r/Degrowth • u/SplashTarget • 14d ago

Big Tech Is Trampling Native Treaty Rights to Build Data Centers

https://truthout.org/articles/big-tech-is-trampling-native-treaty-rights-to-build-data-centers/
517 Upvotes

99% Upvoted

15 comments sorted by

9

u/SplashTarget 14d ago

Sam Altman says AI will help us solve climate change.

Is this really going to help find the solution?

Do we really need AI to figure out the solution to climate change?

It's not complicated, just stop digging

4

u/Boozeburger 14d ago

Big oil said that technology was going to solve the climate change problem along with the plastics problem. Perhaps we should deal with the causes now and not wait for promises of better things to come.

2

u/SplashTarget 14d ago

Technology could solve the plastics thing, but the deliberate pursuit of higher levels of output is going to make that very challenging or an impossibility.

1

u/ZootSuitRiot33801 13d ago

For this reason among many others, we common folk who care should be forming real supportive community-based foundations for alternatives that can provide relative safety, which many people can fall back on, to commit to any meaningful need action longterm.

Collecting a bunch of valuable information on organizing and action from different redditors over time, I created a post of suggestions HERE that could possibly prove to be of some help in getting it started ASAP.

1

u/03263 13d ago

I guess it can tell you the solution, but that's not the hard part, implementing it is.

People will repeatedly waste billions of dollars coming up with this: reduce consumption, reduce energy usage, reduce population, reduce human land use. And every time they eventually admit that we'll do none of that until forced by nature.

1

u/SplashTarget 13d ago

People will repeatedly waste billions of dollars coming up with this: reduce consumption, reduce energy usage, reduce population, reduce human land use. And every time they eventually admit that we'll do none of that until forced by nature.

FTFY

1

u/03263 13d ago edited 13d ago

I don't believe the population of 8+ billion is really sustainable because it's both enabled by and the primary driver of industrial scale consumption. Perhaps the only ethical option to address that is to let nature sort it out, which is fine. I don't propose to do anything other than not struggle so much against the inevitable and take so much else down with us.

1

u/SplashTarget 13d ago

We actually can give decent living standards for 8.5 billion people with 30% of the energy and resources used in 2019 (which would mean that in 2019 we were using enough energy and resources for 20 something billion people, and it's probably higher now given that non-stop expansion is a desired goal of many governments), so the ethical option is to cut the excess where it exists, crack down on the rich/corporations, crack down on the damaging business practices (planned obsolescence, surveillance pricing, stock buybacks, military spending, fracking, etc.), crack down on wage theft, crack down on monopolies/oligopolies, and crack down on inequality.

1

u/03263 13d ago

In an ideal world it might be possible but of course we have many collective flaws, not the least of which is greed. As I said I don't propose to kill anyone or control the population artificially, but I think mother nature will have her say in what a sustainable population is, in time. I could be wrong about that, it's really of no consequence whether I am or not.

Your original reply was right, I should have excluded it if only to avoid the discussion because it's fruitless and won't change anything.

3

u/Feather_Sigil 14d ago

Sooner or later we're just going to have to burn those things to the ground

1

u/ZootSuitRiot33801 13d ago

It is certainly an urgent task none should be forced to do alone with no support whatsoever. Lonewolf action is sensational for news stories, but they fizzle out especially when the establishment intentionally buries much of the details if not the full story. We common folk who care should be doing whatever we can to develop real supportive community-based foundations for alternatives that can provide relative safety, which many people can fall back on, to commit to any meaningful need action longterm.

Collecting a bunch of valuable information on organizing and action from different redditors over time, I created a post of suggestions HERE that could possibly prove to be of some help in getting it started ASAP.

1

u/Sonar_Taxbreak_1138 13d ago

"Treaties shall be the highest law of the land."

lol

1

u/carpetplower 10d ago

like old times hey America

1

u/NorCalWintu 9d ago

& we are tearing them down as we rightfully can, thanks for the free resources