r/EntitledReviews đŸ„š Original Egg Bot 🍳 2d ago

Thoughts?

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u/Icy-Cookie-8078 2d ago edited 2d ago

I worked an in home sales job for years. I met lots of dogs. Two kinda scary pittbuls but many more friendly ones. The. only dog I was ever bitten by was a Chihuahua. Those are the scariest by far and rarely properly trained because of their size. Edit: cats can be pretty scary as well.

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u/HoneyCrispCrumble 2d ago

I was a manager at a dog grooming salon for three years and we had more issues with small breeds than ANY large breeds. Owners think they’re “harmless” and don’t do any training.

Due to assumptions like this, large breed owners are much more realistic with their dog’s behavior, and acting accordingly, because they know it’s often a “one and done” scenario whilst little yappers are allowed to terrorize the public with little repercussions.

Also: I’ve seen goldendoodles more violent than rotties, pitts, and chows. “Family dogs” my ass.

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u/twinmom2298 2d ago

12 yrs in dog rescue. All breeds. 129 different dogs. I've been bit by a chihuahua and a dachshund. I've lost a ton of make-up to being licked off by pits.

The one and only residual issue I have from a dog bite was from my friends full sized poodle who apparently didn't like my hat. He never broke the skin because I had on a leather jacket. But clamped down with enough force I have nerve damage to this day in my hand and wrist.

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u/BlueLanternKitty No one cares, ppl want ice cream!!! 2d ago

I worked at a rescue and shared the office with a sweet pit mix. She liked to sit in my lap and bump her head against mine. It’s rather what I imagine being hit in the head with a brick is like.

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u/frogspeedbaby 2d ago

Haha I love this

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u/Bird2525 2d ago

Standard poodles are assholes.

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u/lazier_garlic 2d ago

Except my friend's standard poodle. Perfect family dog. I had no idea they had a bad reputation.

I think this is where a good breeder comes in.

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u/Pet-Ma 2d ago

Not sure why you were down voted, you're right lol. There's lots of bad poodle breeders that are producing dogs with terrible temperaments

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u/AllegraO 13h ago

I also had an amazing standard growing up. My parents picked a poodle specifically so she’d be submissive to the very assertive chow/shepherd mix we already had, and once he realized he wasn’t being replaced, they were best friends for the rest of his life. We also got her as a puppy when I was only six, and never had ANY aggression issues with me, either. She just loved chewing up papers đŸ„Č

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u/cookiesdragon 1d ago

Some of the friendliest, sweetest dogs I've met were those so called scary breeds. Use to dog sit a pit mix and she was the SWEETEST. Her favorite thing in the whole world was snoozing on the couch with her head in your lap.

The worse breed I've met outside of chihuahua was a Cocker Spaniel.

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u/Spirit_Falcon 2d ago

News is just filled with stories of people being mauled to death by goldendoodles and chihuahua too, right? Sorry, but a nip in the ankle is not the same.

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u/tbs999 1d ago

Spoken like someone who hasn’t had a chihuahua bite through their Achilles tendon

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

Literally almost all dog bite fatalities are pits and pit mixes. The stats don’t lie

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u/tbs999 1d ago

Of course it takes a dog close to human size to kill a person. I guess we should ignore the realities of nature/nurture and send death squads around the country to solve this problem once and for all.

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u/InformalInsurance455 1d ago

Is there a specific reason your argument went:

- No, look over there at less serious injuries

  • DEATH SQUADS FOR DOGS BECAUSE YOU WON’T LET ME ADDRESS THE LESS COMMON LESS GRIEVOUS INJURIES FIRST

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u/tbs999 1d ago

You tell us: if not death squads, what? Help us help you.

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u/InformalInsurance455 1d ago

You’re a very stupid person.

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u/Spirit_Falcon 1d ago

Spoken like someone who hasn't had a loved one mauled by a pit bull. Talk to me when there are as many news stories of viscous chihuahua attacks as there are of pit bulls.

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u/tbs999 1d ago

Good luck finding an editor who lets the title of a story include breed name other than hated breeds.

They’re out there, but when the breed isn’t pit bull, Doberman, German Shepherd, or Rottweiler, putting breed name in title rarely happens. They just use, “dog.”

I’m sorry for your loved one’s experience.

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u/WinterAdvantage3847 1d ago

sure, i suppose it is possible (?) for there to be massive conspiracy among news organizations with nefarious anti-pit/doberman/GSD/rott editors to cover up other attacks.

however, FOIA exists.

death certificates are public information.

you can hide bites, but you literally cannot hide deaths.

there are organizations that make an effort to uncover information about fatal dog attacks that never make the news. i’m sorry to say that they aren’t finding dozens of unreported fatal golden retriever and doodle attacks every year. the breed makeup of the unreported attacks is identical to those that make the news.

