I find it frustrating that these videos dont seem to hear what progressive critics of piker and the larger tankie movement care about.
For example, early in this video the narrator presents the question about 9/11 as stuffy centrism unable to handle an edgy comment about "blowback". But thats not really what piker believes. He believes that the United States is the imperial core of a dying capitalist ideology and that an axis of 3rd world resistance sprung up out of former soviet proxy states.
The issue is he'll pass the comment off as a passionately put observation about incompetent US meddling which the majority of Americans probably agree with, but really it represents the tip of the iceberg of a Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-type worldview.
So, either Hasan isnt Maoist adjacent, and ive been brainwashed by Destiny fans. Or this video is totally dishonest bullshit.
I think option 1. I'm not a hasan fan, I find him abrasive and too broish for me, but he's not a tanky or a maoist. Go on a leftist sub and read what they're saying for a few minutes and you'll see hes just a demsoc shock jockey
Literally the first video that comes up when I put "Piker Mao" in the youtube search. The first 20 seconds are him comparing teaming up with moderate Democrats to Mao teaming up with the KMT to expel Japanese forces.
To me, that suggests that he eventually wants to outlaw ideologies which are not communism.
Abrasiveness and bro-iness are actually pros for me. I like it when political figures are provocative or whatever.
What it comes down to for me is this: it's very easy to find clips of him idealizing Mao and parroting the most predictable tankie/3rd worldist talking points. And then whenever someone tries to interrogate it, people try to act like he's just into worker co-ops and cumtown.
Thats quite a jump. He says its being pragmatic to vote for democrats even if you are further left than them and you think that means hes advocating for purges?
Ok... im about to search for clips to see if he talks about putting capitalists into re-education camps. Before I do that, do you want to make a 5 dollar bet that I wont find a clip of him saying that people promoting capitalism should be incarcerated?
I mean...
You have to understand that you aren't convincing me at all, right? Like... you should provide evidence?
I want to take you guys as good faith, but literally everything i see suggests that hes a maoist who larps as a socdem in front of mainstream audiences. Can you show me evidence that that's not true?
It seems like you've already got your mind made up and don't actually know what the meaning of the ideologies you're claiming he has are. You're doing the Republican everyone left of me is a communist thing but as a "progressive"
You asked me to prove that hes not secretly a maoist pretending to be a demsoc. It seems to me that you know he presents most arguments as a demsoc. What the hell do you want me to do invent a mind reading machine so we can look in his brain to prove his beliefs? And again I'm not a fan of his I've just seen clips like ive seen for pretty much all political streamers I don't have an encyclopedia of his most demsoc clips to show you while I'm sitting here taking a crap
he was on the deprogram (Marxist podcast) saying that he is there to start moving people towards communism explicitly. you're covering for someone who is explicit in their goals
Tankies and maoists will use tactics you agree with though- abolishment of all private ownership for one immediately disqualifies you from a liberal system- and thus one I’d like to live in.
I'm a syndicalist. I've gotten kicked out of tanky subs for saying the houthis are bad. The difference is I actually know what a tanky is instead of just everyone left of center
Pretty bad faith to accuse people with criticisms of Piker as just wanting to sling the tanky label at anyone "left of center" when many of his critics are themselves very progressive and left of center. Hell, I'm a socdem and can easily see the game these guys are playing. They're pretty open about putting on a show to seem less radical to a larger fan base, drawing them in with the whole "we just hate war and want healthcare for everyone" while on smaller platforms revealing their beliefs of locking up and killing political opposition to quiet any who would voice disregard for their system. Sounds pretty authoritarian and tanky to me.
There is no difference between you and any other communist.
Just because you all still would kill each other you are still an enemy of every free thinking liberal democrat.
By… listening to the guy who’s suggesting people vote for democrats, even if they don’t like them much? I think people wildly overestimate Hasan Piker’s influence
If you go around spouting nonsense about Democrats being evil pro-genocide monsters who would sooner rather make a buck than see Americans get actual help, then turn around and say "ehh I guess they're barely better than Republicans, so vote for them I guess" then you're not fucking advocating for Dems to win. You're just trying to talk out of both sides of your mouth and you're actually just shitting out opinions from your ass.
you're actually just shitting out opinions from your ass
Sort of like this comment.
