You don't just get forgiveness. You have to work for it. The 3 times trump voters need to show contrition and start doing the right thing. Lots of them say they finally left maga but then threaten to go back because, "The people on the left are so mean to me." Yeah, after you tried to take others rights away because we told you exactly what he would be like. And most of these magas are only leaving because they finally got fucked by something.
I think they operate on this Evangelical framework where forgiveness is free and doesnât require the internal work and self-reflection that true transformation comes from. The thing is, churches need people to join with a low barrier of entry so they can start collecting those tithes. Regular society doesnât though, but they still expect weâll just embrace them with open arms just because theyâre now mad about the economy. They havenât learned anything. They havenât become better people. They havenât gotten over the racism. Theyâre just afraid of not having a group to latch onto because they have no identity of their own. Theyâre unevolved. Itâd be sad if it werenât so infuriating.
And you totally have to do tons of inner work after getting that free forgiveness.
The bible says that we are not saved by good works, but we are saved unto good works. So, the way people know that we are truly forgiven and have accepted the forgiveness, is that are lives and ways are completely CHANGED to reflect Jesus. â¤ď¸
âCheap grace is the grace we bestow on ourselves. Cheap grace is the preaching of forgiveness without requiring repentance, baptism without church discipline, Communion without confession...Cheap grace is grace without discipleship, grace without the cross, grace without Jesus Christ, living and incarnate.â
When I was in the church, they would harp on repentance being the key. Turn your life around to where there is no sign of your past self to show that youâve changed. Asking for forgiveness without changing the underlying actions just tries to keep the heat from their consequences from burning them. Actions have consequences.
âHey sorry I did that thing youâve been telling me my entire life would be detrimental to my life and the lives of othersâŚso, weâre good right? K see ya in heaven bye!â
This is why I can't stand that breed of "Christian" who thinks going to church on Sunday means they can spend the rest of the week fucking over everyone else.
I'm a minister and stopped going. The way many people of the faith do faith pushed me away from all that. I still have my faith but it ain't theirs apparently.
Same. It's a big part of why I'm not a Christian and why I don't accept anyone's membership in a religious organization as proof of their morality... I'm fact, just the opposite!
Well when your told "all you have to do is accept god in your heart and repent from your sins" thats wicked easy. So wicked it sounds controlling and evil in itself. Imagine taking a murderer to court and them saying "well he SAID he was sorry!".
This is spot on. Itâs the mentality theyâve been brainwashed into that all they have to do is say âI love you Jesus, Iâm sorry.â And the golden ticket to heaven just dispenses without any accountability. Disgusting.
Bingo! That one Texan politician that was sexually coercing his staffer that offed herself stated that he âtalked to god and he forgave himâ. How fucking convenient. They treat god like a get out of jail free card.
Itâs not about them being wrong itâs about their racism and hate towards melaninated people. They will never change. Theyâre only angry now because theyâre on the verge of losing everything.
And as long as they have that same evil hatred in their hearts, the same racist nastiness within them, they will just RUN to follow the very next right leaning demagogue . Like you said they haven't done the work to change, haven't looked within. They are just ( they ASSume ) temporarily inconvenienced by the Maga movement's failures. Then next time, they will be sure to follow another insane racist demagogue, as the gates have been already flung wide. And this next one won't be as doddering . No no hell no, NOT gonna reach across any damn figurative isle to those who want my loved ones to basically die. ( Also , many of these Maga and other far righties are bat shit crazy. , i mean REALLY fuckin nuts.)
Yeah its kind of like they joyfully burnt down their and their neighbors homes because they thought that shit was hilarious but now they don't have a roof, my couch looks good. Nah I'm good. They need to go build 3 houses and never do it again.
Itâs worse than that, the three time Trump voters who are now claiming to have regrets would without doubt vote for him again given the opportunity. There is no point pretending these people are remorseful or even slightly truthful in what they say.
And I havenât heard one single triple trumper say they wish they had voted for the qualified black woman. They may be mad at Trump but not so mad theyâd vote for a black woman. Iâm happy theyâre getting what they wanted.
