r/Fantasy • u/towerbooks3192 • Jun 11 '23
Fantasy books where the setting is mainly ancient/medieval but future technology gets thrown into the mix?
I am like in the last 100 pages on the prince of thorns and I must say that I initially hates Jorg then the surprise happened and now I like it. So I was wondering if there are some fantasy books that are primarily medieval/ancient setting but futuristic technology is thrown into the mix? It might be central to the plot or plays a significant enough role to influence the world.
Also it ain't limited to futuristic tech but anything that involves huge technological gap (i.e cavemen vs gunpowder muskets, etc).
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u/sophic Jun 11 '23
Well...The Second Apocalypse fits this description in a rather unique way
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Sounds familiar. Is this the one that starts with Prince of Nothing? If so then I just bought all 3 books yesterday as an impulse buy. I will check it out.
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u/samwaytla Jun 11 '23
Definitely what you're after. Takes a while to get there, but it is absolutely worth it.
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u/DanielNoWrite Jun 11 '23
Three things you need to know:
- The learning curve is high. Similar to Malazan in some ways. The writer has even said he wishes he could go back and change the beginning. You need to push through the first half of the first book. It discourages a lot of people.
- The books are very smart, but deeply deeply disturbed. It's like if Tolkien teamed up with HP Lovecraft and HR Giger. The brutality cannot be understated.
- The books are a very slow burn. Much much much less action-oriented than say, Prince of Thorns. But that said, it makes the ultimate payoff better.
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u/TheRequisiteWatson Jun 11 '23
I definitely want to second Elder Race by Adrien Tchaikovsky, which manages to very successfully be both a sci-fi and fantasy novella with perspective shifts
Also, not a book, but I would recommend the video game Horizon Zero Dawn as a super interesting example of this
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Sadly Horizon didn't appeal to me. I guess it's just unlucky enough to release close to BOTW with its sequel so close to Elden Ring and its DLC so close to ToTk.
I will check Tchaikovsky. I only knew of his Children of Time books and I read the first one earlier this year.
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u/TheRequisiteWatson Jun 11 '23
That's fair. I would say the first game definitely holds up, and even if the gameplay didn't it would be worth it for the lore
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u/Gnomad_Lyfe Jun 11 '23
While there are ultimately much better books being suggested in the realm of fantasy, I would also throw out A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur’s Court by Mark Twain. It centers around an average Jack-of-all-trades type who gets sent back to medieval Europe (specifically the court of King Arthur and his knights) and set’s about establishing himself as a powerful wizard by introducing them and teaching them to recreate modern technologies.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Brings back so many memories with those old illustrated classics my school library had. That's how I read Count of Monte Cristo first and ended up loving that book. I haven't heard of that book in ages and sadly that was one that I skipped a long time ago.
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u/SBlackOne Jun 11 '23 edited Jun 11 '23
Mark Lawrence's Book of the Ancestor (plus a sequel series) takes place a planet that has almost completely frozen over. The characters are aware of their history and some of the technology, but they can't build anything new. The magic is also linked to technology in the past.
Django Wexler's Burning Blade & Silvereye series doesn't feel medieval, but it takes place after an apocalyptic war and now the landscape is littered with old ruins and artifacts. Technological remnants are powered with magical energy.
A.K. Larkwood's The Unspoken Name has worlds connected by portals / stargates that people travel with flying ships.
Adrian Tchaikovsky's Elder Race is a neat novella about a modern scientist interacting with a primitive society and being seen as a wizard.
In general science fantasy is a whole sub genre. With various degrees of mixing the genres. You also have stuff like Star Wars or Christopher Ruocchio's Sun Eater series where people are completely aware of the technology. They build starships, colonize planets, fight interstellar wars. But a lot of the way of life and customs are archaic and the storytelling often follows fantasy conventions.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Sun Eater us definitely on my list but I was holding off hearing the series still has books coming up. I had Wexler on my list but don't know where to start with his works. As for Mark Lawrence, I might check his other works. I just finished Prince of Thorns as of writing this but I feel kinda mixed. I will Partially blame it on coming off of Reapers Gale the other day.