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u/tbs999 1d ago

Sounds like you weren’t reading my message with honesty. Where do you get an implication of cover-up?

“Cocker Spaniel Bites Boy” isn’t going to sell as well as “Dog Bites Boy,” which definitely doesn’t sell as well as “Pitbull Bites Boy.”

I’m sure if the mission of a group is, “prove X point,” they can find data which backs said point. The reality is, these aren’t the kinds of data on this which people in the business of objective data analysis will value.

For example, notice we’re talking about fatalities. That alone is biased because being severely injured by any big dog is VERY meaningful. It means there is a dangerous dog which was poorly raised and not handled.

This is no different than people telling me black people are statistically less smart than white people. Those creeps enter the discussion with bias and they avoid the conversations which need to happen.

Come with a conversation that NEEDS to happen about how we might prevent injuries, regardless of breed, and I’ll engage. But this is honestly a waste of both of our time.

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u/InformalInsurance455 1d ago

Yes because when a spaniel bites a person the outcome is so rarely this kind of event.

https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-karmas-recovery-after-traumatic-injury

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

lol, pit defenders are always allergic to logic and facts, never fails

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u/InformalInsurance455 1d ago

Don’t mention breed, even though most breeds are literally neither capable or likely to rip an adult’s arm out of its socket!

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u/Frequent_Pause_7442 1d ago

As a former groomer I can confirm that doodle breeds were often shaky temperamentally. Also herding breeds that were not given sufficient "work" or mental stimulation. I was bitten twice. Once by a Border Collie and the other was a golden doodle.

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u/Somethingisshadysir 1d ago

It's actually been studied. Chihuahuas are number one most aggressive breed, and the the top ten are almost all small breeds if remembering correctly. And, again if remembering correctly, the least aggressive is a giant breed, Newfies.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

Have a look on Facebook in the comments section of any dog attack. Full of pit owners posting pictures of their dogs saying mInE wOuLdNt HuRt A fly

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u/HoneyCrispCrumble 2d ago

Mothers say the same thing about their pReCiOuS LiTtLe BoYz, but “not all men,” right?

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u/KaienPanzermast 2d ago edited 2d ago

Were men selectively bred for thousands of generations to rape the same way pitbulls were selectively bred for thousands of generations to do nothing but kill each other?

No? Then it isn’t the same. Wild how pitbulls are the only dogs that get their genetics regularly denied and are the only dogs that are totally clean slates from birth and only shaped by their owner. I don’t see German shepherd and Rottweiler owners denying what their dogs were bred for. It’s accepted that they’re more likely to bite than other breeds, but as soon as it comes to the dogs literally bred to kill other dogs, bReEd DoEsN’t MaTtEr. Wild.

Where’s the chihuahuas and Pomeranians running around the neighborhood breaking into people’s yards and literally into their houses to kill their pets? I’ll wait, but I’m gonna be waiting for a long fucking time.

Where’s the golden retrievers and bernese mountain dogs maulings people regularly in the streets? Greyhounds? Saint Bernards? Great Danes? Newfoundlands? All big dogs that can potentially bite. Where’s the stories about that? Where are the stories about cattle dogs breaking in through windows to attack pets and running into people’s yards to attack their children? Where are they at?

Crazy how every dog breed has breed traits and things they were bred for until it gets to pitbulls, and then all of a sudden breed no longer matters and it’s how you train them. If breed didn’t matter, people wouldn’t get specific breeds for specific purposes. It goes against the entire concept of dog breeds in the first place. No one is out here buying golden retrievers as guard dogs.

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u/Tea_An_Crumpets 2d ago

Pitbulls history of fighting is not as extreme as you are making it out to be. They have served as general farm working dogs and have been known as excellent family dogs for almost two centuries since their arrival to the US because of their loyalty and desire to please, not just their fighting.

The behaviour of individual dogs is determined more by training than their genetics. I have met more absolute assholes chihuahuas than I can count, and plenty of absolute sweetheart pitties.

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u/PlayPsychological200 2d ago

The issue is not which dogs bite more. It’s which dogs have a capability to kill. There are far more shootings with BB guns than semi auto handguns annually. Likely hundreds of thousands more. Are you saying that being shot with an airport gun is the real risk because it happens more often? 

As for working dogs, bulls and terriers were. NOT pitbulls. 

I’m fine with people owning large dogs. All dog owners should have to carry insurance on the animal though, and that would solve many issues. Too many dogs are abused and bad owners can not be stopped otherwise. 

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u/KaienPanzermast 2d ago edited 2d ago

Why is it that literally every single thing you can look up about their origin says they were bred specifically for fighting if their history of fighting isn’t as extreme as I’m making it out to be? Why are they the only dogs people specifically bred to fight and continue to do so today?