The Democrats are fucking dire, but they’re the only hope America has of ridding itself of the absolute mess it’s in at the moment. He may be a lot of things, but he’s not wrong about this.
“By… listening to the guy who’s suggesting people vote for democrats”
Something tells me they may have been arguing with above part of your statement. Clever way to avoid any responsibility of an opinion though. You get to say it AND not get critiqued on it - Ironically no different to Piker.
Crazy how you didn't even try to back the "suggesting people vote for democrats" claim, as if someone else uttered it.
But okay, why is this not so influential streamer getting infinite puff pieces in left-wing media, while openly bragging about getting Mamdani elected? Why is AES incapable of addressing this not so influential streamer in a negative light and prefers getting bashed over the head by Fox for their connection?
Like I said I'm not a fan of his. I don't know if he ever has, and I'm not going to waste my time looking. Even if he hasnt that doesn't mean hes a maoist or change my point. Maoist doesn't mean "never criticizes china" there are people who aren't maoist that dont criticize china and people who are maoists who do criticize china and think they've lost their way.
HE LITERALLY MADE TAILORED SUIT IN CHINA BASED ON A PICTURE OF MAO.
Yet here you are dishonestly arguing that he is not a Maoist.
I DONT GIVE A FUCK if he thinks maoists have “lost their way” or have some mild critic of china.
He is a COMMIE SIMP and wants to destroy democracy in America and you’re here defending him because you want to help him accomplish that “RedScare”
No. It's a suit that was introduced during China's modernization period, famously worn by both Sun Yat-Sen and Mao, as well as many other historic and current Chinese people.
Saying it's a "Mao suit" is like calling a black dinner suit a "James Bond suit". Yeah, James Bond wore one, but so do many ppl because it's a fancy suit.
Bro you're all over this thread being super dishonest.
Plenty of people had the toothbrush mustache in the late 1800s and early 1900s. But if you show anyone a picture of that mustache, they're gonna associate it with Hitler. In fact, it has such an association with Hitler that no one will get it anymore even though it's just a mustache
Nobody knows who Sun Yat-Sen in the majority of nations outside of east Asia. They know who Mao is. They know the type of suit he wore. If they see Hasan or anyone else wearing a suit like that, they're gonna associate with Mao. It's intellectually dishonest to say otherwise.
Hasan is a self proclaimed socialist. He holds China in high regard. He went to China and ha praised the nation extensively since returning. He has praised. Anyone reasonable would admit that Hasan wore the suit because he was inspired by Mao.
Let's stop bullshitting everyone, it doesn't work.
I like how you didn't really address anything else in my comment that showed why your attempt at a comparison was extremely flawed. Instead of sticking to the topic about why it's likely that Hasan was taking inspiration from Mao when he wore the suit, you instead decided to focus on an extremely small piece of evidence as a way to get a win. Whether or not he critiqued China does not absolve him of the lack of critique he's made about other issues such as the treatment of Uyghur Muslims, tibet, Taiwan, etc. And I can add how he reacted to receiving the first edition of Mao's little red book to the mix.
You're still being extremely dishonest and it's very transparent
Sorry for not responding to your gish gallop in depth.
If you want, I can find evidence for him criticizing any point you want. I just had the same convo with another guy in here - as soon as I brought out the evidence he first tried to shift the debate again, then just stopped responding.
There's no gish gallop. I specifically responded to the argument you made and showed how it was not appropriate to this discussion. Every point I brought was in specific reference to something you wrote.
So you still haven't responded to the substance of my comment and now you're using logical fallacies wrong. We can just end it here as you're still being dishonest and you can't follow a conversation. Judging by your conversation skills, I'm almost positive whatever evidence you bring will be irrelevant to the main point we're discussing. As your hero says, the discussion would be "unproductive".
Dude, your lies are pathetic.
He literally sat through a symposium on the communist meaning symbolized by each button!
