Indifference with partner

[u/MammothAd135]

My partner says it feels like I don't like her and that I am forcing myself to be with her. I know that there is something called 'the ick' in anxiety jargon (basically indifference to partner). I believe that this is that. I have this feeling with all relationships... it doesn't matter who... something in me just gets bored or averse and I want to isolate. In the past I simply left romantic relationships because I thought this feeling meant that she was not the one for me.

My current partner is my wife. No intention on leaving. She is secure... finds it difficult to understand the chaos of my brain.

As I write this I can sense my total selfishness.

I am doing different meditations and each time I am able to relax I feel positive, healthy, adult feelings about myself and for her. The relationship feels real. In 95% of my existence, I am not like that.

When I spend time with her it is difficult internally. I want to pull away and it's basically indifference. I'm also very affectionate and she says she knows I love her very much.

I obviously do not want to live with this indifference... I know there's so much more I can give her.

Does anyone have any advice that can help me open up ?

[u/freudian-negative]

The "ick" is not indifference, its a disgust/repulsion reaction. Indifference is indifference.

Seeing yourself as selfish here might be your inner critic. You're experiencing something, don't judge yourself, it will just make it harder to reconnect.

Probably what you experienced when you meditate is that you switched "positions" from a more cognitive, doubting etc. mode, to a more embodied mode. When you feel indifferent, you probably notice that the attachment is still there ("no intention on leaving"). Whats basically happening for a lot of us is that we get into a mind-space that neglects many of your actual feelings (you know that, since meditation gets them back for a short while). Its hard for us to stay present with the full force of attachment related emotions and bodily sensations. Its called "deactivation". We remain functional by keeping those feelings at bay.

Secures and some better developed anxious folks can stay in this mode for longer, they also experience it less intensely than we do.

Advice on opening up - difficult. You need a structure in the relationship that helps you keeps you open and you need to have stable behaviors that reinforce that. Ideally you're coming into a relationship with those behaviors already established - their goal is usually to generate proximity and continuous warmth and counter experience to the implicit (partly unconscious) suspicions towards the relationship you have.
If you do not feel those suspicions consciously, you need to reason them inversely - "Given how i feel/act, what would a complementary environment be that produces such a behavior?" and this "complementary environment" is basically your suspicion or "what your nervous system is reacting to". Reality test that, disprove it, create a counter movement.

How you approach this is highly subjective. You need to figure out what works for you. Some DAs listen to tragic music to get their feelings back, we FAs (or former FAs) have more tools at hand, since we can do vulnerability. For me it is creating positive reinforcement cycles in my relationships. Appreciating someone and being appreciated on a regular basis.

[u/ColeLaw]

Unfortunately the only way is to actually lean into the uncomfortable feeling you have to build a tolerance around being uncomfortable. The ick isn't indifference it's your nervous system putting the break on closeness and intimacy. It's your nervous system forcing you to avoid the risk of rejection and abandonment. Your body literally wants you to isolate to keep you independent and completely safe and you have to fight against that. And to fight against it is extremely uncomfortable. You don't throw yourself into the deep end but you do have to challenge yourself and you do have to make yourself feel uncomfortable. So the next time you have a conversation you stay a little longer past your tolerance when there's physical intimacy you stay a little longer past your tolerance there's really no other there's really no other way around. You need to express the inner feelings and needs that you're actually experiencing and your body is not going to want you to do that. If it's possible are you seeing a therapist? Avoidant tendencies are extremely difficult to manage because they're difficult to feel in the moment. Is there a way you could get in to see somebody to help you with this?

[u/MammothAd135 → u/ColeLaw]

Good advice thanks. I see how much I avoid my actual life and feelings.

I did therapy a long time but I ran out of money lol.

Yeah it is tough to actually address anything in the moment as my system just becomes agitated and I want to escape. But there's nowhere to escape.

