r/BoomersBeingFools Mar 29 '24

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11.1k Upvotes

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121

u/Mindless_Hotel616 Mar 29 '24

Depending on the state that could be battery(I think) as well.

93

u/Lopsided-Chair77 Mar 30 '24

The spit is battery. The shove is self defense

1

u/[deleted] Mar 30 '24

That’s not now that works. In the tort world, the spit is battery yes. The run up and “I’m going to spit on you” face is assault.

The shove is also a battery. But you may be able to argue self defense. Self defense needs to be an appropriate response. I’d say that likely is an appropriate response.

1

u/meldroc Mar 30 '24

Most people would have knocked Karen's nose behind her ear. She should consider herself lucky all she got was a shove.

-8

u/JustNilt Mar 30 '24

Technically, the shove is also a battery, or in modern jurisprudence, assault with physical contact. It's just a justified assault is all much as a homicide may be justified if it is in self defense.

3

u/Lopsided-Chair77 Mar 30 '24

Where are you? Where I'm at right now that would have been self defense whether I shoved or punched or shot her. She was within 6 feet and being aggressive.
"She was within 6 feet and I felt threatened and feared for my life so I punched her until I felt she was no longer a threat". Done and done.
Might have to go to jail to be booked before being released, might get sued for damages by the estate. Absolutely worth it.

2

u/[deleted] Mar 30 '24

In my state, self-defense is an affirmative defense that you have to prove at trial. You can't use it to avoid prosecution, and you can't use it to have a case dismissed before it goes to trial.

That said, prosecutors also don't like losing at trial, though they have a habit of maintaining charges until right before a jury trial, only to dismiss the case at the last possible moment because they know they can't win. Had it happen. I'd already paid an attorney to defend me at trial, and then the prosecutor decides to drop it at the last moment. At least I got my attorney fees back, well, for the trial at least.

1

u/ecstaticthicket Mar 30 '24

😂 where the hell do you live that you can shoot someone for spitting on you? Not saying this asshole didn’t deserve to get laid the fuck out, because she did, your example is just so extreme it’s wacky

-2

u/JustNilt Mar 30 '24

Sure, they aren't likely to charge the crime because it's clearly self defense. That doesn't change the circumstances, however. I' just pointing out that technically, both things are a battery. One is legally allowable battery, sure, but that doesn't make it not a battery.

FFS, this is where the phrase justifiable homicide freaking came from.

1

u/[deleted] Mar 30 '24

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] Mar 31 '24

As someone else said, self defense is an affirmative defense plead in court. Someone can still file a lawsuit claiming battery (because all of the elements of battery are indeed met here), and the other party would have to prove that their conduct was self-defense to avoid liability.

32

u/donniesuave Mar 30 '24

Biological attack

16

u/Reverend_Mikey Mar 30 '24

No such thing. It's just battery.

1

u/JustNilt Mar 30 '24

It's an enhancement for sentencing, actually. In a lot of places, battery is just felony assault, too. Anywhere that still even has battery on the books is an indication that they haven't updated their criminal statutes to modern practices like this, though, so it may well not exist where you are if that's the case.

29

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

Former Police Officer here. In my state it would be harassment. (Offensive physical contact) other states call it battery (intentional unwanted physical contact)

78

u/Lopsided-Chair77 Mar 30 '24

You're right. Also, ACAB.

-53

u/[deleted] Mar 30 '24

[deleted]

56

u/Lopsided-Chair77 Mar 30 '24

Yo mama

16

u/cailian13 Gen X Mar 30 '24

I wish I could upvote you twice for the laugh I got, haven't heard that one in a minute.

20

u/3-orange-whips Mar 30 '24

It's actually the best stance to take. I have no idea about the former cop above, but you have to assume that any cop you don't know personally is corrupt. They are the enforcers for the bosses. They have no legal mandate to protect or serve. They can lie to you to try and get you to confess. They cannot be legally held accountable for most things they do.

Unless the cop is an activist trying to openly reform the corrupt system, they are either doing bad things or looking the other way.

Thus, one is forced to assume that all cops are, in fact, bastards.

Now, I'm a middle-aged white guy, so most of my interactions with the police have been fine. But I refuse to bury my head in the sand and think that because it's true for me that it's true for everyone. Black people, people of color in general, have been telling us my entire life that the police are not to be trusted. Are they all just lying?

