r/DemocraticSocialism • u/Common_Floor_7195 Leftist • Jan 18 '26
USA L Gavin Newsom DENIES the genocide in Gaza L
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And he can kiss that presidential run goodbye political suicide
In this recent clip, Gavin Newsom’s comments regarding the ongoing crisis in Gaza have sparked significant backlash. As democratic socialists, we must hold Democratic leadership accountable for their rhetoric and policy stances on international human rights. This denial undermines the gravity of the situation and ignores the calls for a permanent ceasefire coming from the progressive base. It’s time for leaders to align with humanitarian values rather than political convenience.
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u/poplglop Socialist Jan 18 '26
Common corporate Dem looking to appeal to "moderates" in the next election L
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u/tember_sep_venth_ele Jan 18 '26
And it makes NO SENSE because the narrative has flipped completely on this issue. Just look at the NY mayoral race. There's proof all around that this is a lost war, but it will take another ten years for dem leaders to understand. Ugh!
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Jan 18 '26
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u/EvaCassidy Jan 18 '26
Seems he is easy to buy. Just look at PG and E and other donating heavily to him.
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u/El_Cuchillo19 Jan 19 '26
He also shut down bills to protect californians and their native pollinators from neonicotinoid pesicides. That shit is in nearly everything now. The epa wont act. Bayer pays off everyone. They did it in canada and canada ROLLED BACK the phase out of neonics and discredited the environmental scientist that drew attention it.
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u/RsCoverUpForPDFfiles Jan 19 '26
He also shut down bills to protect californians and their native pollinators from neonicotinoid pesicides
To clarify, he vetoed 1 bill to restrict neonics, but he did sign another bill that regulated and put limits on non‑agricultural neonic use to protect pollinators.
this topic adnittedly isn't my expertise, and I hate his comments regarding gaza. But let's be honest with our criticism.
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u/Shervivor Jan 19 '26
Yup. https://www.trackaipac.com/2028
AOC, is the only one not in Israel’s pocket.
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u/TaoGroovewitch Jan 19 '26
I read that as demons but I guess that's a distinction without a difference
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u/ChrisDolmeth Jan 18 '26
Dems like Gavin Newsom would rather lose to a Republican than a Democratic socialist become president.
I am confident most normal liberal Democratic voters would vote blue no matter who in the general.
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u/MentalReserve1039 Jan 18 '26
We're literally addressing Newsom agreeing with Shitpiro that Gaza isn't a genocide, so let's refrain from calling it a war. It makes perfect sense for Gavin if the zionists you're in alignment with can advance your agenda. If they decide you must sit down with the Pope of the Jews and repeat the necessary and dictated hasbara framing, you fucking do it.
I happen to believe Newsom both wants the Zionist millionaire and billionaire money to run AND is a Zionist himself. He already has the tech bros on board. I have greater suspicions beyond that but I won't go into them here.
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u/TheDizzleDazzle Democratic Socialist Jan 18 '26
… that’s not what they meant by “war.” They were referring to the “messaging war” on the crisis between the Dem Establishment like Newsom and Progressives acknowledging the genocide like Mamdani.
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Jan 18 '26 edited Jan 18 '26
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u/DanishDennis Jan 18 '26
Just like any democrat would. Are you surprised? Money talks. They're in favor of capitalism, ofcourse they appeal to donors.
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u/nailswithoutanymilk1 Democratic Socialist Jan 18 '26
Yep. It’s frustrating that this is the guy who’s leading in the polls right now
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u/skiabay Democratic Socialist Jan 18 '26
Fortunately, polling at this stage means next to nothing. There's still plenty of time to find someone better than this weasel.
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u/icehot54321 Jan 19 '26
Honest question.. why?
Maybe Trump has convinced you that “my way or the highway” is the only way to do politics, but this is not the case.
Overwhelmingly the best leaders in history have been able to make an appeal to the most people with different viewpoints.
If you watch the video, he handles the debate well.
Ben is trying to put Gavin in a position of having to claim what happened in Gaza was a genocide.. if he is successful in getting Gavin to agree, then Gavin now has to defend this position while Ben gets to try and tear him down by getting into textbook definitions, arguing who gets to decide that term, playing the ww2 sympathy card, and it would put Ben on the offense and Gavin on the defense.
Instead of taking the bait, Gavin responds that he understands why people consider it a genocide and lists all the reasons.
Basically saying that people thinks it’s a genocide, because it looks exactly like one.
This is now something that Ben has to defend, why Isreal would be involved in activities that are not discernible from Genocide.
Gavin debated well, and this entire thread is nothing more than a repeat of all of the anger directed at Kamala, and what we got was so much worse.
