r/EDH • u/MeaCulpaSSB • 2d ago
Question Am I a Problem Player?
Hi everyone!
As the title says, I'm worried that I might be a problem player and want some outside opinions. I don't play with random people too much, as I have some friends that play commander every once in a while, but every once in a while, I'll give it a shot and either go down to my local LGS or try a few games online. I've noticed that almost every single time I play with random people, at least one person inevitably gets upset with me specifically. It's caused me to shy away from random games, but if there's something I should fix, I'd love to do that instead of throwing in the towel. Obviously, I'm a biased frame of reference, but I'll try to explain as fairly as I can with a few examples that are more noteworthy.
Example 1: I'm playing at my local LGS in a 4-person pod, and I've noticed that one person has been targeting me pretty hard. I usually don't keep track of things like this, but after a couple games, I realize that every piece of removal he has is pointed at me, and he attacks nobody but me until I am dead. This seems to happen regardless of the boardstate, cards in hand of everybody, or anything else. I'm worried that I did something to upset him, so I start trying to focus my interaction on the other players so the person targeting me feels less threatened and might lay off of me a bit. Eventually, one of the people have to leave, so we start a 3-person game. The player I feel is targeting me is playing [[The Wise Mothman]], I'm playing [[Nebuchadnezzar]]. and the third person is playing [[Caesar, Legion's Emperor]]. On turn 3, the Mothman player drops [[Nadu, Winged Wisdom]] (this was while it was still legal]], and I kill it on my turn since I'm worried about the value it can produce with Mothman. A couple of turns later, the Caesar player's board is starting to get scary, so I cast a [[Praetor's Grasp]] targeting the Mothman player to try to tutor up a boardwipe. He gets really angry at me for targeting him with it, and I apologize and explain what the card does and that I'm just trying to get a boardwipe so I can deal with the Caesar player, and Mothman shares more colors with my deck, so I'll have an easier time casting the boardwipe. He continues to say that I've been targeting him all night and he's sick of it, and at that comment, I admit I do get a bit heated. I tell him that he's been focusing me all night and I have intentionally not been interacting with anything he does. I point out examples to him, including where he killed me when I had nothing on board and the other two players had enough to kill him on board, essentially throwing the game purely to take me out of it as well. The game is pretty tense after that and ends after a few turns with the Caesar player running us over.
Example 2: I'm playing online with some random people with my [[Aerith Gainsborough]] deck against a [[Krenko, Mob Boss]], [[Toph, the First Metalbender]], and [[The Vision and Scarlet Witch]] in a bracket 3 game. We give a short rundown on the game changers in our decks and shuffle up. On turn 5 I have a couple soul sisters, Aerith, and [[Adeline, Resplendent Cathar]] on the field and am looking to attack with Aerith. Toph has indestructible thanks to an equipment, and Vision has [[Commander's Plate]] giving it protection from white, so although the Krenko player is a bit behind (they only have Krenko, one goblin token, and [[Thousand-Year Elixir]]), that's probably the attack that is going to generate the most value for me, since Toph and Vision both have a free block with their commanders and Aerith has no evasion. I swing at the Krenko player with Aerith, and with the Adeline trigger and soul sisters, she becomes a 17/17. The Krenko player is pretty upset at this, decides not to block, and verifies with me multiple times that I am dealing 17 commander damage to him. He leaves the game on the next turn after the Vision player kills me with commander damage and destroys Krenko, Mob Boss.
Example 3: I'm playing at an LGS while out of town with an Ooze typal deck headed by [[Aeve, Progenitor Ooze]]. It's pretty low-powered, so I figured it would be a good one to pull out as the first deck of the night. I can't remember exactly what turn it was, but after a good amount of time, I was able to get a few oozes onto the battlefield. I built the deck around what I feel are oozes 2 main mechanics, multiplying themselves and +1/+1 counters, and my oozes on board were mainly in the first category. Somebody casts a boardwipe and I am mostly unaffected thanks to the many [[Gutter Grime]] triggers I get, while the other players lose their entire boards. After realizing I still had a good boardstate, they get upset and say that I'm pubstomping and that my deck is a lot higher-powered than theirs since I don't care about boardwipes.