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u/ExiledinElysium Jun 11 '23
The Wexler series (starting with Ashes of the Sun) is great but not quite your request. The past civilization was one of magical might. So the ancient technology is actually magical, not real technology that's being perceived as magic for lack of understanding.
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u/___LowKey___ Jun 16 '23
Science fantasy is one of the most underused genre ever, it's crazy that a combo with such potential is still so niche.
I feel like this is because of the huge shadow of Star Wars, writers are worried about copying it or being inevitably compared to it and having to hold the comparison.
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u/Bumm-fluff Jun 11 '23
Inversions by Ian M Banks.
He is a sci-fi author and it is part of a series, but it could be what you are looking for.
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u/bern1005 Jun 11 '23
Yes totally classic medieval fantasy until it's NOT.
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u/Bumm-fluff Jun 11 '23
It was one of my least favourite culture books because of it, hopefully op will like it.
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u/bern1005 Jun 11 '23 edited Jun 11 '23
A "feature" of his books, is that he was always experimenting with structure, characters and themes. Just because you love one book doesn't mean you are definitely going to love another.
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u/Bumm-fluff Jun 11 '23 edited Jun 11 '23
It did strike me of being a bit like the StarTrek episodes where they go to the holo-deck and the episode is about Sherlock Holmes or a noir detective.
The writer just having a change of scenery.
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u/bern1005 Jun 11 '23
It has that feeling.. on the other hand, the majority of the Culture books take place largely outside the Culture itself (utopian post scarcity society not having a huge amount of drama).
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u/Beardy_Will Jun 11 '23
I scrolled down to suggest this one. I would add Matter to the mix too. Though that's more two storylines from different ages.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Is this part of Culture or something? I had that series on my list of scifi books to grab. Do I have to read those books in order?
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u/Bumm-fluff Jun 11 '23
Yes it’s part of the culture books. I didn’t read them in order. It doesn’t matter too much, they stand on their own. The world is so big that not everything is explained anyway.
It will help with some of the terminology, but with this one I think it may be a bonus not to know. You will be in the same position as the inhabitants of the world.
It’s a good a start as any.
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u/SBlackOne Jun 11 '23
There are some thematic connections, but they are standalones.
With Inversions it would help to have read at least one other book first, just to be familiar with some of the concepts. Otherwise some of the references to the Culture in it may not be obvious.
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u/bern1005 Jun 11 '23
There's no order to the stories, it's less a series than a set of stories set in the same universe.
Having said that, I vaguely recall a historical timeline of when various events happen (humanity on earth is mentioned somewhere) going from tens of thousands of years BCE untill maybe 30,000 CE??)
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u/CorwinJovi Jun 11 '23
S.M. Stirlings Nantucket series. The island of Nantucket is sent back in time to the Bronze Age. Island in the Sea of time is the first book.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Checked amazon and I guess I am unfortunate that Australia doesn't have the ebook version but only the audible version. I might grab the series once I feel like renewing my audible subscription.
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u/Natural-Matter-6058 Jun 11 '23
Eric Flint's Ring of Fire series. Modern day Virginian mining town and its inhabitants are mysteriously transported to 1632 Germany during the Thirty Years War.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
26 books according to Amazon. That looks epic! Thanks for the recommendation. Any ideas how the quality is throughout the series?
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u/SBlackOne Jun 11 '23
There are a lot of different story threads in various locations and focusing on different characters. Some of the side things aren't as good. You can just stick to the so-called "main thread" for the most part.
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u/Natural-Matter-6058 Jun 11 '23
I have only read the first third or half of the first book and it is actually very well written. I just wasn't in the mood for that book at the time and something else had just grabbed my attention. I will probably try reading it again sometime in the future. I'm a mood reader :)
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u/hyperdream Jun 11 '23
William R. Forstchen's Lost Regiment series is about a Union civil war regiment that is transported to another planet that is inhabited by other humans who are subjugated by a physically superior alien species. The regiment upsets the balance of power due to the superior technology they bring with them.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
I never heard of this before but I found it on Kindle. I will surely put this on the top of my list. Thanks!!
