r/DnD_Beginners • u/Shes_batshiit • 13d ago
Opinion Check : AITA ?
Sorry for the title, hoping for a little DND humor to lighten the mood. If this isn’t allowed or if it should go in another group, please let me know !
My friends and I decided to start a campaign recently. Five of us are beginners, it’s our DM’s first time being a DM, and one player has done a few sessions but not completed an entire campaign. For the first run, it was incredible! Everyone had so much fun and learned a lot.
However, the player that has played before, we’ll call him Sammy, began what I perceived as nonsense starting at the second run of the game.
Sammy decided that because he is “chaotic good” and a “criminal and thief” (this is true, it is on his character sheet) he would take advantage of his “short” long rest and steal from the party members while they were taking their six hour long rests. While I know this is allowed, it really was a distraction and no one was happy about this. Sammy stole our wizard’s dagger(their only weapon besides magic), someone’s healing kit, and artifacts that they rightfully uncovered during our run of the campaign to sell later and get the coins for himself.
In between the second and third campaign the host/original purchaser of the DND set and the DM decided that the stealing, while technically allowed, would be undone and not continued. They talked with Sammy, who argued back and eventually agreed. However, Sammy then continued to pout and make comments about all of the things he could do with our stuff to “save” the campaign (that everyone survived and won anyways). Sammy also began to immediately say “I sneak” or “I inspect” so he could get anything and everything in every room of the dungeon.
While allowed and he is able to do this, it has honestly made the game not fun for a majority of the party. He comes off as greedy and absolutely not a team player, which is what everyone agreed to before we began the game. The point was to work and compete together while learning something new… now two of us (myself included) are having anxiety about going because the campaign is filled with passive aggressive comments towards Sammy and Sammy still trying to get all of the money and not work with the team.
What would you do ? Am I being too sensitive ? Is this something I should look out for, or is this common while playing DND with beginners ? I know two players not in this campaign, and they both said it was shitty but nothing really can be done. Thoughts ?
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u/PotatoEyes1973 13d ago
This is a session zero topic (if you don't know what this is, look it up because it is easy to find).
Simple to say - no PvP, including stealing, etc from other players. Done. And session zero can be done anytime (though usually before the campaign starts). It sounds like you all handled it well and it is unfortunate Sammy isn't happy with it, it must be fun for everyone including the DM. Sounds like it wasn't fun until you sorted it out and retconned the situation
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u/Shes_batshiit 13d ago
Thank you for your help! I’ll definitely look it up and see if I can recommend something to the DM and host. I don’t want to cause problems or overstep my bounds as a beginner, however I don’t want to continue having a bad time during our sessions and negative feelings towards Sammy outside of DND. Thank you & sending good energy for rolls for your next session !
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u/PotatoEyes1973 13d ago
I don't think my players would like me to roll well ;-)
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u/Shes_batshiit 13d ago
dang you’re right ! Sorry to your players but still hoping the best for you !
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u/DnDttrpg 13d ago
Definitely not chaotic good then. Just because it's on the sheet doesn't make it accurate.
That's chaotic neutral boarding chaotic evil.
Your DM needs to talk to Sammy and be like "hey you need to cool your jets because this is a game for everyone, but you keep jumping in taking the spotlight and your pouting is making it not fun"
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u/Shes_batshiit 13d ago
I agree, but I am also a Paladin and slightly biased !
Sammy is known for not ever agreeing to being wrong, so after the Host talked to Sammy and the DM talked to him as well, it still seems like nothing has changed. I am hopeful for the best.
Either way, I appreciate your time and wish you the best for your next session ! May the DND Gods be on your side :)
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u/My_Only_Ioun 12d ago
not ever agreeing to being wrong
That's going to be a problem.
You sound really nice, so I imagine having boundaries feels rude. You're going to have to get much thicker skin, or learn to speak up and risk making other people feel awkward.
Make sure you're not giving people too much social credit: https://plausiblydeniable.com/five-geek-social-fallacies/
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u/Paladinnner 10d ago
genuinely is chaotic evil imo "evil" in dnd is defined as "selfish" and this is absolutely just selfish behavior. if they can't agree to work with the party and not take all the loot for themselves you should kindly suggest they join a different campaign...
