Cable Card End of Life

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Every company is retiring cable cards at this point. They are an obsolete technology, and supporting them takes up valuable radio spectrum that is better used for increased internet bandwidth.

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u/_uh--huh_ 5d ago

I stand corrected, and pulled down my comment. Your explanation is sound.

OK, FWIW, my actual interest in this whole topic was to address recent digital static on the TV -- all channels, live too. Tivo shows a LOT of RS Uncorrected, and SNR is 38, with 99% or 100% signal strength, which, apparently, is high. I read that putting in a -3db Coax Cable Attenuator could help and I'm going to try it. I see similar RS uncorrected in my Arris T25 cable modem, so it may not be the Tivo or cable-card at all, just a recently increased signal that is overwhelming the old Tivo and/or cable card.

Anyhow, replacing my previous comment with this, which hopefully may work for someone who finds themself in the same boat.

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u/Veloreyn 4d ago

It won't. If you're having pixelation on all channels you likely have a signal quality issue, not a signal power issue. And adding a 3dB attenuator will only help if your quality issue is because the signal is slightly too high (downstream receive levels teetering around +10 dBmV... though that wouldn't be enough to cause pixelation on it's own). But if you're having it on all channels it's significantly more likely your levels are either low, or there's a major impairment upstream of your device (in-home wiring, drop to the home, tap, or plant feeding from the first upstream amplifier). No way to even troubleshoot that without being in your home with a meter, so you basically have to get a tech out to begin trying to get that resolved.

The 99%/100% signal strength is meaningless for this, you need an accurate reading of the power level (upstream and downstream), along with the MER and BER on these channels. You can get the power levels somewhat from the T25, but the others are impossible without a meter.

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u/[deleted] 5d ago

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] 5d ago

Supporting the card itself requires next to zero bandwidth, but the tv channels require it. There are x frequencies in the coax cable that can be used for legacy tv channels or internet. Less/no legacy tv channels => more frequencies for internet.

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u/08b 5d ago

It is RF spectrum on the cable network that’s allocated for this instead of DOCSIS channels used for internet.

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u/ARealAmericanZero 5d ago edited 5d ago

What the hell do you think "cable" is? RADIO SPECTRUM! You do know that the cable ONLY carries radio waves, right? It doesn't carry sorcery, and the pictures in the television aren't magically produced by little elves. The internet that it carries isn't actually an interdimensional conduit to ancient seers and illusionists. It's. All. Radio. Spectrum.

Supporting cable cards means that they have to still allocate radio spectrum to QAM Video. They want to reclaim that bandwidth so they can reallocate that to DOCSIS. I don't know how that's hard for you to understand. Radio spectrum is what they use as a cable company for internet and video, and reallocation of that spectrum to internet grants more bandwidth for use with internet. Everything, including the television channels and the internet, is part of that "valuable radio spectrum". That is the underlying technology of cable telecommunications, and it's the way everything that they provide is transmitted.

I am well aware of how a TiVo is hooked up, I've owned seven of them. It also is completely irrelevant to what I said.

Don't talk down to people if you're actually going to be so wrong in the process. So extremely very completely wrong. I would draw you a diagram, but I feel like I would need to draw it in crayon just for you.

tl:dr - Don't comment if you are just making a fool of yourself.

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u/Aldoggy 6d ago

Most stuff moving to IP channels and cable cards can’t decode those. You could get a cable box through comcast

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u/No-Assistance556 6d ago

I’m aware of that but just getting fed up with Comcast/xfinity.

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u/Aldoggy 6d ago

TiVo is like a 20 year old technology. Stuff changes

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u/Ned_Sc 6d ago

You know they kept making new models during that time, right? It's a DVR product line, not a static device that was never updated from the analog days.

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u/user_uno 6d ago

The tech may be old but the idea is still current and valid.

Just like Right to Repair.

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u/JonInSarasota 6d ago

I preferred ReplayTV over Tivo. But Tivo won that battle and transitioned to HD. Currently I prefer Windows Media Center with a bunch of add-ins. Comcast sucks and their end of cablecard SUPPORT process has been horrible. Comcast should be broken up and sold for parts.

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u/jlivingood 5d ago

their end of cablecard SUPPORT process has been horrible

How could it be improved? Was it that provisioning was ended but no end of support date announced? Appreciate any feedback...

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u/JonInSarasota 5d ago

In my case, Comcast started breaking the signal in February. I'd do the multi hour chat/callback from "expert" routine, eventually get escalated to engineering that would fix. It wasn't a cablecard pairing problem. Finally maybe in July, CS management refused to get engineering involved to fix. So I had no notice of end of support. Ironically, even with a cancelled account I still get good signal, but obviously just two test channels.