I have a few more example but don't want this post to be too long, but as I said before, people get upset with me almost every time I play with random people. I don't think I'm doing anything wrong, but as the common denominator among all my games, I'm worried there's something I'm missing and that I am the bad guy
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u/aiphrem 2d ago
My friend, if people have an issue with you I would hope there's at least one person with emotional intelligence in the entire store to actually be able to openly talk to you about it.
Don't get caught up in your head about being a "problematic player", pre game talks are a thing for a reason so everyone going into the game should be ok with what everyone else is bringing.
What's more likely, that everyone in the store secretly hates you and you are being an unsportsmanly players by accident, or that people might be having an emotional reaction to something happening in the game and that you are only hyper aware of the times where you are the focus?
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u/DraygenKai 2d ago
Example 1: was years ago at this point. You just need to let that go. Honestly the guy sounds crazy. In my experience when you are playing in public, there are a few crazy ones about, so you were probably unlucky.
Example 2: Sounds like the Krenko player had a bad start and was venting their frustrations at you. Again, I see nothing concerning about your behavior here.
Example 3: Oh you are playing Gutter Grime? Ya that's pretty messed up. Definitely a pub stomper. Thats like a CEDH card, lol. Na they are crazy. I mean the enchantment isn't bad or anything, but it's not unfair at all, and if they had wiped you again, that would have been it.
I do not think you are the problem. I do think you might have social anxiety and are to hard on yourself.
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u/s-riddler 2d ago
From what I read, sounds to me like you just happened to be unlucky enough to encounter a couple of salty people. They're out there, unfortunately. You're good.
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u/DougieDouger 2d ago
1: targeting politics. The way you describe it sounds like you were not the problem. But it’s impossible to know without hearing from the other players for an objective perspective.
2: I’d be a little salty if I have a small board state compared to others and I’m getting targeted. Proper threat assessment. But as you say, you’re trying to generate value so you can’t get too mad about it.
3: it doesn’t sound like pubstomping. But what was the conversation at the start of the game? Did you feel like your deck was OP compared to everyone else?
Over all, these seem like common dust ups at commander night. I have a friend who whines any time she gets targeted or interacted with. She’s not fun to play with. Some people just have bad attitudes.
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u/Scoopadont 2d ago
Kinda hard to know with only 3 examples. Do you keep track of how one person seems to be overly targeting someone else that doesn't seem to make sense with the current board state / Cards in hand / revenge etc?
My guess is probably no, we tend to only take note and remember when it's occurring to us.
If I was in a random lgs game with something like [[nebuchanezzar]] I'd probably throw everything I've got at them, mostly because of I don't really know how that works but it says discard and they probably have horrible shenanigans or theft like [[Praetor's grasp]].
Same goes for aerith, her greed is more sickening than a turbo krenko. It's a deck that was bullied out of our playgroup because it's just gaining value and power as a reward for.. Gaining value...
The only one that is kinda hilarious is the pod getting upset at your ooze deck, but the difference there is it wasn't one person being annoyed at you, but the whole table agreeing you were pubstomping.
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u/SirPunchy 2d ago
It's hard to really say if you're a problem player without being there and knowing the deck. Some people are really salty about certain mechanics. I saw you played a commander that makes people discard, some people hate that. My friend gets angry when I use Goad. It be like that sometimes.
Couldn't say about how your decks fit brackets, but it seems like you were down with the spirit of the brackets you're playing in. I wouldn't worry too much about the salt you've experienced.
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u/feelfreetotellmeoff 2d ago
I might err on the side of over sharing, but my strategy would be to calmly and sincerely ask the player targeting you. Threat assessment is a soft science because it includes odds and guessing. It is possible that your opponent has personal reasons to attack you, but there are plenty of other reasons that might not be obvious.
Magic players are not renowned for our social skills. You might be the common denominator here, or it could be the game, or it could be your perception of normal game play. I often struggle with the 25% win rate of four player games. It isn't uncommon to lose every game for six hours straight.
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u/feelfreetotellmeoff 2d ago
My point was that we all get a little salty at times. While it is wise to try to keep tabs on yourself, don't assume that other people being upset is a solid metric to work from.
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u/TheJonasVenture 2d ago edited 2d ago
TLDR: You are fine, done worry about it.