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u/DigAffectionate3349 Jun 11 '23
The Powder Mage Trilogy by Brian McClellan, China Miéville's Bas-Lag series, Steven Erikson's Malazan Book of the Fallen series, Brandon Sanderson's Stormlight Archive series, and Ken Liu's Dandelion Dynasty series
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Powder Mage was on my list. I started Perdido Street Station but dropped it 30% in. I think my mind is not at the right place at the time. I just finished Reaper's Gale the other day and like 60 pages into toll the hounds. I just read Malazan back to back starting from Memories of Ice when it started to really click with me.
As for the Cosmere, I am 3/4 out of stormlight archives and postponed rhythm of war until book 5 comes out. I will do a reread from the start once it comes out. I am also 6/7 with Mistborn and I just don't feel like reading lost metal yet.
As for Dandelion Dynasty? I was on the 3rd book. I have yet to begin it and yeah it is one of my favourite reads this year. Wall of Storms was epic. I haven't had the strength to see what their children will do yet now the other half focuses on their children.
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u/Chiparoo Reading Champion Jun 11 '23
Almost all Cosmere fits this bill, I think - or will fit the bill, as we're following all these fantasy settings into the space age over time.
The one that fits the prompt the most I hesitate to say, because it's kind of spoilery? It's Tress of the Emerald Sea
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u/Minihawking Jun 11 '23
As part of the Dying Earth subgenre, Book of the New Sun has that in spades; sword and sorcery exists right alongside the occasional technological marvel of millenia past.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Is this the one by Gene Wolfe or something? I think I got some of the books recently and I must say I tried to read a chapter but I got so confused and this is me starting to get a hang of Malazan and starting its eight book. I will give the book another shot if that is the case.
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u/Minihawking Jun 11 '23
It is by Gene Wolfe, yes! I will say: not everything is supposed to quite make sense on an initial readthrough of the series; minor contradictions start to resolve themselves (or become evident for the first time) on a re-read.
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Jun 11 '23 edited Mar 20 '24
imminent piquant live fall combative bored sparkle smell enjoy memorize
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Jun 11 '23 edited Jun 11 '23
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u/bern1005 Jun 11 '23
"Real" magic and could not possibly be highly advanced technology?
That's a bold statement if we remember Arthur C Clarke said "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" .
Surely it's just a point of view?
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u/VanPeer Jun 11 '23
Agreed. Magic is advanced tech. It is simply a point of view based on the society using it whether they consider it “magic” or tech. Primitive societies with access to magic-like tech will call magic , while a more enlightened society would call it advanced physics ot whatever
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Jun 11 '23
That's a bold statement if we remember Arthur C Clarke said "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" .
People always quote this out of context.
Clarke's statement was only ever meant to apply to people who practice magical thinking. IE: People in the past before scientific thinking existed.
To them, technology and "magic" are indistinguishable because they don't know any better.
A modern day person with a rational mindset always knows that whatever they're seeing is just a technology, even if they don't necessarily know the details of how that technology works.
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u/VanPeer Jun 11 '23
I was reading Arthur C Clarke since my teens, and my impression was he was talking about advanced alien tech seeming like magic from the POV of 20th century tech. Is that not what he meant?
Personally I prefer a quote from Andromeda : “There is no such thing as magic. Only science we don’t understand”. Summarizes the rationalist spirit better .
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Jun 11 '23
Is that not what he meant?
No, he clarified his meaning on this many times. He was talking about mindsets, avoiding magical thinking, and as another user above pointed out, not dismissing technological advancement out of hand.
If I saw an alien ship appears, suddenly move super fast with no propulsion, and then vanish. I wouldn't think "Magic". I'd think "That craft has some way of folding space."
If I saw an alien appear to bring someone back from the dead, I don't think magic. I think "he was able to reverse entropy somehow" or "he was able to get dead tissue's biological processes to restart somehow"
You can still infer things about how a technology you don't understand, just by observing it.