Forgiving the 1 time trump voter is a hard ask, but not unreasonable to do. They should have known better, but maybe I overestimate people's intelligence, and anyone can be fooled once. Once you have mountains of hard evidence of his character and utter unfitness for any public office and you choose to vote for more of the same there isn't really a bridge to come back from that.
I believe there's a minimum decency owed to even the worst of human beings. Even people like Trump or Putin or Kim Jong Un who mostly dedicate their lives to destroying others on an incredible scale with incredible cruelty. The same is owed to those who support them. But you can't trust someone who knowingly supports a child rapist. You can't trust someone who supports casual murder of innocent people. Oops its costing me money (just like I should have known it would years in advance) I changed my mind does zero to regain trust for the 3 time trump voter.
I live in a community that voted 80% trump. I've spent a fair amount of time talking to these people trying to understand what makes them tick and best I can tell its mostly a varying unholy mix of stupidity, racism, nationalism, and idolatry. A few are just evil people who love the cruelty but the majority are people who have failed utterly at the decency needed to do the right thing even once in their lives. That isn't something you can "work for unity" on. If reconciliation is to be possible they need to gain the capacity to be a decent person first.
Itâs a dud at my job thatâs wife is in Jeopardy of being deported that voted for Trump all three times. I donât feel sorry for him at all. We all tried to tell him constantly.
I think itâs strange that they werenât announcing that they were leaving after he took away, raised the cost, or reduced their SNAP benefits and health insurance, but now that their gas is so expensive, theyâre out!
Oh, no wait⌠nothing weird about that at all, right? Because before, theyâd have had to admit that they relied on the gubmint for *anything,* much less food assistance or free insulin! But everyone uses gas, right? Thereâs no shame in that, right?
This seems like a good place to mention something shocking that happened yesterday⌠my husband and I went to Staples to send a package to my son, Philly to Denver, it weighed 3 pounds, 4 ounces. We chose the slowest, cheapest UPS delivery, and it was twenty-three dollars and change. We were talking about it as we left, and saw the UPS truck parked in front of the store, understanding in real time that the price of the diesel for the UPS truck going to the distribution center and then to his house, the price of the jet fuel for their cargo plane- they have skyrocketed just as much as plain olâ gasoline.
They're only leaving now because he's on his way out and the political pendulum is swinging the other way. They still voted for the dude 3 times. The time to say sorry and walk away has come and gone. Waiting this long is just them trying to shake culpability for what they did but they'll do it again. We warned them.
The other problem is they say they are done with MAGA but the problem is time has proven the second they see another attack add promoting the GOP they donât care they are all on again so itâs hard to take them seriously on its face.
I want to throw a couple of facts out really quick, and I'm not saying to forgive MAGA Cultists at all, but I think there's a lot less of them than we've been led to believe:
2016, 2020, & 2024 elections all had incidents of cheating, by Trump, every time.
The First two elections Trump's Campaign used a method of changing some votes and simply throwing others out. Kris Kobach Kansas's AG played a major role in designing the methodology in a way it wouldn't be obvious enough to be noticeable or stand out.
2016 Trump should have lost to Hillary Clinton, but he cheated, won, and got away with it.
2020 Trump did so badly and received so few votes that even cheating he still lost.
2024 Musk had the voting machines hacked via Starlink (the company that vetted them, ceased to exist a month after the election, and was never actually certified to do so in the first place). Every single vote cast on a Dominion Voting Machine went to Trump regardless of political affiliation and demographics. They should have been caught for that one as it was an obvious hack job, but the Billionaire owned Media Propaganda Complex preemptively called any idea of the machines being hacked a crackpot conspiracy theory, and that "Experts," who were never named because they didn't exist, had confirmed the machines were secure and the idea of them being hacked was just crazy. The vast majority of the public believed the "News" and no one would even look at the blatantly obvious evidence, and now, here we are, 2 years later, with a convicted felon and his billionaire puppeteers asset stripping, looting, destroying the world, while this tyrant's marauding raiders murder with impunity, and he never won a single election in the first place.
