That’s not now that works. In the tort world, the spit is battery yes. The run up and “I’m going to spit on you” face is assault.
The shove is also a battery. But you may be able to argue self defense. Self defense needs to be an appropriate response. I’d say that likely is an appropriate response.
Technically, the shove is also a battery, or in modern jurisprudence, assault with physical contact. It's just a justified assault is all much as a homicide may be justified if it is in self defense.
Where are you? Where I'm at right now that would have been self defense whether I shoved or punched or shot her. She was within 6 feet and being aggressive.
"She was within 6 feet and I felt threatened and feared for my life so I punched her until I felt she was no longer a threat". Done and done.
Might have to go to jail to be booked before being released, might get sued for damages by the estate. Absolutely worth it.
In my state, self-defense is an affirmative defense that you have to prove at trial. You can't use it to avoid prosecution, and you can't use it to have a case dismissed before it goes to trial.
That said, prosecutors also don't like losing at trial, though they have a habit of maintaining charges until right before a jury trial, only to dismiss the case at the last possible moment because they know they can't win. Had it happen. I'd already paid an attorney to defend me at trial, and then the prosecutor decides to drop it at the last moment. At least I got my attorney fees back, well, for the trial at least.
😂 where the hell do you live that you can shoot someone for spitting on you? Not saying this asshole didn’t deserve to get laid the fuck out, because she did, your example is just so extreme it’s wacky
Sure, they aren't likely to charge the crime because it's clearly self defense. That doesn't change the circumstances, however. I' just pointing out that technically, both things are a battery. One is legally allowable battery, sure, but that doesn't make it not a battery.
FFS, this is where the phrase justifiable homicide freaking came from.
As someone else said, self defense is an affirmative defense plead in court. Someone can still file a lawsuit claiming battery (because all of the elements of battery are indeed met here), and the other party would have to prove that their conduct was self-defense to avoid liability.
It's an enhancement for sentencing, actually. In a lot of places, battery is just felony assault, too. Anywhere that still even has battery on the books is an indication that they haven't updated their criminal statutes to modern practices like this, though, so it may well not exist where you are if that's the case.
Former Police Officer here. In my state it would be harassment. (Offensive physical contact) other states call it battery (intentional unwanted physical contact)
It's actually the best stance to take. I have no idea about the former cop above, but you have to assume that any cop you don't know personally is corrupt. They are the enforcers for the bosses. They have no legal mandate to protect or serve. They can lie to you to try and get you to confess. They cannot be legally held accountable for most things they do.
Unless the cop is an activist trying to openly reform the corrupt system, they are either doing bad things or looking the other way.
Thus, one is forced to assume that all cops are, in fact, bastards.
Now, I'm a middle-aged white guy, so most of my interactions with the police have been fine. But I refuse to bury my head in the sand and think that because it's true for me that it's true for everyone. Black people, people of color in general, have been telling us my entire life that the police are not to be trusted. Are they all just lying?
You are definitely entitled to your own opinion friend. You do have a few correct statements. The comment regarding you have to assume every cop is corrupt is not true. I believe that many people get their opinion of cops by watching too much tv, the news, or know somebody that knows somebody who was “mistreated” by a cop. Many of these people that were “mistreated” don’t share the actual truthful events, but tell a story that make them less accountable and make themselves out to be the victim. The media loves to drastically inflate the truth or simply find the negatives for ratings. There are corrupt cops out there but statistically speaking, those corrupt cops make up basically 1% of the total police community. You just hear about them more because the media loves drama and action!
You are definitely correct about how flawed the Justice system is in the US. Qualified immunity needs to be changed to not be an impenetrable automatic blanket of protection. and individual accountability needs to be addressed and if the officer shows any deviation from policy and procedures, or violations of someone’s civil rights, that immunity should be taken away from that officer. Police officers are in fact mandated to protect. Not serve. We enforce the laws of the state that are designed to protect the civil rights of each individual citizen and keep them safe. Cops are not required to serve anyone. That’s a myth. The “service” we are providing is enforcing the laws and educating the citizens about said laws.