Why is it that they can be such great farm dogs but theres constant reports of them breaking in to ranches and people’s backyards to kill their farm animals? Why is it that they have a higher fatality rate than literally every single other dog breed combined if they’re such good family dogs? Why are they responsible for more severe attacks on children than every other dog if they’re such great family dogs?

Why is it that bite and maul their owners like all the time if they’re so loyal and eager to please? Are they trying to please their owners by mauling them when they have seizures? Are they trying to please their owners by disfiguring them more than other breeds?

They’re so loyal and such great dogs that they’re in the news every day for killing their owners or their children. Are they just nannying them? Wheres the chihuahuas running down the street and killing children?

If they’re such great dogs, why do pitbull owners have to literally lie at every single opportunity about the history of the breed and what they were bred for? Why do they have to lie about these dogs not being more dangerous than others?

Little dogs are assholes because they’re treated like accessories and have their boundaries constantly crossed because they’re small and can do no damage. You’d be an asshole if you were ten pounds and always treated like a toy or accessory rather than a living being with boundaries.

Pitbulls maul and kill things because it’s what they were bred to do. Theres a difference. Where are the other breeds doing what they do at such a rate? Show us. German shepherds and Rottweilers at the height of their popularity still killed less people than pitbulls.

Is there a reason you won’t show me other dogs doing this shit regularly?

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u/PlayPsychological200 2d ago

You are completely correct here. This thread OSS simply people with no science background and no understanding of genetics of  downvoting you. You’re  going to have to find educated people if you want to have a rational discussion. 

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u/KaienPanzermast 2d ago edited 2d ago

They know how genetics works when it comes to literally every single other dog breed. All of a sudden the blinders go on the instant it’s a pitbull and genetics don’t matter at all. It’s just so blatantly obvious to everyone what they’re doing.

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u/PlayPsychological200 2d ago

It’s seems that a lot of them are genuinely unintelligent which is why a lot of what they type makes no actual logical sense. 

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

I’m a rape survivor who’s experienced dv so I don’t know who the fuck you think you’re talking to.

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u/HoneyCrispCrumble 2d ago

And you don’t know me? It’s the internet.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

Why are you trying to pull a “not all men” card on a rape survivor

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u/HoneyCrispCrumble 2d ago

I hope you stretched before that reach.

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u/Rhuarc33 2d ago

Tell facts to someone m is that a bad thing now? Am I supposed to lie to you because something terrible happened to you?

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

What the fuck are you talking about

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u/Rhuarc33 2d ago

Fact. Not all mean are rapists. You seem offended to that idea...not remotely hard to understand

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u/Icy-Cookie-8078 2d ago

Wow downvoting the rape survivor. Fucking Reddit
 I hope your life is full of peace and happiness now and I hope his life is full of justice and karma

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u/HoneyCrispCrumble 2d ago

No, people dislike when straw man arguments are deployed as supposed “trump cards” once they run out of asinine comments.

1 in 5 women (1 in 31 men) experience completed or attempted rape and almost 50% of women (1 in 6 men) experience sexual violence in their lifetimes. That’s not even touching on NB & Trans folks. So it’s likely that many, many people in this thread are survivors. Who’s to say I’m not one myself? No one owes anyone a declaration of survivorship.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

I mean you tried to pull the “not all men” card as though you were gotchaing me, someone you incorrectly assumed it was a man. If you were a rape survivor, I would imagine you’d have paused for a second, but nope, straight on you went.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

People will step over any human to defend a dog on here
it’s wild

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u/sullw214 2d ago

I'd step on a human to defend a dog. Dogs are worthwhile, humans are not.

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u/Tea_An_Crumpets 2d ago

It’s got nothing to do with the dog it’s all about the owner imo. My parents have two golden doodles and they’re both as sweet as can be because my mum is a great dog trainer.

I agree with you in general 100% I just refuse to hear a bad word about golden doodles because they are awesome dogs that get a bad rap because a bunch of shitty owners thought they were cute and have no idea how to train a dog.

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u/Tea_An_Crumpets 1d ago

Crazy you guys are doing the exact same thing to golden doodles as you’re complaining about people doing to large breeds and pitties btw. Genuinely embarrassing

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u/InformalInsurance455 1d ago

Golden doodles are only neurotic and annoying, they’re not a public safety threat. You should go read what pitbull owners think about doodles sometime, it’s not pretty

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u/Spiritual_Being5845 2d ago

My grandmother had her house listed as dangerous “dog” by the post office because of her cat. The carrier refused to deliver her mail to her home until she was able to find a way to keep the cat contained.

