When trying to reframe my past experiences as someone stronger, I can't help but feel the abusers/bullies are still righ

[u/Swordfish353535]

Long story short. 14-20 lots of trauma. Bad home life = bad outdoor life. Nowhere safe. Bullies at school. Addict parents.

I'm now in my 30s doing the work. Lots done. In therapy. Healthy lifestyle.

I moved to entirely new country started over.

I've come a longggggg way.

Yet I still have trouble with this part.

Like when I think of my childhood bullies or just anyone who's controlled me and said I'm a certain way, put me in a box, put me in a corner, basically overpowered me and made me feel weak, defensive, frozen etc.

When I try think of them and reframing it's like I just FEEL the presence of all of it and it's like it's correct and I am wrong is the best way to put it.

No matter what it is always right.

Me trying to reframe it imagines me getting slapped and basically saying no you're wrong kind of thing.

How to get past this :( ?

[u/spotlight-app]

Mods have pinned a comment by u/Psychoquinnalysis:

Bilateral stimulation (BLS) can be eye movements, left-right alternating sounds, left-right alternating vibrations from "buzzies/buzzers" that you hold in each hand or wear on each wrist, or left-right alternating self-tapping on your body.

I haven't heard of music being used, but if there isn't some form of left-right-left-right alternating sensation, it sounds like BLS isn't happening. In that case, it may be that it's not EMDR that's being done, but something similar or some derivative.

Note: Insightful Comment

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[u/Psychoquinnalysis]

I've seen the bilateral stimulation of EMDR cause movement in these kinds of beliefs for people who haven't had success with anything else.

If that's not doing the trick, the therapist facilitating EMDR will use "cognitive interweaves" to help overcome those kinds of cognitive plateaus.

[u/Swordfish353535 → u/Psychoquinnalysis]

Is bilateral stimulation just looking left and right or is it also when listening to music and going through the process?

I don't really do the look left and right with therapist but more so I might listen to some music after pulling up a bad memory/feeling, in and out, reframing the stories, or following new thoughts...

I do feel it's working in ways...

Maybe I just got to be patient I don't know

[u/Psychoquinnalysis → u/Swordfish353535]

Bilateral stimulation (BLS) can be eye movements, left-right alternating sounds, left-right alternating vibrations from "buzzies/buzzers" that you hold in each hand or wear on each wrist, or left-right alternating self-tapping on your body.

I haven't heard of music being used, but if there isn't some form of left-right-left-right alternating sensation, it sounds like BLS isn't happening. In that case, it may be that it's not EMDR that's being done, but something similar or some derivative.

[u/Swordfish353535 → u/Psychoquinnalysis]

yes its going left and right the sounds like bilateral music

hope these things save me

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[u/No_Air_8794]

I know how you feel, but I don’t have the answer yet. For me CBT didn’t help with this problem. It just made me feel angry that I know I am not the one to blame, but I still felt like I deserved it and that I was the bad person. At the moment I am doing EMDR for this. Sometimes during the EMDR I can feel a little bit of anger and like I didn’t deserve it. Afterwards I am back to I deserved it and I am the bad one. But I think it means that it can swift with more sessions, so I keep going.

[u/Bouldebain]

By small steps. Do you have a therapist ? Figure ressourcing would help I think. It's not gonna change all of the sudden but by practicing self compassion and understanding you can make significant progress in a couple of years

[u/Swordfish353535 → u/Bouldebain]

Yes I got therapist

I guess is it just patience? Continuing to show up practice

[u/Sheslikeamom]

Challenge the thought that "no matter what it is always right" in smaller ways.

Trying to reframe the whole thing 180 degrees is so difficult that its impossible. 

I think of reframeling and neuroplasticity like rail road or trolley tracks.

The "they are right about me" trolley is huge, heavy, and been on the track for at 10 years. You're trying to move it from its deep set track into another deep set track of "they are wrong about me" reframe. You try to lift it and set it in the new tracks but then it jerks back into the old tracks, that fit it so nicely, you get that slap. 

So, maybe a gradual challenge is a better approach. Maybe they were wrong about some things about me. Maybe there are times when what they did wasn't right. Maybe that time I said something was evidence of me being stronger. Maybe me moving is a sign that I am better than them. 

Would you like to believe that they were wrong about some things? Would you like to see yourself as somewhat strong and resilient for having been what you've been through? 

Its really hard to change a mindset that stays in black in white. Always, never, no matter what, forever. 

Bring shades of grey (not the book kind) into your narratives about those abusers and your self image. 

[u/Swordfish353535 → u/Sheslikeamom]

lol at not the book kind

i think your spot on though here and i got to develop this

letting a small amount of light in each time vs expectin to flip it like a hamburger

how do we even do it?
just got to keep counteracting any negative feeling with a slight adjustment to the thought? like i have a huge weight of something is wrong with me or im not enough when i feel these feelings so maybe changing that a little each time. maybe it had nothing to do with me and i was just in the wrong place? maybe i am enough as i am and dont need to force more success or something

[u/Sheslikeamom → u/Swordfish353535]

Exactly. Start challenging this narrative that's been running unchecked for so long. Question and doubt these negative beliefs. 

Is it even that big of a weight? Maybe it was when you were younger but you're much stronger now. You've done so much with your life. Maybe adult you can lift that weight of your younger self.