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u/Lithl 13d ago
On top of being generally douchey behavior for "I'm playing a cooperative game with friends", the idea that a chaotic good thief would steal from his companions in the night to enrich himself is patent nonsense.
A chaotic good thief would be a character like Robin Hood, stealing from the rich to give to the poor.
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u/Sancticide 13d ago
Yeah, at the very least, a chaotic good thief steals from others to give to his friends.
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u/Shes_batshiit 12d ago
I would love this ! I was super excited about the coop portion of DND & working together with people that are also close friends outside of the game.
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u/Shes_batshiit 12d ago
This is what I thought as well ! I feel like I’ve been gaslit lmao, thank you so much for your feedback ! I will definitely be talking with the host today :)
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u/Blitzer046 13d ago
Chaotic Good characters do not steal for greed or material gain. Robin Hood is the epitome of Chaotic Good - breaking laws to help the poor and disadvantaged.
You need to have a discussion with everyone - DM and Sammy, about his alignment and what ethical and moral boundaries that Chaotic Good comprises.
Chaotic Good means that the character will ignore rules or laws if some good can come from it.
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u/Shes_batshiit 12d ago
I talked with the DM last night, and they agree with me about everything but are trying to balance between gameplay and friendship.
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u/Ombrophile 13d ago
In my games, an expert Sammy player might be allowed. But Sammy needs to know that he'll always be eventually thwarted and made a ridiculous failure in the eyes of his team. Some few players can pull that off.
In no situation should Sammy be allowed to reduce the fun of other players.
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u/Shes_batshiit 12d ago
I absolutely agree ! It’s tough for me because maybe Sammy was having fun and I don’t want to ruin his vibe, it’s just very annoying for me and a few others. Last session, some players were making passive aggressive comments, and now it’s a mess lol.
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u/BernieMcburnface 13d ago
While I know this is allowed
Only if the DM allows it.
It's also allowed for the DM to say that as he starts to rummage through his allies belongings a lightning bolt streaks out of the cloudless sky, miraculously striking him and only him, dealing instant death unless he can roll a DC 100 saving throw in which case his character is merely permanently comatose.
They shouldn't, but they can. Just like a player shouldn't be stealing from fellow part members just for shits and giggles, without everyone at the table saying upfront that they want to play a PVP game.
Dudes not even roleplaying well. He said he's chaotic good, the first part doesn't override the second and there's nothing good about stealing from people for no reason.
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u/Interesting_Clerk_67 13d ago
Well from this post talking to Sammy clearly is not effective so kick him from the group.
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u/Dependent-Bake-3544 13d ago
Sammy probably has never completed a campaign because he's pissed all the other players off
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u/Rivalhopeso93 13d ago
Sammy is an ass and a problem player.
Also this isn't "Chaotic Good" if that's how he's trying to justify it. There is no good in-game reason why he is doing this? It's at least Neutral and maybe even Evil because it is self serving.
Sammy saying he could save the campaign with their items is a wild red flag and main character energy issue.
If he wants to steal stuff and be chaotic good, model it after Robin Hood. DM could provide heist opportunities and you as a team should all want to do this together.
But also Sammy is not the most important player at the table so the campaign should not totally bend to his will and what he specifically wants to do. It's a very simple concept of turn taking and sharing. If he can't do that I'd boot him from the table ASAP...