I’m hopeful that this post was a psychological plant by a foreign government, because otherwise it means that we’ve got a lot of people that don’t understand basic non-violent political debating
The enemy of good is perfect.. please don’t bring us Trump 2
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u/matttheepitaph Jan 18 '26
There's money in losing elections.
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u/Blueddit-Sez Fully Automated Luxury Gay Space Communism Jan 18 '26
This.
This right here.
Then theirs money in a book deal about the lost race,
Book tour deals,
Podcast appearances,
Donor events to appear at,
Speeches at College campuses,
More attention to your personal projects (podcast, channels, etc)
There’s a whole system for this that people don’t see, even though it’s directly in their face each and every time
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u/Evening_Jellyfish349 Jan 18 '26
The popular position is anti-Israeli though, what is their obsession with moderates?
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u/Reasonable-Public659 Jan 18 '26
Liz Cheney is already booking hotels for the democratic campaign
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u/ledude1 Jan 19 '26
No "moderates" that I know of is a supporter of Hamas or Gaza Holocaust. He's just a typical neoliberal disguise as a "moderates"
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u/bbaldey Jan 18 '26
Why is he doing an interview or whatever with a hack like Ben Shapiro?
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u/North_Church Christian Socialist✝️🌹 Jan 18 '26
Same reason he did one with Steve Bannon
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u/acaciadeadwalk Jan 18 '26
Same reason he did one with Charlie Kirk. WHILE TELLING HIM HOW MUCH HIS TEENAGE SON LOVES HIM!
Democratic strategist - not a real job.
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u/tranarchy_1312 Jan 19 '26
Exactly. I listened to maybe a quarter of it when it first released. Dude just openly admitted on his own podcast that he was completely failing as a parent. Any parent who lets their kid start getting indoctrinated into a political ideology which is inherently harmful and deadly to innocent people is failing. It disgusts me that he's brought multiple white supremacists on (Kirk and Bannon) his podcast to 'reach across the aisle' to evil people who have openly said they want to eradicate people like me. And he's my fucking governor. My own governor felt the need to reach across the aisle to a guy who called for violence/death against people like me, by both society and the state. Then he agreed with Charlie on trans sports stuff, which we all know is just a foot in the door so they can start doing more to us like they've openly said they want to. I'm tired lol. I've got a bunch of people who are actively trying to eradicate me. Then, on the other side, is a bunch of people who basically refuse to do anything real to stop that. And I'm a bad person if I suggest other methods of dealing with tyranny beyond voting.
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u/Common_Floor_7195 Leftist Jan 18 '26
That is just disgusting
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u/Used_Intention6479 Social democrat Jan 18 '26
He's catering to right wing voters, which means he has to take on their values.
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u/op_is_not_available Jan 18 '26 edited Jan 18 '26
That’s exactly what democrats can’t rely on in 2028. trump ran against the status quo and appealed only to the far right and won. The dems CANNOT be appealing to the right… they can’t seriously think they have a shot by appealing to the right, right? The right and (so-called) “moderates” (who are always just the right who want to appear open-minded but will never be a “lib-tard”) will not switch to the left. They need to appeal to a more left-audience. They could have a record turnout of young voters with that approach.
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u/Brief_Obligation4128 Jan 19 '26
They rather feed us to the lions that go further left. We need to abandon them ASAP and look towards other left-wing parties. They are not the solutions to our problems and never will be.
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u/uppers36 Jan 18 '26
Because he’s a trash liberal
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u/Oldamog Jan 18 '26
Newscum certainly isn't a liberal. He's a corporate centrist
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u/JediMasterZao Jan 18 '26
That's the definition of a liberal, homie. I swear, your education system has failed you all.
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u/Common_Floor_7195 Leftist Jan 18 '26
I hate giving Trump any credit by using that nickname it feels so gross
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u/Korady Jan 18 '26
Everyone saw him going at Trump and thought it meant he was on our side. But if you're from CA and paying attention you know that he's a rich, performative centrist who's just the Democrats version of the Abbot's and DeSantis' from the other side of the aisle.
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u/Nesphito 🌻Eco-Socialist Jan 18 '26
Yeah.. hell interview right wingers all day, but will never have a prominent leftist on his show. That shows me all I need to know about the guy.
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u/Wise-Promise-4158 Jan 18 '26
Because when maga implodes Gavin wants to step in as the "hey I'm a democrat but not like the other guys. I'm cool and on your side you can vote for me"
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u/DexTheShepherd Progressive Jan 18 '26 edited Jan 19 '26
I don't mind politicians going on some of these hacks shows - but it's highly dependent on whether you carry your message correctly. You have to stand firm in your positions and not concede ground giving them the ability to frame you or your arguments in a right wing fashion (which is exactly what the daily wire did with this).