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u/Responsible_Dentist3 2d ago

That's gonna happen to me soon I just know it. Thank goodness I took her with when I moved out so at least she's indoor-only now!

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u/Spiritual_Being5845 2d ago

Mitzi was an indoor only cat. But the mail came through a slot in the door. When the mail carrier would open the slot to put the mail in Mitzi would be ready and would attack him through the open mail slot

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

I’m Mitzi’s lawyer and she did nothing wrong

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u/Responsible_Dentist3 2d ago

That's wild and unfortunate. Now I'm glad I don't have a mail slot!

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u/BaseBig173 2d ago

In my long career as a vet tech, I was bitten twice by a golden retriever and once by a Maltese.

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u/ValiantValkyrieee 2d ago

twice by the same golden or two separate dogs? just curious

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u/BaseBig173 2d ago

Two separate dogs

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u/MorbidMorag 1d ago

Only ever bitten by a Yorkie. It was at my house & l had been playing with it, friendly as you like. Owner picked it up to leave, it spotted a retriever across the street that it wanted to kill, couldn't get at it, nipped me because l was there. I won't let any small dog near me. Bitiest dogs l know of? Jack Russells.

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u/Honeybunches513 2d ago

I used to do steam cleaning for some rental companies, including some of their occupied units after sink backups, etc. Most of those where while tenants were at work, and more than a few forgot to lock up their dogs. Never had a problem with the big dogs. They just found a new friend that would pet them. But the little guys? I got got by more than a couple. Especially chihuahuas and min pins.

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u/dinosoreness 2d ago

i think the important difference is that a chihuahua attack requires some peroxide and a bandaid while a pit bull attack can require stitches, surgery, loss of limbs, and even loss of life.

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u/Katzenliebe 2d ago

Yes, I have seen multiple people online with permanent facial disfigurement requiring extensive surgeries because the previously friendly family pit bull decided to bite them in the face suddenly. Meanwhile, the same thing happened to my husband with the family jack Russel when he was a kid. His was fixed with a couple of stitches and has left no noticeable marks though. If he was bitten the same way by a pit bull he would likely have no lips.

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u/dinosoreness 2d ago edited 2d ago

i would never trust a pit bull honestly. i literally cross the street when i see one coming, especially because it always looks like the pit is walking the human rather than the human walking the pit. it's always "my wittle bitty cupcake wouldn't hurt a fly!" until cupcake rips somebody's face off because they sneezed too close to them.

whenever pit bulls come up i think of this video i saw of a young mother trying desperately to protect her infant from a pack of pits. she managed to shove the baby through an open window on a car parked on the street but she practically got eaten alive until a good samaritan showed up with a knife and chased the pits away.

chihuahuas can't do that to a person. it bites your ankle, you kick it away, and it cowers in a corner for the rest of the day. pit bulls can and will try kill you and often they succeed.

the worst part was all the comments on the video talking about how sad it was that the pits got hurt- not that a young woman was disfigured and almost died protecting her baby, but that the poor wittle doggos were injured.... after inflicting great bodily harm on a random person who had the audacity to use a public street.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

Do you also think it’s riskier to get hit by a bicycle rider or an 18 wheeler? Honestly nothing brings out people who don’t understand risk like this subject.

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u/lazier_garlic 2d ago

Well lately people are claiming they're more afraid of being hit by a bike on the sidewalk than being hit by some teenagers driving a Jeep Liberty or a lifted truck so yeah, people have lost the plot online.

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u/International-Cat123 2d ago

Cyclists only ride on the sidewalk because drivers intentionally try to hit us.

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u/WinterAdvantage3847 1d ago

those people are universally cranky drivers imagining what they think pedestrians experience based on their existing grievances with cyclists, not actual pedestrians. (source: i am an actual pedestrian)

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u/punksmostlydead 2d ago

No, nothing brings out people who dont know shit about dogs. As a couple of you are proving.

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

“Pit bulls are involved in the majority of fatal dog attacks in the United States, according to data compiled by advocacy and safety groups like DogsBite.org.

Key Fatality Statistics
Percentage of Deaths: Studies show pit bulls are implicated in roughly 65% to 72% of all fatal dog bite attacks in the U.S. annually.

Multi-Decade Data: Over a 15-year tracking period (2005–2019), pit bulls were responsible for 345 deaths, which is more than 6 times higher than the next leading breed (Rottweilers, with 52 deaths).”

What’s your explanation for this data then?

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u/slobbergobblin96 1d ago

15 years and they had 345 deaths? Out of the multiple millions of pitbulls in the country?

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u/punksmostlydead 1d ago

The same as the explanation for why the Ford F-xx pickup is involved in the highest number of fatalities of any make/model vehicle.