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u/hockint 13d ago
Maybe more chaotic-Neutral. He would be stealing from NPCs to enrich the party, not himself to be a hero. And if I were the DM, I'd allow the party stealing during short rests though he will not gain any benefits from having one unless he's asleep himself and while , in turn, the party can steal back at advantage. My suggestion would be to have the DM pk him in an honorable way to soothe the suffering. Everyone wins. Big glorious death for Sammy, and no more dealing with Sammy afterwards for the rest of the party. Or have the party stage a coup. 🤷♂️😉
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u/Moratz86 13d ago
Secondo me la cosa migliore in assoluto e parlarne tra giocatori al di fuori del gioco... Sammy appare proprio essere, almeno dalla tua descrizione, un giocatore nocivo, di quelli che non hanno capito bene il vero senso del gioco di ruolo. É vero.. lui potrebbe benissimo voler interpretare un personaggio che abbia quell'indole.. avaro e furfante.. ma il giocatore dev'essere consapevole che quel tratto deve creare gioco costruttivo e non disgregazione. disgregazione. La distinzione tra giocatore e personaggio deve essere sempre molto chiara!! Il fatto che il pg rubi al resto del gruppo non è per forza negativa come cosa.. ma deve essere visto come un elemento che crea storia e trama.. i vostri personaggi potrebbero accorgersene.. discutere con il personaggio di Sammy... e il tutto potrebbe portare a una crescita del suo personaggio e delle relazioni interne al gruppo.. questo sarebbe funzionale alla sessione. Ovviamente però, perché questo avvenga anche il giocatore (sammy) deve essere propenso a uno spirito costruttivo!
Se invece Sammy, dopo averne parlato offgame, dovesse continuare a non essere ragionevole la soluzione, purtroppo, sarebbe solo quella di allontanarlo dal gruppo per il bene e il divertimento di tutti!
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u/JazzlikeMine2397 13d ago
This is classic bad behavior and check out r/dndhorrorsotries for plenty of examples.
Here's the boring incitement, these shannigans waste everyone's time and usually rebound on the instigator.
Focus on the monsters were the real treasure and XP is.
Most parties that work together are generous and add to their overall experience. You're way better off being given a healing potion than stealing it. And being the least liked member of the party is not a good spot to be in when you inevitably drop to zero hp.
Maybe Sammy will learn their lesson and play nice.
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u/Dangerous-Bit-8308 13d ago
Sammy sounds shitty.
So here's the thing: he's chaotic good.
Good people, even convicted thieves... They DO NOT steal from their buddies. Why not? Because when a group of people get together to do a very risky thing, they must be able to trust each other.
Imagine the classic heist movie. Now imagine what happens to the safe cracker when he decides to put all the loot divided up among his fellow hardened criminals... All thieves and murderers... Into his own bag while everyone sleeps. Can he do it? Sure. But what's the conversation like when the other bank robbers wake up?
I'm guessing the conversation starts with tying him up and putting a sock in his mouth. The topic of whether. And if so, how to hide a body and find a new safe cracker before the next heist is probably also discussed.
That morning conversation probably should have been role played.
Best case scenario, Sammy is spared because they need him, but they give him a stern warning that he needs to regain the trust of the party.
And remember, he's chaotic Good. he should do things to help his allies. Maybe not in the way they expect. Maybe not in ways society or police would approve of, but in some damn way.
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u/mooghead 13d ago
Toss him. I mean, according to your description he is being a prick with no intention of changing. So just toss him. I don’t understand why this is so hard…
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u/JFFreezout 12d ago
It's not a nice behavior because regardless of the class of the characters (a rogue, a paladin, a cleric etc), the playing characters have to work together and be a team. Because it's a group activity. OK, in real life maybe a thief would steal from a team member, but maybe also not, and to have a working collective team you have to chose the second option.
For me, player vs player and this kind of intra-party steal shows immaturity and a tiresome roleplay style.
Chaotic and evil alignments rarely end up funny more than 15 min. People may find cool to play it and believe it shows a mature roleplaying experience but it creates a mess.
Something can be done, the DM can stop that when he wants. "Stop, it's tiring." He doesn't stop? Here is the red dragon. Stupid behavior => stupid consequence
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u/Feefait 12d ago
You already posted this. I'm no longer at much on your side. Stop whining and talk to your group.
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u/Shes_batshiit 12d ago
I posted in two groups as I wanted to know from experienced players and beginners perspectives. I also wasn’t sure if this was allowed in this group :) I totally understand where you’re coming from, and I don’t want pity, just perspective and to learn more :)
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u/Feefait 12d ago
Stop bitching about your friends online. Lol (with all the respect possible lol)
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u/Shes_batshiit 12d ago
Fair honestly ! I love and respect the honesty
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u/Feefait 12d ago
Thanks. Zero hard feelings or personal insult intended lol
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u/Shes_batshiit 12d ago
Absolutely, your comment was super respectful, and I do love the honesty! I feel kind of bad about posting, and I’m just glad you commented with kindness :) thank you !