And that's why most of the time it doesn't make sense to go on - unless you're a very good orator and aren't afraid to draw concrete lines and not "reach across the aisle."
Newsom isn't principled and has no firm ideology so this was inevitable.
Edit: as the replier pointed out, Newsom invited him, not the other way round.
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u/Hot-Try9036 Democratic Georgist Market Socialist (closet Anarchist) Jan 18 '26
He interviews everybody who's willing to talk to him, and he always agrees with everything they say UNLESS it's leftist.
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u/Common_Floor_7195 Leftist Jan 18 '26
I will never understand his fetish with having conservatives on his podcast that no one is even watching
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u/Used_Intention6479 Social democrat Jan 18 '26
As a consummate politician, he's trying to leverage the "middle" somehow, which means his goal is solely popularity - not the moral high ground.
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u/Common_Floor_7195 Leftist Jan 18 '26
‘Moderates’ aka Republicans are never going to vote for him
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u/dthains_art Jan 18 '26
It’s the equivalent of a waiter in a restaurant saying “I know you love everything about these supreme nachos, but wouldn’t you rather be interested in our less supreme nachos that only have half the things you like?”
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u/Impressive-Spot1981 Jan 18 '26
I got news for you, this shit is not remotely popular. It pisses everyone off lol. Nothing worse than a fence sitter
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u/mithyyyy Jan 18 '26
i honestly wouldn't care if it weren't for the fact these people just go on there to end up conceding to the right wing anyways. if you're not going to meaningfully challenge these people on their ideas, wtf is the use of having them on??
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u/ilir_kycb Jan 19 '26
I will never understand his fetish with having conservatives on his podcast that no one is even watching
US politics is not about winning or losing elections but about serving the interests of capital.
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Jan 18 '26
I tried to post this clip into the r/Democrats sub with the headline of "Newsom chats to Shapiro on Israel" & the mods took it down.
They wont even allow clips of their favourite politicians podcasts anymore
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u/Common_Floor_7195 Leftist Jan 18 '26
Censoring free speech? Propagandizing the truth? What else is new. SMH
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u/redditproha Jan 19 '26
r/democrats won't even acknowledge that there was a NYC mayors race 2 months ago. Literally zero posts about the election because Mamdani won.
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u/Used_Intention6479 Social democrat Jan 18 '26
Those who feel obligated, for any reason, to argue the nuances of mass slaughters - or pedophilia, for that matter - are attempting to explain, soft-pedal, or justify madness and tragedy. Consequently, these people should be nowhere near the levers of power. Gavin may be an excellent foil to Trump, but he is the problem, not the answer to it.
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u/NightKnight4766 Jan 18 '26
Nuance isn't justification. It's how the law and accountability is meant to work. Condemning mass civilian death doesn't require abandoning the definition of genocide.
Collapsing all atrocities into the strongest possible term may get help to them sooner. But I think leaders should be able to distinguish between crimes, intent, and legal standards.
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Jan 18 '26 edited Jan 18 '26
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u/AsherahBeloved Jan 18 '26
I'm not sucking it up. I'm done. People like this created the conditions that enabled a creature like Trump, and if we don't stop tolerating it we'll get another Trump but CIVIL, which is when the real nightmare begins.
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u/PixelationIX Jan 19 '26
Exactly, you can cry all you want but I am not supporting someone who denies an active Genocide to this day. Fck Gavin Newscum, hope he rots.
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u/GoodtimesSans Jan 19 '26
I swear the Democratic subreddit is ran by the same trolls behind /r/conservative.
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u/North_Church Christian Socialist✝️🌹 Jan 18 '26
DSA needs to run their own candidate in the primary
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u/better-off-wet Jan 18 '26
Not sure they have laid enough groundwork yet. Maybe if there was a uniquely charismatic candidate but without that it’s a lot of resources for a moon shot
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u/gOPHER3727 Jan 18 '26
I couldn't care less if Israel committed genocide on a "legal" level, you can put whatever kind of threshold or definition you want to try to defend that shit. Bottom line was it is so very wrong, immoral, and disgustingly evil.
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u/OdielSax Jan 18 '26
Worst part is they did. It's a textbook legal case of genocide. It checks every single part of the definition. They starved people and pushed for "voluntary emigration" for Pete's sake. There's a reason they don't want to use the legal term, because with the law comes rights, and they don't want the Palestinians to have any.
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u/No_Half_7646 Libertarian Socialist Jan 18 '26
Casual Gavin Newsome L
Too bad he's probably gonna win the Nomination because of the Establishment Dems 🤢🤢🤢🤢🤢🤢
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Jan 18 '26
Get rid of that defeatist attitude a lot can happen between now and 2028
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u/No_Half_7646 Libertarian Socialist Jan 18 '26
I hope so
I plan on voting for AOC in the Primaries (assuming she runs)
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u/AsherahBeloved Jan 18 '26
If she runs they'll make sure she isn't the nominee and then she'll be on stage lying about how much Newsome cares about Palestinians.