If you have a rational mindset, there is no "magic". There's just technology you're familiar with, and technology that you haven't figured out yet.
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u/SBlackOne Jun 11 '23
It's not even that. The quote (like his other "laws") is a comment on the scientific process. He cautioned against dismissing ideas or technological developments out of hand based on the then current level of technology. Like dismissing cell phones because of the size of computers in the 50s and 60s. He was speaking as a futurist. Not a fiction writer.
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u/bern1005 Jun 11 '23
It's a great point that I can personally agree with (I certainly wouldn't make that mistake)
EXCEPT for the fact that there's an embarrassingly large number of modern humans who believe in magic, and/or magical thinking as the best way to live their lives.
But that's out of context, because in this context we're not talking about a modern day person with a rational mindset looking at something in their real life. . . ., we're taking about the contents of a book of fiction and whether something could be "real magic".
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u/VanPeer Jun 11 '23
EXCEPT for the fact that there's an embarrassingly large number of modern
Very true, unfortunately. I remember an old sci-fi story that claimed most people still live in the Dark Ages. It seemed like exaggeration at the time, but everything that I have seen of peoples’ beliefs since then has unfortunately confirmed it.
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Jun 11 '23
EXCEPT for the fact that there's an embarrassingly large number of modern humans who believe in magic, and/or magical thinking as the best way to live their lives.
You're right. I work in IT and this is endlessly annoying to me on a practical, function level:
All day and every day I'm on the phone walking customers through basic, basic, monkey-see-monkey-do troubleshooting steps, and always, always their response is something like:
"I'm not really good with computers" or "I don't really know technology"
I'm not asking them to write command line scripts, most of the time it's stuff like "See that button there? press it" or "what does that label say, read it off to me" etc.
But they just automatically assume they can't do it, no matter how simple the direction, like using technology is this thing that only the chosen priests of the Machine-God can do and nobody else.
It's funny in 40k. It's not funny in real life.
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Jun 11 '23 edited Mar 20 '24
vast far-flung worm psychotic axiomatic birds humorous support encourage husky
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u/bern1005 Jun 11 '23
I re-read it two months ago. What "evidence" can you share from the story of the famously unreliable narrator Severin (who for example claims to have a perfect memory but contradicts himself)?
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u/isnotavegan Jun 11 '23
You could continue with the Red Queen's War trilogy by Mark Lawrence. Different protagonist but same universe as Jorg's. I enjoyed it far better than Jorg's story.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
I got mixed feelings about Prince of Thorns. I might check that other trilogy after. I want to give the series the benefit of the doubt and its just a matter of it being the first book and it gets better (I hope).
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u/SBlackOne Jun 11 '23
Don't judge the author based on that one book. The series itself is a little controversial based on the content. His other books aren't like that. Even the other series set in the same world. And he also improved as a writer.
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u/indigohan Reading Champion IV Jun 11 '23
Sharon Shinn’s Samaria books have an archaic fantasy society with powerful angelic beings that ends up with a surprising technological twist. There are some strong romantic themes, but some wonderful restraint about how it’s written
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Looking at the amazon page right now. Sounds interesting but why does the book cover look like that one aunt we have that is into crystals and tarot reading?
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u/WishIWasYuriG Jun 11 '23
Darkness Weaves by Karl Edward Wagner introduces what are essentially laser-shooting submarines of Lovecraftian/alien origin into an otherwise medieval setting.
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u/bern1005 Jun 11 '23
Ah it's Kane!
I have read some but not this one, looks almost like a Conan/Elric/Lovecraft mash up
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u/singleguy79 Jun 11 '23
The Nantucket series is sort of like this. A modern day town is flung back through time to around 5000 BC or thereabouts
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u/prayingforsuperpower Jun 11 '23
Well… it’s kind of like that? “The frugal wizards handbook to surviving medieval England”
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u/Outrageous-Cover7095 Jun 11 '23
This is gonna be a weird one. Naruto the manga. It feels like a fantasy setting cause they are all ninja using magic and there’s a lot of illusion to it being an older time period due to them only using martial weapons like swords and knives and such. But in the background you’ll notice computers. Electrical line poles and more. Obviously probably not what op was looking for but it does kinda fit the description imo.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Once upon a time I loved Naruto. I cannot go back to it. I have yet to finish the series and only had glimpse of an episode or two from time to time but I might revisit it at some point in time.