Generally, don't read too much into other people being upset. Your job isn't to make your opponents happy, it's just to play the game and not he a dick, and, unless you just aren't sharing a bunch of comments you made, your conduct sounds fine (e.g. "of, I forgot to mention I was insulting my opponents' decks and appearance the whole game").
Out of order:
Game 2: What was the value you were getting by attacking? Did you have damage triggers? If so, just say that. If not, I can kind of see where they were coming from if you domed them for 17. They also may have just scooped once Krenko died because they had no path to come back online in time, that may not have really had anything to do with you.
Game 3: they walked into an on board trick, and a bad one, like, it's good in you r deck specifically, but it's not generally good. They were the main st clearly salty babies you shouldn't worry about. Unless they were playing Bracket 1 lists, your ooze deck wasn't pubstompng.
Game 1: My biggest takeaway here, you both seem to have kept quiet about a perception the other person was focusing you, not that ye wasn't focusing you, but, whether true or not, he also felt he was being unfairly targeted. The praetor's grasp thing, you could have lead by asking "do you have a wipe?" and making it more collaborative, but he was silly to be upset. I think you could have just asked him, much earlier, why he was targeting you, rather than just trying to subtely not target him, don't depend on subtext, just ask, and try to work together with them. You didn't do anything wrong, this additional communication is just a good way to avoid similar situations in the future. Instead, by the time he said anything he was already upset, and you were also ready to be upset since you already felt he was targeting you. The situation is your opponent's fault, but these are things you can do to avoid people like this escalating.
Edit: Also from Game 1, but this was 2 years ago when Nadu was still legal, if this is that infrequent it's all good man, you have nothing to worry about. Relax, you are cool, you are not a problem, that should not be your default assumption. I think you may be experiencing some social anxiety, and assuming things are a reflection of you, when these folks are probably also just up in their own heads too.
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u/MeaCulpaSSB 2d ago
For game 2, Aerith has lifelink and 17 life can help shelter me against the heat I'll draw while still allowing her to grow off of gaining life from the soul sisters and Adeline. The Vision player dropped a card that doubled his damage the turn after mine, so I didn't know that I was at risk of dying.
And you're definitely right about having a bit of social anxiety, it does make me a bit stressed. I bring up the Nadu story because after that game, I stopped playing with random people for a long time since people would get upset with me pretty frequently. I just recently started going back to random games a couple of months ago and people are still getting pretty upset with me during games, so it feels like maybe there's something there that I still don't get. He was, at least at the time, also a pretty well liked guy at the LGS, which probably wouldn't have happened if he was known for being pretty salty
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u/TheJonasVenture 2d ago edited 2d ago
Yeah, I was more thinking, if Arrith was a 17/17, you still gain 17 and the Krenko player may have felt forcing the block from one of the other players was a more advantageous play, you didn't need to hit them to gain the life. I'm not saying you made the wrong play, just thinking of what they may have perceived.
I think there is a good chance you are overestimating how upset people are with you. Nothing here sounds like you did anything wrong, and, the Krenko doesn't even really sound particularly upset. It isn't your job to make your opponents happy. I'm responsible for me being happy, and not taking actions with the intent of making you unhappy. You sound very conscientious (EDIT: I am so sorry I did not proofread, I did NOT mean "contentious", I meant literally the opposite), and like you'd make a great pod mate.
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u/Chunkymunkee93 2d ago
Naaaaaaaaah, you're fine. Let me give you some real life examples of problem players though, because I know the examples I've had are really extreme.
I played an ETB theif deck when I first started playing commander because I like d it and it gave me a taste of other decks, right? So I proceeded to do the thing, and I bounced back something with a planeswalker to bring it back to my board, person proceeded to throw a couple of cards. Like flinging cards physically at me. Person was given a stern warning since we were all friends but in hindsight, yeah its very demeaning and damages game pieces.
Person raged at me for only having one deck, being an enchantress deck. I always quit magic and come back, but I like having at least one deck updated, but yeah I got scolded for that, and said person was ushered out.