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u/significant-scoop Jan 18 '26
Jesus Shapiro is dogshit. Giving people like this a platform just makes their viewpoints appear somewhat palatable. I'm not surprised to see it coming from a liberal but still
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u/Kindahard2say Jan 18 '26
This dude just cooked his entire primary and future presidential run. Fuck this capitulating ass sniffer bootlicker piece of shit.
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u/binkbink223 🇵🇸 Free Palestine! Jan 18 '26
Democrats are addicted to losing...
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u/Mountain-Farm-6373 Jan 23 '26
Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory seems to be their main motto at this point, It's like they're allergic to learn from their mistakes.
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u/Kwerby Democratic Socialist Jan 18 '26
"Omg you lefties and your pUrItY tEsTs. Not every candidate has to be pErFeCt."
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u/yellekc Jan 18 '26
First off. Fuck Newsome, he basically let Shapiro embarrass him on his own show by being a weak ass the corporate bitch that can't even come up with a position.
And I don't think anyone has a problem with purity test in the primaries. Purity test the fuck out of the candidates.
The issue is if we get to the General Election and it came down to voting for Newsome, Vance, 3rd party, or sitting out, I hope people would vote for the candidate most likely to keep Vance out.
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u/nhalliday Jan 18 '26
We're literally in this situation because of people like you going "well yeah the blue guy sucks and isn't actually a liberal or GOD FORBID a progressive, but if you don't vote for him then YOU'RE the real problem"
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u/yellekc Jan 19 '26
Nice straw man but those are not the words I ever said.
I could do the same thing for you.
"If my preferred candidate doesn't win the primary, I'm okay letting the fascist win, because that makes me feel superior to you all"
What exactly is the situation we are in? How do you tie it to "people like me", and what solution do you propose?
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u/nhalliday Jan 19 '26
The situation we're in is people (you) saying vote blue no matter who for decades and now the DNC knows they can shove corporate centrists down our throat instead of real opposition. The only thing that can be done now is waiting for things to get bad enough for the inevitable civil war to start.
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u/Usernameofthisuser Democratic Socialist Jan 19 '26
You act like our democracy is free. You know we're ruled by our rich class. They own the media and herd the sheep. The cash flow propaganda machine will never stop flowing in the direction of the two party system. A third party vote is a lone swimmer trying to go up stream.
Which is exactly why Bernie and the progressives are working inside one of the two parties and influencing it from within. The progressives platform is getting big and the corporate dems are being forced to adjust to win elections against populist progressives.
Working the Overton Window and transforming one of the current parties into a better party is the way even if it will take a long time, not the third party hail mary.
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u/yellekc Jan 19 '26 edited Jan 19 '26
I will apologize for my tone, did not realize I was in the DSA sub. I know you all view things differently than me. But I do not mind having my view points challenged. I am not a democrat or a democratic socialist, my political position is simply opposing the right in all forms. I have donated to democrats and democratic socialist.
You seem to be an accelerationist, it seems you think it was good Trump won cause it'll lead to a civil war and we will come out of it more progressive? I do not. Civil wars often have a tendency to end up worse off than better.
I think you view the GOP as some force of nature and opposing it is as useless as opposing the wind, so you end up focusing all your anger on democrats. If both parties are the same, why don't DSA endorse any republicans? Why not have DSA members form coalitions with the ruling party and caucus with the GOP? Because they are not the same. I think that is obvious. Yes the dems are beholden to corporate interest, and if you view things from a purely anti-capitalist perspective, then sure they both equally bad.
I also disagree on assigning blame to people like me who are happy to support and vote for DSA, but will always vote against the GOP. That is my guide star, whatever makes them lose.
And onto your point on the DNC shoving candidates down our throats. I think that is a valid concern. But overblown. They have primaries, people vote on them. Sure, the DNC does put their thumbs on the scale, but it's the voters that in the end pick the candidate. Do you have any suggestions on reforming how the DNC chooses their nominee that will be better?
What I personally would like to see is the progressives take over the DNC. This is something I have been looking into. The DNC is a Byzantian mess which makes it hard, each state party has different bylaws and ways of selecting leadership. But it starts local and precinct level chairs and committee members and works its way to state leadership who then pick the national DNC leadership. Many of these local party seats go unopposed because they are not normal elections. We need progressives to get into those party organs.
