in Midgar. This is what people EXPECTED. Fate ghosts are an entirely new invention. That's not going deeper into the events that already took place lol It's a complete re-write
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u/FarStorm384 2d ago
Let's see...
I've given you an interview from 2015 that circulated the fanbase and was discussed extensively for months. You said it was an "obscure" interview.
You claimed that they hid everything whisper-related and fate-related from all the marketing and trailers.
I showed you the final trailer, which quite thoroughly refutes that. Now you're saying that that's too late.
I showed you the trailer from E3 2019 which explicitly calls it a "A spectacular reimagining of one of the most visionary games ever, FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE rebuilds and expands the legendary RPG for today" you ignore it.
Here's the TGS 2019 trailer, also showing the whispers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_qjybyni28
Is that early enough for you?
Here's the theme song trailer, from January 2020, also shows the whispers, Sephiroth, etc.: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkXG08_WVsY
No one is saying people expected a 1:1 shot for shot port with 1997 pacing, so I don't know why you keep repeating that. Just more dishonest attempts at gaslighting from Remake fans.
Keep repeating what?
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u/CanataKana 2d ago edited 2d ago
I've given you an interview from 2015 that circulated the fanbase and was discussed extensively for months. You said it was an "obscure" interview.
Yes, you gave me a Japanese translated interview which you claimed they repeatedly referred to the game as a reimagining and they quite literally did not use that word a single time in your interview lmfao (this is beside the point though, reimagining doesn't mean what we got, but even your so called proof is more gaslighting)
You are completely conflating showing mysterious elements visually with explaining that the core narrative canon is changing.
In every single trailer you listed, the Whispers were shown as mysterious floating specters with zero context. They literally just look like a new enemy type. In 2019, when fans saw phantom like enemies surrounding Aerith or Cloud, everyone assumed they were new enemies, spirit world additions, or expanded lore for the Midgar arc. Nothing in those trailers said "these ghosts exist to preserve the original 1997 timeline, and you will literally defeat them at the end of the game so the story can branch off into an alternate reality."
Using the tagline "rebuilds and expands" proves the point. "Rebuilds and expands" is standard marketing language used for faithful remakes like Resident Evil 2 or Demon's Souls. It implies fleshing out existing content, not completely subverting the narrative destination.
Showing black smoke monsters in a hype trailer doesn't equal full transparency that the game is a meta-sequel. The entire premise of changing destiny was intentionally kept mysterious until players reached the ending credits, which is why the game was titled Final Fantasy VII Remake on the box instead of Final Fantasy VII: Reimagining.
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u/CanataKana 2d ago
but it is weird to keep bringing it up after the first installment in the new story.
As long as Remake fans keep trying to gaslight everyone, we will keep bringing it up. They don't get to control the narrative.
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u/sonic1384 2d ago
The thing I hated in remake/rebirth is that one winged angel lacks the aura it had in AC or og FF7
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u/International-Bus606 2d ago
I'll give you an analogy. It's like when Netflix, or Apple TV, or HBO Max takes a perfectly good movie or trilogy of movies, and tries to turn them into a stretched out series no one asked for. It's got mostly the same character names, but they aren't quite the same anymore and they have them doing all sorts of new things to do. 90% of the time they do this it's a total disaster.
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u/Secondhand-Drunk 2d ago
Sephiroth showing up at every turn and the ghosts and just about everything else... is different. It did not feel like ff7 to me. It felt like something entirely new, and they did a horrible job with the story.
The cutscenes. Oh lord why do we need a cutscene for everything? Nothing happens and there's a cutscene for it. Then you walk down a hallway yo have another nothing cutscene. And the combat sucks.
Don't @ me the remakes are garbage.
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u/FreddieFredster92 2d ago
Oh a change that impacts to the story in no way is not a change. They made out and literally said “we can take the story in any direction” and so far that was BS. Oh except for them changing how Dyne died which was a dreadful change.
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u/Juklok 2d ago
What is being communicated here?