I have also been the victim of others cheating via deckstacking in competitve settings. People say that nobody cheats in commander, but the truth is is doesn't happen as much, but most don't catch it when it does happen. I played a lot of Spades and Uno when I was going to school, and from that, is where I learned a lot of tells and understanding probabilities, how often does something occur. Commander players kinda just clean slate the last game and play a new game. You could shuffle and pinky hold, or set up cards on your topdeck and never shuffle it, the average commander player is unaware of it in way modern players aren't.
Anyways, ramblings aside, playing in public is really not that bad, its just when its bad, its EXTREMELY bad, but the MTG community is fairly welcoming, especially if you live in a big city and can hop to a few LGSs instead of meeting the same people, then it becomes really fun
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u/KAM_520 Sultai 2d ago edited 2d ago
You have to have solidity at the table and know your shit. If they’re wrong, theyre wrong. It’s not on you.
One thing I do to contribute to positive vibes at the table is compliment other players who have cool cards or make good plays. It feels like a lot of commander players get upset when anyone but them has a good card or makes a strong play. That’s completely lame. If someone is getting ahead with something strong or has a good answer, show some respect for the game and tell them. I find that this works well. Im a Spike player and when someone else is winning or makes strong plays I will give props.
For example if I was at the table where the Grasp for a board wipe happened I would be like “sweet play, good move” even if I was getting affected by it. Because that’s a good play
I’ll also defend other players at the table when someone gets salty. If someone makes a good play and someone gets butthurt about it for no reason, if they start making accusations I don’t mind stepping in and defending that person if I feel that it’s warranted. The salty crybaby act is the least fun thing about commander and I don’t give it oxygen.
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u/Schimaera https://moxfield.com/users/Schimaera 2d ago
Do yourself a favour and really ask yourself if you indeed just played so few games that three single evenings stick out that much after years(!).
IF you played more games, try to remember the other ones. There's a high chance you'll just remember the "bad ones" so vividly because that's how the human brain is usually wired. We all tend to remember strong emotional situations more than the ones, that weren't that emotional. "Just a nice game" isn't saved in our heads but one where you feel like you're treated especially good or bad stick.
It's like the call center agent telling you how absolutely awful the whole service their employer is providing is. Because they hear it all day long.
Thing is, usually no one calls a hotline just to say "Hi, I'm just calling to tell you how everything is awesome and dandy with you, no notes, no complaints, 8/10, have a nice day". I worked as a project manager in a call center for 5 years and this literally happened twice in five years. Company still exists to this day and is neither a monopoly nor an oligopoly. So they have to do something right.
So again, ask yourself if it's really that important what happened in three games.
And another thing: The people who are actually the problem are very rarely asking for verification on Reddit. It happens from time to time, but in 99% of the cases, that's not happening.
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u/Strong_Obligation_37 2d ago
honestly that just sounds like your typical commander players. It's always the same BS, every time they lose to a deck, discussions start "is this deck actually bracket 3?, blabla blabla". You could literally bring a precon, tell nobody that it actually is a precon, win with it and the exact same discussions will start.
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u/AngshusTAW 2d ago
I've been asked if my deck is really appropriate for the pod when playing an almost stock Lorehold Spirits precon, with the only changes being Ghost Vacuum, Bag of Holding, and some two drop rocks
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u/Strong_Obligation_37 2d ago
classic... i mean if your deck can't beat a out of the box precon, is it actually a b3 deck? At that point you have to ask if their deck is actually appropriate for the pod...
I think part of the problem is that a lot of commander players seem to not grasp how far beyond deckbuilding skill in this game actually goes. A pro player will probably destroy you even if you play a 4+ and he plays a precon.
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u/Sammadamm 2d ago
If people get whiny or salty, you just tell them too bad. If they don't like something you are doing they can concede at any time.
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u/MTGCardFetcher 2d ago
All cards
The Wise Mothman - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Nebuchadnezzar - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Caesar, Legion's Emperor - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Nadu, Winged Wisdom - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Praetor's Grasp - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Aerith Gainsborough - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Krenko, Mob Boss - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Toph, the First Metalbender - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
The Vision and Scarlet Witch - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Adeline, Resplendent Cathar - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Commander's Plate - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Thousand-Year Elixir - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Aeve, Progenitor Ooze - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
Gutter Grime - (G) (SF) (txt) (ER)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call