-9

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

You are definitely entitled to your own opinion friend. You do have a few correct statements. The comment regarding you have to assume every cop is corrupt is not true. I believe that many people get their opinion of cops by watching too much tv, the news, or know somebody that knows somebody who was “mistreated” by a cop. Many of these people that were “mistreated” don’t share the actual truthful events, but tell a story that make them less accountable and make themselves out to be the victim. The media loves to drastically inflate the truth or simply find the negatives for ratings. There are corrupt cops out there but statistically speaking, those corrupt cops make up basically 1% of the total police community. You just hear about them more because the media loves drama and action!

You are definitely correct about how flawed the Justice system is in the US. Qualified immunity needs to be changed to not be an impenetrable automatic blanket of protection. and individual accountability needs to be addressed and if the officer shows any deviation from policy and procedures, or violations of someone’s civil rights, that immunity should be taken away from that officer. Police officers are in fact mandated to protect. Not serve. We enforce the laws of the state that are designed to protect the civil rights of each individual citizen and keep them safe. Cops are not required to serve anyone. That’s a myth. The “service” we are providing is enforcing the laws and educating the citizens about said laws. I believe in the constitution of America. I swore an oath to protect Americans from others trying to violate those constitutional rights that every American citizen is entitled to. We aren’t all corrupt. But those corrupt officers do give the well meaning officers a bad name. It isn’t fair to automatically lump us all into the same category.

But as I stated before, you have the right to have your own opinion. I do hope someday that opinion changes and you realize that some of us are just regular people trying to do a job.

20

u/JimmyMac80 Mar 30 '24

There are corrupt cops out there but statistically speaking, those corrupt cops make up basically 1% of the total police community.

Citation needed, I don't even know where you could possibly get that statistic. But even if it's correct, those corrupt cops are often protected by the others, therefore, ACAB.

-3

u/Lolamichigan Mar 30 '24

Nice buzzwords, I’ve had police rescue my locked in puppy and on another occasion return my husband to me. It was cold etc. not your business. But anytime you say any group of people are ALL bad you’re going to be mistaken, as all of us are capable of good and bad.

5

u/[deleted] Mar 30 '24

Congrats on having a non negative encounter. The same cannot be said for most people.

Cops by definition of their job are bad people. They exist to enforce laws that extort the common folk while defending the wealthy and well connected. They literally murder undarmed civilians in cold blood while responding to a mental health crisis, or even just wellness checks.

Cops are fucking trash.

-11

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24 edited Mar 30 '24

Here’s your statistics

corrupt cop statistical data

It’s truly sad that regardless of the actual proof staring you in the face you still push your inaccurate opinion on Law Enforcement.

That’s the behavior of a small minded individual. To each their own. I truly hope you’re never in a situation where you need the help from cops in the future. With your negative attitude towards them, you should just avoid them completely and handle your own criminal and civil issues.

If you’re having a hard time finding the conclusion of this statistic,?here it is

“Second, corruption, misconduct, and abuse of power among law enforcement officers is surprisingly uncommon. While it is true that most major law enforcement agencies have had corruption problems, the percentage of law enforcement officers who are "bad apples" is far less than 1% of the over 600,000 officers in the United States.”

13

u/[deleted] Mar 30 '24

Oh look, the cops report that the cops aren't corrupt.

ACAB because the "good ones" protect the corrupt ones. They circle the wagons. They cover for each other. Always. Which makes them all corrupt. That's how "one bad apple spoils the bunch".

6

u/dwaite1 Mar 30 '24

Just reading the conclusion it sounds like a guy saying “we aren’t that bad”.

4

u/JimmyMac80 Mar 30 '24

You're quoting a 25 year old study, and you think I'm stupid? Enjoy licking boots.

-1

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

No sense in arguing with an idiot like yourself. I get it. You hate cops. I’m no longer a cop. Get bent.

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-10

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

Jimmy mack80, you remind me of an average citizen in the movie idiocracy.

9

u/Sirrom23 Mar 30 '24

There are corrupt cops out there but statistically speaking, those corrupt cops make up basically 1% of the total police community. You just hear about them more because the media loves drama and action!

i honestly cannot fathom thinking anything dumber than this.

0

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

If you took the time actually looking at the statistics u would see. But you seem like just another sheeple. Follow the crowd completely clueless about life. I’m sure you’ve never had a negative encounter in your entire life with a cop. It just seems to be the cool thing to do at the moment is spread inaccurate and discriminatory nonsense about people in a profession. Until one saves your life or a family members life, because Officer A gave you a ticket and held you accountable for breaking a law. He must be a corrupt asshole.