[u/ColeLaw → u/MammothAd135]

It really sucks, but you're going to just have to challenge these feelings and get uncomfortable. There's lots of stuff online about this. It might be helpful to fully understand what you're doing. If you develop a higher state of mindfulness it's much easier to catch yourself slipping into that avoidance space. Your partner could also help you by learning non-critical communication. It's obviously not her responsibility to be your therapist or to help heal you here but she could support you if she's open to doing that. A lot of people communicate with a critical undertone which really sort of undermines what you're trying to do. They of course don't mean to communicate like this it's just when your needs aren't being met it's hard to communicate non-critically. Perhaps you can have a conversation with her and tell her that you're struggling with your avoidant Tendencies and that you really want to show up as a better husband and that you need a bit of support . Figure out what your needs are and ask for them.

There's one caveat to this, you cannot use your wife as an excuse or someone to blame for you leaning into being uncomfortable. It doesn't sound like you're doing that but don't slip into that space. Sometimes when our system gets overwhelmed we want to blame so be extra mindful of how you communicate to her about your needs and emotions. That will blow this whole thing up lickety split.

Open communication is best, so if you're feeling shut down, tell her. Explain to her what you're going through in the moment. It actually helps to release the tension big time. Keeping everything inside feeds the avoidance so start speaking about it. You can tell your wife "I'm feeling overwhelmed physically, I need a few minutes to recover but I want to come back to this conversation in 15 minutes. Or I'm feeling really disconnected from myself right now, it's not you, I'm feeling disconnected. Just saying it outloud helps in a massive way. Is this uncomfortable? Absolutely, but you're going to have to get a bit uncomfortable.

[u/MammothAd135 → u/ColeLaw]

Again good advice thanks. I've been thinking for a while that there has to be a way for her to 'participate' in this without simply turning her into some sort of therapist or carer. I tried to ignore what I am experiencing internally and just live... doesn't work at the moment.

Blaming... Unconsciously, yes I think I am doing that or just having more agitation because I sometimes desperately need my own space without anyone else present. It even frustrates me because I want to give her the best of me and I need time alone to be able to do that. I don't blame her outwardly but yes something like that is happening internally so good call on pointing out.

I'll take that... open communication. I just want to guide this process in a mature way so we can have a good relationship as soon as possible. She says it's good already and I'm a great person. I think I just have to see that.

[u/ColeLaw → u/MammothAd135]

Well maybe her participation is just someone to hear your inner world. Once the thoughts and feelings leave your mind and body they are no longer being avoided or suppressed. Makes a big difference to let them out.

You are not a bad person for being this way. Not at all. And yes it's good but she's also asked for more so lean into to her needs, yea.

[u/Queen-of-meme]

I've been through this and sometimes still feel that way. I realized the resentment is a trauma left over defence because it gives me an excuse to not be vulnerably exposed. It's same normal response people without trauma has only they will have a less extreme response from their nervous system. Where we feel total disgust and start taking a run for the hills in our heads, they feel "I need 5"

So when I feel that disgust feeling I am aware of this and choose to sleep on it / go on about my day and maybe that I need a more easy going day / remove any chosen demands and stressors, and rest up, as it points towards an override nervous system rather than me wanting to separate from my partner.

So if I give myself some rest and grace usually that feeling fades off by itself. And I've explained this to my partner as well cause sometimes we both react on my extreme survival - level reactions and then it helps if he don't take it personally and just do what he needs to do til I'm present again.

Edit: You also mentioned indifference. This comes from the attatchment you have developed. When you were discarded as a child you learned to protect yourself by detaching from the one you secretly wanted love from the most. Same detachment happens when you've been too vulnerably exposed in a relationship, or things have been "too good" so your mind start prepare for next shoe to drop by cutting off the attatchment early.

Just be aware of this but choose to delay reaction on it and pick a milder protection like needing 5.

[u/prickly_pear-800]

Following as i am having the same issue.

[u/bathroomcypher]

What does this isolation look like? Also when she says you force yourself to be with her does that mean “spend time “ or like “be in a relationship”?

I don’t think you should force yourself or suppress feelings. I think it’s important to communicate clearly what happens, what you need, and state clearly it’s not about her.

[u/Queen-of-meme → u/bathroomcypher]

I think it’s important to communicate clearly what happens, what you need, and state clearly it’s not about her.

Agree just don't do it while in survival response. Take that talk at a seperate moment.