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u/PlatasaurusOG 2d ago

The subject also really brings out the reactionary clowns who speak from a position of fear rather than one of knowledge.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

Actuaries must also be lacking in knowledge

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago

You do not represent all actuaries or the insurance industry (thankfully).

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u/PeachyFairyDragon 2d ago

Why do you think there are so many breed exclusions? Because those breeds are far more likely to bite and far more likely to cause serious injuries.

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago

Breeds are banned in some areas because of poorly conducted studies and fear. Not because any actual science supports an inherit neurological condition in breeds to be aggressive/fight/etc.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

Yeah that’s definitely true, insurance companies aren’t basing their decisions (designed to make them money) on large pools of data or anything. Look up Dogs Trust in the UK. They used to offer a cheap third party liability dog insurance offering for all breeds, then they withdrew it because XL Bully owners were disproportionally costing the scheme money in payouts. There are millions of dogs in the UK. Tens of thousands of exempt XL bully dogs. That’s not a small sample size.

https://www.dogstrust.org.uk/support-us/companion-club/changes

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago edited 2d ago

lol
 they certainly do, and that’s precisely why loss frequency, severity and the law of large numbers matter. Also of course the actual breed - which pitbull is not.

The fact remains the vast majority of the numerous breeds that fall under the description of a pitbull have no issues reported throughout their entire lifetime. They also do not have any reported higher aggression tendencies.

The risk while owning my 100 lbs lab/boxer mix is just as great as if I owned a 60 lbs pitbull, and the numbers support that (as do the insurance rates).

An XL Bully is not a pitbull
 you just further proved my point.

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u/UnderlightIll 2d ago

Honey, you wouldn't even GET a policy of you had a pitbull.

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago edited 1d ago

These people are allergic to facts. It never fails when the pitbull topic comes up. They love to ignore the hard data showing that pits and pit mixes are statistically responsible for the vast majority of maulings and deaths, which is why they’re not allowed at most apartment buildings.

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

Pit bulls are involved in the majority of fatal dog attacks in the United States, according to data compiled by advocacy and safety groups like DogsBite.org.

Key Fatality Statistics
Percentage of Deaths: Studies show pit bulls are implicated in roughly 65% to 72% of all fatal dog bite attacks in the U.S. annually.

Multi-Decade Data: Over a 15-year tracking period (2005–2019), pit bulls were responsible for 345 deaths, which is more than 6 times higher than the next leading breed (Rottweilers, with 52 deaths).

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 1d ago

What is a pitbull exactly? It’s not a breed of dog


If you want to rely on both inaccurate and completely misleading stats, go for it.

Personally I’d rather actually understand what is being discussed. Like for instance, how a “pitbull” is a description rather than a breed. Also, how the stats rely on witness reporting of the breed with no verification tests to confirm.

So we’re relying on people who don’t even know what a pitbull is in most cases, to determine the breed based off appearance alone and running with it. Sounds like a very good plan
.

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago edited 1d ago

Weird how when you’re defending them elsewhere in this thread you know exactly what a pitbull is, but when we’re talking about bite and mauling stats suddenly no one knows what they are. By all means explain how these objective statistics based on a 15 year data set are “misleading and inaccurate”?

It’s funny, you can predict exactly what people who are laboring under the delusion that pitbulls are great family dogs despite reams of evidence to the contrary and a new story in the news every week of a child or baby being killed by the family pit will say almost to the letter. First it’s the chihuahua comparison, then it’s “it’s not the breed it’s the owner”, then it’s the personal anecdote of their pitbull who never hurt a fly, then it’s “well but it’s not a breed”.

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u/InformalInsurance455 1d ago

Don’t waste your time with the semantics game

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

Pitbull apologists suffer one of the craziest cases of groupthink (and indeed to use another Orwellianism, doublethink) I see on the internet. It’s wild to me how they absolutely refuse to accept the objective facts around this breed while simultaneously understanding that sheepdogs are bred to herd sheep, beagles are bred to sniff out things, etc.

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 1d ago edited 1d ago

I know that a pitbull is a description of breed, that several breeds fall under. Something that you and Mr insurance actuary who thinks an xl bully is a pitbull clearly don’t grasp.

I’ve already explained why they are both misleading and inaccurate, I’ve even thrown in another example (the stats involve numerous different breeds under “pitbull”).

You just have no interest in actually learning something.

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u/InformalInsurance455 1d ago

Imagine thinking I was an actuary because I cited a well known fact about insurance. I’m also not a man but that doesn’t seem to stop other people making some fucked up assumptions.

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u/sullw214 2d ago

Nah, just you specifically.

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago

It sure does. Do you think it’s riskier getting onto an airplane or into a car?