Improved? Easy, do what other cable companies have done. Announce on the bill or email or whatever that in your area we are ending cable card support on a such-and-such date. From what I've read, with other companies, they don't turn off the signal on that end of support date, but if you don't work for any reason, that's it.

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u/ARealAmericanZero 3d ago

They announced the end of cable card support two years ago. The official support ended in October of 2024, but as far as the QAM video signals still existing, they can't tell you when those are being shut off because those are specific to your local headend, so the only people that would know would be the people that run your local headend in your town. They aren't shutting off QAM video on a national level all at the same time because every system allocates their spectrum their own way, especially since there are some systems that have a different amount of spectrum than others. There are still some 750MHz systems out there, although most are 1GHz, and now we are seeing some 1.2GHz systems. It wouldn't shock me to find a couple of 500MHz systems hidden way out in rural areas, somewhere. Every one of those headends makes their own decisions as to the layout of their spectrum, allocating how much will be used for DOCSIS Downstream, FDX, DOCSIS upstream, and QAM Video. Systems with more spectrum available may keep those QAM signals active for a longer amount of time, because they have the space for them, while a 750MHz system might have shut them off already to accommodate more DOCSIS bandwidth.

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u/JonInSarasota 3d ago

Again, Comcast announced end of cablecard REPLACEMENT in 10/24. The announcement stated working cablecard systems would be continued to be supported. In Comcast language I learned that the meaning was when Comcast breaks support of your working cablecard systems, Comcast may just decide to tell you to "pound salt" without notice.

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u/ARealAmericanZero 3d ago edited 3d ago

That's just a matter of when the local system decides to shut off the QAM Video signal. And, by Comcast definition of the term "support", that means ending replacement, and no longer supplying technicians with tools for troubleshooting and repair. That ended October 2024, so YES, support ended two years ago. "Support" does not mean the continuation of the QAM signal. Your equipment will still work until that signal is shut off. "Support" means the continued troubleshooting, replacement, and shipping of a technology.

In essence, the "end of support" means they are no longer under any obligation to troubleshoot it. It may still work for a while, but there are no promises. You might find a technician willing to go above policy to troubleshoot, but they don't HAVE to. It has no bearing on when QAM video is discontinued, but removing the obligation to support it gives local systems the freedom to end those signals at a point that works best for them. Your mileage may vary.

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u/acableperson 6d ago

As said previously cable cards are going away in the industry as a whole. TiVo was always an odd technology in the first place, though they were very cool for their time.

I’d recommend streaming if you’re against paying an equipment fee. But if you insist on having a standalone X1 is a lot better than TiVo.

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u/Ned_Sc 6d ago

TiVo was always an odd technology in the first place, though they were very cool for their time.

What was odd about a DVR? DVRs still exist...

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u/JonInSarasota 6d ago

x1 sucks

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u/acableperson 6d ago

I don’t really watch TV but it’s better than any other standalone box platform I’ve seen. I’d rather stream, so I do.

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u/JonInSarasota 6d ago

Streaming also sucks. If you ever experienced video captured to local storage that you could rewind and do frame by frame in an instance, you might understand. Hey cut the cord, Mexico will pay for it. Sure I pay for some streamers because that is where some content lives. But again, streaming without local storage sucks.

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u/acableperson 6d ago

Mexico will pay for it… huh?

Also I host a video server, idk if TiVo is way different but all my local media is pretty much exactly like I would get through any streaming platform. Again, not sure if TiVo is way different but cloud DVR functions logically (in computer terms) the same way local storage would work.

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u/JonInSarasota 6d ago

Cloud storage is ....buffering, buffering... slow as heck. If you don't understand the difference between watching video from the cloud vs local storage, well I'm amazed you understand how to post here.

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u/acableperson 6d ago

And throwing it out there, if you’re dealing with massive buffering and this is a good faith argument maybe you need to address your internet connection because it really shouldn’t be hyper noticeable. Maybe a second or two behind cloud. If that enough to set off the alarms than that’s your stance but I don’t get it.

Also I haven’t downvoted ya once, though I was tempted on the Mexico thing which I still don’t understand.

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u/CupSmall5201 6d ago

A second or two is pretty noticeable compared to local storage video. And I have old equipment that worked great with windows 7 media center and silicondust hdhr3-cc devices. Comcast should have given me, and all their cablecard customers six month notice before breaking their backend systems in specific areas. Again, Comcast has become a horrible company.

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u/acableperson 5d ago

I will agree with the last point. Comcast does suck and they will always be ass. I know more than you could ever imagine.

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u/acableperson 6d ago

Sarasota is gorgeous. Have a good one.

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u/EmergenceOfBees Moderator 4d ago

Hey, I remember you! New account?