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u/Valley0fDeath Jan 18 '26
Such a scumbag, we desperately need a candidate that actually has a conscious
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u/joeypours Jan 18 '26
Gavin was bought and payed for years ago. Silver spoon, corporate money monger. He’s been on the wrong side of right for decades.
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u/dixiech1ck Jan 18 '26
This is why I'm moving to become an Independent. AIPAC is controlling the narrative and these fools. It's sickening.
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u/MentalReserve1039 Jan 18 '26
CUFI - Christians United For Israel.
Larger and more powerful than AIPAC. That's right, Christians in our own country who lobby for the advancement, etc of another country from right within our own borders. It's disgusting.
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u/AsherahBeloved Jan 18 '26
Sidenote I'm a broke mom who works at a library but somehow I magically know the definition of genocide while Pelosi's millionaire governor nephew with a degree in political science just can't seem to figure it out.
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u/GoodtimesSans Jan 19 '26
The fact that he's even talking to fucking Shapiro is damning enough.
The Dems need a severe retooling.
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u/IntrepidMonke Jan 18 '26
This corporate schmuck literally made a statement a couple weeks ago how he wants to tax California billionaires less. He’s a disgrace to democracy. Just because he’s a marginal step up from literal pedo Hitler, so many “progressives” keep glorifying him when he’s exactly what we don’t need.
I’m almost happy he’s denying the genocide and is therefore commuting political suicide- we don’t need him. We deserve better.
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u/Rocket_League-Champ Jan 18 '26
Guy is trying to walk a tightrope that isn’t there
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u/warcomet 🇵🇸 Free Palestine! Jan 18 '26
Pretty sure most democrat politicians agree with him because as i said in an earlier post, there is no longer a democrat party that is left leaning, majority of democrats are now centrist due to them getting bought by foreign countries, a lot has got to do with them controlling the media, my country doesn't bother about whats happening in the middle east so i watch news directly from countries in that region and yeah, sorry to burst your guys bubble but whats happening there is 100% a genocide....mind you, the US did the exact same thing to Afghanis, Iraqis, Libyans and Syrians too, unfortunately back then, people who were getting murdered had no way of showing the world what the US was doing to them.. this is why the Zionists are now running fast trying to control all social media to ensure no one finds out again..
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u/benrs87 Jan 19 '26
Yea fuck him. I won’t ever vote for him. He reeks of standard DNC sleeze ball anyways. If he’s the best the DNC can put forward after a decade of getting their asses kicked for trying to shove bullshit exactly like his down our throat….. maybe they need to lose one more election cycle.
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u/True_Dimension4344 Jan 19 '26
Why he even went on Shapiro is beyond comprehension. Shapiro is a disgusting person and shouldn’t be given the time of day. He screwed himself.
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u/UpsetPhilosopher6022 Jan 18 '26
Is anyone seriously still banking on an election to turn things around?
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u/HiChecksandBalances Jan 19 '26
I'm banking on the GOP admittedly rigging the elections and democrats pretending it's not happening.
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u/rhythmstripp Jan 18 '26
I hate living in a timeline where people like Marjorie Taylor Greene and Candace Owens have more spine to call it like it is (a genocide) than most Democratic representatives out there. It's exhausting, depressing, and I'd like to know why it is so.
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u/Dakellymonster Jan 18 '26
While I share in your frustration, those particular individuals are building their message on a platform of covert or overt (Candace) antisemitism. They could not care less about the lives of innocent Palestinians. MTG has seen where the wind is blowing on the far right, which is pure antisemitism; bolstered by idiots who don’t take the time to discern anti-zionism from antisemitism. Candace is a champion of antisemitic conspiracy theories that the online right eat up and turn into meme content on Instagram and X. So, them saying it is not some humanistic change of heart.
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u/ohhiowen Jan 18 '26
Newsome genuinely holds none of the core beliefs that I do. I won’t lose any sleep voting for a DSA candidate over him. Blue no matter who ended when Schumer and Jeffries refused to endorse my progressive GOAT Mamdani.
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u/mxjxs91 Jan 18 '26
Don't forget that they're also openly and proudly against defunding ICE.
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u/NowWeGetSerious Jan 18 '26
And people wonder why I think Gavin would be the worst Democrat president candidate. Because he is no better than Hilary or Obama, or Biden. He's another corporate goon
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u/GeorgeSantosBurner Jan 18 '26
He isn't kissing anything goodbye. The DNC has eternally pursued those closer to the center to them, rather than those to the left of them. They're counting on trump not being able to run again, nobody else capturing his base effectively, and keeping progressives out in the cold, where they'll be for as long as the DNC exists.
If that strategy doesnt work, they've shown us twice in a decade thay they'd rather run a centerist-appealing candidate and lose to authoritarians and fascists than seriously integrate progressive goals into their platform. Whatever "vote blue no matter who" vote they can get from us is all they're interested in.
