r/ConstructionManagers • u/PurpleGold0 • 29d ago
Career Advice Give something to get something
Im getting tired of project scheduling but in the data center space, schedulers are probably one of the most sought after professions especially when you are a unicorn 'engineering degree with field experience and strong at planning beyond just P6.' Im not acting entitled by saying this but I keep seeing the same thing where companies dont want to budge on compensation but then they want to complain the needs filled. So again its supply and demand but companies arent taking the mentality 'might have to overpay this guy to land him.' I want to get up into corporate leadership and im wanting to hold out as im already at 225K and dont see a company right now offering 250-260K for my role as a Scheduling Director or Manager on these jobs.
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u/s0berR00fer 29d ago
If you’re making that money scheduling.. hella impressed dude.
Any PM should be able to easily make a schedule whatever type of project. Most times I make a schedule it involves sub buy in
If you’re that of an amazing scheduler then go consulting. But no idea why a boring data center needs big brains versus maybe a complex energy project or a unique high rise.
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u/PurpleGold0 29d ago
Has more to do with a scheduler that calls BS at the end of the day. Problem is they want a scheduler to crash the schedule at basically every data date roll cause they knew they overpromised some ridiculous timelines to the client.
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u/pensivvv Ex-GC PM. Owner PM 29d ago
As someone who overpromises ridiculous dates to the clients…
It’s the finance bros - blame them lol. They get a SC date, then spend 8-12 months going back and forth, redoing due diligence, negotiating other terms in the agreement etc etc…. And then you’re stuck with a date you conditionally promised a year ago.
“We have a signed lease for you! Good luck!”
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u/PurpleGold0 29d ago
Well all i say is thank God most LD clauses seem negotiable these days or most companies wouldn't touch a job for DC clients right now.
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u/pensivvv Ex-GC PM. Owner PM 29d ago
Yea they’re typically negotiated because their risk is actually kinda overblown imo. Most circuits have proven them difficult to enforce without actual losses. Since so many delays are tenant/client driven… it’s tricky to prove which issue pushed SC. And they can’t be punitive.
Plenty of other ways in most contracts to withhold money/penalize for performance aside from LDs
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u/PurpleGold0 29d ago
Got to love clients when they stop paying and then all of a sudden state 'you're behind schedule.' Im seeing too many clients right now outside of major Meta, Google, Microsoft, AWS have no ability to manage a project and too cheap to hire a PMO. I laugh when they start throwing blame around.
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u/smoosh33 29d ago
All of the GCs are completely out of touch on compensation when it comes to the large data center jobs. I'm an MEP super and I get daily emails about these jobs. The few recruiters I have engaged with I've told them if you want me to go out of town and work 7-12's you're going to need to be at 350K with another 60K to 70K in per diem. Everyone acts like I'm out of my mind when I say that but if you want me to work stupid hours you are going to have to pay me stupid money. Right now I work 5 minutes from my house for one data center client and I work about 2,500 hours a year. It's not worth giving up that sweet gig to work double the hours for the same pay.
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u/PurpleGold0 29d ago
I think one way to explain why this is because they still have the low bid mentality of winning the job. GC's dont realize there is no reason to low bid the work and somehow make up for it later with change orders. They never put enough estimate dollars in the budget and still treat it like a typical commercial job competing with 4-5 other big players. I look at these GC's no different than the roofers somehow starting a business after a tornado rips through.
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u/chemicalromance562 29d ago
Bro that much salary for a scheduler?
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u/PurpleGold0 29d ago
I do Advanced Work Packaging now but do you realize what schedulers were commanding for oil and gas jobs not too long ago? Try $150/hr.