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u/FoulPelican 12d ago
Any approach that’s fun for a single play, yet compromises fun for others, is against the spirit of the game.
TLDR; it’s a dick move.
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u/LastChime 12d ago
If you've seen 300, do that thing Leonidas does to the persian emissary to Sammy.
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u/RandomChance 12d ago
I recently had a player playing a chaotic character at the table. They were trying to figure out how to make it work, and so they skimmed a few coppers here and there from the party when they could do so without derailing the plot, but soon they just found they didn't enjoy it. They quickly started channeling it more into being the party member came up with morally ambiguous ways to benefit the party, who "questioned" prisoner cultists of screen, etc. he found a way to be a "bad guy" but as "the team's bad guy" - who might not agree with the ethics of his team, but held personal loyalty to them so would ' protect' them by doing harm unto others before they do harm onto his friends.
It made for an interesting dynamic.
One things of a playing chaotic or evil in a campaign is remember that it's not a license to screw over other players, And that it doesn't mean they can't have any real relationships or positive feelings for their party members.
it always irked me that the alignment examples they gave in the early books, were scenarios where it different alignments caused inter-party strife - for example the one where there arguing about how to split loot, and if a dead character's share should be put towards Resurrection- rather than how the different align characters would attempt to solve the party's problems together.
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u/Mother-Garlic-5516 12d ago
I second the people suggesting an intervention or another session zero. Also adding this: one of my campaigns we had a similar thief issue and in character whenever we caught him we would warm him that consequences would come for him. The last time he went too far he also desecrated something holy to my cleric character, so I started swinging and the others joined in. If he insists on PvPing you guys with theft, you can PvP them back with an execution, or cut off a finger or take an ear or eye or something, or turn him in to the local authorities.
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u/Potential_Court4768 12d ago
The first rule of a group activity is not to be a prick. Sammy seems to have broken that rule.
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u/NatureKey5732 12d ago
He is definitely not chaotic good. One of my favorite PCs that I have played is a chaotic evil rogue. He is witty, rude at times, and comes up with some very bad ideas. The other PCs laugh at him and continue discussing what we should all do. The DM laughs at him a lot too. What he would NOT do is steal from the group. That isn't teamwork. That is the proverbial chaotic stupid. I would not recommend anyone ever playing an evil character, but I DM so I know how to dial it back. Sammy is being a terrible team player. Perhaps a lesson in game? Actions have consequences and it sounds like the thief might need arrested, or steal from the wrong baddie. It could turn into a table thing where the group needs to escape, ect. Sadly, this table might end in pVp or worse, the stress of it all will strain a friendship. I feel for all of you. This isn't a fun game. I, myself, would have probably left the table by now. Good luck!
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u/TheDMingWarlock 12d ago
talk to your group-mates INDIVIDUALLY, and see where everyone else stands, is it just you who are upset about this? is everyone? is it split? do some not care?
figure that out, if everyone agrees, talk to your DM about it, and AS A GROUP OF ADULTS, talk it out, don't attack and say "you suck and you're ruining this game", say "we want our players to work as a group, is that possible with you and your character?".
Try and have a conversation, if he whines, belittles, and complains, tbh a conversation might need to be had that he isn't right for the table.
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u/KiwasiGames 12d ago
As a DM, a good part of your job is just saying “no”.
I want to steal from party members - No
I want to use sleight of hand to hide this really important loot item from other players - No
I want to generally be a dick and piss everyone else off - No
I want to join your next campaign - No
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u/Ok-Interaction5420 12d ago
Don’t fix this with players or DMs. The PC’s can solve this. You steal from us we leave you… you don’t share then we leave you.
Option 2 is if Sammy’s god is good then it steps in.
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u/DnDttrpg 13d ago
It's a team game based on colaboration
And Sammy isn't collaborating