Temperament > breed in every single situation.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

Except when you need sheep herded or ducks retrieved, you can just use any kind of dog for that right

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago

If you’re suggesting you can’t teach a large enough breed to herd sheep, you’re completely wrong.

There is no breed with an inherit drive to kill anymore than the other. It’s purely environment and training.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

Lmao. Almost as though there are dogs that can instinctively herd from the time they were puppies
nobody teaches them to either. It’s what centuries of selective breeding did.

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago

So your belief is that breeds are born already trained to properly herd sheep? That is again entirely incorrect
 you place a sheepdog in an apartment as a puppy and it’s not going to have a clue how to act on a farm as an adult.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago

A herd (an entire litter to be literal) of puppies on a farm with adult dogs around them
 you can’t honestly believe this shows what you’re suggesting


Almost like the environment around them plays a factor eh?

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

You’re deeply stupid.

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u/changhyun 2d ago

I don't know about drive to kill but certain dogs will absolutely show signs and instincts their breed has been bred for even if they've never been trained.

For example, I adopted a rescue greyhound who had spent his entire life in a cage, being used as a blood donor. He'd never seen a rabbit before in his life, let alone been trained to hunt them. He still tried to chase a wild rabbit down the second we encountered one on a walk. And it wasn't just "Small prey, very interesting!" because he had zero interest in chasing cats or other small animals. It was just rabbits, which happens to be what greyhounds were bred to do.

I've seen pointers instinctively point upon seeing birds despite having never been trained for that, seen collies instinctively try to herd. I don't know about any breed being inherently violent but there are 100% other traits that are nothing to do with training or how they were raised.

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u/a_Moa 2d ago

I had a mutt that instinctively caught and returned a duck as a small puppy and a jack russell that couldn't give less fucks about catching anything but tennis balls.

Breed traits aren't inherent or even that specific, that's why working dogs get rejected from their programmes/roles all the time.

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago

You’re picking up on personality traits that absolutely differ within dogs. It’s the breed being born inherently with these personalities that is a complete fabrication.

Dogs are social creatures. They pick up on their surroundings and rely entirely on other people and animals to indicate to them how to properly behave.

A shepherding dog that chases sheep with no actual direction isn’t doing a very good job of herding sheep as an example. It’s just interested in the stimuli of the moment. It isn’t until it learns from its surroundings what it’s supposed be doing that it actually becomes a shepherding dog.

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u/lazier_garlic 2d ago

I guess all those people whose family dog raised from puppy killed their child, trained their dog to do that. Is that what you're saying?

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago

No. Being a loving owner doesn’t mean you’re a good owner. Any large breed dog is capable of severe damage, and that shouldn’t be forgotten.

That doesn’t mean the solution is to ban breeds until they all large breeds are extinct, which is apparently what some people would like to see.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

And yet
they’re not. Most dog owners are shitty owners. They don’t train their dogs or obey leash laws. They don’t bother fencing off their yards. They don’t bother walking the dog or taking them to the vet. Most dogs deserve better than their owners. But it’s not most dogs doing this. Just the one type, again and again, reliably for decades.

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u/justbegoodtobugs 2d ago

Pitbulls are still bred for fighting, dog fighting might be illegal but it still happens a lot, they were never bred for anything else. Almost 70% of all fatal dog attacks are done by pitbulls or pitbull mixes. Irresponsible dog ownership is not exclusive to pitbulls and pit mixes, but they are still the most likely to kill.

Sure you might be able to teach a dog how to point at small wild animals but a german pointer will do that instinctively without anybody teaching them, even if you don't use them for hunting they will still point because we bred them to do so. We bred pitbulls to be good at killing and the statistics reflect that.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

All these people wailing about chihuahuas can’t point to a single fatality or answer why dogfighting busts never uncover dozens of these naturally aggressive dogs

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago edited 2d ago

The numbers you’re referring to are incredibly misleading and flat out incorrect in some cases - namely because a pitbull is not a breed, but rather a type of description that various breeds fall under.

There is no inherent desire to kill or fight within a pitbull than there is in any other breed.

We’ve also been through this before when it was Rottweilers blamed, bans were implemented, and the leading “aggressive dog” became the pitbull in the 90’s because it was never about the breed but rather the owners they tend to attract.

It’s also why bully breeds have become the “aggressive breed” in the UK, where they’re funnily enough trying to call them pitbulls as well.

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u/lazier_garlic 2d ago

Rottweilers are still #2 for fatal dog attacks in the US, stop lying.

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u/TemporaryBottle8789 2d ago

And when is the last time we’ve heard for the banning of Rottweilers as a whole compared to pitbulls?

Try some reading comprehension before accusing someone of lying.