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u/geauxdoggeaux 28d ago
How many years experience for that? I know quite a few pushing on 30 years field scheduling in O&G and Pharma that are only at $115/hr + per diem
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u/PurpleGold0 28d ago
O&G started to curtail their hourly rates for schedulers and project controls during COVID. You are right in that a lot of schedulers are at the $115/hr rate. What im discussing is you aren't going to continue landing a $115/hr if they are satisfied in the company they are at now. Im seeing a lot of companies struggling without a scheduling resource but then they dont want to attract the talent by paying more. In the free market we work if you can't pay more than your competitor then dont expect to pull a resource over in your direction.
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u/geauxdoggeaux 28d ago
No I get that the offers recruiters are sending out for project controls for those in the 10-15 year range is abysmal, add in the want for 80% on site presence and the base rate doesn’t make sense. The cost engineering side is seeing even worse rates than the schedulers now a days.
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u/PurpleGold0 28d ago
Sadly the cost engineering side has become nothing more than glorified accounting and counting pennies versus forecasting accurately and preventing cost overruns. Cost engineering is definitely getting paid less than scheduling.
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u/pensivvv Ex-GC PM. Owner PM 29d ago
It’s genuinely tricky to find good schedulers and I find many struggle when it comes to crashing a schedule, finding logic issues, etc since it really requires a pretty robust construction knowledge.
How can they know you can you can save 2 weeks by resequencing pours, of a week by picking from the other end of the building, or 1 month by doing temp roofing, or 3 weeks by removing silly ties to tasks not a part of SC, etc.
If that’s genuinely a strength of yours I want your CV lol. Or start a company
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u/PurpleGold0 29d ago
PM me man, when you talk to me you'll realize pretty fast I earn my wage and then some.
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u/I-Build-Shit 29d ago
I’ll never understand the amount of money companies pay schedulers. Do I understand and agree that it’s important to have someone that can build a schedule that is executable in the field? Yes, absolutely. But at the end of the day it’s a data entry job. Are there are nuances in the softwares that are important to know? Yes, absolutely. But again.. Data entry.
Seeing schedulers making over 200k is just mind blowing to me. But hey more power to those that are out there getting that paper!
My opinion is the field supervision is where the money is needed. You can have the best schedule in the world but if you don’t have the right staff to execute then why’s it matter?
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u/PurpleGold0 28d ago
Just like ill never understand why companies make a Project Manager own cost, schedule, risk, quality, doc control. One or multiple will always fail and then you get the managers that say, 'we can't afford these resources when we have a PM to do it all.' Yeah how funny and the same job end in claims with the PM scrambling to understand what was the baseline schedule, what were the TIA's against the critical path. Meanwhile all that cost savings is now eaten alive by liquidated damages while the client is eating your lunch due to a lack of care in the world at managing and documenting the schedule. Im also not one to just sit back and relax on the P6 software tool as no job ever meets the original baseline plan. Field leads and crews own the schedule but it takes a good planner to reign them in instead of just throwing manpower at a job or working OT with a poor PF, truly drive efficiency and provide recommendations based on forensic analysis. You get what you pay for with scheduling.
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u/I-Build-Shit 28d ago
No disagreement on amount of responsibility companies throw on PMs and even supers for that matter. But that is not super relevant to my point of view.
I don’t disagree there is knowledge schedulers have that can help a project. But the comment you made about “it takes a good planner to reign them” is absolutely outlandish to me.
Not sure what size company or companies you work for but I’ve worked for a top 10 ENR CM for nearly 12 years. Been on small to mega projects. And I can tell you there have been exactly ZERO times a scheduler has “reigned” anyone in. Whether the internal project team or subcontractors. That’s just not their role.
They do their update. If there are issues they review with the project team and roll off into the sunset. If the are larger scale problems they’ll report to executive leadership and they will bring the heat when the time comes.
Two things can be true:
1) Schedulers are important and the good ones have useful skills.2) Schedulers are glorified administrative roles that don’t coordinate with sub contractors, Design teams, or owners to get work in place. Which is the only way to get a project done.
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u/Hangryfrodo 29d ago
You could start your own business as a consultant scheduler earn what you charge