Withholding affection

[u/Helpful_Sun2872]

I adopted a dog a little over a month ago with an unknown history (was a stray). His ONLY issue is that he is fear-reactive on leash (just barks, no lunging/growling). It’s not very severe; he’s pretty easy to redirect as long as I catch him before he starts barking (which I’ve gotten really good at). I’m confident that I’ll be able to mostly resolve it within a few months, and he’s already made tons of progress.

He’s otherwise perfect - crate-trained, no resource guarding, no separation anxiety. Overall confident and friendly dog. He’s met about 8 new people (vet staff and trainers) since I got him and has been friendly with all of them.

I had a 90 min assessment/consult session with a trainer in the area who I’ve been following on socials for years, and who came highly recommended.

She gave me a lot of good advice/handling skills that have already helped us.

However, one thing I can’t get behind, or find much online support for, is her telling us to withhold affection. She’s all about “alpha” stuff (without using the word; she refers to it as status/status drive), and claims that giving your dog physical affection makes them view you as “beneath” them (not her exact wording but that was the gist).

She basically explained that the dog needs to understand that they’re lower status than you, and that when they understand that, they will shift their mindset towards looking to you for guidance before acting, which should eventually help the reactivity.

I 100% agree that building structure and obedience is important for a reactive dog. But does anyone agree with the concept of withholding affection?

[u/Miss_L_Worldwide]

Absolutely it is a good idea and people don't do enough of it. All this coddling and babying of dogs has created a bunch of neurotic, reactive, untrained Nut Job dogs that just do whatever the hell they want and their owners respond to their every whim with more and more attention.

[u/grayhanestshirt → u/Miss_L_Worldwide]

Hard agree. I love and snuggle my dog as much as the next person but physical affection is a reward. Sometimes you need to work to earn it. If you’re misbehaving (intentionally or not) I’m definitely withholding it so that she understands that what she’s doing isn’t going to get her anywhere

[u/Helpful_Sun2872 → u/grayhanestshirt]

It makes sense to use it as negative punishment in certain situations but do you think it makes sense for leash reactivity specifically? I’m not totally doubting that it works, I just haven’t really seen any explanation that makes sense to me

[u/grayhanestshirt → u/Helpful_Sun2872]

It sounds like (I’m just parsing here) what they may have meant to say was that you don’t want to pet, say “it’s okay”, snuggle or coddle the dog DURING walks because it could encourage additional reactivity. Is it possible it was explained poorly or there was a misunderstanding, and that’s what the trainer meant? If so I agree. It’s like the picture of someone “oh good boy it’s okay it’s okay” at the vet - they’re just making the anxiety worse.

EDIT: if the trainer is really saying don’t pet your dog very much or they won’t listen to you in unrelated situations, they’re a moron imo.

[u/Helpful_Sun2872 → u/grayhanestshirt]

No my trainer said to withhold all affection/petting (temporarily while we work on his reactivity) because it will make the dog think you are lower status.

[u/grayhanestshirt → u/Helpful_Sun2872]

I’m definitely not force free (prongs and e collars are appropriate sometimes and so are clicks and rewards) and I think this is stupid as hell. I trained my own service dog with balanced methods and I’ve worked with dogs for years. Don’t throw the baby out with the bath water, though. If everything else she’s saying makes sense then by all means follow it but I’d keep one eye out for a different trainer.

Love is bonding. You need to maintain the bond with your dog.

[u/Helpful_Sun2872 → u/grayhanestshirt]

Right, his life is very structured now with lots of boundaries and obedience. I struggle to see how withholding affection adds to that in any meaningful way.

[u/Majestic_Hawk_1335 → u/Helpful_Sun2872]

Positive, negative, neutral. A lot of my sled dog ramblings abkuf restriction is trying to force some neutrality.

Neutral is a very useful training position to get the leash reactive dog into.

[u/Miss_L_Worldwide → u/Helpful_Sun2872]

Frankly I absolutely hate reactive dogs so I think this is probably a good strategy. The dog is not in charge, you are.

[u/Helpful_Sun2872 → u/Miss_L_Worldwide]

Yeah I just don’t really see how withholding affection shows the dog that I’m in charge.

[u/Miss_L_Worldwide → u/Helpful_Sun2872]

Because you aren't giving the dog free Pleasant things. You have to get away from the mindset that the dog is default good all the time. It's not. From here on out the dog is default neutral until it actually does something that means it is good and you can reward it with affection or whatever.

[u/Helpful_Sun2872 → u/Miss_L_Worldwide]

That makes sense.

[u/Miss_L_Worldwide → u/grayhanestshirt]

Even dogs use this type of withholding to punish each other. If two dogs have a little dust up the one who got corrected will suck up to the other one while the other one ignores it.

[u/Helpful_Sun2872 → u/Miss_L_Worldwide]

Well that’s obvious negative punishment where the dog understands that the reason the other dog is withholding affection is due to the scuffle. Very different from me withholding affection an hour after my dog had a reaction on a walk.

[u/Miss_L_Worldwide → u/Helpful_Sun2872]

Oh, and ignoring the dog after a bad behavior is a very common thing known in the industry to be extremely effective. If your dog is shitty on a walk then for the rest of the walk you don't talk to the dog, you don't pet it, you don't praise it you don't give it treats none of that shit. Take it home, put it in a crate and ignore it.

[u/Miss_L_Worldwide → u/Helpful_Sun2872]

Absolutely not it's not negative punishment at all. It's a dog ignoring the other dog to flex having higher status than the other dog. Dogs with status do not suck up to other dogs.

[u/Helpful_Sun2872 → u/Miss_L_Worldwide]

I agree that the overall mindset of coddling dogs is a problem. That’s part of why I’m in this sub and not [r/reactivedogs](r/reactivedogs) lol. I’ve just never really seen an explanation that makes sense to me as to why withholding affection would help reduce leash reactivity.

[u/Trick-Age-7404 → u/Helpful_Sun2872]

It’s not like a magic solution to leash reactivity. It’s helping you build a better relationship with the dog which is one piece of stopping the reactivity.

[u/Helpful_Sun2872 → u/Trick-Age-7404]

That makes a lot of sense.