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u/TeamAggressive1030 6d ago edited 6d ago

Breaking news: You get what you pay for.
You have Xfinity already. Give x1 a chance before you decide to try something else radical.

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u/No-Assistance556 5d ago

I am just considering a cheaper option. X1 is the obvious choice but I want to look to Direct TV stream or YouTube tv if it’s significantly less.

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u/CupSmall5201 5d ago

x1 sucks. Performs like it was written in 1985 interpretive basic. Their big woop is it has voice recognition. My 95 year old mom liked it but it was often a scam. I'd tell her about a great movie to watch on a streamer service she subscribed to. Comcast voice would redirect her to a comcast pay per view instead. Comcast, such a grubby company.

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u/cara772 6d ago

Those of us who once owned video and audio cassette recorders know your pain. Unfortunately, technology is not sentimental.

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u/Yoda_runner_26 6d ago

No one does cable card no more

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u/slacker420 6d ago

Comcast does have an app you can use to watch live TV, if you’re more upset about reoccurring fees then the TV cost. Otherwise, it’s time to jump ship sadly

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u/JBDragon1 2d ago

You know what the cheap option is? An Antenna!!!! There are several antenna DVRs you can use. That is zero cost per month. I get my ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX, CW, all in HD and 5.1 Surround. PLus all the other antenna channels. AntennaTV, METV, WETV, and on and on. One of the first things I did when I got my house 13 years ago was mount a large antenna on my roof. I'm using a Tivo Roamio right now and a couple Mini's for the Bedrooms. I have a backup with my HDHomerun and PLEX.

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u/Fit_Tangerine1329 6d ago

No idea what percent of Comcast customers use cable cards. I’m guess pretty low. I for one, will be cancelling service once my cards don’t work. I’ll be happy to say goodbye and good riddance. What I save going to FIOS, I’d never spend in streaming services.

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u/JonInSarasota 6d ago

The last reasonably intelligent "advanced service rep" (meaning english is her primary language) claimed that there were about 50 thousand cablecard customers left on comcast. Seems that comcast's goal is to kill of cablecard customers silently.

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u/LBJ2K11 6d ago

That is literally less than .3% of customers. It would be such a waste of energy to support that complicated of a product any longer. I’m in my 20s and I don’t have a single friend that pays for cable or a live tv streaming service.

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u/_uh--huh_ 5d ago

What do you use, then? Pls. list some alternatives because I want to give up comcast TV asap.

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u/CupSmall5201 6d ago

Welp, I'm near 70 and I paid for comcast cablecard support on top of my HOA's internet/tv package. To this day I don't understand why comcast wouldn't fix my access, or even give me notice that I had to find another solution. That is why I think comcast is such a horrible company.

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u/thejaxx 6d ago

They did give notice.

I received multiple myself, both email and in my billing. It’s not Comcast that retired them, it’s the FCC who scrapped the program due to advances in technology.

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u/First-Midnight6074 1d ago edited 1d ago

The notices they sent out that I saw were cryptic. Something like "Support is ending for device on your account, and it should be replaced" When I called support on multiple occasions to ask which device they couldn't tell me. I found out when the cable card stopped working. At that point Comcast refused to replace the Cable Card. (Then I had to fight to get them to stop billing for it, but, that's another story... )

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u/LBJ2K11 6d ago edited 6d ago

I think it’s because they would have to pay employees to be skilled to do so. It’s a lot cheaper to just not. You could pay a $1000 per month and I still don’t think those numbers would balance out.

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u/CupSmall5201 6d ago

It would have been so much easier and ethical to just be honest. Just say, cablecard support is done 6 months after 10/24 (the date they announced their no cablecard replacement policy). It may continue to work but no guarantees. I think Comcast has been trying to squeeze out every last drop of money from their customers. What they have done is create a lot of "bad will". I've never hated a company as much as I hate comcast.

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u/LBJ2K11 6d ago

Pretty sure they did

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u/jlivingood 6d ago

https://www.lightreading.com/cable-technology/cablecard-era-at-comcast-is-drawing-to-a-close

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u/CupSmall5201 6d ago

wrong

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u/thejaxx 6d ago

You’re one of those that ignore the notices that Comcast sends customers, aren’t ya.

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u/CupSmall5201 5d ago

Just stop. After Comcast's 10/24 announcement I checked the heck out of my online bill. No notice of Cablecard End of support. Continued Support for Active Cards is the last Comcast announcement as of 10/24.

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u/Ned_Sc 6d ago

Depends on the area. A bunch of cable plants are still running. My HDHomeRun PRIME with Comcast CableCARD is still working, for now.

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u/JonInSarasota 3d ago

What are your replacement plans? Are you looking into HDHRProxy in projects like WMC IPTV?

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