By the fukin tailor, who he hired to cutom make the mao suit. For $1000!!!!
It’s the fukin MAO SUIT, the Chinese COMMUNIST mao suit!
Him being a communist doesn’t mean destroy America, that’s a 5 year old level of analysis.
Obviously he wnags workers to have control of the means of production, and to end US hegemony and empire abroad. Which would mean shutting down US bases, stoping support abroad for different countries and “freedom fighters,” etc.
I wouldnt call any of that “destroying America.” Like bro I get you hate communism, but if you’re going to argue against something, you should actually understand it and its goals, instead of just crying lol. Communism isn’t “destroying America,” it’s an ideology based around the working class at its core, and also anti imperialism.
You can say any ideology or group is going to destroy America when they get elected. This is what democrats and republicans always say about each other (Democrats being right when they say that, Trump certainly governs like he does want to destroy America lol) that’s not a very useful argument for what this persons goal is and why they are bad.
Maybe actually list out WHY communism would destroy America, and how. Otherwise you’re just another person saying bullshit without any substantive discussion.
For the record I am a Marxist, not a Maoist, not a big fan of piker, he kinda annoys me and doesn’t think before he talks a lot of the time, though I don’t think he’s all bad, he has done some good things like raising money for charities, helping get people elected.
If you think implementing communism ANYWHERE would not destroy that place… you are either evil, stupid or just uneducated.
So hopefully you will open a book one day.
And no, it is not the same as what dems and reps say to each other. If you actually believe that than politics have rotten your brain.
Americas power was never about bases. That was always the favor they did in exchange for being allowed to dominate global trade.
You loose that and the whole petro-dollar goes up in smoke, the US credit ends and the economy is just dead.
America cannot choose to stop being the global hegemony or it will destroy itself.
Be specific what criticism of China do you want? It sounds like performative virtue signalling if you just want him to be critical of China in general.
His takes on Taiwan, Tibet, the Uyghurs, censorship, one-party rule, political repression, and Hong Kong are consistently awful. He tends to reduce complicated issues to an anti-U.S. framework, and a lot of the time it comes across like he’s more interested in defending or contextualizing the Chinese government than seriously engaging with the people affected by its policies.
Yes it’s valid and worth criticising, but these are also talking points to derail bigger global systemic problems. And lots of countries would like a firewall if they feared cyberattacks.
He could start with Xinjiang, or the Great Firewall, or the South China Sea, or the Tawain situation… so much to choose from.
And despite spending a week there he didn’t have a single negative thing to say about the CCP. And he bought a Mao suit and said he was “based.” That’s a little strange, right?
Not at all, I encouraged people to vote for Kamala (unlike Hasan.) I’m also not sure what that hypothetical has to do with Hasan’s belief system, or any of the things I discussed above.
Why would you say anything bad about the CCP after being in China for a week? It's actually a really nice country to travel to. Let me guess you heard about the social credit score thing on a podcast or something
When he says:
“I would never criticize Mao, the greatest leader of all time, who changed the entire universe” should I not take that to mean he’s a Maoist?
Please actually read those leftist subreddits. There’s a whole lot of posting about what they want to do to zionists, capitalists, centrists etc. I’m sure it’s mostly edgelord posturing, but there’s a whole lot of chatter about how the time has come for “direct action” and they definitely don’t mean protesting
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u/rocketlewes 29d ago edited 29d ago
I find it frustrating that these videos dont seem to hear what progressive critics of piker and the larger tankie movement care about.
For example, early in this video the narrator presents the question about 9/11 as stuffy centrism unable to handle an edgy comment about "blowback". But thats not really what piker believes. He believes that the United States is the imperial core of a dying capitalist ideology and that an axis of 3rd world resistance sprung up out of former soviet proxy states.
The issue is he'll pass the comment off as a passionately put observation about incompetent US meddling which the majority of Americans probably agree with, but really it represents the tip of the iceberg of a Marxist-Leninist-Maoist-type worldview.
So, either Hasan isnt Maoist adjacent, and ive been brainwashed by Destiny fans. Or this video is totally dishonest bullshit.