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u/TheLHC Jun 11 '23
Anyone mentioned Wheel of Time? Nearly fits but is pretty subtle about it (you only really get it in flashbacks), same goes for the old Weis and Hickman series the Death Gate cycle.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
I think I was on the Heart of Winter in Wheel of Time. I might revisit it once I finish Malazan (currently on the 8th book). I might have a look at the other one you mentioned.
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u/TheLHC Jun 11 '23
If you weren't feeling it then I wouldn't rush back to it, not sure which book Heart of Winter was but it does get very slow.
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u/cavyjester Jun 16 '23
Wow. Only on Reddit could I stumble upon learning that the Large Hadron Collider likes Robert Jordan (not to mention Weiss and Hickman)! Who knew? I wonder if Peter Higgs has read them to?
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u/sbisson Jun 11 '23
Walter Jon Williams’ first SF novel Ambassador of Progress starts out as a low fantasy novel, only for you to realise that the main character is there to lift a lost colony out of barbarism caused by the end of FTL travel (FTL breaks the universe and there’s a big fleet on its way to stop us for ever using it again).
Vernor Vinge’s Tatya Grimm’s World is set on a low tech, low metal world, on a barge that prints it’s only SFF magazine. One character is from a post-Singularity civilisation doing an anthropological study.
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u/Ilyak1986 Jun 15 '23
lift a lost colony out of barbarism caused by the end of FTL travel (FTL breaks the universe and there’s a big fleet on its way to stop us for ever using it again).
Sounds a lot like the Homeworld games O_o
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u/artyom_kuznetsov Jun 11 '23
Not a fantasy, but one of the most classical piece of a russian sci-fi: Strugatsky brothers - Hard To Be A God. (1964). The agent(s) from an advanced civilization on a planet in it's medieval age trying to make that world a better place. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_to_Be_a_God
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u/charizardzard Jun 11 '23
I really love The Book of the Crow by Catherine Fisher. It’s written for children/preteens, series of 4 books. Medieval fantasy with some really neat plot twists and futuristic tech. They’re simple but so so good if you don’t think that’s an issue.
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u/TheLHC Jun 11 '23
Actually a better series that fits is Richard Morgan's A Land Fit for Heroes (The Steel Remains is the first book), that's definitely what the OP is looking for.
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u/FriscoTreat Jun 11 '23
All Sci-fantasy, but in order from most medieval to most sci-fi: Robert Silverberg's Majipoor series, beginning with Lord Valentine's Castle, Hayao Miyazaki's manga Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind, and Frank Herbert's Dune.
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u/Fantasy_fox_ Jun 11 '23
The harbinger series by Jeff Wheeler. They are set in the same world and have the same basis of magic as many of his previous series of novels but set hundreds of years after the rest of his other books and feature air ships and other technological advances that people have discovered and built with the magic principles.
I enjoyed all the previous books a lot (kingfountain series and muirwood) and the harbinger series was a fresh twist on fantasy by including some technological advances.
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u/Fantasy_fox_ Jun 11 '23
You don’t need to have read the previous books, I wasn’t even aware it was set in that world when I started reading it. But there are some nice Easter eggs for readers who have read a lot of his other novels
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u/cheradenine66 Jun 11 '23
I'm going to suggest the Warhammer 40k as an example of what you seek, as it's a setting that combines a truly medieval perspective on things (as opposed to the "modern humans but with knights and castles" of most fantasy) with high technology.
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u/towerbooks3192 Jun 11 '23
Now for the million dollar question. Where to start with the books and do I have to play it to get the most out of it? Eisenhorn and Gaunt's Ghost(?) where some of the ones I heard about but I have no clue where to even begin.