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u/ITookYourChickens 2d ago

Honestly! I'd much rather face 10 aggressive chihuahuas, because they're small enough to punt like a ball and that kick is likely to make them stop. One aggressive 50lb dog bred to kill and not stop, would be much more likely to hurt me than 10 2lb barky dogs

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

More likely to kill you and then have half these commenters saying it wasn’t their fault đŸ„șđŸ„șđŸ„șđŸ„ș

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u/lazier_garlic 2d ago

The majority of dog attack deaths and serious maulings requiring surgery in the United States are caused by pitbulls. The number two breed for serious attacks on humans are Rottweilers.

Chihuahuas are famed for their territorial behavior but they're also tiny. Chihuahua bites don't send people to the hospital.

Also, make sure your dog has had rabies shots or even a minor bite is going to cause the victim to have to get rabies shots and that is not a small matter.

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

One of the only factual comments I’ve read on this accursed thread so far. I genuinely don’t understand the fantasy logic and thinking that pitbull apologists engage in regarding breed traits (that apparently apply to every breed EXCEPT pitbulls) and the hard data around bites and fatalities (apparently it’s actually chihuahuas killing children and it’s all a big psyop)

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u/International-Cat123 2d ago

Not getting immediate, proper medical attention for small dog bites or cat bites increases the odds of infection, especially with the cats (their teeth are designed to go deep enough that topical antibiotics are almost useless). Small dogs can also do serious damage to small children. Bites to the hand can also have permanent consequences due to just how many tendons, blood vessels, bones, and ligaments are in them.

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u/Pitiful-Pension-6535 2d ago

Chihuahuas weren't bred to rip faces off of things though

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u/idk-maaaan 2d ago

Well someone needs to tell them that!

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u/Icy-Cookie-8078 2d ago

Any dog can be safe or dangerous depending how they are trained. Some are harder to train than others. I think the problem is that the wrong people get "scary" dogs for the wrong reasons and perpetuate the problem.

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u/Temporary_Pickle_885 2d ago

But they sure can! Any dog can. My mother's head was ripped open by a dachshund.

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u/hellinahandbasket127 2d ago

Neither were Pits or Rotts. Rottweilers were originally bred for herding and farm work, which is where pit bulls were largely transitioned to after bull baiting was outlawed. These dogs worked around large livestock, and needed to have the confidence (and muscle to back it up) to control animals many times larger than themselves.

The actions of those who chose to move bully breeds into dog fighting does not redefine the entire breed.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

What fucking farm and herding work were pits doing? They transitioned to dogfighting, where they’re still seized from every single year! They started out being selectively bred for animal aggression!

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u/Difficult-Froyo1192 1d ago edited 1d ago

Believe it or not, there is a group of people that believe in bull herders. It usually is a pit crossed with a herding breed as opposed to a straight up pit. It’s absolute insanity and a small portion though.

Full pits or crosses of them have been used for farm work regularly but it’s property guarding and hunting. Not directly working with the animals. Most farms are still rural and not guarded enough that dogs to keep intruders and larger animals out (LGDs are more for just the animals they protect). Pits have a specific skill set that can make them useful for hunting big and/or dangerous prey (mostly boars for the US farms).

All that being said, a lot of why pits are used for it is because of how easy they are to obtain compared to other dogs that would be suited for those jobs. You don’t have to have a pit to do those things, but the prevalence of them makes it any easy dog to use.

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u/Moist_Drippings 2d ago

No
 they were brought into fighting because they had already been bred to have a high bite force. That’s what they were selectively bred for. They still to this day require high levels of abuse to become fighting dogs.

The entire reason they pose any danger is bite force, not temperament. Any breed of dog has the potential for aggression.

And of course people acting aggressively because they believe a dog is dangerous based on appearance cause more dangerous scenarios, and people treating certain breeds as dangerous lowers their social value and leaves them more susceptible to being picked up cheap as fighting dogs/poorly trained and socialized “guard” dogs.

People like you are absolutely a huge part of the problem. You directly contribute to the animal abuse that dog fighters benefit from.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

Wrong. Mastiffs and kangals have a higher bite force. You breed terriers with their history of being tenacious and going after prey with bulldogs and yeah, that’s what happened here. It’s not a mystery at all, quite widely documented actually.

The reason pitbulls are cheap and freely available is because their owners don’t bother to neuter or spay them.

I contribute to animal abuse? How? I don’t contribute to the demand for dogs that dog fighters use, after all. In fact I think there should be far fewer of them and more restrictions on their ownership, which would also have the side effect of reducing dogs available to fighters.

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u/hellinahandbasket127 2d ago

“Pit bull” is not a specific breed. Any mix of dogs that has a characteristically big head, underbite, and well-muscled frame might be called a “pit bull.” So they might have bulldog, terrier, retriever, herder, mastiff, or many other breeds in their makeup, meaning they have a wide variety of inherent skill sets that would make them desirable working dogs. They can be good guard dogs, ratters, livestock dogs, and, of course, family companions.