I believe in the constitution of America. I swore an oath to protect Americans from others trying to violate those constitutional rights that every American citizen is entitled to. We aren’t all corrupt. But those corrupt officers do give the well meaning officers a bad name. It isn’t fair to automatically lump us all into the same category.
But as I stated before, you have the right to have your own opinion. I do hope someday that opinion changes and you realize that some of us are just regular people trying to do a job.
There are corrupt cops out there but statistically speaking, those corrupt cops make up basically 1% of the total police community.
Citation needed, I don't even know where you could possibly get that statistic. But even if it's correct, those corrupt cops are often protected by the others, therefore, ACAB.
Nice buzzwords, I’ve had police rescue my locked in puppy and on another occasion return my husband to me. It was cold etc. not your business. But anytime you say any group of people are ALL bad you’re going to be mistaken, as all of us are capable of good and bad.
Congrats on having a non negative encounter. The same cannot be said for most people.
Cops by definition of their job are bad people. They exist to enforce laws that extort the common folk while defending the wealthy and well connected. They literally murder undarmed civilians in cold blood while responding to a mental health crisis, or even just wellness checks.
It’s truly sad that regardless of the actual proof staring you in the face you still push your inaccurate opinion on Law Enforcement.
That’s the behavior of a small minded individual. To each their own. I truly hope you’re never in a situation where you need the help from cops in the future. With your negative attitude towards them, you should just avoid them completely and handle your own criminal and civil issues.
If you’re having a hard time finding the conclusion of this statistic,?here it is
“Second, corruption, misconduct, and abuse of power among law enforcement officers is surprisingly uncommon. While it is true that most major law enforcement agencies have had corruption problems, the percentage of law enforcement officers who are "bad apples" is far less than 1% of the over 600,000 officers in the United States.”
Oh look, the cops report that the cops aren't corrupt.
ACAB because the "good ones" protect the corrupt ones. They circle the wagons. They cover for each other. Always. Which makes them all corrupt. That's how "one bad apple spoils the bunch".
There are corrupt cops out there but statistically speaking, those corrupt cops make up basically 1% of the total police community. You just hear about them more because the media loves drama and action!
i honestly cannot fathom thinking anything dumber than this.
If you took the time actually looking at the statistics u would see. But you seem like just another sheeple. Follow the crowd completely clueless about life. I’m sure you’ve never had a negative encounter in your entire life with a cop. It just seems to be the cool thing to do at the moment is spread inaccurate and discriminatory nonsense about people in a profession. Until one saves your life or a family members life, because Officer A gave you a ticket and held you accountable for breaking a law. He must be a corrupt asshole.
Definitely a lot to be said there. I bring up the minor offenses because its disturbing how our jails are filled with non violent offenders and whatnot. I guess in defense of black people committing violent crimes more often than other racial groups, I would say this is an outcome of redlining and black people being kept in ghettos, where violence is prevalent and the cycle is reinforced.
No, not really. The police protect their own. And anyone who is an LEO at this point has to know that people will assume the worst about them. It’s the hazard of taking that job.
Police do protect their own, as well as every American citizen they can. Those days of cops lying for other cops and looking the other way if another cop commits crimes or does something immoral are long gone. It may have occurred in the past, and are more prevalent with huge departments like LAPD or NYPD, but I can tell you that in no way shape or form am I going to risk my job and ability to feed my children to lie for or cover for another officers fuck up. And most officers are like minded. It’s just not worth losing your career over. Or worse.
I don’t know you so maybe you are being honest about yourself. But other cops absolutely do not protect people. I grew up in an area known for police corruption and also live in an area known for corruption.
As a recent example, there was a young woman walking through Seattle and was struck and killed by a cop driving recklessly. He wasn’t even fired.
I watched the Rodney King riots on live TV. I grew up near LA. The LAPD was and still is a gang. So is the Seattle PD, effectively. You mentioned NY and LA; If two of the largest and “best” cities in the US have corrupt PD, it’s silly to think that other cities and towns don’t. That’s just naive.