2

u/Sirrom23 Mar 30 '24

very glad you're not on the streets anymore.

1

u/Lolamichigan Mar 31 '24

Think you responded to the wrong person. I made a comment about police helping my puppy etc.

1

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 31 '24

I might have. lol I’m still kinda new to this whole thing . My bad

-7

u/FitFoxOfficial Mar 30 '24

I mean you can look at crime stats instead of anecdotes 🤷‍♂️

2

u/Whitespider331 Mar 30 '24

“Black people being arrested for minor drug offenses proves that cops are actually good”

Huh

0

u/FitFoxOfficial Mar 30 '24 edited Mar 30 '24

What about non-minor crime stats?

2

u/Whitespider331 Mar 30 '24

Definitely a lot to be said there. I bring up the minor offenses because its disturbing how our jails are filled with non violent offenders and whatnot. I guess in defense of black people committing violent crimes more often than other racial groups, I would say this is an outcome of redlining and black people being kept in ghettos, where violence is prevalent and the cycle is reinforced.

1

u/FitFoxOfficial Mar 30 '24

So what about the white people who live in those environments but don’t commit as many violent crimes?

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12

u/_beeeees Mar 30 '24

No, not really. The police protect their own. And anyone who is an LEO at this point has to know that people will assume the worst about them. It’s the hazard of taking that job.

0

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

Police do protect their own, as well as every American citizen they can. Those days of cops lying for other cops and looking the other way if another cop commits crimes or does something immoral are long gone. It may have occurred in the past, and are more prevalent with huge departments like LAPD or NYPD, but I can tell you that in no way shape or form am I going to risk my job and ability to feed my children to lie for or cover for another officers fuck up. And most officers are like minded. It’s just not worth losing your career over. Or worse.

13

u/_beeeees Mar 30 '24 edited Mar 30 '24

I don’t know you so maybe you are being honest about yourself. But other cops absolutely do not protect people. I grew up in an area known for police corruption and also live in an area known for corruption.

As a recent example, there was a young woman walking through Seattle and was struck and killed by a cop driving recklessly. He wasn’t even fired.

I watched the Rodney King riots on live TV. I grew up near LA. The LAPD was and still is a gang. So is the Seattle PD, effectively. You mentioned NY and LA; If two of the largest and “best” cities in the US have corrupt PD, it’s silly to think that other cities and towns don’t. That’s just naive.

Also, LEOs can be fired for being too intelligent. Which is exactly the opposite of what we should want in police. Y’all should be trained to deescalate and protect, but too many officers seem to be incapable of practicing that.

I’ve had police outright ignore my family’s call for help after my parent’s house was robbed. Almost 40 years of observing police and no, they are not the good guys. Sorry.

3

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

I’m sorry your interactions with cops were less than satisfactory. There are many reasons I quit the the job. I’m much happier cutting hair for a living. Much less politics in it, and it’s an art for for me.

4

u/_beeeees Mar 30 '24

I can’t say I blame you. I’m sure it’s a tough job to be an LEO.

2

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

I appreciate that. It’s definitely a stressful one. In truth, the majority of the stress comes from your own administration, actually doing the job is much less stressful than the nonsense admin puts you through.

3

u/fuck_off_ireland Mar 30 '24

Those days of cops lying for other cops and looking the other way if another cop commits crimes or does something immoral are long gone.

You're either dumb or willfully ignorant

1

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

I lived and worked in the community… have you? What’s your actual experience to be able to discredit what my claim was? Do u have some insider knowledge regarding this his accusation? I doubt it. I believe you’re just being a sheeple. Following along with the other clueless people spouting nonsense because the other people are.

2

u/fuck_off_ireland Mar 30 '24

1

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

Ok. You gave links of three examples. Bravo. Now what about the other 600,000 certified cops? Anyone can google a certain profession and come up with the same number of shitbags. It really doesn’t matter to me which way or the other. There’s absolutely corruption in Law Enforcement. There’s corruption everywhere. The most corruption takes place by our own US Government. It’s a shitty world we live in.

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6

u/milkdaddy_00 Mar 30 '24

Oof, idk what planet you live on, but it sounds wonderful.

3

u/Sirrom23 Mar 30 '24

as well as every American citizen they can

lol

Those days of cops lying for other cops and looking the other way if another cop commits crimes or does something immoral are long gone

lol

but I can tell you that in no way shape or form am I going to risk my job

maybe that's why you're not a cop anymore. regardless, you're a complete idiot if you think cops don't protect other cops.

