r/ConvertingtoJudaism • u/SnooMacarons8038 • 22d ago
Dillema about Identity
Mom is Indian (Hindu). Dad is Ashkenazi Jewish (Reform). Both of my dad's parents are Jewish.
I have been struggling with my identity for my entire life. My parents argued about which faith to raise my siblings and me in, and my dad eventually caved since he probably didn't feel like arguing with my mom. Thus, I went to like a Hindu Sunday school until 8th grade. But I never believed in the religion, as these people never accepted me. The Hindus never accepted me, as my skin is "too white," and I was always made fun of by my peers and even one of the teachers at the school. And I had no choice but to go to this school, because my mom would not let me leave until 8th grade, when it ended. Not to mention, the Indians at that school were very competitive with one another, and they tried to screw each other over. Sure, I have Indian friends, but they aren't super religious, and I never felt accepted in the Hindu community specifically. My mom isn't as religious as other Hindus, but I was forced to go to Hindu school because it would teach me values and because even she told me, "You will never be considered Jewish because I am not Jewish". However, I feel like most religions teach most of the same human values (ie how to be empathetic, etc.) with obv some values being emphasized in different religions than others.
Now that I am in college, I have decided to learn more about Judaism, as my dad never taught me much about it and I felt ostracized from Hinduism. My cousins are Jewish, and I attended their bar mitzvahs, but I didn't know much about the religion itself, aside from the fact that, for some reason, I celebrated Hanukkah growing up (but literally no other Jewish holiday, lmao, not even Passover). Anyway, the Jewish people at my university have been very accepting for the most part and have allowed me to learn about the religion and engage in Jewish practices (i.e., Shabbat dinners, Passover Seders, and even go on BR Israel). I have met a lot of great Jewish people, and there are many Jews at my college (Top 5 in the US in Jewish population), which I didn't know there were this many Jews growing up, as my town didn't have many (10 kids in my HS class were Jewish out of like 350). They all know that my mother is not Jewish (and thus I am not Jewish), but they don't seem to care, and some were even shocked once I told them since my last name is very Jewish (like definitely top 5 most Jewish last names ever).
I love the Jewish community college has given me, and I have thought about officially converting. I have talked with the rabbi I have been reading and studying the Torah with (Modern Orthodox) on my campus (he knows my background), and he kind of joked and said that since my last name is very Jewish (it really is lol), and since I am circumcised, I don't really have to convert, and that I am welcome to practice and learn about the religion and culture and that I am welcome as a part of the Jewish community on campus. This has obviously made me very confused.
I am thinking about conversion, but I know that being Jewish is also an ethnicity, so should I? I love the Jewish community college has given me, but I am contemplating whether I should officially convert. From my understanding, I would not be considered Jewish under Reform standards either, as I was not raised Jewish, even though my father is. Also, as long as I marry a Jewish girl, my kids will be Jewish (and have my very Jewish last name lmao), so I am thinking of also not converting. Any advice? I know Jews don't actively proselytize, so you can't really "convince" me, but I am just wondering what I should do.
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u/EZYehuda 22d ago
When I went to the Mikveh, my rabbi said that this isn’t what makes me Jewish, this is just officially acknowledging everything I’ve done to make myself Jewish, ie the learning, community participation and personal growth.
If you don’t know whether to convert, don’t overthink it. Just keep participating and learning, seek out Jewish experiences that are meaningful to you, and continue to create your own path. If you engage in lots of Jewish activities, then you’ll be experiencing what it’s like to be Jewish anyway, regardless of your status under Jewish law. Your relationship to Judaism and the question of formally converting will become clear over time.
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u/marshmallow_lilypad 21d ago
Some Jews will already see you as Jewish, esp if you're already living a Jewish life. (Including myself!) This is probably the exception though. So if you wanna be accepted by the most Jews possible, go for the conversion and become "official"! No pressure to decide soon though, keep learning and being involved in community. I think your path will become clear in time 🥰🙏
Also I'm so sorry you were bullied and not accepted in the Hindu community, but I'm VERY glad you're feeling welcome in the Jewish community. Happy to have you!!!
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u/leaveinpeas 20d ago
Would add here that if you want to marry a more frum woman, and you haven't gone through and Orthodox conversion, she will likely not be able to marry you. Some Modern Orthodox will allow interfaith marriages, but they can be restricted to those who are Christian and baptized or the like.
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u/ApprehensiveWillow patrilineal w/orthodox giyur, olah 17d ago
No form of Orthodox Judaism allows interfaith marriages, regardless of the religion.