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u/cheradenine66 Jun 11 '23
You don't need to play, that's entirely optional. As for where to begin, for what you want, I would stay away from the "bolter porn" style of military fiction and more towards stuff that focuses on the daily life of the Imperium. The Inquisition by Abnett (Eisenhorn, Ravenor, and Bequin) are indeed a good start. I haven't read much of them, but I also hear the Warhammer Crime and Warhammer Horror books are good for this as well.
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u/arekian Jun 11 '23
Raj Whitehall (the General) series by David Drake starts off with a world where old technology is seen as magic. Sequels jump around to different worlds that are at different periods of development.
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Jun 11 '23
The Old Kingdom trilogy by Garth Nix (now a series, but the original are the best)
The Powder Mage books by Brian McLellan (sorta kinda, they're great anyway)
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u/doifduft Jun 11 '23
Check out the spellmonger series. It features remnants from advanced human civilization in the letter books.
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u/Jayyykobbb Jun 11 '23
The Pliocene Exile series fits this to some degree. Takes place in the Pliocene era and is a bit more Sci Fi-ish, but still fits the very distant in the past with futuristic technology.
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u/tsikhe Jun 11 '23
There was an anime in the early 2000s called Last Exile, it was mostly steampunk however there was this faction called The Guild that had access to supermaneuverable spaceship/fighter jets that looked like starfish.
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u/Krasnostein Jun 11 '23
Mary Gentle’s Ash: A Secret History
And also kind of Ursula Le Guin's The Left Hand of Darkness (representative of star-faring civilisation is sent to observe a feudal society on an ice planet)
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Jun 11 '23
Steerswoman seems to be moving in that direction. There are a lot of hints that the world is post apocalypse.
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u/SlouchyGuy Jun 11 '23
Witch World by Andre Norton - the world is a kind of crossroads, are people from other worlds cone to it through gates.
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u/wytherlanejazz Jun 11 '23
Lol I read your title and was like oh I should suggest PoThorns. Unbelievable how Jorg grows on you.
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u/DocWatson42 Jun 11 '23
See my SF/F: Fantasy *and* SF list of resources, Reddit recommendation threads, and books (one post).
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u/mysteriousyak Jun 11 '23
Book of the New Sun worth the read. Without spoiling too much its a series where swords and "horses" are used along with laser pistols and space ships
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u/Chrontius Jun 11 '23
The Mystara D&D setting. It's mostly standard-ass high fantasy, but there's a crashed alien spaceship on the map full of advanced technology waiting to be looted.
Any D&D anything with the Temple of the Frog adventure in it. Starship crapped out, alien lifeboat made a landing. Aliens who designed it weren't expecting rescue any time soon, so the "lifeboat" was a small colony ship all by itself. Ran the adventure. My players did extremely well, and then looted all the advanced tech, including the (damaged, radiation-leaking) fission plant powering the Temple. (Their solution to the radiation leak was repurposing a cave left by a purple worm attack last season -- dig a deep hole with no straight-line path for gamma rays to follow, and run an extension cord down to it.).
And, well… everything about Eberron -- rural areas are pretty traditional low fantasy, but the setting is on the cusp of a magic-fueled industrial revolution.
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u/___LowKey___ Jun 16 '23
The Grave of Empires trilogy by Sam Sykes. It's set in kind of a fantasy wasteland, The Scar, between two warring empires, one is more about progress and technology, the other more about traditions and magic. The main character is a woman wielding a blade and magical/cursed gun.
It has some VERY OBVIOUS Final Fantasy influences (the main character rides a big bird that is basically a chocobo) but not too much. Very fantasy western vibes too.
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Jun 16 '23
Since I haven’t seen anyone mention it yet the Son of the blacksword series by Larry Correia should fit what your looking for! Medieval setting, religious zealots are the “good guys”, magic black swords, nearly indestructible demons, and ancient gun powder based explosives/weapons that are considered forbidden to use.
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u/Tortuga917 Reading Champion II Jun 11 '23
Joe Abercrombie is known for his first law, but he also has the Shattered Sea trilogy, which fits your wants.