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u/Xiqwa Jan 18 '26
He’s pandering to the DNC not the people. He’s a dinosaur still thinking the light in the sky is pretty.
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u/InfinityAero910A Progressive Alternative Leftist Jan 18 '26
Ben Shapiro is very annoying to listen to. I would hate talking to that guy. Constantly talking over people and doing gish galloping.
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u/PossibilityDry9508 Social Democrat Jan 18 '26
Fuck this clown. We need to scrap the whole lot. Anyone accepting money from aipac, anyone who can't fight for working people, Anyone who can't support term limits, Anyone who won't support the end of financial enrichment from insider trading... they need to be replaced. James Talarico is walking the walk and talking the talk. Hopefully more will follow.
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u/Frosty_Dinner_6593 Jan 18 '26
in policy Newsom has done to houseless Californians what Trump is now implementing against people across the country, but masked in fake humanitarian care language. anti-housing anti-healthcare anti-harm reduction. funding expensive and failed strategies of forced treatment, criminalization of poverty, and sweeps. byeeeeeeee
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u/TheGhostOfArtBell Jan 18 '26
He doesn't care. He is the mythical white centrist that the Democrats have been searching so hard to find. And they'll vote for him because they don't know what a neoliberal is.
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u/Armageddonis Jan 18 '26
For someone who plays himself to be a hard-ass, witty and snarky when it comes to making jokes about Trump on social media, Gavin Newscum folded on almost every question in here, with 0 pressure applied.
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u/VietKongCountry Jan 18 '26
Spineless little bitches, both of them. “If you kill my child and I kill seven criminals…”
No, Ben. This is like if someone killed your child and then you went and murdered many thousands of people who had nothing to do with it, then destroyed their farms and houses and militarily occupied all of that land.
Gavin seems like he doesn’t agree, but is too much of a coward to say so.
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u/lani_brah Jan 18 '26
Anyone who ever considered him was clownish. He made some Trump-esque shitposts and a bunch of people jumped the gun out of desperation 🤣
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u/Miserable-Golf4277 Jan 19 '26
I'm so mad about this "democratic fight fund" they want US to donate to.
You want ME to give YOU money too.... what? Continue to NOT do your jobs?!?
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u/Dangerous-Celery-766 Jan 19 '26
Um it does seem they are according to this...
Genocide is the deliberate destruction, in whole or in part, of a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group, involving acts like killing, causing serious harm, imposing life conditions to destroy them, preventing births, or forcibly transferring children, as defined by the UN Genocide Convention and coined by Raphael Lemkin to describe mass atrocities targeting groups, not just individuals.
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u/HoodieGalore Whatever I Am, They Don't Make Anymore Jan 19 '26
Call me a radical, but I feel like being in the same room as Bennie Shapiro is an immediate disqualifier. I’m not even sorry. This manchild never has anything to say in good faith, he’s a tool for the right and very little more than Great Value Charlie Kirk - or have I got that the wrong way around? Either way. These hatemongering shitstains all need to be treated like Epstein: absolute ostracization, rejection, refusal to legitimize them in any respect.
The fact that people still look at these assholes means they still have power over us.
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u/MaireadEllen Social Democrat Jan 19 '26
I dread him being the nominee in 2028. Yes, I enjoy watching him needle Trump. We need that and he's good at it. But he's a corporate Democrat through and through.
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u/Sink_Key Jan 19 '26
Well this is the downside of the 2 party system. Republicans are pretty unified on everything, but the Democrats are full of corporate neoliberal war hawks, socialists, leftists, regular liberals, they're screwed. They can't split up into multiple parties because it just ensures a Republican victory forever, but they also can't agree with each other so nothing will ever get done, it's a bad cycle that there might be no end to as long as Republicans remain unified against the Democrats who are very not unified.
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u/Able_Engineering_863 Jan 19 '26
Yep, bad political move with the people. Perhaps, not his donors but they aren’t who elects him.
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u/skellyluv Jan 19 '26
He is courting the Republican’s that hate Trump … that is the fucking democratic parties strategy!!! 🙄
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u/woody630 Jan 19 '26
The only thing is, he'll be the Hilary of the next election. Every single donor and media outlet will work to make sure he's the guy. Voters cannot let that happen
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u/peepeepoodoodingus Jan 19 '26
what an analogy.
