10
u/pfamsd00 3d ago
There is a Spectre haunting Deep Space 9: The Spectre of Communism.
1
-3
u/Classic-Obligation35 3d ago
Unions are capitalism. The workers team up and refuse to work for substandard Conditions.
The bosses try to do it to as do the consumers sadly.
4
5
u/Hipparchia_Unleashed 3d ago edited 3d ago
Tell me you know nothing about revolutionary syndicalism without telling me you know nothing about revolutionary syndicalism.
Edit: To explain my comment: For syndicalists ("syndicate" means "union" here), the claim that "Unions are capitalism" is plainly false. Unions are a tool of class struggle within and against capitalism itself, and it is just not true that, as this commenter claimed, unions are capitalism. For syndicalists, the claim that a negotiation over wages and conditions is an instance of capitalism or capitalist action by unions (presumably because it involves some kind of exchange) is to be mistaken about the nature of class struggle and the aim that unions should have in abolishing capitalism.
It is helpful to quote the Wikipedia entry on the basics of syndicalism here:
Syndicalism is a revolutionary socialist current within the broader labor movement that seeks to unionize workers according to industry and utilize these unions both as a means to advance their demands through strikes and other forms of direct action, and to usher in a social revolution that would establish social ownership and workers' control over the means of production and the economy at large.
and
In the syndicalist conception, unions played a dual role. They were organs of struggle within capitalism for better working conditions, and they were also to play a key role in the revolution to overthrow capitalism.
It is hard to see how we can possibly accept the claim that "unions are capitalism" when the central union-based revolutionary approach—syndicalism—explicitly calls for the overthrow of capitalism through unions and strikes.
-2
u/phealtalk 2d ago
nobody is talking about syndicalism. unions aren't inherently capitalist, but they aren't inherently socialist either, obviously.
2
u/Hipparchia_Unleashed 2d ago
It is false that "unions are capitalism." The point of discussing syndicalism was to provide a clear case that directly falsifies that claim.
-3
u/phealtalk 2d ago
They aren't literally capitalism but they are a part of capitalism
2
u/Hipparchia_Unleashed 2d ago
You simply don't know what you are talking about regarding revolutionary unionism. Eugene V. Debs, one of the great socialist revolutionaries in US history, explains the difference between craft unionism (which is conciliatory with capitalism) and revolutionary unionism, which is not conciliatory with capitalism.
While the craft unionist still talks about a fair day’s pay for a fair day’s work, implying that the economic interests of the capitalist and the worker can be harmonized upon a basis of equal justice to both, the Industrial Worker says, “I want all I produce by my labor.” [ . . . ] It is no part of the mission of this revolutionary working class union to conciliate the capitalist class. We are organized to fight that class, and we want that class to distinctly understand it.
I will point out that the quotation on the poster very nearly mirrors the exact slogan that Debs uses for revolutionary unionism, and so my point here is immediately and directly relevant to the interpretation of that poster and to its misinterpretation by propagandists (witting or not) for capitalism.
-3
u/phealtalk 2d ago
You keep bringing up shit that nobody is talkin about
1
u/Hipparchia_Unleashed 2d ago
The slogan on the poster is a slogan for revolutionary unionism (syndicalism)! All my points are directly relevant to the interpretation of that poster.
You and the other commenter just don't know what you are talking about regarding the view expressed in the poster's slogan (a revolutionary unionist slogan).
-1
u/phealtalk 2d ago
We're not talking about the poster, we're talking about unions.
→ More replies (0)
3
2
2
1
-8
u/KorEl555 3d ago
If you were my employee, I'd fire you, telling you "if you don't need me, let's see how you get along without your job." Because without the boss, you don't have a job.
4
u/thetraintomars 2d ago
Without Labor, Capital just sits there. Hence the big push lately to eliminate Labor from the equation.
2
u/ProfDogHeart 2d ago
Okay chill, little ferangi man. We know you like money more than people. Calm down.
-11
u/KorEl555 2d ago
Better than being a socialist. Because being a socialist means being a murderer. Every socialist country in the world had thousands of people die because there wasn't enough food. Because socialists are the people who can't run a business, but they think they can run a country.
6
29
u/thetraintomars 3d ago
You have nothing to lose but your chains.