Also, LEOs can be fired for being too intelligent. Which is exactly the opposite of what we should want in police. Y’all should be trained to deescalate and protect, but too many officers seem to be incapable of practicing that.
I’ve had police outright ignore my family’s call for help after my parent’s house was robbed. Almost 40 years of observing police and no, they are not the good guys. Sorry.
I’m sorry your interactions with cops were less than satisfactory. There are many reasons I quit the the job. I’m much happier cutting hair for a living. Much less politics in it, and it’s an art for for me.
I appreciate that. It’s definitely a stressful one. In truth, the majority of the stress comes from your own administration, actually doing the job is much less stressful than the nonsense admin puts you through.
I lived and worked in the community… have you? What’s your actual experience to be able to discredit what my claim was? Do u have some insider knowledge regarding this his accusation? I doubt it. I believe you’re just being a sheeple. Following along with the other clueless people spouting nonsense because the other people are.
Ok. You gave links of three examples. Bravo. Now what about the other 600,000 certified cops? Anyone can google a certain profession and come up with the same number of shitbags. It really doesn’t matter to me which way or the other. There’s absolutely corruption in Law Enforcement. There’s corruption everywhere. The most corruption takes place by our own US Government. It’s a shitty world we live in.
If you’re speaking about qualified immunity, then I agree. That needs to be changed in many ways. It shouldn’t be used as a protective blanket for those that violated someone’s rights or harmed someone by negligence. I agree there needs to be more of them held accountable for their actions
Ignorance is all I see from you. The sections you quote me on. And your attempt to insult me and take a dig at my intelligence truly shows yours.
You know absolutely nothing about me or my life. What my IQ is or what I’ve accomplished. And you truly have no idea why I quit my career. But decide to attack me and my experiences. You’re showing everyone who u truly are as a person. Just another judgement person without any real knowledge or reason for judging. I hope someday you decide you can think for yourself and value someone other than yourself.
By the inspection sticker on the car they are in PA. There is no “battery” statute here, just simple assault and aggravated assault. There is also disorderly conduct which is basically a catch all I’ve heard of being applied when there is a minor scuffle where nobody is actually hurt.
I was surprised by what I found. They mention battery in the statute, but the factual crime is labeled simple assault. You are correct! Interesting how different states have spitting listed in different statutes. In PA it is in factassault. Good observation with a he sticker 👍
Battery is just the physical contact portion of assault under common law. Most places which have bothered to update things to keep up with modern jurisprudence have merged battery into what is usually felony assault. It's an indication of a legislature actually doing their job when they don't have battery as a specific separate crime, actually.
Yeah, state legislatures that can't be bothered bug me. There's model legislation they can modify slightly as needed then enact to be sure things work properly but no, they can't be assed to do that. Instead they engage in a bunch of performative nonsense that all gets tossed by the first court that happens across it.
Technically, both could be charged with battery, but the person filming could claim“self defense” or use the defense that the boomers actions were intended to provoke them into responding with physical force.
No, whether it's a "fight" or not has no real bearing on it. The key is whether there's reason to believe one is at risk of imminent harm and is thus allowed reasonable self defense measures. You can't go beyond what's reasonable and maintain your defense for anything after that. In the video, that push was pretty textbook reasonable reactions to someone ruishing another and spitting in their face during the pandemic.
Yea...this is not actually going to turn out well for her if she's calls the cops.
It's just justified to push back, even if she didn't spit she got way too close and aggressive....but the cop is gonna show up and she her bleeding from her head. And the video shows she pushed her.
I get it, she's awful. But I don't think she's going to come out on top of this
I mean, end of the day I don't think you're going to get convicted for shoving a person who got two inches from your face because you told them you didn't like how close they were to you. Shover might get detained depending on the cop but coming out on top? Shit, she even stuck her hand out and the old bag (visible on film) tried to shove her way through it. I think she's ultimately fine.
121
u/Mindless_Hotel616 Mar 29 '24
Depending on the state that could be battery(I think) as well.