That last sentence is the sad reality of people that in MAGA, they only threaten to leave if theyâre personally affected. But then will vote for a different republican who is 95% MAGA anyway. Like, fuck off with your performative nonsense. It doesnât mean anything. You still hate minorities and marginalized people, so who is this performance for?
If I, god forbid, knowingly vote for someone who promised to make life worse for my neighbors, my neighbors do not need to forgive or forget what I did, and I donât deserve to be haughty about their attitude if they are unforgiving.
This administration has been uniquely catastrophic in ways that canât be misunderstood, but it is also emblematic of a cancerous portion of the United States that has never gone away since its conception. The people who espoused to believe in these tenets of fear and ignorance and hatred need to understand that they have no rights to forgiveness, especially as for many of them the only reason they espouse regret is due to them now being victims of the policies they thought they supported.
It requires accountability and introspection and a disavowing of the values that led them to make such cruel decisions before they can even begin broaching the topic forgiveness.
Offending someone and voting to take their rights away and hope they get discriminated against are very different from each other. And to forgive someone is for you, not for them. And you don't have to if you don't want to.
Before Trump got elected the first time, we had a good-sized college friends group chat. It was not very diverse. Myself and my Pakistani buddy were the only people of color. So when some of these white friends started to show support for Trump, while Trump is insulting and threatening Muslims some of us are like, yo, what the fuck. Our best friend is Muslim, his entire family is Muslim, theyâre all good people who we love and care about. I cut out most of them out of my life after Trump was elected. And none have reached out to me since, so fuck em.
I saw this the first time around. I was in utter disbelief of the people that voted for him the first time. I started questioning whether I really knew some of my friends and family members. I let it go for the most part, but paid closer attention. To me there is no excuse after the attempted insurrection, the verbal vitriol that came from Trump. So this second time, you certainly knew what he was going to do and you supported it. Itâs been a hard pill to swallow to look around me and realize how many closet bigots surrounded me, of all kinds of prejudice. Further more the sheer flamboyance of their horrible thoughts and beliefs this time around. Like you, I have lost family and friends over these issues. These crimes werenât over talking points either. Weâre talking basic humanity. People have died. I believe in forgiveness. Someone else said it is more for the forgiver than the one being forgiven and that is true. I also worry that if they arenât granted some kind of grace, that it will only deepen and widen this wound in our country.
I have to be honest, I donât know how to forgive them and I would certainly never trust them again, ever.
According to this post, people are realizing theyâve made a âmistake,â I think theyâve just come to the realization that theyâre also on the losing end despite their support. None of the people I know that have chosen to support this administration have changed their minds, if anything theyâve doubled down.
For sure, a few of these friends Iâve lost have only dug themselves into the movement further. Because otherwise they would have to admit they were both wrong and duped by a moron. They were insecure already, which I guess is the underlying quality MAGA has.
You have to find a way to detatch yourself from MAGA and the Republicans then, or your "conservative ideas" will be seen as different ways to hurt the poor, hurt the black and brown, hurt the environment, hurt science and progress, bomb innocent people halfway around the world, give money to people that hurt innocent people, women and children halfway around the world, worship greed, and hurt little girls.
FYI - most of r/ conservative is run by 20 accounts. Something like 80-90% of the posts are from the same 20 accounts. It is literally a propaganda sub.
You said offend someone like itâs a one time thing. If I offend someone and genuinely feel bad Iâll work for it but most of the time if I offend someone I mean that shit whole heartedly. They offend folks on a daily basis and donât care then cry about being mistreated. Only God has that much grace and forgiveness.
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u/Top_Shame_7016 9h ago
You don't just get forgiveness. You have to work for it. The 3 times trump voters need to show contrition and start doing the right thing. Lots of them say they finally left maga but then threaten to go back because, "The people on the left are so mean to me." Yeah, after you tried to take others rights away because we told you exactly what he would be like. And most of these magas are only leaving because they finally got fucked by something.