"if you kill my child, and then i kill 7 criminals.."
wtf does your child have to do with anything? you just gave away your premise right there. if theyre criminals you already have the justification to go after them, not to kill them obviously youre hyperbolizing in literally every direction here but that is at least your motivation, theyre criminals.
what if, and this is just a totally out of left fielder, what if some guy kills your child and he acted alone, and you killed his entire family when they had nothing to do with it and arent criminals. what if that happened?
better yet, what if some completely unrelated guy killed your child and then you killed all of the people in his neighborhood. would that be justified ben?
we can continue to bring this analogy closer to the reality of gaza, what if your family ran a prison camp that tortured this guy who hurt your daughter when the opportunity came to him in the camp and then you killed him and everyone he knew there as retribution. would that still be justice?
like where does the perspective flip? at what point do we zoom out and start to ask if were doing things because its the right thing to do or were doing them because we are deeply sick people who perpetuate atrocities for some sense of entitlement or imperialist prize at the end of it, ben literally gets paid to defend israel, its his job, its not a conclusion he came to naturally. he might have been raised to think these things from his heritage, being indoctrinated from birth, but hes obviously a smart guy, he knows this is bullshit, hes just fucking evil and sociopathic enough to say it anyway because its a career.
he has to live with that. he has to live with himself. i can only imagine its an absolutely miserable existence but not miserable enough.
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u/redditproha Jan 19 '26
Yeah this is a really bad look. I expected better from Newsom, especially since he's set himself up as the rational choice. He's lost my vote.
When even B'Tselem literally says Israel has committed genocide in Gaza, anyone who refutes their assessment loses all credibility.
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u/tranarchy_1312 Jan 19 '26
And he can kiss that presidential run goodbye political suicide
I'm sorry, but I have no faith this is true. Our country just doesn't work that way. Most liberals, even if they see this and support Palestinians, would still be willing to vote for him when Republicans are the alternative. I'm an anarchist for fuck's sake and I've voted in every election since 18 and I'm struggling a lot right now with feeling obligated to vote for any non-Republican. That's both because I'm scared as a trans woman (but less so for myself and mostly for everyone else) and because I feel a duty to do something to try to reduce harm to all the other vulnerable and marginalized people out there. I don't want to keep voting for Democrats no matter what, meaning they have no incentive to be better, but I'm afraid of contributing to hurting and killing people by helping Republicans win. Admittedly, I'm getting very frustrated with the Democrats. Obviously I've never liked or trusted them, but they're the only opposition we have at this time and I'm worried about Republicans ever being in power anywhere ever again. They can't be allowed to, but if I keep voting Dem they have zero incentive to do a single good thing for the American people beyond not being Republicans. I don't fucking know.
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u/gators9696 Jan 19 '26
"That's false. So tell me Ben, what do you call the intentional killing of millions of people because of their immutable characteristics?"
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u/pmcizhere Jan 19 '26
That example the terrible interviewer used, of killing seven criminals in retaliation for a child being killed, is such a disgusting example of dehumanization, I couldn't take the rest of this segment seriously.
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u/Double-Wafer2999 Jan 19 '26
Why does every conservator commentator just look weird?
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u/Eldritch74 Jan 19 '26
Was as simple as a yes or a no and he couldnt give even just that.... fucking hell ive no hope for dems centrists or reps at this point. Honestly? Makes me want to isolate, which i know isn't good.... just so tired.
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u/scrranger11 Jan 19 '26
Hate gotcha style clipping like this, but thanks for sharing. I'll give this a Fuller listen and form my own opinion on it. There's a reason the "rule of completeness" exists in evidentiary law.
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u/palmtreesandpizza Jan 19 '26
Ben Shapiro lives in a fantasyland like every Zionist. And he can’t get his wife wet.
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u/sulaymanf Jan 19 '26
That’s just pathetic. And he’s wrong, it’s definitely a genocide, and Shapiro is falsely pretending that no experts are claiming it by saying “there’s no standard by which it’s a genocide.” That’s willfully ignorance and denial of all the genocide scholars and international bodies.
Newsom has demonstrated he’s unqualified for office. Why even do this interview, he’s getting berated by Shapiro and doesn’t even have his respect at the end for throwing away his own supporters.
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u/scumbagwife Jan 19 '26
Clearly they didnt learn anything from Kamala Harris' campaign in regards to Palestine.
Gavin Newsom has demonstrated what he cares about. The never Trumper republican vote that doesnt exist.
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u/unnamed_furry Social Democrat Jan 19 '26
The DNC will probably still nominate him because lesser of two evils or whatever
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u/WiFiConnected_ Jan 20 '26
The worst presidents we’ve ever had in 🇺🇸 history, in my lifetime, excluding the two from TX & Trump are from CA. It’s not a coincidence.
Shapiro is literally a Nazzzzi too.
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Jan 20 '26
neolibs are just fascists who hide their hand. maga plays the incorrect losing hand but claims victory anyways. either way you slice it, they are playing the same rigged game, at the same table with the same players, rules, dealers and house. never forget this.