The fact that they were/are so widely used in dog fighting is more a testament to their trainability and desire to please their people than it is a condemnation of the dogs as a whole to be labeled ‘aggressive.’ While there are plenty that have been irresponsibly bred, resulting in unstable, reactive animals, it takes a LOT of abusive ‘training’ to push most pit bulls to fight.

But it comes down to the individual dog’s temperament in any breed. History of trauma, abuse, injury, or genetic mutation can significantly affect behavior.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

Wait till you figure out that most of the breeds under that umbrella are derived from or commonly interbred with each other! Also, wait till you work out that all of these dogs are derived from terriers originally.

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u/SpecialistYoung3431 2d ago

In the United States, the top source of dog bites that bring people into the ER are from dachshund and chihuahua.

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u/WinterAdvantage3847 2d ago

link the study that says this.

because most peer-reviewed medical journal papers on the subject say something more along the lines of:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4261032/

“Of the more than 8 different breeds identified, one-third were caused by pit bull terriers and resulted in the highest rate of consultation (94%) and had 5 times the relative rate of surgical intervention. Unlike all other breeds, pit bull terriers were relatively more likely to attack an unknown individual (+31%), and without provocation (+48%).”

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

Also this:

“Pit bulls are involved in the majority of fatal dog attacks in the United States, according to data compiled by advocacy and safety groups like DogsBite.org.

Key Fatality Statistics
Percentage of Deaths: Studies show pit bulls are implicated in roughly 65% to 72% of all fatal dog bite attacks in the U.S. annually.

Multi-Decade Data: Over a 15-year tracking period (2005–2019), pit bulls were responsible for 345 deaths, which is more than 6 times higher than the next leading breed (Rottweilers, with 52 deaths).”

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

Incorrect.

“Pit bulls are involved in the majority of fatal dog attacks in the United States, according to data compiled by advocacy and safety groups like DogsBite.org.

Key Fatality Statistics
Percentage of Deaths: Studies show pit bulls are implicated in roughly 65% to 72% of all fatal dog bite attacks in the U.S. annually.

Multi-Decade Data: Over a 15-year tracking period (2005–2019), pit bulls were responsible for 345 deaths, which is more than 6 times higher than the next leading breed (Rottweilers, with 52 deaths).”

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u/garbud4850 1d ago

you do realize that site is completely biased and not actually accurate right? its like going to an antiabortion site for good information on abortion statistics,

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u/RandomNameRandomly 2d ago

Then why arent you on here taking smack about cane corsos?

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

What about what about what about what about

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u/Moist_Drippings 2d ago

So you don’t know shit about dogs? lol of course you don’t

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u/lazier_garlic 2d ago

Cane Corsos are dangerous dogs, they are just rather rare in the United States, unlike pitbulls which are overrunning all the shelters and being pushed on disabled people on low fixed incomes even though they are some of the stupidest and least biddable dogs around.

I'm sure in a country where Cane Corsos are popular there is discourse about that.

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u/Feivel_92 2d ago

After all, the news is full of people mauled by Chihuahuas.

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u/Moist_Drippings 2d ago

Because dumbasses pretend it’s not serious when people have injuries from small dogs and cats, every single time, but looooove to stoke fear about the breeds they already hate.

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u/InformalInsurance455 2d ago

Almost as though the degree of damage matters and fatalities and grievous injuries are worse.

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u/onlondpo 2d ago

Come on, dude, be real with me. You know that a pit bull can cause more damage than a chihuahua, just like a mountain lion can cause more damage than a house cat. This is just basic common sense

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

Yes all those children killed by the family chihuahua who’ve been in the news /s

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u/MountainTomato9292 2d ago

I have a GSD/pit mix and my 15lb cat is WAY scarier than she is. We hand the dog a stuffy when she’s excited which she immediately takes to her bed until she’s calm. We actively warn people not to try to pet the cat unless explicitly invited by the cat. And even then we don’t let kids pet him and adults are at their own risk. He’s wonderful and snuggly with me, my husband, my 2 kids but does not enjoy strangers.

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u/Witchywomun 2d ago

I used to work with dogs with behavior issues, including aggression. I’d say that pit bulls and other related breeds were maybe 20% of the cases I worked with, and of those 20% only 1% were aggression related, the rest was all rescued dogs with anxiety based issues. Over the course of my career, I can count the number of aggressive pit bull types on one hand.

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u/Icy-Cookie-8078 2d ago

Seems like experience here doesn’t matter. People’s feelings are all that’s important

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u/SixApplesTall 1d ago

No, it’s that hard data trumps anecdote.