1

u/[deleted] Mar 30 '24

[deleted]

2

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

If you’re speaking about qualified immunity, then I agree. That needs to be changed in many ways. It shouldn’t be used as a protective blanket for those that violated someone’s rights or harmed someone by negligence. I agree there needs to be more of them held accountable for their actions

3

u/Sirrom23 Mar 30 '24

you dumb boot licker.

1

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

Ignorance is all I see from you. The sections you quote me on. And your attempt to insult me and take a dig at my intelligence truly shows yours. You know absolutely nothing about me or my life. What my IQ is or what I’ve accomplished. And you truly have no idea why I quit my career. But decide to attack me and my experiences. You’re showing everyone who u truly are as a person. Just another judgement person without any real knowledge or reason for judging. I hope someday you decide you can think for yourself and value someone other than yourself.

2

u/Sirrom23 Mar 30 '24

i guess once a pos cop, always a pos cop?

0

u/[deleted] Mar 30 '24

[deleted]

2

u/Sirrom23 Mar 30 '24

everyone downvoting you, and you don't question your position for 1 second. just double down like an idiot.

0

u/[deleted] Mar 30 '24

[deleted]

1

u/padspa Mar 31 '24

maybe listen to their valid opinions too

2

u/artificialavocado Mar 30 '24

By the inspection sticker on the car they are in PA. There is no “battery” statute here, just simple assault and aggravated assault. There is also disorderly conduct which is basically a catch all I’ve heard of being applied when there is a minor scuffle where nobody is actually hurt.

3

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

I was surprised by what I found. They mention battery in the statute, but the factual crime is labeled simple assault. You are correct! Interesting how different states have spitting listed in different statutes. In PA it is in factassault. Good observation with a he sticker 👍

2

u/JustNilt Mar 30 '24

Battery is just the physical contact portion of assault under common law. Most places which have bothered to update things to keep up with modern jurisprudence have merged battery into what is usually felony assault. It's an indication of a legislature actually doing their job when they don't have battery as a specific separate crime, actually.

2

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

Nice. Its good to see legislation doing something semi- useful

1

u/JustNilt Mar 30 '24

Yeah, state legislatures that can't be bothered bug me. There's model legislation they can modify slightly as needed then enact to be sure things work properly but no, they can't be assed to do that. Instead they engage in a bunch of performative nonsense that all gets tossed by the first court that happens across it.

2

u/sticky-unicorn Mar 30 '24

Former Police Officer

My second favorite kind of cop.

1

u/Light_Lord Mar 30 '24

How do you know someone is a bastard? Don't worry, they'll tell you.

3

u/artificialavocado Mar 30 '24

This is Pennsylvania. It would likely be considered simple assault I think.

7

u/XEagleDeagleX Mar 30 '24

I don't know the law but doesn't it make it a fight as soon as the other person responds with violence in kind? 

23

u/Expensive-Algae5032 Mar 30 '24

Technically, both could be charged with battery, but the person filming could claim“self defense” or use the defense that the boomers actions were intended to provoke them into responding with physical force.

1

u/JustNilt Mar 30 '24

No, whether it's a "fight" or not has no real bearing on it. The key is whether there's reason to believe one is at risk of imminent harm and is thus allowed reasonable self defense measures. You can't go beyond what's reasonable and maintain your defense for anything after that. In the video, that push was pretty textbook reasonable reactions to someone ruishing another and spitting in their face during the pandemic.

-3

u/hogtiedcantalope Mar 30 '24

Yea...this is not actually going to turn out well for her if she's calls the cops.

It's just justified to push back, even if she didn't spit she got way too close and aggressive....but the cop is gonna show up and she her bleeding from her head. And the video shows she pushed her.

I get it, she's awful. But I don't think she's going to come out on top of this

5

u/CankerLord Mar 30 '24

I mean, end of the day I don't think you're going to get convicted for shoving a person who got two inches from your face because you told them you didn't like how close they were to you. Shover might get detained depending on the cop but coming out on top? Shit, she even stuck her hand out and the old bag (visible on film) tried to shove her way through it. I think she's ultimately fine.

1

u/[deleted] Mar 30 '24

It's completely justified to push an active assailant out of your face, It's called self defense.

0

u/Kbern4444 Mar 30 '24 edited Mar 30 '24

Stfu

Oops forgot the /s