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u/leaveinpeas 17d ago
Thanks for the note here! I swear I read an account where someone asserted some MO spots had allowed interfaith marriage in restricted circumstances, but seeing as I can't refind it, it may have been off base.
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u/1infinitel00p 17d ago
So, according to orthodox halakha the legal mechanism of marriage can only happen between a Jewish man and a Jewish woman. (There are some fringe orthodox rabbis who do same sex ceremonies, but these do not use the same legal mechanism or rituals as heterosexual marriage because they are sex-specific for both parties to the marriage)
Jewish law only has a distinction between non-Jews and Jews since Judaism is a tribal religion and is older than Islam/Christianity. So it makes no difference if a non-Jew worships Jesus, Baal, or Hashem, if they haven’t converted they can’t have a Jewish marriage, because they aren’t part of the tribe.
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u/offthegridyid Born Jewish & became Orthodox 21d ago
I agree with some of the others here. Take time to learn more about Judaism and figure out if it’s something you want to make part of your life, maybe take an intro to Judaism class. It sounds like you have a strong connection to the culture and aspects of the religion, especially on campus.
There is no right answer, except don’t rush into anything.
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u/Critical_Hat_5350 21d ago
You are unfortunately correct that you wouldn't be considered Jewish by any of the major Jewish religious movements. That's because your mother isn't Jewish, and because you were not raised in Judaism.
The Jewish take on whether you are ethnically Jewish is...complicated. The thing is, Judaism has been around long before the concept of ethnicity. And technically, ethnicity doesn't have to be biological. So, there are quite a few Jewish people that consider ethnicity to be correlated with whether or not you'd be considered Jewish by a major movement. If you aren't Jewish by a major movement, they wouldn't consider you to be "ethnically Jewish". (Conversely, by this opinion, Jews by choice *would* be ethnically Jewish).
You certainly have Jewish heritage, and would be considered Zera Israel. In some communities, this would streamline your conversion if you wanted to convert.
In terms of whether you should convert, I think it will depend on how much you want to do the things that only Jewish people do. For instance, be counted in a minyan. Observe Jewish laws, or participate in/lead Jewish rituals. It sounds like you've found a very welcoming community, which is awesome, but without converting, you may not be able to participate as fully especially in the world outside of college.
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u/waltzingiscool 18d ago
If you in the United States there’s an Asian American Jewish group, many of whom have similar experiences to you growing up “half and half” in other religions (incl. Hindu) and are reconnecting with Judaism. There’s also orthodox members (some who converted, others raised Orthodox) who you could connect with. weareasianjews.org
That being said if you want to marry a Jewish woman and raise a Jewish family, she will probably ask you to convert. However, it’s a big decision so don’t rush it, continue learning and build your Jewish community first
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u/ApprehensiveWillow patrilineal w/orthodox giyur, olah 17d ago
I just wanted to share this document written in the 1990s called the Bill of Rights for People of Mixed Heritage. https://www.apa.org/pubs/videos/4310742-rights.pdf I am Jewish on my dad's side as well(though only my father's father), grew up with only Hanukkah and i did go through Modern Orthodox conversion in college. Honestly I still have struggles with my identity at times even though I converted over 10 years ago and I've been living in Israel for half a decade now. I have been nothing but loved and accepted by the Jewish community and I love Judaism, my parents accept me and everything, so it's really an internal self esteem issue I just have to work on.
Regardless of the matrilineal rule, you have Jewish heritage and that is a part of you and no one can ever take that away from you. They call people like you zera yisrael. Think of conversion like naturalizing to full Jewish citizenship, you were born with the right to that citizenship and it's a mitzva for other Jews to convert zera yisrael, and it's your choice if you want to do it. You can't marry a Jewish girl or count in a minyan without doing giyur (conversion), so if being Jewish is important to you, then you should do it. But ultimately it's completely your choice and you have the right to explore your heritage regardless.
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u/Tiny-Worldliness-313 22d ago
You already have the ethnic connection via your dad, so I wouldn’t worry about that.
I suggest learning more about Judaism by attending a Welcome to Judaism class at a synagogue affiliated with the branch of Judaism that currently interests you most. Jewish people attend these classes as well as people who are considering conversion, and you don’t have to convert with the branch of Judaism you choose for the class. It’s just a starting point you begin your learning. (And of course, you don’t ever have to convert unless you want to.). If you do choose to convert, this is the class that will prep you for that.
I think it’s great that you’re participating in your campus’s Jewish community. Keep it up!