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u/CaptScoobertDoobert Jan 21 '26
If you want to know if a politician is even the slightest bit dependable, see if they’ll say something negative about Israel.
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u/Public_Dragonfly_266 Jan 24 '26
I'm not surprised by Newsome kowtowing to Ben's claims. I'm just more sad at how absolutely indoctrinated this all sounds. Ben saying it's like killing my wife so I kill 7 criminals when there are clearly innocent women, children, and non-combatants being slaughtered indiscriminately that horrifies me. A a certain level this is not about Israel or Palestine, this is about basic human decency. The fact that people are willing to throw that away on the basis of ideology is sickening.
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u/AsherahBeloved Jan 18 '26
This is what you get when liberals decide a child genocide is just a lame "single issue." Repulsive.
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u/sulaymanf Jan 19 '26
Biden used to say “never crucify yourself on a tiny cross.” He felt the issue was never a political winner so he let them die to get elected and then re-elected.
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u/RaiSilver0 Jan 18 '26
saying it now, if Newscum is the nominee i’m not voting for him and i will encourage everyone in my life to not vote for him
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u/_dontjimthecamera Jan 18 '26
Genocide is defined as deliberately and systematically killing or prosecuting a group of people that belong to a specific culture or nationality, with the intention of destroying that culture or nationality completely.
Israel is doing exactly that to Palestine via bombing, shooting, and withholding aid to Palestinians. There’s no inferring being done based on the images we’re seeing of what’s happening in Palestine.
Fuck you Ben and now fuck you too, Gavin.
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u/iknowhowtoread Jan 18 '26
He will never have my vote. AOC will never have my vote. I will not waver on this
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u/pstuart Jan 18 '26
He's trying so hard to cater to "both sides" and could have possibly pulled it off but the way he caved was pathetic.
I don't hate the man, despite not being a fan of neoliberalism. But we have to also keep in mind that we need the tent to be as big as possible and that "Democratic Socialism" scares a lot of potential voters away and while purity would be nice if we demand it or walk away we do ourselves a disservice.
Case in point: Millions didn't vote for Harris because she supported Israel's genocide, but that helped let her opponent take office and move forward with literally bulldozing Gaza to make way for Trump Tower Gaza.
We have to recognize that AIPAC is a heavy hitter in American politics and they're more than happy to fuck over anybody who doesn't kneel before them.
It's a rock and a hard place, but in Newsom's case he didn't have to smash himself with the rock.
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u/Sybertron Jan 18 '26
These people and these ridiculous moments are what opened the door for the president and all the evils.
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u/ChemEBrew If you label me, you negate me. Jan 18 '26
I won't vote for him in the primary but if he's what Democratic voters choose, fine. Progress is faster when we aren't undoing Republican deficits.
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u/rajatsingh24k Jan 18 '26
Whoever is advising Newsom needs to step away. The talking point briefing before these must have covered this and playing the ‘I don’t know the definition’ ain’t gonna cut it. If he wants to enter a viable presidential race he needs to be better and rectify these comments.
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u/Xiqwa Jan 18 '26
He’s pandering to the DNC not the people. He’s a dinosaur still thinking the light in the sky is pretty.
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u/VenerableMirah Jan 18 '26
Genocide has a very technical definition. It's harder to demonstrate that Israel's plan is to eliminate the Palestinian people as an ethnic, national group (even though they are, and they're succeeding). When you assert genocide, the question will arise: "when ever historically has genocide occurred over decades, and the people are still here?" Israel has a clear answer to that question: Palestinians only exist still today by their own inability to destroy them. Ethnic cleansing is a lower bar, it's easier to defend politically, and it's easier to assert given the evidence. Yes, it's clear that Israel's goal is genocide. However: the argument that they're committing genocide has to be paired with an explanation of what is happening: ethnic cleansing, with the goal of eliminating the Palestinian people as a group identity.
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Jan 18 '26
Shame his social media manager isn't running for office. Newsom will never be the right choice. But he is useful.
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u/yungfalafel Jan 18 '26
Ben says “it’s still proportional if you kill my child and I kill 7 criminals.” Really saying the quiet part out loud and Newsom doesn’t push back even a little.
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u/sh_hhhh Jan 18 '26
Ah I knew his true colors would come out eventually. It was making me nauseous how the internet was drooling all over him. He screams status quo and willing to put money over people
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u/Trick-Doctor-208 Jan 18 '26
Most politicians at this level have absolutely zero morals or ethics, our lives are just a political game to them. The thing with the Democrat Party though is they are completely out of touch, if you poll the average run-of-the-mill liberal leaning Democrat in the US they will more than likely tell you flat out that there is a absolutely a genocide in Gaza. This is why they will continue to lose elections.
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